Confusion over controversial new Immigration Form

[webfact]

Confusion Over Controversial New Immigration Form
By Sasiwan Mokkhasen
Staff Reporter


Customers at One Stop service Center for Visa and Work Permit in Chamchuri Square

BANGKOK — Sebastien edged up to the counter and handed the form to the immigration officer. A few breaths later, it was accepted despite a lot of unanswered questions.

In recent days alarm has been raised over a new immigration form asking foreigners to provide the government with their bank details and where they hang out online and offline.

Full story: http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1461064735&typecate=06&section=

-- Khaosod English 2016-04-20

[JLCrab]

From the linked Khaosod article:

"Chatchawan Wachirapaneekhun, the Immigration Bureau deputy commissioner who designed the form said Monday that it would help solve problems, such as the difficulty in tracking down foreigners who commit a crime."

So they would now be able to track down any foreigner who committed a crime and who had provided them with accurate and up-to-date information on the form. OK.

[BritTim]

From the linked Khaosod article:

"Chatchawan Wachirapaneekhun, the Immigration Bureau deputy commissioner who designed the form said Monday that it would help solve problems, such as the difficulty in tracking down foreigners who commit a crime."

So they would now be able to track down any foreigner who committed a crime and who had provided them with accurate and up-to-date information on the form. OK.

Sure. The home address you provide several times (on entry, TM-30 and 90-day report) is practically useless to locate anybody. However, knowing their Twitter user name and bank account number will allow them to be tracked down immediately.

[JLCrab]

Twitter just links to an email which links to nothing. Again you are assuming that the criminal-to-be is on an extension and has a bank account. Many can get by just using an ATM linked to their home account.

Personally, I'm not gonna ever give any false information but I'll be cautious as to what information I provide as one of these days I might decide to become a criminal.

Edited April 19, 2016 by JLCrab

[gk10002000]

Twitter just links to an email which links to nothing. Again you are assuming that the criminal-to-be is on an extension and has a bank account. Many can get by just using an ATM linked to their home account.

Personally, I'm not gonna ever give any false information but I'll be cautious as to what information I provide as one of these days I might decide to become a criminal.

Did the form expect a Thai bank account versus a bank account in their home?

[Don Mega]

From the linked Khaosod article:

"Chatchawan Wachirapaneekhun, the Immigration Bureau deputy commissioner who designed the form said Monday that it would help solve problems, such as the difficulty in tracking down foreigners who commit a crime."

So they would now be able to track down any foreigner who committed a crime and who had provided them with accurate and up-to-date information on the form. OK.

Sure. The home address you provide several times (on entry, TM-30 and 90-day report) is practically useless to locate anybody. However, knowing their Twitter user name and bank account number will allow them to be tracked down immediately.

The form is not asking for your twitter account name and for the bank account... ive an old UOB account I have no cares for.

I'll be ok I reckon.

Edited April 19, 2016 by Don Mega

[chrisinth]

From the linked Khaosod article:

"Chatchawan Wachirapaneekhun, the Immigration Bureau deputy commissioner who designed the form said Monday that it would help solve problems, such as the difficulty in tracking down foreigners who commit a crime."

So they would now be able to track down any foreigner who committed a crime and who had provided them with accurate and up-to-date information on the form. OK.

It is for sure a wild and cunning plan......................

As long as the foreigners committing the crime are long stayers and haven't entered the country on a visa exemption or a tourist visa (not sure about visa on arrival?) where these people don't have to fill in this three page waste of paper. Love to see the queues if they do introduce that!

You know the ones i mean, like the 30 million TAT are claiming visited the country last year...........................

[alanferdi]

Twitter just links to an email which links to nothing. Again you are assuming that the criminal-to-be is on an extension and has a bank account. Many can get by just using an ATM linked to their home account.

Personally, I'm not gonna ever give any false information but I'll be cautious as to what information I provide as one of these days I might decide to become a criminal.

Public profiling..... this is non of their business.... Immigration concentrates only on the validity of documents, background checks with those documents with the authorities back home, who have the competency to answer any question related to the person. They have no need for social information, with whom one associates, hangs out or plans to go. In Germany a country that knows much about this profiling and abusing...under nazism and also the STASI in the Eastern block. People are not obliged to give their ID or copies of it to people who have nothing to do with the law. Even Banks will not disclose any information of a person unless parties have agreed with each other. Prying into personal life is not vouched for every tom dick and harry, who is looking to find a reason to make a case.

Foreigners recognise your rights you are only obliged to give details of where you are staying and how long you have stamped on your travel document. The rest is not anyones business. They cannot control their own lot...let alone follow up on the local crimes, they are thinking of international.....Good luck

[WaffleIron]

The whole "We want to catch those criminals!" line is getting really old when each week brings a new rule or crackdown against foreigners.

First, it was the overstayers: "Most overstayers are criminals hiding in the country!". Obviously untrue, most overstayers are just people who fell on hard times. Not excusing, just saying.

Then, it was the people on a married visa: "They marry Thai women just to be able to stay in the country a long time and commit crime!". Obviously false as well.

Now, it's "Hey, we need to be able to track you online or track your bank account without a search warrant because... errr... we want to catch criminals".

If people are missing the real point of all those "crackdowns," they may want to go get a brain scan.

Edited April 20, 2016 by WaffleIron

[quandow]

Don't you people have any accounts you use for obvious "junk?" For example, I have an Excite.com email address for just such an occasions, and you can make a mistaken typo when filling out any of the other items.

[JLCrab]

Well so far I'm overly concerned about any of the information they might ask for on the form even if they do ask for it at some point when I have reason to go to my local Immigration office.

But if they do genuinely ask for it, I doubt I would ever say to them point-blank to their face: That is none of your BIZ-NESS!

[DinoSabanovic]

Just a big ROFL. open another hotmail account, open twitter with that email, throw some junk pictures and give them that info and that's it.

[cumgranosalum]

it seems that these forms - if completed - are going to be susceptible to a plethora of different creative responses...... multiple addresses, cars from around the world, I think maybe the dept has underestimated the amount of information that could be added to these forms if one complies to the letter....they would be totally swamped by the extra paperwork......but these practicalities are never considered in this sort of one-man dictum, are they?

[razer]

Thailand's Immigration had two leaks on line revealing names, address, passport numbers, flight details, etc.of foreign nationals. They are rated a high risk by security firms.

Now our bank accounts and personal behavior could be all over the internet?

What about criminals who want to stalk foreign nationals and get into their bank accounts? Thai Immigration could be making a move that will lead to more criminal extortion.

THIS KIND OF INFORMATION COULD EASILY BE SOLD TO CRIMINAL GANGS.

Edited April 20, 2016 by razer

[meatboy]

Thailand's Immigration had two leaks on line revealing names, address, passport numbers, flight details, etc.of foreign nationals. They are rated a high risk by security firms.

Now our bank accounts and personal behavior could be all over the internet?

What about criminals who want to stalk foreign nationals and get into their bank accounts? Thai Immigration could be making a move that will lead to more criminal extortion.

This information would be very easy to sell.

what do you think they do with your application forms eg.TM7 ect.?

they use the blank side for the same.

i got one with somebodys,passport no.bank details,name and address.

so when i fill mine in i cross the back.

i would like to know what our embassy thinks about it.or i exspect they cant be bothered.

[Pappap]

How many have actually had to fill in these forms? Just did my 90 day yesterday and no form, no questions asked, in and out as usual..

[MAMMartin]

Whatever you do guys don't give them your TV username you will all be nicked for defamation

[Suradit69]

Thailand's Immigration had two leaks on line revealing names, address, passport numbers, flight details, etc.of foreign nationals. They are rated a high risk by security firms.

Now our bank accounts and personal behavior could be all over the internet?

What about criminals who want to stalk foreign nationals and get into their bank accounts? Thai Immigration could be making a move that will lead to more criminal extortion.

THIS KIND OF INFORMATION COULD EASILY BE SOLD TO CRIMINAL GANGS.

"What about criminals who want to stalk foreign nationals and get into their bank accounts?"

Every person who has ever transferred money to my account or received money transferred from my account (and employees working for those businesses) and everyone working at the banks or who process annual renewal of extensions of stay at immigrations, et al has my bank account number without bothering to stalk me. I don't see criminal gangs paying a lot for bits of information that's easily obtained through other means.

Some of the old dears on Thai Visa are sounding more and more like little old ladies nattering over the garden fence. Or else they have something to hide. They probably disseminate more information about themselves every time they get on the Internet than they will with these forms.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Suradit69

[Inepto Cracy]

Load of crap. Bangkok are trying this.

Official ruling from Phuket Immigration, they wont use the form and it is illegal to get or use, private information. I was told face to face by the big guy at Phuket Immigration, that if he were a farang, he would not answer the questions. It is legally in breach of your Privacy rights. End the thread of lies please.

[Jesse123]

How many have actually had to fill in these forms? Just did my 90 day yesterday and no form, no questions asked, in and out as usual..

Same for me in Hua Hin

[Jim walker]

Why not just put a tickbox with are you a wanted criminal yes or no if they tick the yes box then quickly nab them on the way into Thailand

[Suradit69]

How many have actually had to fill in these forms? Just did my 90 day yesterday and no form, no questions asked, in and out as usual..

Likewise. Did my report a week or so ago. No forms to fill in or questions asked.

[keskeseksa]

Why all the fuss? It's just a survey. Just write anything you like.

[grantbkk]

The conversation has been going on a couple of days and the form seems to be the work product of some misguided mid-manager in a single satellite office of Thai immigration. Clearly he has overstepped his authority and this will soon go away later to be classified as a April Fools joke.

If not, I going another way on this. I will take the time and submit a complete (sort of) guide to my movements in the Kingdom. They have to input the information somewhere in a database. I figure if this does come to pass I will photocopy the first 5,000 word response and use it to resubmit each time I have to visit immigration. If a few of us did this the system would soon become overwhelmed and collapse.

If I were a criminal I think my form might contain false information that would be no help to anyone.

[awayego]

Yet another dictum emerges from the bowels of a gubernatorial office with no apparent research, no prior warning, no explanation and apparently no uniform prior knowledge by most immigration departments around the country........SNAFU

Just as a matter of interest, does this "dictum", issued by a Depute Commissioner in the Immigration Bureau, have any relevance under present Immigration Law? Wouldn't it have to have the authority of legislation behind it, rather than the mere whim of an individual, in order to be enforced nationwide?

Twitter just links to an email which links to nothing. Again you are assuming that the criminal-to-be is on an extension and has a bank account. Many can get by just using an ATM linked to their home account.

Personally, I'm not gonna ever give any false information but I'll be cautious as to what information I provide as one of these days I might decide to become a criminal.

Public profiling..... this is non of their business.... Immigration concentrates only on the validity of documents, background checks with those documents with the authorities back home, who have the competency to answer any question related to the person. They have no need for social information, with whom one associates, hangs out or plans to go. In Germany a country that knows much about this profiling and abusing...under nazism and also the STASI in the Eastern block. People are not obliged to give their ID or copies of it to people who have nothing to do with the law. Even Banks will not disclose any information of a person unless parties have agreed with each other. Prying into personal life is not vouched for every tom dick and harry, who is looking to find a reason to make a case.

Foreigners recognise your rights you are only obliged to give details of where you are staying and how long you have stamped on your travel document. The rest is not anyones business. They cannot control their own lot...let alone follow up on the local crimes, they are thinking of international.....Good luck

Totally agree!

Well so far I'm overly concerned about any of the information they might ask for on the form even if they do ask for it at some point when I have reason to go to my local Immigration office.

But if they do genuinely ask for it, I doubt I would ever say to them point-blank to their face: That is none of your BIZ-NESS!

Well, if I AM asked to give such private and personal information, I will most definitely tell them, in the nicest possible smiling way, that it is simply NOT their business. End of. (Yes, maybe 'end of' my ten year plus stay in Thailand too!)

[GarryP]

It is an invasion of privacy. I believe if it were tested in the Administrative Court, they would be barred from gathering some of the information they are seeking. Perhaps, you could also demand confirmation of the security used to store such information when the tabled data privacy legislation comes into force.

[Inepto Cracy]

Which shops, clubs and restuarants do you frequent? Any that take my fancy.

Which car do you drive, any one I want, I have five.

What social media do use, All of the sh.. except whats up.

[TPUBON]

April 5th I went to immigration at Phibun to renewal my visa. Everything went smooth. The only new item was them asking me for the name of my bank. No account number or amount, just the name which happens to be in the U.S.

If you have to start listing all of the places you frequent, I could see a very very long list.

[NongKhaiKid]

I'm surprised this idea ever took hold because, as a Pol Maj Gen said, it will create more work for the Immigration Bureau.

[crazydrummerpauly]

Don't you people have any accounts you use for obvious "junk?" For example, I have an Excite.com email address for just such an occasions, and you can make a mistaken typo when filling out any of the other items.

Exactly - i am a 'woman' in a GMX mail account. Free identity-loose emails are the big loophole. And for max anonymity, create it at a free public net connection and not at home.