"Contract" Teachers

[JAG]

Interesting development on day 1 of Term.

The school I teach at runs an English Program . they call it "Gifted" - the children aren't, but their parents are prepared to pay extra...

Anyway, last year it was largely staffed by Filipinos, who were payed very little, but accommodated by the school. I have to say it seemed a waste of time, I remember waiting outside a classroom whilst a teacher banged on , in English, about soil characteristics, to a class of confused 10 year olds who could just about muster the English to explain how to get to the Bus Station, (the subject of my pending lesson). Anyway, today we were graced by a couple of young Thai teachers, speaking excellent English, who have arrived to teach Mathematics. They are employed by outside contractors, wear their company "uniforms" complete with company logo. They explained to me that they are not allowed to speak Thai in the school, so that the children "will think that they are foreigners"! Their English is remarkably good, with an accent is far less marked than the Filipinos who they have replaced, but they are still very obviously Thai.

It must be costing the school a fortune to hire them in. The only reason I can imagine is that it is an attempt to boost the exam results, which last year for EP students were less than stellar.

I think the company is called "True Wit" ! Has anyone else encountered them?

Edited May 16, 2016 by JAG

[tonray]

No...I teach 'Gifted' also. Some classes are truly better and some just not. But having a NES or near NES with students whose proficiency level is low to start with does not really help....it's the method of increasing their vocabulary, helping them naturally construct sentences and build dialogues that really brings results.

Edited May 16, 2016 by tonray

[Rob13]

Mai cau jai. If the problem is the kids got low test scores because they aren't understanding the classroom English, how is hiring Thai people who are only allowed to speak English going to be of any help? Or did I miss something?

[lostinisaan]

They are employed by outside contractors, wear their company "uniforms" complete with company logo. They explained to me that they are not allowed to speak Thai in the school, so that the children "will think that they are foreigners"! Their English is remarkably good, with an accent is far less marked than the Filipinos who they have replaced, but they are still very obviously Thai.

I've met some brilliant Thai English teachers and just recently a lecturer of a university with a Doctorate degree from the UK, including teaching/lecturing experience from the UK and the States, He's the father of one of my students and it turned out that the private university where he's currently employed pays him less what my smaller primary school pays me. ( I'm on 33 K /month now)

It gave me a very bad feeling. This guy is Thai, highly qualified with a perfect English ( Queen's English) and earns less money than I?

A big and well- known primary school with an EP in lower northeast hired a Filipino last year who wasn't able to understand very easy questions when an American was asking him about his teaching load.

When more and more people/ parents/ foreign teachers complained about this guy, they tried to save face by telling all that he wouldn't teach English, "only science."

"Only science'? Teaching grade one kids who never had English before, what the difference between living and non- living things would be, is already a tough one.

How do you teach more advanced science in English if you can't even have a simple conversation with a NES teacher?

[JAG]

Mai cau jai. If the problem is the kids got low test scores because they aren't understanding the classroom English, how is hiring Thai people who are only allowed to speak English going to be of any help? Or did I miss something?

They are employed by outside contractors, wear their company "uniforms" complete with company logo. They explained to me that they are not allowed to speak Thai in the school, so that the children "will think that they are foreigners"! Their English is remarkably good, with an accent is far less marked than the Filipinos who they have replaced, but they are still very obviously Thai.

I've met some brilliant Thai English teachers and just recently a lecturer of a university with a Doctorate degree from the UK, including teaching/lecturing experience from the UK and the States, He's the father of one of my students and it turned out that the private university where he's currently employed pays him less what my smaller primary school pays me. ( I'm on 33 K /month now)

It gave me a very bad feeling. This guy is Thai, highly qualified with a perfect English ( Queen's English) and earns less money than I?

A big and well- known primary school with an EP in lower northeast hired a Filipino last year who wasn't able to understand very easy questions when an American was asking him about his teaching load.

When more and more people/ parents/ foreign teachers complained about this guy, they tried to save face by telling all that he wouldn't teach English, "only science."

"Only science'? Teaching grade one kids who never had English before, what the difference between living and non- living things would be, is already a tough one.

How do you teach more advanced science in English if you can't even have a simple conversation with a NES teacher?

Exactly!

[Colabamumbai]

From my experience of nearly 5 years teaching in Thailand, Thai students are not really interested in learning English. None of them spoke it out of the class, unless it was to me.

[sanukjim]

I have met some well educated and capable Thai English teachers that are far more capable then these "back packers" hired in these phony schools.Wealthy local and foreign parents are foolish enough to be seduced into thinking (by theses schools) that "a white faced foreigner that can utter some what English " can educate their children in a proper Western way.So these educated Thai teachers even though they would be better for the children's education are put on a lower tier.But The government will not change this t".In my opion"

[tezzainthailand]

Yes Jag, the school I teach at has two Thais employed by 'True Wit' and both have adopted western names for school hours. They are very good, and often ask me for advice on matters 'English' . They also are separated from other Thai teachers, so it's just the three of us in the one room, however the students and staff must know they are Thai. How can you hide your Thainess?

[bazza40]

The Filipinos were "payed very little"? And you're teaching English? Good grief.

[mesterm]

Are these "contractors" Thai Chinese? Is that why they may be thought not to be Thais?

[neeray]

Thanks bazza40 for beating me to it. Glad to see you "paid" attention.

To go on, Filipinos are taught English but good luck trying to understand one. But they do write good English. I prefer texting with my Filly friends over verbal communications. It really is nice to understand the conversation.

[Rob13]

The whole idea of hiring a Thai to teach Thai students and then try to pass him off as a foreigner is beyond absurd. The admin of that school holds a pretty low opinion of their students.

[abrahamzvi]

I have met some well educated and capable Thai English teachers that are far more capable then these "back packers" hired in these phony schools.Wealthy local and foreign parents are foolish enough to be seduced into thinking (by theses schools) that "a white faced foreigner that can utter some what English " can educate their children in a proper Western way.So these educated Thai teachers even though they would be better for the children's education are put on a lower tier.But The government will not change this t".In my opion"

I entirely agree that there are some Thai most qualified English teachers. However, it is the Thai parents who consider Thais incapable of teaching their children a foreign language and therefore the private schools, or even the public ones with the 'extra" English classes, are not able too employ the highly qualified Thais. The result is that very few Thais are prepared to invest years of studies in getting properly qualified, as they know that their chances of getting a proper position are really minimal.

The solution: In my view, the government has to reduce the number of work permits to foreign teachers and the schools must prove that they are unable to find the right Thai teachers, before they are granted the work permit to a foreign teacher. Within a certain period of say 10-15 years, there won't be a necessity to employ foreign teachers, as more capable Thai young people will get the proper qualifications, knowing that if they do, they will get decently paid positions.

[cbuddha]

This article about companies employing Thai teachers to pose as foreigners made the rounds a few months ago:

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1454995350

[JAG]

The Filipinos were "payed very little"? And you're teaching English? Good grief.

I

Deleted. Second thoughts and all that.

Edited May 17, 2016 by JAG

[1phish2phish]

Schools employ non degreed persons, obviously more job insecure to counter their need to sign legitimate, legal degreed applicants for higher, proper wages. Part of the zombie brigade. Thailand, hub of zombie teachers.

Check Craigslist.org. Many ads for pretty much anybody willing to work for 30k or less. All the small agencies will consider contractors. Some schools seem to be getting very desperate.

Edited May 17, 2016 by 1phish2phish

[BruceMangosteen]

How can you hide your Thainess?

Many Thai ladyboys in Nana Plaza are able to hide their gender(at birth gender). Don't think for a second a Thai hired as a teacher under such a stipulation as "no Thai is to be spoken" can't hide his/her "Thainess". Another example is when a "bargirl" says she actually likes the farang twice or triple her age and it isn't about the money after all.

[sanukjim]

The Filipinos were "payed very little"? And you're teaching English? Good grief.

anouther of these back packer teachers no doubt.

[jerome2]

The thais who speak good english dont want to teach for the money they get... teaching is a vocation... teaching thais children is a priesthood

[1phish2phish]

How can you hide your Thainess?

Many Thai ladyboys in Nana Plaza are able to hide their gender(at birth gender). Don't think for a second a Thai hired as a teacher under such a stipulation as "no Thai is to be spoken" can't hide his/her "Thainess". Another example is when a "bargirl" says she actually likes the farang twice or triple her age and it isn't about the money after all.

Sorry, maybe Ladyboys can hide their gender because it's something you want to believe but, no As for bar girl types the punter is actually convincing himself. Another error.

I think over the course of a short time it would be evident they are Thai unless they claimed to be from neighboring country or NES from the West of Thai decent.

We should applaud Thais finally taking control over their lack of speaking the world's lingua franca. Good on em' it's a start.

Edited May 17, 2016 by 1phish2phish

[SilverBeast]

How much are English teachers getting paid over there these days? I'm 32 myself with minimal teaching experience or training but I'd give teaching English a go. My degree is in Computer Science and I'm currently working in my field in Canada. When I can retire early and go to Thailand I would consider it. The wife is from Isaan and has a PhD from a University here in Canada in Engineering. She's considered teaching at a University in either Khon Kaen or Kalasin. Not sure I want to go to quickly though.

Staying here for now building capital so that I could maybe retire early...

[gemguy]

Hmmmm

Since I first came here in 1979 I have been aware that the Thai government authorities wanted to teach the Thai children English language.

Here we are, 36 years later and the Thai children and the citizens of Thailand, over all, still remain very, very sloooooooow learners.

Of course there are more Thai people speaking English now as it is a percentage factor based on English being the most common language spoken by everyone, so some of it will rub off ...so to speak.

Most bar girls learn English faster than the educational system teaches the Thai children English language

Meantime, after nearly 40 years of successive Thai government administrations continually promoting the English language in their educational programs the success rate is dismally low.

Why is that??

What is it about the Thai mentality of every Thai person that seemingly blocks their ability to learn the English language...or they struggle with it immensely.

As pointed out by the majority of teachers, the children do not want to learn or they are totally disinterested.

Either way, they are failing

Give them a "D" and ignore their protests.

Cheers

[BugJackBaron]

Hmmmm

Since I first came here in 1979 I have been aware that the Thai government authorities wanted to teach the Thai children English language.

Here we are, 36 years later and the Thai children and the citizens of Thailand, over all, still remain very, very sloooooooow learners.

Of course there are more Thai people speaking English now as it is a percentage factor based on English being the most common language spoken by everyone, so some of it will rub off ...so to speak.

Most bar girls learn English faster than the educational system teaches the Thai children English language

Meantime, after nearly 40 years of successive Thai government administrations continually promoting the English language in their educational programs the success rate is dismally low.

Why is that??

What is it about the Thai mentality of every Thai person that seemingly blocks their ability to learn the English language...or they struggle with it immensely.

As pointed out by the majority of teachers, the children do not want to learn or they are totally disinterested.

Either way, they are failing

Give them a "D" and ignore their protests.

Cheers

I am a NES teacher and have a Thai gf with pre-intermediate level English.

My Thai is improving so fast as almost nobody in the province (Rayong) speaks English - with rare exceptions of course. Certainly nobody else in her family. People out here just don't need to know it. So it goes.

[Rob13]

I thought Rayong is where that big oil refinery is, must be a few people using English out there.

[fiddlehead]

The way I see it: The bar girls WANT to learn to speak English.
The school kids don't.
That makes a BIG difference.

Somehow, they need to be given more of a reason to learn English.
Perhaps start putting cartoons on TV in English with Thai sub-titles?

[gemguy]

The way I see it: The bar girls WANT to learn to speak English.

The school kids don't.

That makes a BIG difference.

Somehow, they need to be given more of a reason to learn English.

Perhaps start putting cartoons on TV in English with Thai sub-titles?

"Somehow, they need to be given more of a reason to learn English."

Or pay them to learn English as that will appeal to their Mentality....lol

"Now Kids....If you pass this English examine ( without cheating ) then you will win 500 baht".......and have 1st and 2nd and 3rd place awards

Cheers

[BugJackBaron]

I thought Rayong is where that big oil refinery is, must be a few people using English out there.

Engineers and upper managers in international companies who need to meet with Japanese or other foreigners learn enough English of course. But not the average person in CK Plaza (the shopping mall here). Even at Nissan , I think they have very few staff with reasonable English. But this is not a tourist province or centre like Pattaya so there is less need....

[ThaiRich]

No...I teach 'Gifted' also. Some classes are truly better and some just not. But having a NES or near NES with students whose proficiency level is low to start with does not really help....it's the method of increasing their vocabulary, helping them naturally construct sentences and build dialogues that really brings results.

I think it is important to have those students with low proficiency start with a NES or near NES. We wouldn't want to be filling young minds with bad pronunciation and bad grammar habits. Remember, what we learn first is what we remember the best. So if in the beginning we allow someone with a low proficiency of English to teach sa-poon(spoon), sa-cool(school), fie(five), tree(three), se-wen(seven), ta-welve(twelve), ta-wen-ty(twenty) or any other vocabulary incorrectly it becomes nearly impossible in the classroom setting to over come that. Not only is it difficult(nearly impossible) to over come bad pronunciation in a classroom setting, it also makes the student unable to understand when the word is spoken correctly, salad(sa-laud) or spaghetti(sa-pa-get-thee).

Edited May 18, 2016 by ThaiRich

[tonray]

No...I teach 'Gifted' also. Some classes are truly better and some just not. But having a NES or near NES with students whose proficiency level is low to start with does not really help....it's the method of increasing their vocabulary, helping them naturally construct sentences and build dialogues that really brings results.

I think it is important to have those students with low proficiency start with a NES or near NES. We wouldn't want to be filling young minds with bad pronunciation and bad grammar habits. Remember, what we learn first is what we remember the best. So if in the beginning we allow someone with a low proficiency of English to teach sa-poon(spoon), sa-cool(school), fie(five), tree(three), se-wen(seven), ta-welve(twelve), ta-wen-ty(twenty) or any other vocabulary incorrectly it becomes nearly impossible in the classroom setting to over come that. Not only is it difficult(nearly impossible) to over come bad pronunciation in a classroom setting, it also makes the student unable to understand when the word is spoken correctly, salad(sa-laud) or spaghetti(sa-pa-get-thee).

I agree...but many Thai school directors simply do not want to pay the "mon-eeeee" to get a NES>

[gemguy]

No...I teach 'Gifted' also. Some classes are truly better and some just not. But having a NES or near NES with students whose proficiency level is low to start with does not really help....it's the method of increasing their vocabulary, helping them naturally construct sentences and build dialogues that really brings results.

I think it is important to have those students with low proficiency start with a NES or near NES. We wouldn't want to be filling young minds with bad pronunciation and bad grammar habits. Remember, what we learn first is what we remember the best. So if in the beginning we allow someone with a low proficiency of English to teach sa-poon(spoon), sa-cool(school), fie(five), tree(three), se-wen(seven), ta-welve(twelve), ta-wen-ty(twenty) or any other vocabulary incorrectly it becomes nearly impossible in the classroom setting to over come that. Not only is it difficult(nearly impossible) to over come bad pronunciation in a classroom setting, it also makes the student unable to understand when the word is spoken correctly, salad(sa-laud) or spaghetti(sa-pa-get-thee).

You are correct of course....but that can be challenged.

When people, who are not native speakers, are trying to learn the English language and they are been taught the language correctly and by the book, so to speak, with all the numerous details involved, most of them just give up while they feel the language is impossible to learn.....and... they are afraid to speak English because they worry people will laugh at their poor English skills.

They hear the teachers telling them they are wrong, wrong, wrong all the time it frustrates them .......because to them, there seems to be far too many details to remember.

Meantime, the beautiful thing about the English language is no matter how badly some one speaks the language, 9 times out of ten you can easily understand WHAT they are trying to say and figure out what it is they want or what it is they mean ...even with bad accents and poor grammar and words placed in the wrong order and garbled sounding words coming out of their mouths you quickly enough realize what they are saying....resulting in :

You understand them.

When I hear Thai people speaking English poorly I do not judge them or try to correct them per say as I still understand what they are trying to say or what they mean ...so, when I hear them say: "Seh-wen" instead of "Seven" or "Sa-poon" instead of "Spoon" and any number of words that they are speaking incorrectly, it does not matter to me as I can still communicate with them and understand them and what they are trying to say or the meaning of what they have said...even if poorly spoken.

When you learn Thai language, the most common complaint is how the Thai people you are speaking with all too often can not figure out what you are talking about because you are not speaking some or many of the Thai words correctly or using the words correctly or your accent is interfering with the sound of the words you are attempting to speak and the way they are used to hearing the words spoken all the time by other Thai people...including the mannerisms in which Thai people speak to one another.

When they hear a foreigner speaking, many of them completely do not understand what you have said and think you have just spoken a totally foreign language and they can not figure out what you are trying to say, as they are totally thrown off ...even if you pick up the glass, for example and show it to them and attempt to say the Thai word for glass, they are still dumbfounded because you did not say it correctly and they do not connect the meaning of what you are trying to say.

If a Thai person says: I ..I ....Gwass...Gwass ...and I hear that, I can quickly realize what they are trying to say .... and specifically if they pick up the glass and show it to me....... I get the connection...while it does not really matter that they say: "Gwass" ...."Gwass" ..instead of "Glass"..."Glass"...I understand...I figure it out quick enough.

But the Thai language, all too often, has to be spoken more or less precisely and near perfectly and if not spoken more or less precisely then you have lost them and often enough they do not recover ...so you have to try the English word and often enough they know that particular English word or you have to try using some other Thai words ( if you know enough of them ) that will result in them finally understanding what it is that you are trying to say ...but often enough they are sort of dumbstruck by your inability to say a particular word or several words precisely and the way they are used to hearing it spoken to them by Native Thai speakers all the time.

Point being...the easier communication aspect of the English language is a big part of why the English language is so widely spoken....even if spoken incorrectly...as most often they do speak it incorrectly ...but ....we understand what they are talking about.

Cheers

Edited May 18, 2016 by gemguy