Obama: Trump ‘woefully unfit’ to be President

[lannarebirth]

3 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Do you think there are states in which demographics won't change?  Why should demographic change prevent the ideal of one person, one vote, all votes of equal weight, majority rule?

 

Because you made it about a specific outcome, ie: Bush and Trump.  I happen to think the Electoral College is a highly prescient, super elegant process that accounts for all Americans now and in the future.

[heybruce]

11 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Do you think there are states in which demographics won't change?  Why should demographic change prevent the ideal of one person, one vote, all votes of equal weight, majority rule?

 

2 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

 

Because you made it about a specific outcome, ie: Bush and Trump.  I happen to think the Electoral College is a highly prescient, super elegant process that accounts for all Americans now and in the future.

I mention Bush and Trump because they are two recent examples of the flaws of the Electoral College.  And you did not answer the question.  The link you provided described demographic change happening everywhere.  The EC won't keep that from influencing election results, but it will continue to make votes unequal.

[lannarebirth]

31 minutes ago, heybruce said:

 

I mention Bush and Trump because they are two recent examples of the flaws of the Electoral College.  And you did not answer the question.  The link you provided described demographic change happening everywhere.  The EC won't keep that from influencing election results, but it will continue to make votes unequal.

 

My post wasn't intended so much to show demographics as migration patterns which have an equalizing affect in themselves. I'm not sure we're going to find common ground though because I just don't buy into your nationwide popular vote theory. I do buy into the popular vote of each state being meaningful however. I personally believe it was a brilliant process that was amended to the Constitution even when it hasn't always produced the outcome I would have preferred. I am not in favor of changing it and I think those people who are are being shortsighted.

[sjaak327]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The US belongs to ALL the citizens, not just a majority in a few cities. why should a rich liberal in San Fran have more ability to elect a president for her, than a poor farmer in Texas to elect a president for him? The EC recognizes that different states have different druthers and stops one side winning every time.

But by making votes not matter the US can never belong to all citizens. In fact, it belongs to about 50% of inhabitants of the main swing states, all the rest don't matter.

 

Democracy means that the poor farmer's votes counts just as much as the liberal's vote from San Francisco. That there might be more liberals in San Francisco then poor farmes in some town in Texas is all part of the game.

[MajarTheLion]

18 hours ago, heybruce said:

Four years tops, if the country can survive.  As soon as the farm states realize that ending trade deals and imposing tariffs on imports will shut down their access to overseas markets, and that keeping out immigrants will leave many crops rotting in the fields, farm state support for the clueless one will plummet.  The realization that trade barriers won't bring back high paying manufacturing jobs to the country (unless you have expertise in robotics) will eliminate another block of supporters.  All he'll have left will be the Alt-Right and the KKK.

 

Ending trade deals? Gee, that's funny: I could have sworn I heard Trump say he wants to dump and then RENEGOTIATE NAFTA.

 

As for the KKK, they're history. They're nothing but a few thousand losers roaming the hills in their pickup trucks. You really need to come up with new scare tactics. Frankly, it looks silly babbling about the KKK when Black Lives Matter is actively rioting, calling for violence against others while cop deaths from shootings skyrocket.

 

And if tariffs are OK for Barack Obama, why are you now suddenly against them? Me, I'm against them no matter who's president. I suspect you'll find Trump is negotiating when he warns of tariffs. Watch and see.

 

You see, he's had real, actual success in the real world and understands how things work in the real world-  unlike our clueless  and communist moron with his snappy teleprompter we have in the White House right now.

Edited November 25, 2016 by MajarTheLion

[heybruce]

8 minutes ago, MajarTheLion said:

 

Ending trade deals? Gee, that's funny: I could have sworn I heard Trump say he wants to dump and then RENEGOTIATE NAFTA.

 

As for the KKK, they're history. They're nothing but a few thousand losers roaming the hills in their pickup trucks. You really need to come up with new scare tactics. Frankly, it looks silly babbling about the KKK when Black Lives Matter is actively rioting, calling for violence against others while cop deaths from shootings skyrocket.

 

And if tariffs are OK for Barack Obama, why are you now suddenly against them? Me, I'm against them no matter who's president. I suspect you'll find Trump is negotiating when he warns of tariffs. Watch and see.

 

You see, he's had real, actual success in the real world and understands how things work in the real world-  unlike our clueless  and communist moron with his snappy teleprompter we have in the White House right now.

"I could have sworn I heard Trump say he wants to dump and then RENEGOTIATE NAFTA."

 

Yes, dump = end.  Renegotiating is a long, difficult and uncertain prospect.  During that time the $21 billion a year in agricultural exports to Mexico can be expected to decline. https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/americas/mexico 

 

"You see, he's had real, actual success in the real world and understands how things work in the real world"

 

I'm not sure if Trump's silver spoon fed life qualifies as real world experience.  He's also not held in very high regard among the business elite:

 

"ALTHOUGH he styles himself as a chief executive who can turn the country around, Donald Trump is an outsider in the world of American business. His commercial operation is tiny by the standards of the country’s mega-firms and few of their bosses have ever viewed the president-elect as an equal or ally." http://www.economist.com/news/business/21710005-businesses-may-come-love-or-fear-donald-trump-either-way-they-will-have-make  

 

 

[Opl]

recording obtained by The Washington Post captures what New York reporters and editors who covered Trump’s early career experienced in the 1970s, ’80s and ’90s: calls from Trump’s Manhattan office that resulted in conversations with “John Miller” or “John Barron” — public-relations men who sound precisely like Trump himself — who indeed are Trump, masquerading as an unusually helpful and boastful advocate for himself, according to the journalists and several of Trump’s top aides.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/05/13/transcript-the-full-text-of-john-miller-interview-about-donald-trump-with-people-reporter/?tid=a_inl

 

 

Edited November 25, 2016 by Opl

[Andaman Al]

8 hours ago, MajarTheLion said:

Ending trade deals? Gee, that's funny: I could have sworn I heard Trump say he wants to dump and then RENEGOTIATE NAFTA.

Yes , you can also swear that you heard him say he was going to build a wall, repeal Obamacare, appoint a special prosecutor to put Hillary in Prison, 'empty the swamp', deport 11 million immigrants, show his tax returns, put his businesses in a blind trust, had no relationship with the Russians, the elections would be rigged and the electoral college system was a disgrace, etc etc etc, but apart from all of that you should be able to rely on him doing whatever he says.

[Briggsy]

I would put money on the idea that Trump wants to send Kushner to talk to Israelis and Palestinians to further the interests of the Trump organisation.

 

"Well, the peace deal didn't happen, we tried folks, but we racked up another annual $30 million in name endorsement deals which is great news. We had to drop some tariffs and agree to more aid funding which will cost around $500 million a year but this is tremendous because these costs can be put on to the taxpayer not my business. Deal done. #MAGA"

Edited November 26, 2016 by Briggsy

[Xircal]

I know conspiracy theories abound already, but I'm intrigued about Trump's apparent admiration for Putin: a man who covertly invaded and annexed up a large slice of another country's sovereign territory and whose record on human rights is abysmal.

 

So why would Trump be so conciliatory towards Russia? Could it possibly be that Trump who has visited Moscow several times was a little indiscreet with a young girl, maybe somebody of around 15 years old and this liaison was surreptitiously filmed and is now being used to blackmail him? It sounds far-fetched I know, but bearing in mind Trump's interest in young women, it's not beyond the realms of possiblity that something like that could have happened.

 

Was Trump assured that arrangements would be made to enable him to win the presidential election and that once in office he'll be expected to dance to the Kremlin's tune or risk being exposed?

 

I'm intrigued as to how this will play out once he's in office if Russia decides on a course which would normally bring about a military confrontation between the US and Russia, such as the latter invading the Baltic States of which all three are NATO and EU members, but Trump turning a blind eye to it.

[Jingthing]

Yes, the trump - Russian connection is deeply disturbing.

 

Americans keep looking away from the election’s most alarming story

Quote

Frighteningly, Putin’s worldview has resonance in the populist and nationalist fixations of Stephen K. Bannon, the president-elect’s senior counselor, whose stated mission is to “destroy” the “establishment” and end the domination of the “donor class.” Bannon’s “closing argument” ad for Trump, redolent of Russian propaganda, described the United States as a corrupt and failing state because of nefarious “global special interests.” It all points to grave danger for democracy and a world order that has kept the peace for 70 years. Is this what America voted for?

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/americans-keep-looking-away-from-the-elections-most-alarming-story/2016/11/25/83533d3e-b0e2-11e6-8616-52b15787add0_story.html?utm_term=.cffa066c6841

 

[pgrahmm]

http://fredoneverything.org/uniquely-talented-only-the-democrats-could-have-lost-to-trump/

 

An interesting read.....

[Andaman Al]

Now here is a man that will be re-elected! Top speech.

 

 

[Jingthing]

Great RESISTANCE speech. Thanks for sharing it.

[Ahab]

The title of this topic always makes me chuckle. A President that was woefully unprepared for the duties required of the President of the United States stating that someone else is unprepared for the job.

[Andaman Al]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Great RESISTANCE speech. Thanks for sharing it.

 

They are only just warming up Jingthing. Now what do the Trumpeteer's think of this speech. I am not interested in comments on Warren, but the factual content.  Trump IS woefully unfit to become POTUS!

 

 

[thehelmsman]

On ‎11‎/‎24‎/‎2016 at 9:40 PM, heybruce said:

Do you recall Trump and his supporters complaining the vote was rigged and the election fixed before the election?  After Trump lost the popular vote by a significant margin but won the electoral college vote I haven't heard a single complaint about the rigged system.

 

The "rigged vote" had to do with media bias and unfair, inaccurate polls, undocumented folks voting, not an inaccurate ballot count.

[metisdead]

A post in violation of fair use policy has been removed. 

[Prbkk]

1 hour ago, Andaman Al said:

 

They are only just warming up Jingthing. Now what do the Trumpeteer's think of this speech. I am not interested in comments on Warren, but the factual content.  Trump IS woefully unfit to become POTUS!

 

 

 

She's in form in this one, just as she was the day she ripped into the sleazebag from Wells Fargo: the problem is she really should have been backing Team Sanders rather than Hillary. Maybe a politically expedient choice but with hindsight looks like a big error of judgement.

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, thehelmsman said:

 

The "rigged vote" had to do with media bias and unfair, inaccurate polls, undocumented folks voting, not an inaccurate ballot count.

"media bias" is subjective.  Many people think the unfair and unbalanced pundits on Fox News were blatantly biased.

 

To my recollection, only Trump and Trumpies thought that polls calling the election close but saying one candidate was leading, though within the margin of error, meant the election was "fixed".

 

The scant evidence of illegal voting has been for both candidates.

 

Who has said the ballot count was inaccurate?

[thehelmsman]

29 minutes ago, heybruce said:

"media bias" is subjective.  Many people think the unfair and unbalanced pundits on Fox News were blatantly biased.

 

To my recollection, only Trump and Trumpies thought that polls calling the election close but saying one candidate was leading, though within the margin of error, meant the election was "fixed".

 

The scant evidence of illegal voting has been for both candidates.

 

Who has said the ballot count was inaccurate?

 

The Dems with help of Green party candidate what's her name are going for a recount in certain states.

[Richard W]

46 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Who has said the ballot count was inaccurate?

One source that, alas, I cannot remember, reported that in one state, Trump did better in counties that used electronic counting than ones that had a paper system.

 

For a more detailed, but different, set of discrepanies, see

 

[heybruce]

7 hours ago, thehelmsman said:

 

The Dems with help of Green party candidate what's her name are going for a recount in certain states.

The Green party has asked for a recount in a few close state where there is reason to believe that electronic voting machines were hacked.  I don't have a problem with that.

[iReason]

Russia Says It Was In Touch With Trump Campaign During The Election

“There were contacts,” Interfax news agency cited Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov as saying. (sub-title)

 

"The Russian government was in touch with members of President-elect Donald Trump’s political team during the U.S. election campaign and knows most of his entourage, one of Russia’s most senior diplomats told the Interfax news agency on Thursday."

 

"Accused by defeated Democratic contender Hillary Clinton of being a puppet of President Vladimir Putin after praising the Russian leader,Trump has dismissed suggestions he had anything to do with the Russian government during the campaign."

 

"But in comments that could prove politically awkward for the president-elect,Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov said there had indeed been some communications. “There were contacts,” Interfax cited Ryabkov as saying.

“We are doing this and have been doing this during the election campaign.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-russia-in-touch-election_us_582475f5e4b0d9ce6fc0e5f4

Edited November 29, 2016 by iReason

[Andaman Al]

4 hours ago, iReason said:

Russia Says It Was In Touch With Trump Campaign During The Election

“There were contacts,” Interfax news agency cited Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov as saying. (sub-title)

 

"The Russian government was in touch with members of President-elect Donald Trump’s political team during the U.S. election campaign and knows most of his entourage, one of Russia’s most senior diplomats told the Interfax news agency on Thursday."

 

"Accused by defeated Democratic contender Hillary Clinton of being a puppet of President Vladimir Putin after praising the Russian leader,Trump has dismissed suggestions he had anything to do with the Russian government during the campaign."

 

"But in comments that could prove politically awkward for the president-elect,Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov said there had indeed been some communications. “There were contacts,” Interfax cited Ryabkov as saying.

“We are doing this and have been doing this during the election campaign.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-russia-in-touch-election_us_582475f5e4b0d9ce6fc0e5f4

Posted 4 hours ago iReason and so far none of the rabid "but but but" responses from the Trumpeteer's. I wonder why? Perhaps supporting treason is a step too far for some of them despite their loyalties.

[Jingthing]

Read trump's latest tweets, if you already didn't realize the president elect is clearly INSANE!

https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump

Voters ... what have you done?

 

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, iReason said:

Russia Says It Was In Touch With Trump Campaign During The Election

“There were contacts,” Interfax news agency cited Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov as saying. (sub-title)

 

"The Russian government was in touch with members of President-elect Donald Trump’s political team during the U.S. election campaign and knows most of his entourage, one of Russia’s most senior diplomats told the Interfax news agency on Thursday."

 

"Accused by defeated Democratic contender Hillary Clinton of being a puppet of President Vladimir Putin after praising the Russian leader,Trump has dismissed suggestions he had anything to do with the Russian government during the campaign."

 

"But in comments that could prove politically awkward for the president-elect,Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov said there had indeed been some communications. “There were contacts,” Interfax cited Ryabkov as saying.

“We are doing this and have been doing this during the election campaign.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-russia-in-touch-election_us_582475f5e4b0d9ce6fc0e5f4

You actually expect any Trump supporter to accept anything in the Huff Post? That would be like us expecting anything from Fox to be accepted by the Clintonites.

[Morch]

7 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You actually expect any Trump supporter to accept anything in the Huff Post? That would be like us expecting anything from Fox to be accepted by the Clintonites.

 

It's not an original story, but a re-hash of one that appeared a few weeks ago. Was carried by many sources.

[Andaman Al]

14 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You actually expect any Trump supporter to accept anything in the Huff Post? That would be like us expecting anything from Fox to be accepted by the Clintonites.

Perhaps you will accept it from Reuters then?

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-russia-trump-idUSKBN1351RJ

[Silurian]

Ah, let's add anti-1st Amendment to the child-president's list. He is against flag burning. Uh oh, better lock up all those poor American Legion members for burning flags! Oh and the Boy Scout troops as well since they also burn old American flags as proper disposal.

 

Trump ignores First Amendment, suggests jail time for flag-burning

http://us.cnn.com/2016/11/29/politics/donald-trump-flag-burning-penalty-proposal/index.html

 

BTW per the American Legion: "The approved method of disposing of unserviceable Flags has long been that they be destroyed by burning, but no ritual for such destruction or ceremony in connection therewith has been adopted..."

Edited November 29, 2016 by Silurian