An Australian trying to retire in Thailand

[yardrunner]

4 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

How long before the UK follows suit?

The UK government put something similar out for discussion three years ago, they decided not to do anything about it as it would be unfair. whether that will change after Brexit is another matter

[Clamhua]

5 minutes ago, norbra said:

If your friend is entitled to the aged pension,he will be paid this immediately on registering with Centrelink. He must have an Australian address and family living there to qualify.

 

 You must have family in Australia to receive a pension? 

[georgemandm]

1 hour ago, F4UCorsair said:

 

 

Never mind that he never contributed to a personal pension fund and now expects the government to keep him for the rest of his life, on an increasing pension, never contributing another cent via GST, never contributing to keeping another Australian in a job through spending locally, because it will all be spent out of the country.

 

If it's a dog food pension, why would he be interested?

 

The rate of tax is high, but not as high as many countries, and how many countries will provide you with free medical services, hip replacement $25,000, heart surgery $60,000, etc.  My partner pays over $150,000 in tax a year, and the only benefit she will ever receive is medication for an ongoing serious condition that costs the taxpayer $3000 a month, and for which she pays $36.00 a month, but even a person paying NO tax is entitled.  My view on that is that the more one contributes, the more one is entitled to in government services.  If you contribute little, you receive little....what's unfair about that?

 

Japan is an advanced, civilized country, but when I was working there, one of my colleagues was telling me that every yen her family members generated went to keeping her  brother, who had cancer, alive, with no government assistance.

 

Your friend may not be a social burden on the Australian government right now, but how many TV members, by their own admissions here on these pages,  go back to their home countries in their old age for free/low cost medical services, after contributing nothing of their taxpayer funded pension for years in Thailand....too many.

 

Paying tax should not be an entitlement to a pension for life.  Tax receipts are for running the country, the costs of government.

 

I paid a LOT more tax than most during my working life, provided for myself, never drawn a cent in government funding, and will never be entitled to anything in my retirement.  Comparing with somebody who earned an average income, based on relative contributions, I should be entitled to a pension of $100,000 pa.

 

I find it offensive that people believe that because they paid tax they are entitled to a pension, dog food pension though it may be, for the rest of their lives.  It's conceivable that because somebody has worked in a menial job for a lifetime, paid little tax, and the effects of inflation, they will receive, via a pension, EVERY  cent they ever contributed in the first few years of retirement, and be kept by the next generation/s of taxpayers.

 

That is OFFENSIVE!!  It's why the treasurer has said the 'age of entitlement' is finished, as it should be.

 

1337markus, they have you snookered just as those drawing a pension and living overseas have future generations of taxpayers snookered.

 

How true is your statement 100% 

good on you for telling them on TV how it works back home in Australia.

[dhream]

some of us won't even get a pension living in australia because we have done a little too well, working, paying taxes, supporting bludgers, useless politicians and an overstaffed public service.

but taking the government to court? no chance, none, nil! particularly not if it hits the public purse.

 

did you follow the court case of the south australian whine grower a few years ago attempting to outlaw compulsory voting? if you thought banana courts only exist in thailand...

 

You CAN take them to court and you CAN win. Luckily, it's not the Thai system, and Judges are beholden to the law of the land, not the parasites in the house on the grassy knoll.

I say again, we should organize and have a crack at the bastards, if anything the underdog gets a fair hearing in Oz, you have to at least concede that.

What have we got to lose in a no fee no win situation. The govt pays costs and pensions if they lose, we pay nada either way...

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[norbra]

Just now, Clamhua said:

 You must have family in Australia to receive a pension? 

You must convince Centrelink that your are not "just" qualifying for the portability,that you actually are now a returning resident for the long term,family is a question they ask about at the interview,next of kin, emergency contact,etc. Maybe family is not compulsory but it sure helps

[xerostar]

And they won't "send" you the pension if you're in another country.

They will deposit it in an Aussie bank and you have to transfer it yourself.

Apparently USA citizens get their pension sent regardless of where they live.

The Aussie government waste millions on overpaying public servants.

e.g. The guy who ran the census fiasco is on $850,000 a year. $300,000 more than the prime minister.

Wasting millions on hair-brained schemes e.g The NBN fiasco.

Canberra is looking more like Brussels every year.  

A huge bureaucracy that is increasing its power in order to justify its own existence.

The state governments are quite capable of doing the job but Canberra calls the shots.

Every Aussie that's paid his taxes should be paid pro rata per year of work period, 

This bull about waiting 2 years such as the OP is told to do, is just plain unfair !

 

[dhream]

To mr. OFFENSIVE.
I pay for private insurance here.
I also contributed to super, which they and their rules screwed with costing me 70 grand.
I never went on the dole.
I don't get a medicare card anymore and still have to file tax as a non resident.
Until politicians get their snouts out of lifetime gold passes on Qantas and Chairmans lounge for life, comcars, junket 1st class overseas 'research' trips they could google , etc etc.
Don't tell us whats OFFENSIVE "mate".

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[dhream]

Also, I don't care what happens in Japan. Keep on message.

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[dhream]

 

As those above have said he will not get the pension while not being "an Australian resident". I had only lived part time here for 2 years and was refused. Three appeals (there is a fourth), refused a requested face to face hearing in Australia, similar time phone hearing as quoted. Born there, 45 years of paying taxes, and still do, and they do not care. My pension would have been minimal, maybe $50 per fortnight, but just wanted to get on the system before they changed the rules again.

 

I know of another Aussie that had been living here for 5 years, went back 6 months before turning 65, got the dole until then and was given a full pension at 65.

 

If anyone is in a similar situation get back there to show you are a "resident" on your 65th birthday.

Sorry, but it is not as simple as that to game the system, your friend is bullshitting at some level.
You cant pop in at 65 and get handed a wad for life (unless you're name is O'Chee, remember him? Served one term as a $enator and retired at 35 with a full lifetime pension!)
That's more OFFENSIVENESS right there.

As another poster mentioned, there are several tests and the 2 year residency requirement to fulfill. Ok if your single, maybe, and can go live in a humpy in Tassie, sucks if you're not.

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[xineohp]

5 hours ago, dhream said:

They're so nice the Aussie government. They own you.
They tax you to death. They never let you actually go.
Nevermind you're not a social burden to them here.
Never mind you've paid your dues already.
Nevermind you can't afford to go and live there for 2 years to get their dog food pension...
Nevermind the dollar is a joke.
I am disengaging from them, I will make my own luck, like I have done my entire life.
Theirs is not the only passport I have, I made sure of that too, while the going was easy, before the west got paranoid about a few idiot ragheads...


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Unfortunately, for an Aussie, paying ones "dues" (taxes) is not linked in any way to receiving a pension (aged or otherwise).  Australia's taxation system is one of the most rigid and pervasive tax systems in the world.  Combined with the 'nanny state' approach to everything it has fast become the place to leave, especially with the influx of Arabs/Muslims becaming a flood.

[xerostar]

3 hours ago, Agent Sumo said:

But georgemandm says Australia is such a great place to live

 

Yes If you can afford it !   Not on the AOAP.  

After you've paid the rent, food and electric bill there's not a lot left to do anything

- except maybe buy a bottle of alcohol and drown your sorrows.

You can live, but it's an existence, not real life.

That's why I want to retire in LOS.

[F4UCorsair]

1 hour ago, Old Croc said:

I'm interested in your last sentence.  I'm not an ex politician, but an ex public servant on the old Comsuper scheme. What, or where, is the ruling about  excluding old, pre 2004, pigs from the new tax rules.

The politicians super scheme, for those who were inside the tent pi$$ing out prior to 2004, is a totally different scheme, similar to the 'guaranteed multiple' scheme of private enterprise, but now rare there also. That allows worthless pieces of garbage like Gillard to be on $350,000 tax free, and Bronwyn Bishop on $250,000+, indexed for life.

 

I had a long discussion with a candidate in the recent federal election about the tax on superannuation proposals of the Libs, and he enlightened me, including the post 2004 provisions in the next para.

 

Post about 2004, politicians went onto the same superannuation plans as most workers, 9% contribution, and take your chances.  The information is available online.

 

I don't know anything about the public service super provisions.

 

I think Mark Latham, when he was labor leader, was instrumental in having the change to politicians' super made.

Edited August 26, 2016 by F4UCorsair

[F4UCorsair]

1 hour ago, georgemandm said:

How true is your statement 100% 

good on you for telling them on TV how it works back home in Australia.

 

Thanks georgemandm.

 

Further, I have Private health insurance, in addition to public, a total cost of about $80.00 a week, and a hip replacement cost me over $4000 after being paid what was due by both funds.   To a person without private health insurance, the cost is ZERO!!!

 

I'm sick to death of subsidizing  supporting those who didn't get off their butts and have a go in life.

[F4UCorsair]

1 hour ago, xerostar said:

 

Yes If you can afford it !   Not on the AOAP.  

After you've paid the rent, food and electric bill there's not a lot left to do anything

- except maybe buy a bottle of alcohol and drown your sorrows.

You can live, but it's an existence, not real life.

That's why I want to retire in LOS.

 

It will be not much different from living in any developed country from a cost of living perspective, try Japan, at the risk of being reprimanded by dhdream.....again.  If you're still paying rent when you retire, you've wasted your opportunities in life I have to tell you, and throwing money away in rent will always put you behind the front marker..

 

We have way too many people in subsidized (public) housing in Australia, earning little to qualify, hence paying little/no tax, and therefore contributing nothing to the country, just sucking on the tits of people like me.  

 

It's still a great place to live, but we need to get the bludgers off their butts and to contribute.

 

 

Edited August 26, 2016 by F4UCorsair
spellcheck

[GreasyFingers]

1 hour ago, dhream said:

Sorry, but it is not as simple as that to game the system, your friend is bullshitting at some level.
You cant pop in at 65 and get handed a wad for life

 

He went back to Oz and convinced them that he was a resident even though only there for the last 6 months. You only need to convince the officer that you are a resident

[F4UCorsair]

1 hour ago, dhream said:

To mr. OFFENSIVE.
I pay for private insurance here.
I also contributed to super, which they and their rules screwed with costing me 70 grand.
I never went on the dole.
I don't get a medicare card anymore and still have to file tax as a non resident.
Until politicians get their snouts out of lifetime gold passes on Qantas and Chairmans lounge for life, comcars, junket 1st class overseas 'research' trips they could google , etc etc.
Don't tell us whats OFFENSIVE "mate".

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I'll deal with your last sentence first.   I WILL tell you, and anybody I choose, what's offensive if I desire to do so.

 

I also find the politicians' conduct offensive.  The gold passes were supposed to be traded for 40% pay rises under Gillard, and costly as the gold passes are, they are worth only about 5% of a politician's salary and allowances.  The lower house passed the changes, but it still hasn't been through the senate.  Why?   Because it hasn't been put to the senate!!!  And it never will be.   Bronwyn Bishop retains her gold pass entitlement, but shouldn't have.

 

Re Comcars, Turnbull told me in an email, after I took him on for rorting his travel allowance (also Gillard), that he takes the train to work.  What he didn't tell me was that a Comcar collects him from home, drops him at the station, and picks him up from the station in the city, to take him to the airport, SAME Comcar.

[F4UCorsair]

1 hour ago, dhream said:

Also, I don't care what happens in Japan. Keep on message.

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I'm terribly sorry of going "off message", you have no idea how sorry, but comparing with other developed countries, I consider relevant.

[Saan]

It has happened to several of my friends, two are back in Australia now doing their time now.

The problem started with Greek immigrants who would stay in Australia for 10 years and go back home to wait until they turned 65 and put their hand out for an Australian pension. And of course they never died. When they died in Greece they died as Greek nationals and the Australian Embassy was not informed. And their families weren't going to loose the pension by telling anyone so Costa lived on and on and.... So to stop this practice the Government introduced this grossly unfair system of two years in Australia before your entitlement is paid to you.

It is a great injustice because when you pay tax you are actually paying into a fund that is a pension fund. Your pension is an entitlement not some favour from the Government of the time.

The then treasurer Peter Costello saw this fund a a piggy bank for the Liberal Government and raided it so the Government is now scrambling trying to cover the cost of pensions.

You can get around it but it is too late if you have already turned 65.

 

[F4UCorsair]

1 hour ago, dhream said:

Why dont we do a class action, no win no fee deal, lets organise! We all hate the gov. Aussie and expat alike. Lets take the slugs on!

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A legal firm will only take on a "no win, no fee" case when they are almost 100% sure of a win, and in the event of a win, the fee is frightening, to the point where you're almost almost better off, or not much worse off, not winning.

[smotherb]

2 hours ago, georgemandm said:

It is you <deleted> , you have no idea what you are saying what the hell has a pension got to do with Australia not being a great place.

it is to stop people  routine the  System and it had been happening for the last 40 years.

so lean why it is like it before you get on here and bring me it to brain dead .

melbourne is the most  Livable city in the world.

Gee georgie, are you getting upset? Ignorance is often the reason for loosing one's temper; you simply do not understand and you jump to conclusions.

[georgemandm]

30 minutes ago, F4UCorsair said:

 

Thanks georgemandm.

 

Further, I have Private health insurance, in addition to public, a total cost of about $80.00 a week, and a hip replacement cost me over $4000 after being paid what was due by both funds.   To a person without private health insurance, the cost is ZERO!!!

 

I'm sick to death of subsidizing  supporting those who didn't get off their butts and have a go in life.

I agree with you 1 million % 

i had my hip replace 4 years ago I had private insurance the cost was $40,000 I paid $1,500 .

were in the world can you get that out side of a great place like Australia.

not having a going at thailand but if you get sick. Here God help you . 

[GreasyFingers]

1 hour ago, xineohp said:

Unfortunately, for an Aussie, paying ones "dues" (taxes) is not linked in any way to receiving a pension (aged or otherwise).

 

When I started paying taxes part of it was put in a special fund for the pension. Politicians being what they are could not stand to not have access to that money sitting there for the future. They changed the rules and put the money into consolidated revenue so they couls spend it. We would be entitled to the pension if they did not change the rules

[F4UCorsair]

1 minute ago, georgemandm said:

I agree with you 1 million % 

i had my hip replace 4 years ago I had private insurance the cost was $40,000 I paid $1,500 .

were in the world can you get that out side of a great place like Australia.

not having a going at thailand but if you get sick. Here God help you . 

 

 

I agree and disagree george.

 

My understanding is that the medical services in Thailand are of a good standard, but not cheap.  Out of interest only, I googled joint replacements at Bumrungrad, and the cost was very similar to Australia, yet dental services are very cheap by comparison, also a high standard.

 

Thailand has been developing a medical tourism industry for some years, and they seem to have done it well.  If you google specialists at a major hospital like Bumrungrad, you'll find a lot of them have qualified in foreign universities, UK, Australia, and US, for example.

[georgemandm]

6 minutes ago, Saan said:

It has happened to several of my friends, two are back in Australia now doing their time now.

The problem started with Greek immigrants who would stay in Australia for 10 years and go back home to wait until they turned 65 and put their hand out for an Australian pension. And of course they never died. When they died in Greece they died as Greek nationals and the Australian Embassy was not informed. And their families weren't going to loose the pension by telling anyone so Costa lived on and on and.... So to stop this practice the Government introduced this grossly unfair system of two years in Australia before your entitlement is paid to you.

It is a great injustice because when you pay tax you are actually paying into a fund that is a pension fund. Your pension is an entitlement not some favour from the Government of the time.

The then treasurer Peter Costello saw this fund a a piggy bank for the Liberal Government and raided it so the Government is now scrambling trying to cover the cost of pensions.

You can get around it but it is too late if you have already turned 65.

 

Very , very true but not just the Greeks ok it was from every country out side of Australia.

but the them government should have stop it back then , I am Australia Greek and I couldn't stand what was going on , now we all pay sorry to say .

and now you have all the bogens back home on the free who never ever work .

[bazza40]

4 hours ago, Aussie69 said:

Your mates lucky to get a pension. I have paid huge taxes all my life, I have contributed much to my country, I have been responsible and saved and planned for my future; what do I get .... NOTHING. I must self fund my entire retirement, medical, etc.

And if you have your money in a self-managed super fund, you can draw whatever you like above the minimum .The earnings of the fund are tax-free in the pension phase. Plus if the fund is invested in Australian shares, you get a full refund of franking credits from the ATO.

I would love to be in your position.I would be, if it wasn't for the abject incompetence of ASIC.

If you are looking for sympathy, I'd suggest you've come to the wrong address.

[georgemandm]

4 minutes ago, F4UCorsair said:

 

 

I agree and disagree george.

 

My understanding is that the medical services in Thailand are of a good standard, but not cheap.  Out of interest only, I googled joint replacements at Bumrungrad, and the cost was very similar to Australia, yet dental services are very cheap by comparison, also a high standard.

 

Thailand has been developing a medical tourism industry for some years, and they seem to have done it well.  If you google specialists at a major hospital like Bumrungrad, you'll find a lot of them have qualified in foreign universities, UK, Australia, and US, for example.

Yes I agree with you , but thailand is great place for plastic surgery yes .

not sure about hips .

but my doctor back home who is one of the best in Melbourne told  infection is high in countries like thailand.

i don't disagree with you at all but if I am to have something like that I would like to do it back , because if I don't pull though I can die in my home country.

[GreasyFingers]

Not sure if the greeks were the problem. Don't you remeber when they were having one of their 'wars' in Lebanon and about 100,000 put up their hands to be airlifted to Australia as they were "Australian pensioners"

[F4UCorsair]

Sounds like your surgeon was David Young or Jon Bare??   If neither, then one from Melbourne Orthopedic Group?

[Laza 45]

7 hours ago, SgtRock said:

Sadly for your friend.

 

I believe he has been given the correct information.

I believe that is true... I have a friend who had to do that..  another downside... having been away from Australia for so long he will lose his Medicare card... that has happened  to me  :-(

 

[bazza40]

13 minutes ago, F4UCorsair said:

 

 

I agree and disagree george.

 

My understanding is that the medical services in Thailand are of a good standard, but not cheap.  Out of interest only, I googled joint replacements at Bumrungrad, and the cost was very similar to Australia, yet dental services are very cheap by comparison, also a high standard.

 

Thailand has been developing a medical tourism industry for some years, and they seem to have done it well.  If you google specialists at a major hospital like Bumrungrad, you'll find a lot of them have qualified in foreign universities, UK, Australia, and US, for example.

It depends. I've found dental stuff such as implants to be far cheaper than in Australia.

Bumrungrad is expensive.I have to have a check cystoscopy every six months. It's considerably cheaper for me to fly back to Australia for the procedure, where with private health insurance it costs nothing.

As georgemandm has noted, infection rates are higher in Thailand. Try visiting one of the toilets in a Thai public hospital, and you'll see why.