Tourist visa warning - too many days in one year

[aussienam]

I am in a huge dilemna.  I am currently living in Thailand, own my own condo near Pattaya, but I am 47 years old medically retired which means I do not yet qualify for the retirement visa.  

I have been staying currently on back to back tourist visas - first one issued in Australia, then a trip to Thai embassy in Vientiane in Laos followed by a recent trip to Cambodian Thai embassy in Phnom Penh.  

I got the biggest shock when in Cambodia as firstly the visa shop I went to said I had too many tourist visas in the year and I had to go to the embassy in person.  

The lady there stated I had stayed too many days in a year in Thailand - more than 270 days.  I had a tourist visa from Dec 2015 to Feb 2016 then returned to Australia, followed by a 60 day visa with 30 day extension from April to July 2016, followed by the Laos trip visa which was another 60 day visa with 30 day extension.  

I am not sure if it is within a calendar year that this 270 day rule applies or is it 270 days in a year between visas issued?  

I had to sweat it out in Phnom Penh for 5 days for them to make a decision.  They asked for copies of all my bank accounts which I provided (thankfully an internet cafe not far away) - obviously to make sure I am able to support myself in Thailand and not work.  

So now I am  unsure of what to do?  Will I get knocked back next time if I apply for another tourist visa?  I heard that the embassy in Phnom Penh is renowned for being one of the strictest in the SEA region.  Are there other embassies that are less strict?  Is the 270 day an actual rule or just a guide to look out for suspicious repeat tourist visa holders?  

I have looked at the ED visa option but it seems from what I have read online that attendance is a minimum of 8 hours a week Thai lessons and that you need to attend 4 days a week minimum as well.  This would not suit me and seems very restrictive - especially as the enrollments are for 6 to 12 months - 6, 12 month ED visas.  

I have read that there are other courses that fall within the ED visa category.  I read about self defense courses in Chiang Mai that are through an ED visa.  

I know that there is the Elite visa option - 500,000 Baht for a 5 year visa.  This is very expensive.  This would be the very last option for me if all else failed.  

Also has the volunteer visa been scrapped?  Or are there organisations that you can work for in Pattaya for 1 -2 days a week? 

Anyone have any suggestions about options as well as advice on tourist visas?  

Thanks. 

 

[ubonjoe]

There is no 270 day rule. That is something the embassy in PP made up.

You can easily get a least two more visas in Vientiane or Savannakhet. Same for Penang Malaysia.

The next time you go to Australia you should try to get a multiple entry tourist visa.

[LongTimeLurker]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

There is no 270 day rule. That is something the embassy in PP made up.

You can easily get a least two more visas in Vientiane or Savannakhet. Same for Penang Malaysia.

The next time you go to Australia you should try to get a multiple entry tourist visa.

 

But doesn't that require you to have a letter from your employer? And the OP is medically retired

[darrendsd]

I agree with Joe, there is no rule for how many days you can spend in Thailand,  I would also add that next time you go back to Oz obtain a new Passport but before this you should have no issues in getting TV's in Laos, (Vientianne and Savanakhet (sp) and Penang

 

You can easily get another year doing this, after this get a new PP and start again assuming the rules on obtaining TV'S have not changed by then

 

[ubonjoe]

15 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

 

But doesn't that require you to have a letter from your employer? And the OP is medically retired

There have been reports of some embassies and consulates accepting proof of retirement or disability income to apply for a METV. His medical disability should be accepted in lieu of working.

[gojdthai2016]

best to just go to savannaket easiest place i have used on many ocassions ,,keep going along with tvs hopefully until 50 thats what i have been doing

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, darrendsd said:

I agree with Joe, there is no rule for how many days you can spend in Thailand,  I would also add that next time you go back to Oz obtain a new Passport but before this you should have no issues in getting TV's in Laos, (Vientianne and Savanakhet (sp) and Penang

 

You can easily get another year doing this, after this get a new PP and start again assuming the rules on obtaining TV'S have not changed by then

 

 

Note on Phnom Penh - in general with a good agent like the one in "Lucky, Lucky Motorcycle Shop," a bank-book with proof of $1000 USD should allow you to obtain up to 3 visas from that consulate per passport.  Given your recent experience, you may want to call first, and see if anything there has changed before trying that location again.

 

As others have noted, both consulates in Laos are easier, but only up to 3 or 4 in one passport between both.  When you get a new passport, the count starts over from zero at the consulates, so be prepared to get a new passport after a set of SETVs.  

 

For long stayers on SETVs, options include: 1+ - Hong Kong, 2 - HCMC, 2 - Penang, 3 - Cambodia, 2 - Vientiene, 2 - Savanahket, 1+ Yangoon.  Some require proof of residence or hotel bookings and/or air-fare (a throwaway ticket). So 3 years worth SETVs per passport are possible, more or less. 

 

As other suggested, if traveling home, and you can qualify for an METV, that will give you about 9 months in-country, before starting this sequence, or returning for another METV (depending on your consulate's policy on back-to-back issuance - every consulate makes up its own special rules and/or exceptions to them).

[Aceman80]

Volunteer visa is still available but it has it own problems,friend in Chiang Mai just got kicked out of country with 10kthb fine,someone did not sign some paper and problems started with immigration.

Visa office next to Jomtien immigration has some ideas if you cannot get TV:s anymore.

[darrendsd]

6 minutes ago, Aceman80 said:

Volunteer visa is still available but it has it own problems,friend in Chiang Mai just got kicked out of country with 10kthb fine,someone did not sign some paper and problems started with immigration.

Visa office next to Jomtien immigration has some ideas if you cannot get TV:s anymore.

 

Do you have a name for this shop please? (i'm not in Pattaya)

[Mrjlh]

Ubonjoe...would he qualify for Investment Visa for buying a Condo.  Not sure how much he paid but is that a possibility?

[Aceman80]

19 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

 

Do you have a name for this shop please? (i'm not in Pattaya)

Sorry,i do not remember the name. Maybe someone can remember??

 

[ubonjoe]

13 hours ago, Mrjlh said:

Ubonjoe...would he qualify for Investment Visa for buying a Condo.  Not sure how much he paid but is that a possibility?

There is no investment visa he could get.

He could apply for an extension of stay based upon investment if the condo he bought qualifies and he can show a total investment of 10 million baht by combining money in the bank if the condo cost less than 10 million.

[alex8912]

15 hours ago, JackThompson said:

 

Note on Phnom Penh - in general with a good agent like the one in "Lucky, Lucky Motorcycle Shop," a bank-book with proof of $1000 USD should allow you to obtain up to 3 visas from that consulate per passport.  Given your recent experience, you may want to call first, and see if anything there has changed before trying that location again.

 

As others have noted, both consulates in Laos are easier, but only up to 3 or 4 in one passport between both.  When you get a new passport, the count starts over from zero at the consulates, so be prepared to get a new passport after a set of SETVs.  

 

For long stayers on SETVs, options include: 1+ - Hong Kong, 2 - HCMC, 2 - Penang, 3 - Cambodia, 2 - Vientiene, 2 - Savanahket, 1+ Yangoon.  Some require proof of residence or hotel bookings and/or air-fare (a throwaway ticket). So 3 years worth SETVs per passport are possible, more or less. 

 

As other suggested, if traveling home, and you can qualify for an METV, that will give you about 9 months in-country, before starting this sequence, or returning for another METV (depending on your consulate's policy on back-to-back issuance - every consulate makes up its own special rules and/or exceptions to them).

Hi. Is there something new about a METV? I have my second one now and was quite sure you CAN NOT stay in country for nine months!  I am quite sure you can come into Thailand for 60 days then extend for 30 days then LEAVE then repeat 60 + 30 and then LEAVE and if your USE BY date has not happened then 60 + 30 again. To make this work you have to leave your home country within a few days of obtaining it ( because the use by date is 180 days later) and your visa trips should probably be 24 to 48 hrs or same day.  Can anyone let me know if I am correct and the post above mine is wrong?  Thank you. 

[louse1953]

18 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

There have been reports of some embassies and consulates accepting proof of retirement or disability income to apply for a METV. His medical disability should be accepted in lieu of working.

Disability pension stops after 4 or 6 weeks,Joe,outside Australia Joe.

[ubonjoe]

1 minute ago, louse1953 said:

Disability pension stops after 4 or 6 weeks,Joe,outside Australia Joe.

That would have nothing to do with applying for a visa.

[claffey]

Perhaps the OP should reconsider living here as using tourist visas to live in a country is, technically, illegal. And some of the people on here seem to be encouraging him to break the law? 

[gk10002000]

18 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

There have been reports of some embassies and consulates accepting proof of retirement or disability income to apply for a METV. His medical disability should be accepted in lieu of working.

So what does one do if they are not working, or have a lot of money, or are retired and have sizable investment income from dividends, interest, or have a pension or social security?  I mean as written the METV requirements seems to not cover so many situations.

 

from the Thai embassy DC, USA

http://thaiembdc.org/tourist-visa-category-tr-multiple-metv/

8. A letter proof of employment ( **we don’t accept pay stubs**)
9. For students, full-time student status proof
10.For self-employed, business license or business registration indicating the applicant’s name.

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

10.For self-employed, business license or business registration indicating the applicant’s name.

In many states it is easy to register a business or company. There is no requirement to show it is a active company or business.

[gk10002000]

1 minute ago, ubonjoe said:

In many states it is easy to register a business or company. There is no requirement to show it is a active company or business.

Yes, it is somewhat easy to do that.  Forming an LLC can be done very easily. But honestly, those METV requirements seem to specify a job proof of employment or a self employed business.  Surely they can't really have meant to exclude people that have pensions, retired military for example or social security?  The only thing odder would be the current recent vietnam one year METV visa now the only option for USA citizens, which is effectively a horrible deal for a casual tourist.

[AYJAYDEE]

10 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

So what does one do if they are not working, or have a lot of money, or are retired and have sizable investment income from dividends, interest, or have a pension or social security?  I mean as written the METV requirements seems to not cover so many situations.

 

from the Thai embassy DC, USA

http://thaiembdc.org/tourist-visa-category-tr-multiple-metv/

8. A letter proof of employment ( **we don’t accept pay stubs**)
9. For students, full-time student status proof
10.For self-employed, business license or business registration indicating the applicant’s name.

 

not for canada

 

Multiple-Entry (METV):

• Passport or travel document with validity not less than 6 months. The passport must be valid for travelling to Thailand.
• Visa application form completely filled out for each passport
• One recent official passport photograph of the applicant taken within six months of application
• An applicant has a permanent resident/a permit of stay in Canada
• A copy of a bank statement showing a balance of the amount equal to no less than 200,000 (Baht) per person or 400,000 (Baht) per family
• A copy of round-trip ticket or itinerary for at least the first trip
• A copy of hotel reservation for at least the first trip

http://www.thaiconsulatevancouver.ca/tourist-visa/

[ubonjoe]

2 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

Yes, it is somewhat easy to do that.  Forming an LLC can be done very easily. But honestly, those METV requirements seem to specify a job proof of employment or a self employed business.  Surely they can't really have meant to exclude people that have pensions, retired military for example or social security?  The only thing odder would be the current recent vietnam one year METV visa now the only option for USA citizens, which is effectively a horrible deal for a casual tourist.

What they show on their website is not always etched in stone. I think if a person proved they were getting a pension or had a disability they would issue the visa. Perhaps contact them and ask about it.

[darrendsd]

21 minutes ago, claffey said:

Perhaps the OP should reconsider living here as using tourist visas to live in a country is, technically, illegal. And some of the people on here seem to be encouraging him to break the law? 

 

Technically illegal? Complete rubbish, there is nothing illegal about it

 

As I have said many times on this forum, if you keep getting issued Tourist visas and Immigration let you in on these visas there is nothing illegal

 

Just so you know illegal means breaking the law, what law has been broken exactly?

 

Please know the facts before posting rubbish

[claffey]

12 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

 

Technically illegal? Complete rubbish, there is nothing illegal about it

 

As I have said many times on this forum, if you keep getting issued Tourist visas and Immigration let you in on these visas there is nothing illegal

 

Just so you know illegal means breaking the law, what law has been broken exactly?

 

Please know the facts before posting rubbish

A tourist visa is for short term visits. Living here indefinitely is not visiting. That's often ignored by immigration but the new regulations over the last few years are a clear effort to hinder people living here on tourist visas. Those are the facts. Otherwise why have they clamped down on people obtaining as many tourist visas in a row as they want?????  

[darrendsd]

26 minutes ago, claffey said:

A tourist visa is for short term visits. Living here indefinitely is not visiting. That's often ignored by immigration but the new regulations over the last few years are a clear effort to hinder people living here on tourist visas. Those are the facts. Otherwise why have they clamped down on people obtaining as many tourist visas in a row as they want?????  

 

No you said people are technically breaking the law 

 

What law is this? Please provide a link to this "law"

 

 

[Saradoc1972]

I am in almost exactly the same situation, mid-forties, retired on a disability pension, have been in Patty for over 2 years now. Used to do that on two multi-entry Non-O visa (*not* Non-OA, I am under 50) issued in Essen, but I skipped the trip back to Germany this years and they ceased issuing those as of mid-August. The "O" in that Non-Imm visa stands for "other", and that covers a stay for the purpose of retirement, the "OA" is just "Other, acknowledged".

 

Anyway, next visa I got myself this late September was a single entry Non-O in Savannakhet, Laos, no probs. Filled in their form and entered under "purpose of visit" the naked truth: "retirement (age 44)" and presented them with the official paper I was on a state pension (bit more complicated than that, but it's definitely not private either) getting a monthly annuity roughly summing up to the Non-OA requirement of 800k Baht per year. I actually had a letter from the German General Honorary Consulate to Pattaya stating I easily beat that requirement with some rental income, but I actually doubt that requirement is valid at all for the Non-O, they just need to be satisfied you can support yourself in Thailand. So maybe half that money should do as per the family O visa.

 

Oh, and I had the original letter being awarded that pension for life and the next letter where it got raised according to some rental statistics translated to Thai by a certified translator, I suppose that helped. Over Christmas I'll be going to Phnom Penh and see if they are as forthcoming. General feeling seems to be Savannakhet or Penang are easier to deal with.

[bamukloy]

40 minutes ago, darrendsd said:

 

No you said people are technically breaking the law 

 

What law is this? Please provide a link to this "law"

 

 

 

No link will be forthcoming because he talks out his arse!

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, alex8912 said:

Hi. Is there something new about a METV? I have my second one now and was quite sure you CAN NOT stay in country for nine months!  I am quite sure you can come into Thailand for 60 days then extend for 30 days then LEAVE then repeat 60 + 30 and then LEAVE and if your USE BY date has not happened then 60 + 30 again. To make this work you have to leave your home country within a few days of obtaining it ( because the use by date is 180 days later) and your visa trips should probably be 24 to 48 hrs or same day.  Can anyone let me know if I am correct and the post above mine is wrong?  Thank you. 

 

Apologies for any confusion.  You are correct about the length of stay per visit during use of an METV - you can leave every 60-days or extend each entry by 30 more days at immigration.  Time "out of country" on these border-bounces can be simply leaving and immediately returning - no need to wait 24 to 48 hours.  This is the primary advantage over obtaining additional Tourist Visas, which usually involves at least one night out of the country.

 

Where I got the 9 months, is that you can leave and return just before the "enter before" date, and receive a final 60-days which can be extended by 30 more.  And, yes, you should obtain the visa as close to departure as possible, to maximize its use - as the "enter before" date will be set from 6 months from the issuance-date.

 

The OP was looking for a way to stay here long-term - the METV can aid in that effort.  But, yes, you do have to leave for a few minutes every 60 or 90 days if using an METV to do so.

 

1 hour ago, claffey said:

A tourist visa is for short term visits. Living here indefinitely is not visiting. That's often ignored by immigration but the new regulations over the last few years are a clear effort to hinder people living here on tourist visas. Those are the facts. Otherwise why have they clamped down on people obtaining as many tourist visas in a row as they want?????  

 

I think you are confusing "Tourist Visas" with "Visa-Exempt Entries."  There has been a crackdown on Visa-Exempt entries, and those staying here long-term have/will be warned/denied entry using that method.  My advise: Visa Exempts should ONLY be attempted for "short term visits," and even then, only if not done with a high frequency.

 

There has been no crackdown on Tourist Visas.  Laos, for example, always had a restrictive limit (even back in the double-entry days), and Cambodia is actually more friendly now, than at some periods in the past.  Vietnam and Myanmar are also being quite friendly, these days. 

 

The only restrictive policy-change for Tourist Visas, recently, is the change-over from offering double and triple entries, to offering only the Single or METV - and the METV being more restricted (useless, for most) than the old double/triple entries were.  Yes, they are keeping closer tabs on us - but they are not preventing people willing and financially able to undertake frequent travel, from living here nearly full-time on Tourist Visas. 

Edited November 2, 2016 by JackThompson

[claffey]

1 hour ago, darrendsd said:

 

No you said people are technically breaking the law 

 

What law is this? Please provide a link to this "law"

 

 

Lying to immigration about your intentions is breaking the law. I don't have time to find the exact law. I have a life...

[darrendsd]

1 minute ago, claffey said:

Lying to immigration about your intentions is breaking the law. I don't have time to find the exact law. I have a life...

 

You can't find it because there is no law, strange how you have time to make untrue claims but no time to find a non existent law 

 

 

[claffey]

41 minutes ago, bamukloy said:

 

No link will be forthcoming because he talks out his arse!

And what would you think of people in your own country who lie about their intentions in order to gain entry to your country? You'd want them deported probably. A tourist visa is for a short term visit. It's not intended for people who want to reside there. Lying to immigration is against the law in every country, including Thailand.