Baht Bus, How Much Do You Pay?

[Jingthing]

The baht buses are a mafia and they aren't going away anytime soon. But the truth is that Pattaya has totally outgrown baht buses. What is really needed is a very organized network of low cost mid-size aircon buses with Bangkok style low fares to cover the entire Pattaya metro area AND taxi meters.

Imagine a Pattaya without baht buses. Imagine the reduced dirty emissions. And clearer roads, especially at baht bus glut areas.

[britmaveric]

I love baht buses to be completely honest and its a fine system. Nothing can beat the convenience or relative low cost IMHO!!!

Just post set prices and everybody pays the same would be the ideal.

[Mighty Mouse]

Baht buses are a quick and convenient way to travel short distances.

The whole system would be so much better if they would disconnect the horns on all vehicles. The constant beep beep drives me crazy.....or crazier.

[Tolley]

I love the convenience of the baht buses and the price of 10 baht is fine by me even if Thais pay 5 baht.

I have not time to worry about 5 baht rather i would put my energies into more important things.

Heck most farangs who catch the buses think nothing of spending 1000baht on drinks and another 1000 baht on a girl yet start to talk about principles and 5 baht.

Get over it and worry about things that are important.

[Jingthing]

We could keep a few around for the tourists like tuk tuks in Bangkok and cable cars in San Francisco.

Complete with crazed yaba headed, baseball-bat toting, manic-beeping drivers ....

Hmmm. Sounds rather like a zoo attraction.

Edited December 11, 2006 by Jingthing

[dgoz]

I pay 5b for a shortish trip and 10b for a longish trip. Never had a problem.

Mine is not a financial or princible decision, I just don't want to give them the extra. Not a big fan of Thai guys or Thai monopolies.

[Mobi]

traffic is bad enough with the mix of baht buses, buses, m'cycle taxis and privately owned vehicles but i reckon we can squeeze another lane in for the metered taxi.

Getting rid of baht busses is the first step to resolve the traffic problem. Just look at the baht busses circling 2nd and beach road - 3 of 4 drive around empty!! Get them off the road would provide ample space for metered taxis.

Besides, you tourists tend to forget that most of the permanent residents here live on the other side of sukhumwit - which is not served by baht busses. Sure, you can charter a bahtbus - for 200 baht. The correct metered fare would be something like 50, and provide a relatively clean indoor aircon'd ride and not riding like cattle in the back of a pickup truck.

I personally have no problems riding Baht bsuses - 10 Baht or whatever - just not bothered.

There is no doubt, however, that the large number of them is a major contributor to traffic congestion on Beach and Second Roads.

TAT and the Pattaya authorities are always banging on about Pattaya being a "WORLD CLASS TOURIST RESORT". They also say a lot of stuff about wanting to attract more "high end" tourists.

A few weeks ago a had a "high end" elderly couple come and stay with me, and they wanted to see the bright lights of Pattaya and Walking Street. They are both able to walk, but somewhat infirm, and there is no way they could get on and off a Baht bus without risking life and limb. So I parked in the Wat near second Road, and we slowly walked the short distance to Walking Street. This was literally the only way we could get there, as my friends would have risked life and limb if I tried try to stop close to Walking Street and let them out.

Of course it was a bit of a night mare trying to cross second Road, and we almost gave up trying to cross the road to get into Walking Street, but we made it in the end by the skin of our teeth. The return walk was equally hair raising for them

World Class tourist resort?

I think not

(but all these problems are fixable - if there is a will to fix them).

Edited December 11, 2006 by Mobi D'Ark

[Jingthing]

Mobi,

Thank you.

Another reason taxi meters are desperately needed in Pattaya.

It is really true that anyone with the slightest physical limitation puts their life at risk boarding a baht bus. So many times the driver speeds up before the passenger can fully get on the bus. Lately, I have actually noticed a trend of more buses not coming to a complete stop at all for boarding. Anyone else noticed this "improvement?"

I am not saying the baht bus mafia which effectively blocks any hope of taxi meters in Pattaya is the fault of any specific baht bus driver. Of course not. I am also not saying paying 10 baht or 100 baht is going to crush this destructive mafia. It really is up to the Thais to start getting the message that this system (talking about the mafia stopping taxis) is indeed limiting the desired gentrification of the resort.

[Rinrada]

The baht buses are a mafia and they aren't going away anytime soon. But the truth is that Pattaya has totally outgrown baht buses. What is really needed is a very organized network of low cost mid-size aircon buses with Bangkok style low fares to cover the entire Pattaya metro area AND taxi meters.

Imagine a Pattaya without baht buses. Imagine the reduced dirty emissions. And clearer roads, especially at baht bus glut areas.

Suppose the 10 Bt fare is inclusive of the drivers contribution to their Carbon Footprints policy.....

[Pattaya_Fox]

Mobi,

Thank you.

Another reason taxi meters are desperately needed in Pattaya.

It is really true that anyone with the slightest physical limitation puts their life at risk boarding a baht bus. So many times the driver speeds up before the passenger can fully get on the bus. Lately, I have actually noticed a trend of more buses not coming to a complete stop at all for boarding. Anyone else noticed this "improvement?"

I am not saying the baht bus mafia which effectively blocks any hope of taxi meters in Pattaya is the fault of any specific baht bus driver. Of course not. I am also not saying paying 10 baht or 100 baht is going to crush this destructive mafia. It really is up to the Thais to start getting the message that this system (talking about the mafia stopping taxis) is indeed limiting the desired gentrification of the resort.

You know jingthing sometimes we have to look at a more down to earth picture of things and look at the reallity of what we are discussing.

We are talking about a co-operative system which allows many Thai people with families to earn a

living and also provides many Thai people with a mode of transport which they can afford (infact some would struggle to pay even the 5 baht).

Your perception and your constant reference to Maffia makes the baht bus drivers and the system sound like something out of the Al capone era.

There are many thousands of tourists who visit Pattaya and they use the baht bus system and find it very convenient and a cheap mode of transport.

Yes there are times when there are many busses running around empty but on a positive note Thai people as well as tourists do not have to wait for any length of time and do not have to walk far in order to board a baht bus.

So in my opinion the baht bus is a well proved form of cheap transport that works.

Should this not be your cup of tea then there are private cars to hire which will whisk you to your desired destination in a more luxurious mode than the maligned baht bus.

But I fear that the gentrification of Pattaya is more in the mind of the dreamer then the real users of this wonderful mode of transport.

P.S. It is always sensible when using any mode of transport to make sure that it has stopped before alighting or boarding.

Edited December 11, 2006 by Pattaya_Fox

[Jingthing]

What a bunch of crapola!

Allowing TAXI CABS in a now MAJOR CITY, and the biggest beach resort in all of Asia is NOT rocket science or impossible. It is politically impossible because of the power of the baht baht MAFIA. It is a mafia. Do not kid yourself. Any Pattaya politician who led a drive to allow taxi meters in Pattaya would most likely be MURDERED. Not like Al Capone? How not?

Chiang Mai made the change. Apparantly, there was alot of resistance including VIOLENCE from Chiang Mai BAHT BUS drivers to allowing taxis in Chiang Mai. But they did it. Congrats to them ...

And I simply don't buy that there couldn't be low cost transport for all locals and tourists without the baht buses. If baht buses were abolished, they could be replaced with mid-size, low cost aircon buses, which could be kept low cost because of very high volume.

And, no, there is no convenient way at all to get any kind of taxi within Pattaya, short of a hired, guess what, BAHT BUS, which will charge you 100 baht for a 35 baht ride.

Edited December 11, 2006 by Jingthing

[britmaveric]

Baht Buses rock and dare say taxi(s) wouldnt find much business to be completely honest.

[Jingthing]

Baht Buses rock and dare say taxi(s) wouldnt find much business to be completely honest.

Wrong again. Taxis would boost business to places all over the metro area.

Do you know what a hassle it is for people without cars or motos to get to out of the way places like some restaurant on Third road or to anyplace off the main road around the hill between Pattaya and Jomtien, for two examples.

What a lack of imagination.

Many people would jump at an aircon taxi (especially groups) to avoid the baht buses.

BTW: Your comment about waiting for a bus to stop before boarding is just insensitive to older and disabled people. Imagine when you are old and infirm. Imagine stuggling to board a baht bus (your ONLY option) and having the bus speed away before you can get your balance, and imagine breaking your neck. Imagine how much such people would just love just the OPTION of hailing an aircon taxi? Imagine ...

Edited December 11, 2006 by Jingthing

[Ploughboy]

Baht buses have their place. There is no need to get rid of them. The problem is there are too many of them and, unless you are willing to risk life and limb with a motor cycle taxi, they have a monopoly. The number congest the roads,pollute the air and result inover charging of tourists to make a living. Some, not, all have a racist pricing policy.

Metered taxis would be a useful addition to Pattya's transport system. There are plenty of them cruising around from Bangkok waiting for their return trip. If they were allowed to pick up metered fares there would be a big improvement. Let market forced decide. If there is no demand they will get no business.

I have some experience with transport systems that are not fully controlled by proper legislation which is properly enforced. They are a major target for organized crime control. There is little doubt that applies to the baht buses of Pattaya. If metered taxis are allowed there will be majot demonstrations, even riots. Loook what happened in Phuket whentaxis were allowed in the airport. There was litterely murder. The greater the choice the less chance for organized crime to flourish.

[Pattaya_Fox]

What a bunch of crapola!

Allowing TAXI CABS in a now MAJOR CITY, and the biggest beach resort in all of Asia is NOT rocket science or impossible. It is politically impossible because of the power of the baht baht MAFIA. It is a mafia. Do not kid yourself. Any Pattaya politician who led a drive to allow taxi meters in Pattaya would most likely be MURDERED. Not like Al Capone? How not?

Chiang Mai made the change. Apparantly, there was alot of resistance including VIOLENCE from Chiang Mai BAHT BUS drivers to allowing taxis in Chiang Mai. But they did it. Congrats to them ...

And I simply don't buy that there couldn't be low cost transport for all locals and tourists without the baht buses. If baht buses were abolished, they could be replaced with mid-size, low cost aircon buses, which could be kept low cost because of very high volume.

And, no, there is no convenient way at all to get any kind of taxi within Pattaya, short of a hired, guess what, BAHT BUS, which will charge you 100 baht for a 35 baht ride.

Didn`t you know that they`ve tried the local bus services without success....and taxi cabs ( I assume that you are talking about metered taxis) would certainly not fit the bill for local Thai people coming and going to work in the area.

The baht bus is an efficient mode of transport ideally suited for both the local Thai people and for tourists who are making short journeys.

Taxi meters in Pattaya as the main mode of local transport will not happen.....the cost of journeys will in itself preclude this form of transport.

Murders....Maffia.........ah! fantasy again...

The baht bus works!

[britmaveric]

Imagine how much such people would just love just the OPTION of hailing an aircon taxi? Imagine ...

Only go a short distance dont need aircon!!! Other options are moto-taxi for longer specific distances, or my two feet.

Think again if you think Taxi(s) would be a hit. We all see how well the aircon bus(s) made out.

[Jingthing]

I am suggesting taxi meters be added as an OPTION to the mix. I don't seriously think there is any hope of trashing the baht bus mafia altogether. There are some who would use them all the time, others would use them to get to more difficult places, and of course, in rain storms, they would basically be fully booked. I find it amazing that anyone can't imagine the need for a pool of taxis in a now major city.

Moto taxis are dangerous. A huge percentage of people will not use them under any circumstances.

There are lots of places in the metro area totally uncovered by standard baht bus routes. Taxis would be great for these businesses. They could advertise and include their taxi card.

Edited December 11, 2006 by Jingthing

[Mobi]

Earlier this year, I took some Thai family to the North Pattaya bus terminal to get a bus back to BKK. It was the end of a 3 day holiday and there were massive queues.

I decided to send them back by taxi. Some baht bus drivers overheard our discussion and offered to procure a taxi for us.

You wouldn't believe the 'cloak and dagger' involved in meeting up with this procured taxi a block away from the bus terminal. And no doubt the Baht bus driver got his commission from the taxi driver.

Brit, you wrong on this. Baht buses are very dangerous for the old and infirm, and I am absloutely positive that meter taxis would be an instant hit. But there would still be a good demand for Baht buses, hopefully with a reduced number on the road.

But it won't happen - the mafia will make sure of that.

Edited December 11, 2006 by Mobi D'Ark

[Gary A]

I am suggesting taxi meters be added as an OPTION to the mix. I don't seriously think there is any hope of trashing the baht bus mafia altogether. There are some who would use them all the time, others would use them to get to more difficult places, and of course, in rain storms, they would basically be fully booked. I find it amazing that anyone can't imagine the need for a pool of taxis in a now major city.

The point of the debate is whether to pay 5 or 10 baht for a baht bus. Now you are suggesting that people would pay 35 baht for a metered taxi to go three or four blocks? I had hoped that the last air con bus scheme would work. I have seen the bright new shiny buses stop and watched people instead jump on a baht bus. Are the air con buses even running anymore? All this mafia stuff is the driver's problem and certainly NOT our problem. Mafia? Your imagination is indeed interesting. The baht buses work and MOST people have no problems.

[britmaveric]

Never said they weren't dangerous to the elderly/infirm or to the healthy furthermore. (got me confused with another poster - me thinks) But in the end you get what you pay for and we can't expect much for 5-10bht.

I'm just imagining 1000 taxi cabs on the roads stopped every min looking for faires who only want to go a few blocks.

Perhaps a taxi rank in a designated area, for those going outside the central city norm?

[Jingthing]

Anyone who doesn't know that baht buses are a mafia isn't paying attention.

Who is talking about using a taxi for a 3 block ride? How absurd. Look at a map. The Pattaya metro area is very spread out and there are lots of areas totally uncovered by anything but moto taxis or chartered baht bus mafia rides (where you might end up paying 5 times a taxi meter for the same time/distance in Bangkok).

Edited December 11, 2006 by Jingthing

[Mobi]

Are you saying that there are not enough working Thais, plus all the thousands of tourists and expat residents to make asucces of a metered taxi service?

Well we'll never know if they don't try it out, will we? I'll bet there would be hundreds of taxis who'd like to give it a try if they were allowed to.

In Bangkok, taxis do fine, and probably 95 % of the customers are Thai. Don't forget they also have a very extensive bus network, plus the Sky tains and the underground. (for which most rides are 25 plus Baht or so a head)

Also, many of the middle class Thais drive their own cars - but there still plenty of Thais who use the thousands of taxis.

Very often, 3 or 4 Thais will share a taxi, which means the cost reduces to around 8 - 12 Baht per head.

People looking for a short or medium distance ride on the Beach Road/second road and other regular baht bus routes will still mainly use the baht buses, but meter taxis would come into their own for bespoke journeys outside of these areas, and also late at night; in the same way as taxis are used in BKK away from the Skytrain and underground routes.

You know it makes sense

[Mobi]

Never said they weren't dangerous to the elderly/infirm or to the healthy furthermore. (got me confused with another poster - me thinks) But in the end you get what you pay for and we can't expect much for 5-10bht.

I'm just imagining 1000 taxi cabs on the roads stopped every min looking for faires who only want to go a few blocks.

Perhaps a taxi rank in a designated area, for those going outside the central city norm?

I would never advocate a thousand taxis - that would repeate the gridlock casused by the oversupply of Baht Buses.

Maybe start with 100 cabs and see what happens.?

No... it'll never happen. TIT

[CRUNCHER]

Are you saying that there are not enough working Thais, plus all the thousands of tourists and expat residents to make asucces of a metered taxi service?

Well we'll never know if they don't try it out, will we? I'll bet there would be hundreds of taxis who'd like to give it a try if they were allowed to.

In Bangkok, taxis do fine, and probably 95 % of the customers are Thai. Don't forget they also have a very extensive bus network, plus the Sky tains and the underground. (for which most rides are 25 plus Baht or so a head)

Also, many of the middle class Thais drive their own cars - but there still plenty of Thais who use the thousands of taxis.

Very often, 3 or 4 Thais will share a taxi, which means the cost reduces to around 8 - 12 Baht per head.

People looking for a short or medium distance ride on the Beach Road/second road and other regular baht bus routes will still mainly use the baht buses, but meter taxis would come into their own for bespoke journeys outside of these areas, and also late at night; in the same way as taxis are used in BKK away from the Skytrain and underground routes.

You know it makes sense

Exactly. If there is no demand tazis will not survive. I think they will survive.

There is not enough choice. Baht buses are OK (just about) for the limited routes they operate. I enjoy walking, but no everyone can do much walking. Motor cycle taxis are dangerous - Russian Roulettte is safer. The buses would have done better if properly organized and run.

What other choice is there but taxis?

[britmaveric]

Wouldnt mind an automated tram system like europe, but I know that will never happen. (just a dream)

Moto-taxis are dangerous, but who doesnt like playing dodge-em with the rest of the vehicles or people on the road.

[Pattaya_Fox]

So back to the OP`s question........I am very happy to pay 10 baht and I don`t have a problem with Thai people paying 5 baht.

Now personally and given the choice I would rather ride in or on a Songtaew in Pattaya for short journeys than a metered taxi...........the fresh air, the ambience....the aromas wafting through the air.....and of course being refreshed with the monsoon rains.....I wish they`d do away with those plastic covers

[libya 115]

So back to the OP`s question........I am very happy to pay 10 baht and I don`t have a problem with Thai people paying 5 baht.

Now personally and given the choice I would rather ride in or on a Songtaew in Pattaya for short journeys than a metered taxi...........the fresh air, the ambience....the aromas wafting through the air.....and of course being refreshed with the monsoon rains.....I wish they`d do away with those plastic covers

If the Songtheaw disappeared overnight, I would be very sad indeed. I choose not to ride a motorcycle whilst drinking (beer) so I would be stuck.

5 or 10 or even 20 baht after dark for a 3-4 km trip, has got to be great value, and as 'Pattaya-Fox' has said; experience 'the ambience'.

There is genuine camaraderie between passengers, so I believe that travel by Baht Bus is best appreciated as a quasi-ethnical-wayfaring experience, rather than a menacing-uncomfortable-hectoring experience.

[Phil Conners]

Ok so let a few bahtbusses stay, but only enough to serve the demand and allow in additional metered taxis. I have no problem paying 30-50 for a trip in town in a proper metered taxi. Similarly I have no problem paying 10 for a bahtbus ride if that is the price - but I refuse to be taken advantage of just because I have a different skin color. There are many Thais here who are richer than the farang average and who whould (if they would be bothere) be able to ride for 5 baht with the baht bus. This has nothing to do with socialism and everything to do with racism.

[wpcoe]

One shortfall of the baht bus network is that it doesn't cover the entire city. Granted, Beach Road and Second Road have way too many. Ever try to catch a baht bus on Third Road around Pattaya Klang? Ever try to catch a baht bus on Jomtien Soi Watboon or on Thepprasit? It would be nice if they would spread out the network a bit.

After shopping at Carrefour, I don't mind walking to Third Road to catch a baht bus heading for Jomtien, but I sometimes wait a long, long, long time. I don't require it go directly to Jomtien (although that would be nice!), I'd be happy to get one that turns on to Pattaya Tai and then transfer at the intersection of Second Road.

It would also be nice to be able to ascertain a baht bus's route without questioning each driver. e.g. When catching a baht bus on Second Road, it'd be nice to know what route it will take. At Pattaya Klang, will it turn left or right, or continue straight ahead. Will it turn on to Pattaya Nua, left or right, or will it go straight in to Naklua? Some sort of marking on the bus, or a sign on the dashboard, perhaps?

The system could use some tweaking.

[tropo]

It would also be nice to be able to ascertain a baht bus's route without questioning each driver. e.g. When catching a baht bus on Second Road, it'd be nice to know what route it will take. At Pattaya Klang, will it turn left or right, or continue straight ahead. Will it turn on to Pattaya Nua, left or right, or will it go straight in to Naklua? Some sort of marking on the bus, or a sign on the dashboard, perhaps?

The system could use some tweaking.

Wouldn't that take all the fun out of it?