21 minutes ago, ujayujay said:

Keep this dribble in....he's the Pest

 

Can't he's a man of the people. Self made.

A martyr to the cause of freedom, courtesy of the  army.

23 minutes ago, ujayujay said:

Are you naiv.....whos behind this two Clowns?.........think

No, not naive at all, but the discussion is about Jatuporn and by connection Nattawut and Arisman. I was hesitant to involve Mr.Thaksin of Dubai (or wherever).

2 hours ago, Enoon said:

4 hours ago, robblok said:

Yes a clear criminal/terrorist and still supported by the reds.. kinda says it all. Proves what a violent organisation they are. 

Robblok

This crap goes on, on both sides and will do so until you learn to forgive and forget. But one side has a longer history of suppression than the other and a lot richer and that is fact written in stone

 

You cannot change history but you can change the future, but those who do not change their views will prolong this insult and in the end Thailand will become the second North Korea, just because the few cannot see the light. if the cap fits wear it if not move on.

 

 

Edited January 11, 20179 yr by wakeupplease
spell

35 minutes ago, geriatrickid said:

 

Can't he's a man of the people. Self made.

A martyr to the cause of freedom, courtesy of the  army.

people will support and do lots of bad things if the money is right - it doesn't mean their actions have any moral value in society, it is motivated in the main by ......GREED......POWER.......MONEY with a heavy dose of pure human "evil" (plenty of that around these days)

11 minutes ago, smedly said:

people will support and do lots of bad things if the money is right - it doesn't mean their actions have any moral value in society, it is motivated in the main by ......GREED......POWER.......MONEY with a heavy dose of pure human "evil" (plenty of that around these days)

 

The last asset declaration has Ahbisit 45 M, Suthep 95 M, Prayut. 128M and Jatuporn 0.8 M. Pretty lop sided amount of MONEY.

he did a whole 3 months?? wow - no wonder he lost weight.....

1 hour ago, Eric Loh said:

 

The last asset declaration has Ahbisit 45 M, Suthep 95 M, Prayut. 128M and Jatuporn 0.8 M. Pretty lop sided amount of MONEY.

 

Your right.. pretty lopsided.. YL 579 million.. that is more then Abhisit , Suthep and Prayut together.. 

He could became a monk ike the other politician did and they let all go. what was the guy name Suteph was it?/

3 hours ago, robblok said:

Yes your right, how can there be a democracy in Thailand when one side has a secret terrorist army that is used to suppress dissident voices. The peaceful protesters against the amnesty were shot bombed ect. Then the army stepped in and the PTP and others felt how it was to be on the wrong end of the stick and moaned and bitched about it. However when they used similar tactics before (as described before + the burning of BKK) people call it democratic because they got a democratic wing.. pure sham IMHO. IRA and  Sinn Fein springs to mind. Its nice to have a secret wing of terrorists.. easy to deny .. they are not connected.. the red shirts are not hierarchical ect. ect. and other B.S.  

 

Fact is there was never a real democracy here and getting one will be a real hard task. As long as so much money can be made in politics both sides will do whatever to get in power to loot the states coffers. 

Coherent but biased and partial view of reality.

1- Army, what army? Despite absolute investigation power the Junta has only found a few arm caches with obviously planted UDD cards, red shirt flags, medals, etc. Or do you mean the dad's army of the so-called "Khon Kaen model"? Not much for a secret army, in particular when the other side has a non secret army to suppress dissident voices.

2- There is no proof that the UDD leaders or Thaksin/YL ordered bombings of protesters in 2014, and no political analyst supports this assertion (no judicial investigation either, despite an obvious will to target red leaders or PTP leaders). I guess there were plenty of individuals or small groups angry enough at protesters to do it without order from above. As you implicitly refer to me, what I wrote in a previous post was not that there was no connection between Thankin, YL, PTP and UDD in general (as you pretend to missunderstand), but that in this particular case there was nor evidence nor motive for an order given by leaders.

3- There were peaceful protesters against the amnesty, but you forget the non-peaceful protesters who wanted to take power and establish a non-elected government of their choice, blocked election by violent means, occupied government and parliament buildings, rushed into an army circle, etc....

4- Yes, red shirts are very far from perfect and have been too violent in 2010, but you forget that red shirts have arised as a reaction to yellow shirts and coups. They are called "democratic" because they always campaigned or protested for elections (even sometimes in illaudable ways), while the other side did the contrary. No one would call the other side "democratic" because they have a democratic wing, along the activist arm and the armed body.

5- As for the structure of red shirts, there is a good analysis in the link below (again, I don't say that there is no hierachy influence or by Shinawatras (who were very far from being perfect too), but it's not an homogenous organisation in which all components follow exactly the same line and always obey hierarchy- which is different from, say, a communist organisation)

https://englishkyoto-seas.org/2016/04/vol-5-no-1-naruemon/

40 minutes ago, robblok said:

 

Your right.. pretty lopsided.. YL 579 million.. that is more then Abhisit , Suthep and Prayut together.. 

 

The subject was about Jatuporn. There was assumption that he was motivated by money. If YL has 579 M and Jatuporn has only 0.8 M after almost a decade of activism, does hint that he risk his life and got pittance. Now I have renewed admiration for him. Now where did the huge donations that Suthep collected went. 

42 minutes ago, candide said:

Coherent but biased and partial view of reality.

1- Army, what army? Despite absolute investigation power the Junta has only found a few arm caches with obviously planted UDD cards, red shirt flags, medals, etc. Or do you mean the dad's army of the so-called "Khon Kaen model"? Not much for a secret army, in particular when the other side has a non secret army to suppress dissident voices.

2- There is no proof that the UDD leaders or Thaksin/YL ordered bombings of protesters in 2014, and no political analyst supports this assertion (no judicial investigation either, despite an obvious will to target red leaders or PTP leaders). I guess there were plenty of individuals or small groups angry enough at protesters to do it without order from above. As you implicitly refer to me, what I wrote in a previous post was not that there was no connection between Thankin, YL, PTP and UDD in general (as you pretend to missunderstand), but that in this particular case there was nor evidence nor motive for an order given by leaders.

3- There were peaceful protesters against the amnesty, but you forget the non-peaceful protesters who wanted to take power and establish a non-elected government of their choice, blocked election by violent means, occupied government and parliament buildings, rushed into an army circle, etc....

4- Yes, red shirts are very far from perfect and have been too violent in 2010, but you forget that red shirts have arised as a reaction to yellow shirts and coups. They are called "democratic" because they always campaigned or protested for elections (even sometimes in illaudable ways), while the other side did the contrary. No one would call the other side "democratic" because they have a democratic wing, along the activist arm and the armed body.

5- As for the structure of red shirts, there is a good analysis in the link below (again, I don't say that there is no hierachy influence or by Shinawatras (who were very far from being perfect too), but it's not an homogenous organisation in which all components follow exactly the same line and always obey hierarchy- which is different from, say, a communist organisation)

https://englishkyoto-seas.org/2016/04/vol-5-no-1-naruemon/

 

Obvious planted... (your view not mine)

Unproven.. sure its hard to prove it in a court of law..does not mean it was not true. 

Your redshirts are the armed wing of the PTP no matter how hard you or your bias sources keep denying it. 

That is the good thing about having an UDD .. its easy to deny. They are just not stupid enough to get caught. 

Everyone knew the links between sin fein and the Ira but they never could really find proof.. but that did not mean it was not there either. (they deny it too and I believe them as much as I believe them here)

 

You have your bias view.. and I have my bias view.. but nobody will believe all the bombings and deaths were self inflicted by the read. I live close to chang wattana and have seen how that Isarn rambo (nickname for a redshirt) kept attacking the protesters there in the end it led to that firefight between the pop corn man who came as a response to this guy

 

http://www.bangkokpost.com/learning/learning-news/405902/rambo-warns-court-of-red-shirt-reprisal-photos

 

Here red shirt warning if something goes against YL.. wow no link .. no really 

12 minutes ago, robblok said:

Obvious planted... (your view not mine)

Unproven.. sure its hard to prove it in a court of law..does not mean it was not true. 

Your redshirts are the armed wing of the PTP no matter how hard you or your bias sources keep denying it. 

That is the good thing about having an UDD .. its easy to deny. They are just not stupid enough to get caught. 

Everyone knew the links between sin fein and the Ira but they never could really find proof.. but that did not mean it was not there either. (they deny it too and I believe them as much as I believe them here)

 

You have your bias view.. and I have my bias view.. but nobody will believe all the bombings and deaths were self inflicted by the read. I live close to chang wattana and have seen how that Isarn rambo (nickname for a redshirt) kept attacking the protesters there in the end it led to that firefight between the pop corn man who came as a response to this guy

 

http://www.bangkokpost.com/learning/learning-news/405902/rambo-warns-court-of-red-shirt-reprisal-photos

 

Here red shirt warning if something goes against YL.. wow no link .. no really 

Before criticizing my "biased sources" you may at least read it. The source I quoted is not at all political, it is a scientific paper. If you had read it you would have found out that the author did not take position for or against the yellow or red shirts, just tried to understand how they were organised and how and what were the processes.

They a

1 hour ago, robblok said:

Obvious planted... (your view not mine)

Unproven.. sure its hard to prove it in a court of law..does not mean it was not true. 

Your redshirts are the armed wing of the PTP no matter how hard you or your bias sources keep denying it. 

That is the good thing about having an UDD .. its easy to deny. They are just not stupid enough to get caught. 

Everyone knew the links between sin fein and the Ira but they never could really find proof.. but that did not mean it was not there either. (they deny it too and I believe them as much as I believe them here)

 

You have your bias view.. and I have my bias view.. but nobody will believe all the bombings and deaths were self inflicted by the read. I live close to chang wattana and have seen how that Isarn rambo (nickname for a redshirt) kept attacking the protesters there in the end it led to that firefight between the pop corn man who came as a response to this guy

 

http://www.bangkokpost.com/learning/learning-news/405902/rambo-warns-court-of-red-shirt-reprisal-photos

 

Here red shirt warning if something goes against YL.. wow no link .. no really 

Sorry for previous post, I have been interrupted by a computer problem. Here is the full answer.

 

If you believe that people, who hide weapons because they fear legal or discretionary retaliations, may leave cards with their names and other means to identify them, it's up to you! And anyway, even if true, what they found was ridiculously little for a "secret army"

Again, what secret army? Nobody has seen trace of it.

 

Before criticizing my "biased sources" you may at least read it. The source I quoted is not at all political, it is a scientific paper. If you had read it you would have found out that the author did not take position for or against the yellow or red shirts, just tried to understand how they were organised and how and what were the processes.

They are also not "my red shirts", I have no problem recognising their flaws and written several times that they were far from perfect and that their behaviour has been in some cases objectionable.

I also never wrote that the deaths were self-inflicted, as you pretend to missunderstand, I wrote that there is no clue nor motive about an order by the leaders of UDD or PTP.

 

As for the source you provide, I absolutely don't deny the usual barking by this so-called rambo happened. What I would like to add is that the fact that Suthep's mob have been given a free pass to do whatever they wanted, and that the judicial was rather supporting them, could well explain why some people got too nervous.

 

As for your last attemps at causality: the pop-corn gunman came as a response to "Rambo". I see a small problem. Rambo's speech is from April 21st, while the popcorn man fired on February 1st.

I cannot help but quote the words of Suthep on February 20:

" the protesters would hound caretaker Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra no matter where she might go"

"Regarding the announcement by red-shirt leaders that they would lead red-shirt people to confront the PDRC protesters, Suthep indicated that the red shirts might face attacks by unknown gunmen. “They should come because popcorn vendors have made popcorn for them,”...... “Natthawut Saikuar and Jatuporn Promphan should really come … "

So who has incited hatred?

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/news/national/aec/30227329

This man is a terrorist. responsible for treason against the state. He is responsible for billions of dollars worth of property damage, and perhaps tens of billions of dollars worth of damage to the Thai economy, by attempting to shut down the capital. He should be tried, and sentenced to decades in prison, where he can become good friends with some of the inmates, who will treat him to a very good time, and show him what wreaking destruction really looks like. Again, an example of a very weak, and completely broken judiciary, who should be hanging their heads in shame. And another example of how people with wealth and influence do not pay the price for their crimes here. Above the law. Any and all laws. 

You appear to be off topic. This article is about Jatuporn, not Suthep. What you descibed is exactly what Suthep did.

Sent from my SM-J710F using Thaivisa Connect mobile app

3 hours ago, Eric Loh said:

 

The subject was about Jatuporn. There was assumption that he was motivated by money. If YL has 579 M and Jatuporn has only 0.8 M after almost a decade of activism, does hint that he risk his life and got pittance. Now I have renewed admiration for him. Now where did the huge donations that Suthep collected went. 

 

Militias are expensive Eric.

Sorry, I should have said volunteer security guards.....

Wonder what Jatumoron will do next? I also have equal contempt for Suthep and that political clown monk Issara who has gone way beyond his remit. These figures are terribly unhelpful and divisive.

12 minutes ago, JAG said:

 

Militias are expensive Eric.

Sorry, I should have said volunteer security guards.....

 

Thai Navy SEALs are indeed expensive. Issara will also need big expenditures for his armed thugs and huge fortress. 

Calling Suthep a thug shows you are pretty ignorant of Thai politics. Thugs like Jataporn resort to violence. Suthep has never done so. Suthep was a very brave man and liked by a lot of well educated Thais. I admire him a lot.

http://www.mmtimes.com/index.php/opinion/8991-thailand-here-we-go-again.html

 

Even Mynmar Times call him thug; even worse they called him foul mouth thug. 

6 hours ago, robblok said:

Obvious planted... (your view not mine)

Unproven.. sure its hard to prove it in a court of law..does not mean it was not true. 

Your redshirts are the armed wing of the PTP no matter how hard you or your bias sources keep denying it. 

That is the good thing about having an UDD .. its easy to deny. They are just not stupid enough to get caught. 

Everyone knew the links between sin fein and the Ira but they never could really find proof.. but that did not mean it was not there either. (they deny it too and I believe them as much as I believe them here)

 

You have your bias view.. and I have my bias view.. but nobody will believe all the bombings and deaths were self inflicted by the read. I live close to chang wattana and have seen how that Isarn rambo (nickname for a redshirt) kept attacking the protesters there in the end it led to that firefight between the pop corn man who came as a response to this guy

 

http://www.bangkokpost.com/learning/learning-news/405902/rambo-warns-court-of-red-shirt-reprisal-photos

 

Here red shirt warning if something goes against YL.. wow no link .. no really 

RobBlok

you are in-titled to your opinion which I respect

But please do not try and bullshit the rest of us with facts that do not stand up

Who has all the money Yellow or Red and that includes the $50 billion at CPS that should be putting water and electricity Infrastructure into remote areas of Thailand not making individuals rich beyond western dreams OK Shins made money but most of it before political control. His main mistake was using a loophole not paying tax on the sale but they all do that. If you can see records you will see who made the most during his time and that was CPS

 

The shins are a scapegoat like your use of racialism term Isarn rambo (nickname for a redshirt). you are Thia are you not so why slagg each other off?  But I do not hear it from them like i hear it from you Grow up and buy a VPN and learn the truth

49 minutes ago, gamini said:

Calling Suthep a thug shows you are pretty ignorant of Thai politics. Thugs like Jataporn resort to violence. Suthep has never done so. Suthep was a very brave man and liked by a lot of well educated Thais. I admire him a lot.

Man what school did you go to Gamini

Suthep is worse that Jataporn as jataporn said it out loud when angry and frustrated. suthep did it behind peoples backs and started in 2010 as he states, not to mention Tamasat UNI, then did the classic thai thing of becoming a monk for a few weeks says it all to people who did get an education

 

Thai education system needs a rethink or bottom of the pile you soon will be

 

16 hours ago, Eric Loh said:

 

The last asset declaration has Ahbisit 45 M, Suthep 95 M, Prayut. 128M and Jatuporn 0.8 M. Pretty lop sided amount of MONEY.

so you think this man has 800k to his name - really ?  do you actually believe that ? do you actually think that people here think you believe that - are you really that blind and naïve......I don't think so, I actually regard you as quite sinister and I believe you know why

8 hours ago, wakeupplease said:

RobBlok

you are in-titled to your opinion which I respect

But please do not try and bullshit the rest of us with facts that do not stand up

Who has all the money Yellow or Red and that includes the $50 billion at CPS that should be putting water and electricity Infrastructure into remote areas of Thailand not making individuals rich beyond western dreams OK Shins made money but most of it before political control. His main mistake was using a loophole not paying tax on the sale but they all do that. If you can see records you will see who made the most during his time and that was CPS

 

The shins are a scapegoat like your use of racialism term Isarn rambo (nickname for a redshirt). you are Thia are you not so why slagg each other off?  But I do not hear it from them like i hear it from you Grow up and buy a VPN and learn the truth

Man what school did you go to Gamini

Suthep is worse that Jataporn as jataporn said it out loud when angry and frustrated. suthep did it behind peoples backs and started in 2010 as he states, not to mention Tamasat UNI, then did the classic thai thing of becoming a monk for a few weeks says it all to people who did get an education

 

Thai education system needs a rethink or bottom of the pile you soon will be

 

Obviously you have no grasp of what happened in Bangkok otherwise you knew that the guy called himself Isarn Rambo and his name is Koh Tee (or something like that, i gave a direct link to an article where he is named). So you who pretend to know it all knows only a little bit. I live in BKK near Bangyai that borders near Chang Watanna and I have office workers as friends who were in the peaceful protests that were harrassed and attacked every night by Isarn Rambo (Ko tee) and the police (controlled by YL) did nothing. 

 

[ "This is already a war, but so far it is an unarmed war," said Ko Tee. "If there is a coup, or the election doesn't happen, then it definitely becomes an armed war." [/quote]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/10606562/Thai-red-shirts-leader-says-Its-time-to-get-rid-of-the-elite.html

 

Suporn, also known by his followers as "Rambo Isan", said the trained volunteers will support and safeguard UDD red-shirt supporters. He said their opponent was not the PDRC but any kind of dictatorship.

http://prachatai.org/english/node/3934

 

Again if not paying taxes was the only problem.. but there are many more court cases pending in witch others have been sentenced to long jailterms. We are talking about forcing a bank to hand out loans that were not commercial viable and resulted in billions of losses (was in the news before I guess you missed that or your red glasses blocked it out)

http://www.bangkokpost.com/learning/learning-news/671132/bankers-get-18-years-in-prison-no-thaksin-ruling-until-return-to-thailand

3 hours ago, smedly said:

so you think this man has 800k to his name - really ?  do you actually believe that ? do you actually think that people here think you believe that - are you really that blind and naïve......I don't think so, I actually regard you as quite sinister and I believe you know why

 

You asking a rhetorical question about Jatuporn asset against his legal declaration. Between your wild assumption and a legal declaration, I would say that you are blind and very naive. Sinister is reserved for people who make dangerous assumption based on nothing but voices in his head. 

On 1/11/2017 at 0:36 PM, JAG said:

Very much the same could be said about the leaders who closed down the airports in 2008...

 

 

Well, not to sound too extreme, or too hawkish, but I felt they should have been shot on the spot, before they had a chance to close down the airports. Or at least jailed for life. Any leader that allows the major international airport in it's capital to be shut down, is not a leader at all. This could have easily been prevented. It was pure weakness, timidity, and sloth that allowed this to happen. 

7 hours ago, robblok said:

Obviously you have no grasp of what happened in Bangkok otherwise you knew that the guy called himself Isarn Rambo and his name is Koh Tee (or something like that, i gave a direct link to an article where he is named). So you who pretend to know it all knows only a little bit. I live in BKK near Bangyai that borders near Chang Watanna and I have office workers as friends who were in the peaceful protests that were harrassed and attacked every night by Isarn Rambo (Ko tee) and the police (controlled by YL) did nothing. 

 

[ "This is already a war, but so far it is an unarmed war," said Ko Tee. "If there is a coup, or the election doesn't happen, then it definitely becomes an armed war." [/quote]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/10606562/Thai-red-shirts-leader-says-Its-time-to-get-rid-of-the-elite.html

 

 

You seem to attribute some credibility to the barking of Rambo/Ko Tee as you quote him 2 times in the same thread. So where was his army when the coup occured?

10 minutes ago, candide said:

You seem to attribute some credibility to the barking of Rambo/Ko Tee as you quote him 2 times in the same thread. So where was his army when the coup occured?

I quoted him twice because someone said I was racist looked down on Isarn people while this was a name given him by his own people (followers). Just pointing out that it was not me who came up with the name. 

 

His army was before the coup, it was harassing the protesters near Chaeng Wattana (shooting at them and so on), in the end that made the yellows bring in the pop corn man, (totally wrong action but understandable when the government does not lend any protection because they wont go against their own). Then that led to a shooting where an innocent got killed, I believe the pop corn man is now serving time (and so he should). But all of this would have been avoidable if the government had provided protection or just called off their armed squad and told them to stop harassing the protesters. But the goverment did not and miscalculated what ultimately happened. First miscalculation was the amnesty, second was that they did not count on a coup. They were outplayed. 

 

I guess many of the posters here don't live in BKK and havent seen the red violence guess that accounts for a lot of bias. When you see it with your own eyes it makes an impression. Just like the coup made an impression with all the armed vehicles near where i live (securing tv stations and so on). But when you don't see stuff like that yourself its easy to pretend the red were good people. I seen it twice now.. 2011 and 2014. I can tell you there was a big difference between the two protests. 

2 hours ago, robblok said:

I quoted him twice because someone said I was racist looked down on Isarn people while this was a name given him by his own people (followers). Just pointing out that it was not me who came up with the name. 

 

His army was before the coup, it was harassing the protesters near Chaeng Wattana (shooting at them and so on), in the end that made the yellows bring in the pop corn man, (totally wrong action but understandable when the government does not lend any protection because they wont go against their own). Then that led to a shooting where an innocent got killed, I believe the pop corn man is now serving time (and so he should). But all of this would have been avoidable if the government had provided protection or just called off their armed squad and told them to stop harassing the protesters. But the goverment did not and miscalculated what ultimately happened. First miscalculation was the amnesty, second was that they did not count on a coup. They were outplayed. 

 

I guess many of the posters here don't live in BKK and havent seen the red violence guess that accounts for a lot of bias. When you see it with your own eyes it makes an impression. Just like the coup made an impression with all the armed vehicles near where i live (securing tv stations and so on). But when you don't see stuff like that yourself its easy to pretend the red were good people. I seen it twice now.. 2011 and 2014. I can tell you there was a big difference between the two protests. 

This incident and others are saddening.

But again absolutely no proof of the government sending or controling what you called "their armed squad". And the government did not have any motive, as their strategy was to avoid violent confrontations that would incite the army to make a coup (Prayuth told several times the army would act in case of violence).

"First miscalculation was the amnesty, second was that they did not count on a coup"

I agree with you about the amnesty, but they were all fearing a coup. It is obvious in their behaviour and also in their speeches, i.e it's mentioned by three different red shirts in the article you cited.

In fact, the eventuallity of a coup was in the mind of analysts since the beginning....

http://www.ibtimes.com/yingluck-coup-way-298217

The "people's revolution" failed to get enough support to establish an unelected government, the legal coup (with the help of appointed senators) also failed to establish an appointed government, so there was only one way left....

11 minutes ago, candide said:

This incident and others are saddening.

But again absolutely no proof of the government sending or controling what you called "their armed squad". And the government did not have any motive, as their strategy was to avoid violent confrontations that would incite the army to make a coup (Prayuth told several times the army would act in case of violence).

"First miscalculation was the amnesty, second was that they did not count on a coup"

I agree with you about the amnesty, but they were all fearing a coup. It is obvious in their behaviour and also in their speeches, i.e it's mentioned by three different red shirts in the article you cited.

In fact, the eventuallity of a coup was in the mind of analysts since the beginning....

http://www.ibtimes.com/yingluck-coup-way-298217

The "people's revolution" failed to get enough support to establish an unelected government, the legal coup (with the help of appointed senators) also failed to establish an appointed government, so there was only one way left....

No motive... their motive was to get the people to go home. I guess you missed that speech by Charlem, go home we can't protect you a third hand is attacking you. The motive is clear they did not want big crowds protesting against them because that showed the world that there was an opposition and it put pressure on them. The links between the government and red shirts were tight.. just look at the high government officials at the redshirt meeting that cheered about the attack in Trad. 

 

I can agree that the army might have wanted the coup before and just used this as an excuse... but without this excuse it would not have happened. If it had happened it would have met far more resistance..as I said they brought it on themselves. 

56 minutes ago, robblok said:

No motive... their motive was to get the people to go home. I guess you missed that speech by Charlem, go home we can't protect you a third hand is attacking you. The motive is clear they did not want big crowds protesting against them because that showed the world that there was an opposition and it put pressure on them. The links between the government and red shirts were tight.. just look at the high government officials at the redshirt meeting that cheered about the attack in Trad. 

 

I can agree that the army might have wanted the coup before and just used this as an excuse... but without this excuse it would not have happened. If it had happened it would have met far more resistance..as I said they brought it on themselves. 

Well, It may well be that Chalerm was not enthusiastic about protecting protesters.... it may also well be that it was not possible due to the current mess and the fact that protesters would not allow police near them.

And OK, let's be serious, the police protecting people who want to overthrow a legal government, occupy and threaten media, hunt the PM, block elections, etc...?

As for the motive, the grenade-throwing period occured mainly after elections (which results were not representative, but showed the government still benefitted from a significant support), at a time the number of protesters has started to steadily decline (and, by the way, after the popcorn episode).

PS Again, the way you describe the sickening cheering of the Trad attack may let understand that the officials and leaders present also cheered, omitting to precise that the only guy on the stage who was rejoicing at it was disapproved and thrown out of the stage.

1 hour ago, candide said:

Well, It may well be that Chalerm was not enthusiastic about protecting protesters.... it may also well be that it was not possible due to the current mess and the fact that protesters would not allow police near them.

And OK, let's be serious, the police protecting people who want to overthrow a legal government, occupy and threaten media, hunt the PM, block elections, etc...?

As for the motive, the grenade-throwing period occured mainly after elections (which results were not representative, but showed the government still benefitted from a significant support), at a time the number of protesters has started to steadily decline (and, by the way, after the popcorn episode).

PS Again, the way you describe the sickening cheering of the Trad attack may let understand that the officials and leaders present also cheered, omitting to precise that the only guy on the stage who was rejoicing at it was disapproved and thrown out of the stage.

You mean people who had a peaceful protest but were attacked by the secret army of the goverment.. yea.. of course the police would not protect them because that would work against their armed wing. 

 

No many people cheered after he said so.. he was ushered away because Tida was smart enough to know what a bad press it was. It still haunts them now. You think its because they disapproved.. i think because they knew it could be used against them. Again.. different opinion.

 

Lets agree we just see the things different.. you see them in a red light and I see them in a yellow light. 

 

We can't agree so what chance has reconciliation because we have no real stakes here.. but others have.. monetary too.

 

I said it often as long as politics offers such financial rewards (corruption) every side will resort to violence to get in power.

 

That is why I am always for tough corruption laws.. if there is no money to be made then there will be peace.