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[rooster59]

PM May must set out Brexit plan by mid-Feb to allow scrutiny - UK lawmakers

By Kylie MacLellan

 

Britain's Prime Minister Theresa May waits to greet her New Zealand counterpart Bill English at Number 10 Downing Street in London, Britain, January 13, 2017. REUTERS/Toby Melville

 

LONDON (Reuters) - The British government must publish a detailed plan for Brexit by mid-February setting out its position on future membership of the European Union's single market and customs union, a committee of lawmakers said in a report published on Saturday.

Parliament's Exiting the EU committee, made up of lawmakers from several parties including Prime Minister Theresa May's Conservatives and opposition Labour, also said the government should seek a transitional deal with the bloc.

May, who has said she will begin formal divorce talks with the EU by the end of March, has come under fire from businesses, investors and lawmakers for having revealed little about the government's Brexit plans more than six months after the country voted to leave in last June's referendum.

"The government needs to publish its Brexit plan by mid-February at the latest, including its position on membership of the single market and the customs union, so that it can be scrutinised by parliament and the public," said opposition Labour lawmaker Hilary Benn, chair of the committee.

May, who has said giving a running commentary on preparations would weaken the government's hand in the upcoming negotiations, is due to set out more about her approach to Brexit in a speech on Tuesday.

The committee said the Brexit plan must be presented in the form of a white paper, a government policy document, and should be published alongside economic assessments of the different options for market access and trade.

"We're not asking the government to give away its red lines or negotiating fall-back positions but we do want clarity on its broad aims, given the significance and complexity of the negotiating task," said Benn.

The committee called on the government to seek to ensure continued access to EU markets for financial services firms and avoid the imposition of tariffs. It also said May should commit to giving parliament a vote on the final Brexit deal.

The risk of a "cliff-edge" at the end of the two-year negotiation period with the EU may push some businesses to pre-empt the final outcome and minimise the impact on their firms by re-locating or investing elsewhere, the committee said.

"The government must make clear from the outset that a period of adjustment to any change in trading arrangements or access to EU markets for UK service industries will be sought as part of the negotiations," it said.

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-01-14

[jpinx]

Given the way the landscape of the EU is being criticised, it is no surprise that TM is holding off saying too much.  The face of the "opposition" may well be changed.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-38613027

Edited January 14, 2017 by jpinx

[smedly]

I would assume this is a recommendation only as I agree with TM - keep your cards close to your chest and disclose nothing

 

and this latest

 

Theresa May's Article 50 plans could be delayed by months due to Stormont crisis legal challenge

 

The EU commission dirty tricks dept in action, they have done it before with other EU countries that have held referendums were the results were not what they desired, blatant attempts to thwart the wishes of the British people.

 

TM should just trigger Art50 now so all doubt is removed

Edited January 14, 2017 by smedly

[Grouse]

The EU will adjust over time.

 

I have said from the start that the UK should remain and force change from within.

 

However, with the truly appalling attitudes demonstrated by so many English, I want to see the UK out now. I shall remain.

[Baerboxer]

57 minutes ago, smedly said:

I would assume this is a recommendation only as I agree with TM - keep your cards close to your chest and disclose nothing

 

and this latest

 

Theresa May's Article 50 plans could be delayed by months due to Stormont crisis legal challenge

 

The EU commission dirty tricks dept in action, they have done it before with other EU countries that have held referendums were the results were not what they desired, blatant attempts to thwart the wishes of the British people.

 

TM should just trigger Art50 now so all doubt is removed

 

She can't trigger Article 50 until the Supreme Court rules on whether her executive can use the Royal Prerogative or if she must seek parliaments approval in a vote following a debate. 

If she tries to do so before that ruling, she will cause a constitutional crisis, likely be forced to resign, and be held in contempt of court.

 

She seems to have hoped pretending an advisory referendum result could be implemented as a decision by the executive would not have been challenged despite being constitutionally and legally highly dubious. The Tories seem to think they could get away with making things up as the went along. 

Now she's in a real pickle and weakened her position before the negotiations even start. 

[Baerboxer]

Just now, Grouse said:

The EU will adjust over time.

 

I have said from the start that the UK should remain and force change from within.

 

However, with the truly appalling attitudes demonstrated by so many English, I want to see the UK out now. I shall remain.

 

Agree with your first part before you drift into bigotry.

 

A considerable number of Welsh, Scots and Ulster citizens voted to leave, as well as English. But then that would be the case as it was a British referendum,

 

It's becoming clear more and more peoples in different countries don't share the "vision" Juncke and Merkel are trying to push on them without any discussion. Britain should have stayed and helped lead the reforms, with these other countries, rather than go home with their bat and ball.

[Grouse]

16 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Agree with your first part before you drift into bigotry.

 

A considerable number of Welsh, Scots and Ulster citizens voted to leave, as well as English. But then that would be the case as it was a British referendum,

 

It's becoming clear more and more peoples in different countries don't share the "vision" Juncke and Merkel are trying to push on them without any discussion. Britain should have stayed and helped lead the reforms, with these other countries, rather than go home with their bat and ball.

 

It's not bigotry it's exasperation.

 

There are so many misunderstandings, falsehoods and indeed bigotry that I have given up.

 

I can see England in particular becoming worse and worse as it moves closer to American "values" and further away from what I consider European social justice. All things public are bad, all things private are good. Trickle down economics. Dumbing down generally. So, I hope the UK goes for hard Brexit NOW and lets the EU reform itself. 

[baboon]

"May, who has said she will begin formal divorce talks with the EU by the end of March, has come under fire from businesses, investors and lawmakers for having revealed little about the government's Brexit plans more than six months after the country voted to leave in last June's referendum."

 

Leaving the rights or wrongs of Brexit to the side for a moment, is it just me who suspects the plan can't be revealed because all it amounts to is 'Christ knows. We'll  just have to see what happens and hope something comes up'?

[jpinx]

29 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Agree with your first part before you drift into bigotry.

 

A considerable number of Welsh, Scots and Ulster citizens voted to leave, as well as English. But then that would be the case as it was a British referendum,

 

It's becoming clear more and more peoples in different countries don't share the "vision" Juncke and Merkel are trying to push on them without any discussion. Britain should have stayed and helped lead the reforms, with these other countries, rather than go home with their bat and ball.

UK tried to "reform from within" many times but what was the reception?  Has there been any sign of reformation of the EU from Brussels?  Now the Dutch are talking about the mobile labour force problem as well.  Brussels refuses to admit that anything is wrong - their fat pensions are at stake here. 

 

 

[Rimmer]

A baiting post has been removed

[KBsinter]

How many times did M.Thacher TRY TO CHANGE, if she failed what chance

these Idiots have, one country against 27 others, the EU is set up to impede

the Nay Sayers............... 

[nauseus]

The Committee Has Decided? What a crock! There was none of this soft/hard boiled BS after the 1975 referendum.

Accept it and act on it like the last time, after the whole country had been conned!

[gamini]

3 hours ago, smedly said:

I would assume this is a recommendation only as I agree with TM - keep your cards close to your chest and disclose nothing

 

and this latest

 

Theresa May's Article 50 plans could be delayed by months due to Stormont crisis legal challenge

 

The EU commission dirty tricks dept in action, they have done it before with other EU countries that have held referendums were the results were not what they desired, blatant attempts to thwart the wishes of the British people.

 

TM should just trigger Art50 now so all doubt is removed

I don't think Brexit is still the wishes of the British any more.

[Srikcir]

6 hours ago, rooster59 said:

so that it can be scrutinised by parliament and the public

Sounds as if the Committee is anticipating that the Supreme Court will rule that parliament vote will be necessary to invoke Art50. If royal perogative prevailed this Committee and its concerns would be unnecessary.

[Khun Han]

3 hours ago, jpinx said:

UK tried to "reform from within" many times but what was the reception?  Has there been any sign of reformation of the EU from Brussels?  Now the Dutch are talking about the mobile labour force problem as well.  Brussels refuses to admit that anything is wrong - their fat pensions are at stake here. 

 

 

 

All this nonsense about changing the EU from within. The EU has clearly shown that it has no will or inclination to reform. It has it's agenda, and it will bully it's way through to getting that agenda. We dodged a bullet by getting out. Hopefully, other countries show the determination to do the same.

[dunroaming]

4 hours ago, smedly said:

I would assume this is a recommendation only as I agree with TM - keep your cards close to your chest and disclose nothing

 

and this latest

 

Theresa May's Article 50 plans could be delayed by months due to Stormont crisis legal challenge

 

The EU commission dirty tricks dept in action, they have done it before with other EU countries that have held referendums were the results were not what they desired, blatant attempts to thwart the wishes of the British people.

 

TM should just trigger Art50 now so all doubt is removed

 

Yes that Martin McGuiness resigning is all a plot by the EU commission!

 

May wants to trigger article 50 but cannot for the reasons already stated.  Brexit should go ahead but it is going to be a rough ride.  As for May keeping her cards close to her chest well that is very well but why say that we will probably end up out of the single market and cause the pound to fall further?  Stupid doesn't even come close!

[dunroaming]

12 minutes ago, Khun Han said:

 

All this nonsense about changing the EU from within. The EU has clearly shown that it has no will or inclination to reform. It has it's agenda, and it will bully it's way through to getting that agenda. We dodged a bullet by getting out. Hopefully, other countries show the determination to do the same.

 

I used to say change from within but now the decision is made to leave we have to hope that plan B comes into play.  It was always my hope that if we voted leave that it would trigger the fall of the EU so that it could be re-born as a workable trade organisation.  That is still my hope.  However that is still pie in the sky and if we leave burning all our bridges then we could end up with the EU still in place and us worse off.  No easy answers

[jesimps]

3 hours ago, baboon said:

"May, who has said she will begin formal divorce talks with the EU by the end of March, has come under fire from businesses, investors and lawmakers for having revealed little about the government's Brexit plans more than six months after the country voted to leave in last June's referendum."

 

Leaving the rights or wrongs of Brexit to the side for a moment, is it just me who suspects the plan can't be revealed because all it amounts to is 'Christ knows. We'll  just have to see what happens and hope something comes up'?

You can "Suspect" all you want but only she knows what she has up her sleeve. If I was in her place, I wouldn't reveal my negotiating position either. To do so when dealing with the EU backstabbing, two-faced so-called friends would be madness.

[jesimps]

1 hour ago, gamini said:

I don't think Brexit is still the wishes of the British any more.

And which firm did you employ to do this nationwide poll which brought you to that conclusion? Sounds very much like wishful thinking to me.

 

 

[7by7]

4 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

She seems to have hoped pretending an advisory referendum result could be implemented as a decision by the executive would not have been challenged despite being constitutionally and legally highly dubious. The Tories seem to think they could get away with making things up as the went along.

 

Well, she does have the 1975 referendum as a precedent!

 

It seems to me that there are a lot of people who are more interested in bashing the Tories than there are those who want the best post Brexit deal for the UK.

 

Even his own MPs have no faith in Corbyn, another one resigned yesterday. I'd hate to suffer from the dog's breakfast he would make of the whole thing.

 

 

Edited January 14, 2017 by 7by7

[Srikcir]

13 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

she does have the 1975 referendum as a precedent!

'The 1975 referendum was held after the re-negotiated terms of the UK’s EC membership had been agreed by all EC Member States and the terms set out in a command paper and agreed by both Houses.'

http://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2016/12/mps-were-told-the-referendum-was-not-binding.html

Doesn't seem to apply as a precedent.

 

[dunroaming]

Brexit is not about party politics.  Tories or Labour we are where we are.

 

Edited January 14, 2017 by dunroaming

[7by7]

18 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

'The 1975 referendum was held after the re-negotiated terms of the UK’s EC membership had been agreed by all EC Member States and the terms set out in a command paper and agreed by both Houses.'

http://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2016/12/mps-were-told-the-referendum-was-not-binding.html

Doesn't seem to apply as a precedent.

 

 

The 2016 referendum was also agreed by both houses in the European Union Referendum Act 2015.

 

Parliament agreed to hold a referendum with one simple question; remain or leave.

 

The people voted to leave. The wrong decision in my opinion, but I accept the democratic will of the, albeit small, majority.

 

The government should now be allowed to get on with the process of leaving without people with a political axe to grind or others preventing them from doing so.

[Retiredandhappyhere]

Some people seem to think that the EU holds all the cards, but when full negotiations get underway, we will see compromise on both sides which will result in the UK still being able to trade with the EU in a manner not too detrimental to either side.  As far as the immigration and freedom of movement issue is concerned, some compromise on that will also be reached with mutual face-saving.

This is what "negotiations" are all about....no side gets everything it wants and compromises are made which enable each party to claim some form of victory.  

[7by7]

8 minutes ago, Retiredandhappyhere said:

Some people seem to think that the EU holds all the cards, but when full negotiations get underway, we will see compromise on both sides which will result in the UK still being able to trade with the EU in a manner not too detrimental to either side.  As far as the immigration and freedom of movement issue is concerned, some compromise on that will also be reached with mutual face-saving.

This is what "negotiations" are all about....no side gets everything it wants and compromises are made which enable each party to claim some form of victory.  

 

Indeed; and to enter those negotiations having first published all our plans and aims, effectively telling the other side in which areas we are prepared to compromise or even concede before the negotiations have even begun, would be foolhardy in the extreme.

 

 

[jpinx]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

 

The 2016 referendum was also agreed by both houses in the European Union Referendum Act 2015.

 

Parliament agreed to hold a referendum with one simple question; remain or leave.

 

The people voted to leave. The wrong decision in my opinion, but I accept the democratic will of the, albeit small, majority.

 

The government should now be allowed to get on with the process of leaving without people with a political axe to grind or others preventing them from doing so.

I've been saying this for what seems like forever, but some people can not accept democracy

[bangon04]

8 hours ago, Grouse said:

 

It's not bigotry it's exasperation.

 

There are so many misunderstandings, falsehoods and indeed bigotry that I have given up.

 

I can see England in particular becoming worse and worse as it moves closer to American "values" and further away from what I consider European social justice. All things public are bad, all things private are good. Trickle down economics. Dumbing down generally. So, I hope the UK goes for hard Brexit NOW and lets the EU reform itself. 

if the EU had any interest to "reform itself" surely it would have made some effort by now? Maybe the Brexit is the only way to force a reform of the United States of Europe by showing the consequences of zero effort to reform.

 

If David Cameron's earth-shattering "concessions" from the EU were the limit of "reform"........

[bangon04]

7 hours ago, nauseus said:

The Committee Has Decided? What a crock! There was none of this soft/hard boiled BS after the 1975 referendum.

Accept it and act on it like the last time, after the whole country had been conned!

The 1975 referendum was about remaining in the EEC - the single market - which most people seem to agree is/was a good thing.

The 1975 referendum result was later used to further the EU's plan for ever closer unelected union - not democratic.