Thai wife refused entry on Thai passport?

[Penefattore]

On 3/24/2017 at 10:21 PM, lovelomsak said:

Why not just have her do a border run with her Thai passport. Then she will be in the country as Thai.No need to fly out.

yeah, and meanwhile her UK id will be overstaying risking detention and blacklisting.What a mess. Thai Immigration is plain crazy.

[nss70]

On 03/30/2017 at 8:21 PM, Maestro said:

The wise thing to do would have been to call the immigration hotline 1178 in the presence of these immigration officials and it is still advisable call this number now.

 

 

 

 

This number does not exist.

Do you have the correct one.

Found 1111, will try that.

Edited April 4, 2017 by nss70

[nss70]

According to 1111 we have 2 choices.

 

Apply for a 1 year extension on her UK passport using Thai ID etc. After that she can have her "thainess" registered.

 

Or leave and come back, UK pp to leave and Thai pp to reenter.   Must have old Thai passport to hand and complain if refused. ( both of which I originally told her and have been reiterated here but hey, what do us farangs know eh)

 

There is no other fix according to them.

[Eff1n2ret]

3 hours ago, nss70 said:

 

Apply for a 1 year extension on her UK passport using Thai ID etc. After that she can have her "thainess" registered.

 

I don't understand how that really puts her in a different situation from what she is now. If they can accept her "thainess" and let the extension lapse, why can't they just do the same in relation to a visit stamp? What they've actually suggested is that she be treated as a former Thai citizen who will have to re-apply for citizenship.

 

The 1111 advice just doesn't meet the situation, that she has been incorrectly treated by a minor official. If she stays and does nothing, she's not an illegal and they're hardly likely to come looking for her. The stamp in her UK passport is an irrelevance.  Next time she wants to travel, she can leave (and re-enter) using her Thai passport.

[Maestro]

This number does not exist.
Do you have the correct one.
Found 1111, will try that.

Sorry about that. 1178 used to be the direct hotline for immigration.

1111 is the general hotline number for for the entire government and calling that number one gets put through to any department one needs for information.

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[ubonjoe]

3 hours ago, nss70 said:

According to 1111 we have 2 choices.

 

Apply for a 1 year extension on her UK passport using Thai ID etc. After that she can have her "thainess" registered.

 

Or leave and come back, UK pp to leave and Thai pp to reenter.   Must have old Thai passport to hand and complain if refused. ( both of which I originally told her and have been reiterated here but hey, what do us farangs know eh)

 

There is no other fix according to them.

After Thursday when the new constitution is promulgated it will not matter what immigration says since it states a Thai cannot be denied entry to the country.

Perhaps have a copy of that clause handy.

[nss70]

^^^^^^

Will this be available in English anywhere so that I can quote the clause as it's reference number?

 

It's such a ridiculous situation.

[ubonjoe]

10 hours ago, nss70 said:

^^^^^^

Will this be available in English anywhere so that I can quote the clause as it's reference number?

 

It's such a ridiculous situation.

From page 19 here. http://www.constitutionnet.org/files/thailand-draft-constitution_englishtranslation_june_2016.pdf

 

Quote

Section 39 No person of Thai nationality shall be deported or prohibited from entering the Kingdom.

Revocation of Thai nationality acquired by birth of a person shall not be permitted.

 

[nss70]

Aha! Thanks for that, another bullet to load into the gun. :)

[Guest]

Ubonjoe, thanks for your and others advise on entry into Thailand on an Embassy issued Thai passport. Only one issue came up and this a courteous but perplexed IO who seemed hesitant on allowing pass through without an Exit stamp in passport or recent Exit noted in system.  This was readily resolved when I retrieved the older passport which had the Exit stamp.

 

I am not sure if the newly signed charter will be displayed in full in the Royal Gazette.  If yourself or other who can read Thai see the finalized Thai version, appreciate confirmation that the wording, as above,  remains as previously translated or has been changed. Thanks.

 

 

[Guest]

I believe this is the finalized copy of the Thai constitution (sorry if mistaken)

 

http://www.mratchakitcha.soc.go.th/     

รัฐธรรมนูญแห่งราชอาณาจักร [พุทธศักราช ๒๕๖๐]                ๖ เมษายน ๒๕๖๐

 

มาตรา ๓๙ การเนรเทศบุคคลสัญชาติไทยออกนอกราชอาณาจักร หรือห้ามมิให้ผู้มีสัญชาติไทย เข้ามาในราชอาณาจักร จะกระทำมิได้

การถอนสัญชาติของบุคคลซึ่งมีสัญชาติไทยโดยการเกิด จะกระทำมิได้

[digbeth]

Okay, so for those with both Thai and other Passport, the best way to exit Thailand to not cause trouble with re-entry is to exit with a Thai passport in order to get the 'stamp'/passport number (the automatic machine doesn't stamp Thai passport?) into the system right? 

 

But when you check in, the airlines do check and forward your passport detail to immigration/passport control on the arrival country... and since you already hold the destination country's passport as resident or citizen, you're unlikely to have that country's visa in your Thai passport right? that would set alarm bells ringing in some case and they might not let you board the plane even? 

 

Can you just check in with your 'foreign' passport but present the Thai passport at departure passport control instead? that would cost the least amount of trouble right

[Eff1n2ret]

2 hours ago, digbeth said:

 

Can you just check in with your 'foreign' passport but present the Thai passport at departure passport control instead?

Yes, my wife does that every time, no problem. On the return trip from the UK, when we're travelling on the second half of a return ticket she shows the airline check-in both passports so that they are assured there's no risk of her being bounced back from Thailand at their expense.

[7by7]

3 hours ago, digbeth said:

But when you check in, the airlines do check and forward your passport detail to immigration/passport control on the arrival country... and since you already hold the destination country's passport as resident or citizen, you're unlikely to have that country's visa in your Thai passport right? that would set alarm bells ringing in some case and they might not let you board the plane even? 

 No alarm bells, no refusal to carry, no problem

 

The airline are only interested in whether or not you have any required entry clearance for your destination. So you show them the passport you will use to enter your destination.

 

If, for example, you are a Thai/British dual national all they will want to see is your British passport. That you don't have a UK visa in your Thai passport is of no concern to them because, as a British citizen, you obviously don't need a visa to enter the UK.

 

Indeed, there is no reason to show the airline when checking in your Thai passport at all!

 

You will need to show it to Thai immigration on leaving Thailand so that they know you are a Thai citizen and so have not overstayed or otherwise been in Thailand illegally; but that is all they are concerned about and couldn't care whether you have the correct entry clearance for your destination or not. So no need to show them your other passport at all.

[jphasia]

 No alarm bells, no refusal to carry, no problem
 
The airline are only interested in whether or not you have any required entry clearance for your destination. So you show them the passport you will use to enter your destination.
 
If, for example, you are a Thai/British dual national all they will want to see is your British passport. That you don't have a UK visa in your Thai passport is of no concern to them because, as a British citizen, you obviously don't need a visa to enter the UK.
 
Indeed, there is no reason to show the airline when checking in your Thai passport at all!
 
You will need to show it to Thai immigration on leaving Thailand so that they know you are a Thai citizen and so have not overstayed or otherwise been in Thailand illegally; but that is all they are concerned about and couldn't care whether you have the correct entry clearance for your destination or not. So no need to show them your other passport at all.

Yes, as I mentioned earlier in this thread, i went to Japan last week with my son who has Thai and French passport.
On the exit from Thailand, he used his Thai passport. On the entry in Japan, he used his French passport. No problem
When we left Japan last Mondah, at the check in counter, he presented his French passport. Then the airline asked how long he will stay in Thailand because he doesn't have any visa and no return ticket...he show his Thai passport and then was ok for the check in. Later at the Japan immigration, he presented his French passport and then his Thai passport when he entered Thailand.

Sent from my SM-N920C using Tapatalk

[Maestro]

It has been my observation that the only time a Thai immigration official asks a traveller presenting a Thai passport to show "the other passport" is when the presented passport does not have a stamp for the last departure from Thailand and with "other passport" the official means the other, ie the old, Thai passport. This usually happens when the Thai national obtains a new Thai passport during her stay outside Thailand. If the Thai did not take her old passport along, eg because she thought it was not necessary or because she forgot, the correct thing is to say so and if she is a dual national, not to show the passport of her other nationality. As the example of the OP's wife shows, once a dual national shows her non-Thai passport, things get complicated.

[gandalf12]

"Can Thai have dual nationality?

DUAL CITIZENSHIP: NOT RECOGNIZED. Exceptions: Child born abroad to Thaiparents, who obtains the citizenship of the foreign country of birth, may retain dual citizenship until reaching the age of majority (18). At this point, person must choose which citizenship to retain." I took this issue up with the Thai Embassy in Greece and asked this very question. Their reply was "Yes it isnt a problem"

Maybe the rules have changed since then as it was a few years back but most countries accept a person can hold dual nationality.

[ubonjoe]

2 minutes ago, gandalf12 said:

"Can Thai have dual nationality?

DUAL CITIZENSHIP: NOT RECOGNIZED. Exceptions: Child born abroad to Thaiparents, who obtains the citizenship of the foreign country of birth, may retain dual citizenship until reaching the age of majority (18). At this point, person must choose which citizenship to retain." I took this issue up with the Thai Embassy in Greece and asked this very question. Their reply was "Yes it isnt a problem"

Maybe the rules have changed since then as it was a few years back but most countries accept a person can hold dual nationality.

That is completely wrong info. Not sure where you found it. Many websites have the same rubbish on them.

[gandalf12]

Just now, ubonjoe said:

That is completely wrong info. Not sure where you found it. Many websites have the same rubbish on them.

I was told it from the Thai Embassy in Greece. The quote if that is what you are referring to I have no idea where that came from

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, gandalf12 said:

The quote if that is what you are referring to I have no idea where that came from

That is what I was referring to. If you go back you through this topic will find the same wrong info has been posted and the correct info was posted.

[gandalf12]

6 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

That is what I was referring to. If you go back you through this topic will find the same wrong info has been posted and the correct info was posted.

I assumed it was but making sure

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

It's worth noting at this point the plethora of poor information online relating to Thailand. One of the hardest things for a newbie to come to terms with is the volume of duff information being posted online about all aspects of life here. I can't tell you how many times I've seen cut and paste posts on various online resources, that claim to be the 'definitive' resource on Thailand. Most of the information is at best misleading, at worst downright malevolent. There are even websites out there that mislead you into believing they are 'official' resources, when in fact they are operated by a Trevor or a Dave from a bedsit in Leeds.

 

This also goes beyond the river of garbage about Thailand posted online. I lost count how many times I was lectured by some pompous jerk that I can't have a work permit because I have no degree. In fact there is no such law that I am aware of, maybe some industry specific limitation. But, I have a work permit sitting on my desk to the left of me, and I have no degree. What I do have are in demand skills and Thai family, which changes everything.

 

The take away from this is that the only resource you need is the written law, and the most up to date version of it. One day central government will get to grips with their $%^&ed up civil service. Until such time, get busy establishing the legal position of you and yours.

Edited April 14, 2017 by NilSS

[Mickmouse1]

Immigration officer is absolutely correct.

All countries apply same rule.

You must show exit stamp in order to enter with that Passport unless it was issued abroad after your last date of departure .

You can not make your own rules to suit yourselves guys.

Now they know,FALANGS & FARANGS= DUMMIES?

[ubonjoe]

10 minutes ago, Mickmouse1 said:

Immigration officer is absolutely correct.

All countries apply same rule.

You must show exit stamp in order to enter with that Passport unless it was issued abroad after your last date of departure .

 

You are wrong.

And certainly not all countries have such a rule. Many countries do not do departure stamps anymore and others have no departure formalities. I have never gotten a departure stamp form  my home country.

Thais can now use the automated gates for departure which means no departure stamp. 

[dbrenn]

6 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

You are wrong.

And certainly not all countries have such a rule. Many countries do not do departure stamps anymore and others have no departure formalities. I have never gotten a departure stamp form  my home country.

Thais can now use the automated gates for departure which means no departure stamp. 

True, I often travel between Thailand, Australia and the UK. None of my passports ever get stamped.

[digbeth]

The passport no longer get stamped per se, some visa aren't even put on paper pages anymore but for the Thai immigration, their alarm bells are ringing if they see a Thai passport that hasn't showed that the holder 'left' Thailand in their system

[SiamBeast]

It depends on the country but all the ones I know (including Thailand) require you to exit on the same passport than you entered. The best course of action is to leave using her UK passport, travel somewhere, and come back using her Thai passport.

 

Thais can enter the country with an expired Thai passport - it's their country, they cannot be refused entry. Anyway to avoid problems, never show 2 passports to an immigration officer without him explicitely asking you to do so, and this applies to any country worldwide. Immigration will give a very hard time if you try to come in with the wrong passport. Enter / leave Thailand on a Thai passport, enter / leave Uk on a UK passport. That's all.

 

Otherwise you'll just bump yourself to an agent that will give you a hard time just because he can.

 

Edited April 16, 2017 by SiamBeast

[ThaidaGwaii]

If you are Thai, NEVER use a foreign passport.  Thailand is very anal about it.  Just keep the Thai passport to enter or leave Thailand, and countries that don't require a VISA with it.

[JohnThailandJohn]

On 4/4/2017 at 9:54 PM, ubonjoe said:

From page 19 here. http://www.constitutionnet.org/files/thailand-draft-constitution_englishtranslation_june_2016.pdf

 

 

Have her go and just ask for help ... explain what happened and what she would like to happen. Quoting the law to people who enforce the law is rarely ever a good idea unless you are a lawyer and in the proper forum to do so.

[dentonian]

On ‎04‎/‎04‎/‎2017 at 4:53 PM, ubonjoe said:

After Thursday when the new constitution is promulgated it will not matter what immigration says since it states a Thai cannot be denied entry to the country.

Perhaps have a copy of that clause handy.

Section 39 No person of Thai nationality shall be deported or prohibited
from entering the Kingdom.
Revocation of Thai nationality acquired by birth of a person shall not be
permitted.

 

Not sure you could you could use the constitution as a means to argue or disagree with an IO.

In the situations posted, they haven't been refused entry, but allowed entry using their second nationality passports.