Midweek rant: When will the punishment fit the crime?

[webfact]

Midweek rant: When will the punishment fit the crime?

 

 

It is getting utterly ridiculous.

 

Pick a mushroom in a forest and get thirty years.

 

Have a trace element of an illegal substance in a wallet and kiss goodbye to freedom for a few decades.

 

But rent a taxi to a double convicted rapist and pay 3,000 baht.

 

This is not a rant about people who are not brought to justice a la Red Bull heir.

 

This is not a rant about those who slip through the net and never face justice.

 

Though that is horrendous enough in Thailand.

 

This is about those people who have broken the criminal law or those who have fallen foul of government regulations – and get such ridiculous sentences that it makes a mockery of the very word justice itself.

 

Lenient sentences that both belittle and are a disgrace to victims, light sentences that make criminals snigger with glee as they serve five minutes in jail and are out again to repeat their crimes.

 

Severe sentences particular, but not exclusively, against the poor and downtrodden, that advertise Thailand not merely as a place with a ruling elite that can do as it pleases with its unwitting population, but as a country of absurd inconsistency and patent ongoing injustice.

 

This is not a topical rant. One brought on by an isolated incident.

 

Any week of the year you can find poor people like the mushroom sellers who are facing the most incredible harshness because they couldn’t afford adequate legal representation.

 

Every week you can find people who will not see the light of day because someone had it in for them and the system could not protect them.

 

Every week you can see terrible crime – crime that has been confirmed in a court of law, or admitted in a police station without duress – punished by the proverbial slap on the wrist, sometimes even let go because an apology was made to society or a graap or a wai was forthcoming.

 

The inconsistency is staggering, shameful and institutionalized. It is nothing short of disgusting and an affront to the public who deserve so much better.

 

But nobody seems to be doing anything about it. The clamor for change seems to be muttered in markets, quietly spoken of on buses and in queues for street food.

 

The people who are so aware of injustice should be shouting for change.

 

Many laws and statutes seem to have been in existence from a bygone era. They have simply never caught up to modern times.

 

Fines seem to be stuck in a time-warp – it’s a wonder they are not announced in ticals.

 

But it is the sentences that really rankle. Someone seems to have plucked figures from the air – where is the consistency, where is the fairness?

 

There is virtually none and consequently the faith of the public in what passes for the justice system could hardly be lower.

 

The jails are full to the rafters with those convicted of drugs’ offences – just like in America. While in the US the overwhelming majority are black and poor here they are darker skinned and poor.

 

Seems awfully similar.

 

Few would say that drugs are not a scourge in either society but is there not a woeful imbalance? And do the harsh sentences handed down to minor dealers address the problem.

 

Of course they don’t – they just make the authorities look as though they have done something useful while the big fish go free and are almost never apprehended.

 

So what needs to be done?

 

Well first off, there needs to be a National Commission set up to review sentences and make  recommendations to address the haphazard imbalances in both civil and criminal systems.

 

Then those recommendations need to be taken on board - if and when the country is returned to democracy, that is.

 

Equally, the fines that are handed out need urgent review. Companies that flagrantly rip off and con the public need to be slapped with something that hurts.

 

Not something they can find in the till that might have been a reasonable sum in 1905.

 

The rich who break the law need to pay. And pay through the nose.

 

The commission’s watchwords need to be modernization and justice. The people – as quiet as they seem to be at times - are fed up with inconsistency and patent unfairness.

 

The time to act is actually long past.

 

But if something is not done soon those who point the finger at Thailand’s justice system and laugh at the absurd inconsistencies will just gain more traction.

 

And the face that Thais are so desperate to protect will just get increasing hard for anyone to take seriously.

 

-- © Copyright Thai Visa News 2017-05-03

[wakeupplease]

I have to say this is the best Mid-week Rant I have ever read on TV, so very true I wish we could all write like this full credit to Author.

 

But it is the sentences that really rankle. Someone seems to have plucked figures from the air – where is the consistency, where is the fairness?

 

Numbers here are just plucked from the air as minds cannot calculate anything here in the modern era

 

 

 

[ukrules]

The judges pull the numbers out of their collective asses.

[Thaiwrath]

46 minutes ago, webfact said:

When will the punishment fit the crime?

Not in my lifetime, come to think of it, probably not in any member's lifetime, especially as cash is king.

[rodney earl]

It is the same everywhere. A RULE FOR ONE AND A RULE FOR OTHERS.!!!

[ezzra]

To sums it all up, some things in Thailand are wonderful and nice,

others, not so much, we already have agreed on numerous posts

that logic, common sense and fairness are not the forte of this

country.....

[hansnl]

2 hours ago, rodney earl said:

It is the same everywhere. A RULE FOR ONE AND A RULE FOR OTHERS.!!!

You are very right.

The law tends to be, ehhhhh, flexible?

 

[tigermoth]

Under the current regime if anyone raises their hands or shouts in protest they disappear for indefinite periods. That is how this country works and it is all slowly but surely coming to a head. It is not only the educated who are the most likely to begin this upheavel but the poor as well are now simmering. This so called government is on a very precarious path and if elections are not held within the next 12 months then everyone look out. Even if a so called democratic government is elected it will obviously not be perfect but at least the people have had a say, more than they can do now.

[Bluespunk]

Punishment fitting the crime?

 

In that light, has the writer of last week's wildly nonsensical rant been sacked then?

[ianf]

The biggest injustices? Let's start with Koh Tao and the 2 Burmese boys. This is such a bloody disgrace .................. Not to mention the other end of the scale - the Red Bull heir ......and on it goes ...........

 

[FarSeas]

This is something problematic in Bali also. In 2015 an Australian guy was imprisoned for four years for smoking a joint on the beach. In 2017 an Australian woman was imprisoned for four years for her part in bashing an Indonesian police officer to death. I think everyone would agree that these two crimes are far different in severity ! 

[mtls2005]

I doubt there will ever be a match? Either it's too severe for the commoners, or too lenient (if at all) for the amart.

 

But then, that's the whole idea of the Thai "legal" system with its base on sakdina and foundation on the codification via the "Law of the Three Seals (1805).

 

The Thai legal system is simply one facet of the Thai social contract which is based on a hierarchical (pyramid scheme); one supports and reinforces the other, and without it there would be "disorder", according to those at the top.

[TheFishman1]

TIT

[worgeordie]

Its all about money, how much you have,and how much you have not,

in some other countries its if you're black or white.

regards worgeordie

[gandalf12]

Excellent post. All Thailand needs now is the will to change.

[marko kok prong]

Well at least they put drug users in jail here,unlike the Philippines were the end up with a bullet in the head. Lets not forget also this country was an absolute monarchy until1935,so in those terms it is way behind western countries in terms of parliment,and justice,as another poster said if you have enough money you can get away with just about anything,and i can tell you that ain't gonna change,ever.

[Bluespunk]

1 hour ago, FarSeas said:

This is something problematic in Bali also. In 2015 an Australian guy was imprisoned for four years for smoking a joint on the beach. In 2017 an Australian woman was imprisoned for four years for her part in bashing an Indonesian police officer to death. I think everyone would agree that these two crimes are far different in severity ! 

I thought it was the dj who beat the policeman to death.

 

Also wasn't it a fight that resulted in death rather than premeditated murder?

 

Mind the dj only got 6 years, but the prosecution was only pressing for 8 years for what he was charged with [assault]. 

Edited May 3, 2017 by Bluespunk

[mikosan]

I absolutely agree with the OP, but I can't see a change in the near future.  The oppressed are mainly the poor and being poor they cannot do anything about it.  Us farangs can bitch and moan as much as we like, but in actual fact we are on the level below the poor, so no one is going to take any notice of us.  However, it is interesting to see the recent developments in the Red Bull 'Boss' case.  Publicity and public opinion seem to be helping the get something done about it.  We shall see, but I won't be holding my breath.  And in the meantime, I just hope I don't fall foul of the system as it is.

[FarSeas]

12 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

I thought it was the dj who beat the policeman to death.

 

Also wasn't it a fight that resulted in death rather than premeditated murder?

 

Mind the dj only got 6 years, but the prosecution was only pressing for 8 years for what he was charged with [assault]. 

Yes , hence my wording of 'her part' in in the bashing. And you are correct, the boyfriend took the greater charge of 6 years. But the example still remains, bash a cop to death and get 6 years, smoke a joint on the beach and get 4 years. The latter it completely inappropriate a sentence, and in contrast to a far, far greater crime in anyones books, it's shocking. I would imagine getting busted in Thailand for small qty posession would also not be a slap on the wrist. 

Edited May 3, 2017 by FarSeas

[Bluespunk]

2 minutes ago, FarSeas said:

Yes , hence my wording of 'her part' in in the bashing. And you are correct, the boyfriend took the greater charge of 6 years. But the example still remains, bash a cop to death and get 6 years, smoke a joint on the beach and get 4 years. The latter it completely inappropriate a sentence, and in contrast to a far, far greater crime in anyones books, it's shocking. I would imagine getting busted in Thailand for small qty posession would also not be a slap on the wrist. 

It was certainly an odd case. I thought they'd get a lot more until I read more about it. Still surprised how light the sentence was though.

 

As for grass, it's stupid to outlaw it.

[Bangkok Barry]

2 hours ago, tigermoth said:

Under the current regime if anyone raises their hands or shouts in protest they disappear for indefinite periods. That is how this country works and it is all slowly but surely coming to a head. It is not only the educated who are the most likely to begin this upheavel but the poor as well are now simmering. This so called government is on a very precarious path and if elections are not held within the next 12 months then everyone look out. Even if a so called democratic government is elected it will obviously not be perfect but at least the people have had a say, more than they can do now.

The simmering boiled over a few years ago, remember? Barricaded streets, burning of buildings, riots. That's why Thailand now has a military government, to keep order. And so far it has. The problem is, there is now no control over its power. But then, was there ever any real power to limit what any recent (or otherwise) government wanted to impose.

[Destiny1990]

The sentences differ  to much one guy rapes  a woman gets 30 years another guy rapes a woman gets 3 years?small offences can be communial service instead of jail.

[williamgeorgeallen]

of course it is hard to disagree. one good point in thailand is often the offenders can pay compensation to the victims as a form of punishment. of course the down side is the rich can use this as a way to walk over the poor.

[Surasak]

7 hours ago, ukrules said:

The judges pull the numbers out of their collective asses.

Only when they can manage to get their finger out, which is not very often.

[Surasak]

2 hours ago, gandalf12 said:

Excellent post. All Thailand needs now is the will to change.

Give us a call in a few hundred years.

[vaultdweller0013]

First thing that would need to be done is the repeal of the strict defamation laws in Thailand. People need to be free to speak out when there are miscarriages of justice without fear of being hounded by the very justice system they are speaking against.

 

However, to be fair, this sort of thing happens around the world. The difference is that, in the US for example, if a judge issues an extremely light sentence for rape, it can (and has) resulted in such a severe backlash that the judge is forced to resign.

 

 

[NoshowJones]

9 hours ago, rodney earl said:

It is the same everywhere. A RULE FOR ONE AND A RULE FOR OTHERS.!!!

That's true, but you have just got to try and get round any rules or laws that you don't agree with, and make sure you do nothing against ordinary decent people.

[TKDfella]

I do agree with other posters here that here the punishment certainly doesn't  seem to thought out at all. However, in every country this is a problem and the reason is the selecting punisment for crime is subjective. For example there are those that say 'an eye for an eye' and others that don't agree; those that agree with 'a crime of passion' being included and those that don't; those agree with degree and those that don't. Of course here, as others have stated, money is king, and if there are any changes to be made this problem should be the first to eliminate. But then you need competent, trustworthy, compassionate people to discuss punishment...perhaps these are lacking here.

[wabothai]

Very sad state of affairs. Especially now with severe lack of freedom of speech.

 

[Daffy D]

This is a world wide situation but perhaps more prevalent in third world countries like Thailand where the rich and powerful are not accountable.

 

I think judges in general are out of touch with the real word. Most live a privileged life style and have no real concept of what ordinary innocent victims of crimes go through.

 

I know it will never happen but wouldn't it be nice if past victims of crimes were able to hand out sentences. So a person who has gone through the trauma of being mugged would know an appropriate sentence to pass down to a mugger. Same with burglaries, rape and all the other crimes that can haunt a person for life.

 

The judges passing down ridiculous sentences for crimes against persons or property have no concept of what it feels like to have their house trashed or their wife or daughter brutally raped.

 

Let the people who have suffered from the acts of criminals hand down real sentences that DO fit the crime.

 

Just my thoughts.