Somtam slowly killing many Thais, cancer center says

[AlphMichaels]

He refers to the raw fish version - the 6 month "fermented in a jar" type used in NE Thailand.  This is nothing new..., been reported for years.  Pla Ra sauce, used by "reputable" Som Tam vendors (sure that'll stir up a TVF troll or two) is a fermented fish sauce that's been either pasteurized or cooked to a boil and bottled.  Ask your fav vendor to be sure.  If you're concerned with the answer or what they're using, order Som Tam Thai (simple lime juice).  

 

I'll eat a spicy green papaya salad and a host of other Thai cuisine any day over the western fare so many cling to here.  Check cancer stats globally - you got a lot better chance of  avoiding cancer eating Thai food than the western fare.  Still don't get those who come to live here and insist on maintaining a western diet, watching the"family" eat Thai food while he eats what the good wife prepared just for him.   See that sparkle in their eyes as they watch him consume meat & potatoes with butter n gravy.   In 35C heat to boot.        

 

And FYI this good doctor isn't an Oncologist but instead a DERMATOLOGIST, so there you have it.   

 

[Bluespunk]

2 minutes ago, Khunbilly said:

The cancer from under cooked fish that he is talking about is cholangiocarcinoma. My father-in-law died from it two years ago. It's common in Isan with Khon Kaen pretty much being the epicenter for it. But it's not limited to warm regions, as it is also common in Siberia. 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cholangiocarcinoma

What? 

 

You have quoted "was" from a post of mine (I assume) and then written an informative post, but it is unrelated to anything I have written as far as I can see. 

[spermwhale]

4 hours ago, overherebc said:

Never been a fan of thai food myself and never understood the reasoning behind eating food that has so much chilli in it. 

It always strikes me as strange that food should bring on a sweating session, red face and a need to drink litres of water to kill/cool off the burn. More like a competition than enjoyment. Locally I sometimes have TomYam Kung and ask them to bring the chilli in another side dish. Usually they bring 15 or so chillies in the dish for one bowl of soup.

Someone at the table will be happy to have them and add to their own bowl then sit there gasping, sweating and saying Aroi Aroi.

No way can that be good for your stomach lining or intestines over a lifetime.

That's not what they are talking about  in this article. Bla pra is not chili. 

[overherebc]

10 minutes ago, spermwhale said:

That's not what they are talking about  in this article. Bla pra is not chili. 

I know. Neither is Bla pra. Never heard of it.

[chilli42]

I have been advised by Dr's to twice or three times a year to do a 3 day intensive parasite removal.  Forget the. Are of the medication but cheap and readily available at every drug store in Thailand.  Two tables a day for three days, break for a week then same again.  Idea is to not just clear the gut of parasites but the liver etc.  Does not matter how careful you are, you are susceptible to parasites.  You think you eat clean cooked food but how about your maid or the nice lady that cooked your food ... did they wash after using the toilet?

[NoshowJones]

4 hours ago, trogers said:

Perhaps somtam should only be sold like cigarettes, with those gory photos of tumors and cancers...

If it is true about somtam, then it is only going to affect those who eat it, but anyone smoking fags can cause harm and discomfort to people sitting near them if inside anywhere.

[soalbundy]

4 hours ago, trogers said:

Perhaps somtam should only be sold like cigarettes, with those gory photos of tumors and cancers...

You have to be careful with choosing cigarette packets,never choose a nasty looking one, i always choose the ones about the dangers of pregnancy and smoking, like i'm going to get pregnant.

[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, possum1931 said:

If it is true about somtam, then it is only going to affect those who eat it, but anyone smoking fags can cause harm and discomfort to people sitting near them if inside anywhere.

or if you drive a car, those exhaust fumes can do a lot of damage

[Tapster]

The WHO has spent a lot of time and money educating Thais about the perils of undercooked/raw fish and liver fluke. This is because of the extremely high incidence of liver cancer in NE Thailand, as has been mentioned in previous posts. 

 

Long term ingestion of very hot foods (chilli hot) has been linked to oral cancers, so there are two ways that som tam might be a concern. 

 

The chili issue is small compared to the raw fish risk. 

 

I love som tam with five chilies and no raw fish products. 

[Arkady]

He only blames som tam buu plara.  Somtam Thai without the fermented mud fish (or the uncooked field crabs) should be OK,  It has been known for years that plara often contains liver fluke that can caused liver disease including eventually liver cancer.

[NoshowJones]

6 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

or if you drive a car, those exhaust fumes can do a lot of damage

Yes, up to a point, but is it not diesel fumes that are more dangerous to your health, I don't know which is worse, diesel 

fumes outside or smoking fags in an enclosed space.

10 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

or if you drive a car, those exhaust fumes can do a lot of damage

 

[hotchilli]

If the worms don't kill you the pesticides/agri chemicals will...

I asked a Thai friend once why she and many friends refused to eat any vegetables or fruit.. the answer was because of all the chemicals etc, she said she understood that her diet was deficient in many ways which led to sickness & loss of power/energy but to consume the pesticides etc was suicidal...

now without somtam I don't know how they'll survive?

[hawker9000]

4 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

Reminds me of a friend at university back in the day.

 

After a night out we'd all head to a local curry place and order whatever. This guy had a thing about eating the hottest thing on the menu, didn't give a toss what it was so long as it was hot.

 

Mostly he'd get a vindaloo, but one evening after we been a rather long session he was a bit more belligerent than usual and started mouthing off that vindaloos weren't that hot and we were all pussies-or words to that effect. The staff [I'm guessing] took offence at this and told him there was an especially hot curry called a tindaloo, but was too hot for most people.

 

Man, he went off on a big one and started demanding he be given this. The staff eventually agreed and walked away with huge grins on their faces.

 

When the dish finally arrived, I swear it was curry sauce, mystery meat and more chillies than I've ever seen in my life. The thing glowed. You could feel the heat coming off it [well maybe that's just my imagination but that's how it felt]

 

My mate started eating it and immediately began sweating like a dog in heat. He was dripping and his whole face took on a bright red shine. He was clearly in pain but wouldn't admit it and ate the whole thing [well most of it]. Kept on claiming it was ok though.

 

The next day was hell for him and he spent most of the day in the toilet.

 

Funny thing is, he never went to that curry place again. I'd like to say he calmed down a bit on the hotter the better shtick, but he never did.

 

He was a bit of <deleted> if I'm honest though. 

Yeah, a bit...

 

Just the idea of daring a thai kitchen staff like that is jawdroppingly reckless.

Edited May 5, 2017 by hawker9000

[overherebc]

I know I brought chilli into this but I did because I feel consumption of too much on a daily basis must be just as bad for you as raw fish.

The combination of raw crab,  fish and meat must have some dangers, perhaps loads of hot chilli on top magnifies the situation, I don't know.

Seems we have now got smoking, diesel fumes etc thrown in so I would like to add that having a brick dropped on your head on a building site can also be bad for your health.

[bananafish]

5 hours ago, overherebc said:

Never been a fan of thai food myself and never understood the reasoning behind eating food that has so much chilli in it. 

It always strikes me as strange that food should bring on a sweating session, red face and a need to drink litres of water to kill/cool off the burn. More like a competition than enjoyment. Locally I sometimes have TomYam Kung and ask them to bring the chilli in another side dish. Usually they bring 15 or so chillies in the dish for one bowl of soup.

Someone at the table will be happy to have them and add to their own bowl then sit there gasping, sweating and saying Aroi Aroi.

No way can that be good for your stomach lining or intestines over a lifetime.

Capsicum is a cancer fighter and your stomach is much too smart to get affected by it. Your stomach's own acids are much more corrosive than any chili pepper you could find. 

[Songlaw]

If I remember correctly, the only item in Som tam you would be well advised to avoid is the brine shrimp; I think that's the correct English name. I just ask them to leave it out. If they can't do, for whatever reason, I hit the next stall. Personally, I couldn't live here without som tam, so if the doc's right, I guess I'll be seeing you next in the wherever-after. Hope it has som tam.

[fvw53]

I travelled and eat in all the countries from Turkey to Vietnam

I wonder if there is a coincidence with the love for "hot spiced food" with the need to hide rotting of the food because of hot climates. 

I guess if - in the past - Thai people had access to refrigerators they would not have developed the need to eat food so hot spiced that one does not taste anymore what it is.

[soalbundy]

9 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

Yes, up to a point, but is it not diesel fumes that are more dangerous to your health, I don't know which is worse, diesel 

fumes outside or smoking fags in an enclosed space.

 

As a smoker i would say that dying from a heart attack is way better than dying from lung cancer. Read an article recently where it was said that 90% of cancer is basically bad luck, genetic make up etc. some one can smoke 50 a day and drive a diesel lorry and he is OK someone else is fit and clean a jogging fanatic and they get lung cancer or whatever. My daughter a young mother and  fitness freak (30) in Germany was diagnosed with MS, couldn't even do her coat buttons up, she was tested and scanned on a regular basis at the Uni clinic in Munich, suddenly they found she was going into remission and really quickly, 3 months later she was completely free of the decease, lucky genes, thank God. 

[Sig]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Thais’ love of “pla ra” or raw fish used in somtam, as well as other undercooked foods are responsible for increased rates of worm infections, which can lead to liver cancer.

 

"Somtam slowly killing many Thais"

Will the writers and/or translators of these article please start to do better? Somtam is not doing it, even in the article, it's connected to pla ra not somtam. It's kinda like saying that eating is killing you because eating is connected to somtam and somtam is connected to pla ra... How about going to the primary problem instead of a secondary or tertiary issue just to cause a sensation.

 

[Bluespunk]

27 minutes ago, hawker9000 said:

Yeah, a bit...

 

Just the idea of daring a thai kitchen staff like that is jawdroppingly reckless.

This was uk but the principle is the same anywhere I guess

[Lobber]

MSG is a bigger problem

[overherebc]

6 minutes ago, fvw53 said:

I travelled and eat in all the countries from Turkey to Vietnam

I wonder if there is a coincidence with the love for "hot spiced food" with the need to hide rotting of the food because of hot climates. 

I guess if - in the past - Thai people had access to refrigerators they would not have developed the need to eat food so hot spiced that one does not taste anymore what it is.

I've heard that many times and it's something I tend to agree with. As said before it used to be pepper corns that were used to make things hot and spicy. When chilli was brought to Asia from the West Indies it took over from pepper probably because it did a better job of killing the crap taste of local cheap peasant food at the time.

[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, Sig said:

"Somtam slowly killing many Thais"

Will the writers and/or translators of these article please start to do better? Somtam is not doing it, even in the article, it's connected to pla ra not somtam. It's kinda like saying that eating is killing you because eating is connected to somtam and somtam is connected to pla ra... How about going to the primary problem instead of a secondary or tertiary issue just to cause a sensation.

 

Being alive is pretty dangerous as well, it invariably leads to death, God's little joke.

[CGW]

We live in a highly toxic world! daily exposure to all sorts of chemicals, include in that soaps, deodorants, shampoo, tooth paste, floor cleaning agents, GM foods, meats that are injected with all sorts of chemicals, animals that are fed all sorts of crap, vegetables that are sprayed with anything that will produce a bigger harvest - regardless, rotten fish! lets not mention all the airborne pollutants

Nowadays when people are going to retire they want to be near good hospitals, I wonder why?

[Upnotover]

They have somtam, we have bacon, seems a fair deal to me.

[F4UCorsair]

5 hours ago, jaltsc said:

"While he noted that causes of cancer vary, Thais’ love of “pla ra” or raw fish used in somtam, as well as other undercooked foods are responsible for increased rates of worm infections, which can lead to liver cancer."

 

At best, he is illustrating an association, but not a cause and effect scenario.  Considering all the other unhealthy habits and environmental conditions associated with Thai lifestyle (High sodium and Sugar intake, High consumption of reused oil, use of agricultural sprays which have been banned in western nations, tobacco use, lack of adequate exercise, etc.) I find it unrealistic to blame one isolated micro factor. Perhaps further scientific research might isolate the main causes. However, I doubt many can effectively argue that an immediate reduction in the consumption of of the foods containing the elements mentioned above, better regulation of agricultural products, more exercise, etc. would not benefit many Thais. Sometimes common sense is the first step, especially when there are minimal negative side effects associated with those changes in lifestyle. 

My understanding is that this related specifically to liver cancer, triggered by worms from raw fish finding their way  to the liver.

I agree there are many other possible causes of other cancers though.

[soalbundy]

2 minutes ago, CGW said:

We live in a highly toxic world! daily exposure to all sorts of chemicals, include in that soaps, deodorants, shampoo, tooth paste, floor cleaning agents, GM foods, meats that are injected with all sorts of chemicals, animals that are fed all sorts of crap, vegetables that are sprayed with anything that will produce a bigger harvest - regardless, rotten fish! lets not mention all the airborne pollutants

Nowadays when people are going to retire they want to be near good hospitals, I wonder why?

The grim little reaper gets us all in the end but we still live a lot longer than say even as recently as the 1950's

[seahorse]

5 hours ago, overherebc said:

Never been a fan of thai food myself and never understood the reasoning behind eating food that has so much chilli in it. 

It always strikes me as strange that food should bring on a sweating session, red face and a need to drink litres of water to kill/cool off the burn. More like a competition than enjoyment. Locally I sometimes have TomYam Kung and ask them to bring the chilli in another side dish. Usually they bring 15 or so chillies in the dish for one bowl of soup.

Someone at the table will be happy to have them and add to their own bowl then sit there gasping, sweating and saying Aroi Aroi.

No way can that be good for your stomach lining or intestines over a lifetime.

Nonsense. Chili helps prevent cancer.

 

Health benefits of chili

health benefits

Chili health benefits

[Bill Miller]

Chillies originated in Mexico, and were brought to Asia in the sixteenth century by Portuguese traders. Many other popular veggies share the same provenance, such as tomatoes, potatoes, and maize (corn).
Chillies pose no threat to health when consumed in sane quantities. In fact they are noted as beneficial to cardiac systems, anti cancer effect, and weight loss aids.
I suspect as mentioned in another comment that westernization of the Thai diet is much more likely to be the source of increase in cancers, if it is a dietary phenomenon, what with increased reliance on fats and sugars. 

[dotpoom]

6 hours ago, Somtamnication said:

My wife giving up somtam? Never!

I pray it doesn't give her up!