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[snoop1130]

Tanks a Lot: Despite controversial sub purchase, army wants billions for Chinese tanks

By Coconuts Bangkok

 

Photo: Youtube.

 

With the first Chinese submarine not yet delivered to Thailand but already making headlines, the army has decided to request funds to buy 34 armored vehicles and 11 battle tanks from China as well.

 

The vehicles will cost THB2 billion while the request for purchase of the VT-4 battle tanks has not yet been made but will be soon.

 

It’s not that much when compared with the cash the Royal Thai Navy is laying out for the country’s first S26T submarine worth THB13.5 billion — a seafaring vehicle that many critics say the country doesn’t need since it’s not engaged in active maritime disputes.

 

Full Story: https://coconuts.co/bangkok/news/tanks-lot-despite-controversial-sub-purchase-army-wants-billions-chinese-tanks/

 

-- © Copyright Coconuts Bangkok 2017-5-9

[Moonmoon]

And The Army will get what they want, because without the Army, then what does Prayut have?

[pentap]

Could yet more military purchases, be a sign of something yet to materialise?

Why do so many governments/leaders etc have to be hell-bent on investing in what is termed, national security?

What about World security?

Why can't we, humans, as a collective, protect our home, this planet we live on?????








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[colinneil]

More toys for the boys, next 1 the air force will kick off. What about us.

We want the Chinese copy of the f35.

So on and so on, to hell with infrastructure, we dont care what the people want.

We just want our new toys.

[darksidedog]

When you have a military Government who are only capable of thinking in military measures, spending on sensible stuff is going to be way behind military hardware.

They will scratch their heads when they don't have the money for essentials, wondering "How did this happen?", But they will have a good w@nk over the sub and tanks and not give a shit about the "now safe" population being screwed on infrastructure, education and hospitals. Besides with the new media laws, no one can complain, because they probably won't know about any of it.

[simoh1490]

13 minutes ago, colinneil said:

More toys for the boys, next 1 the air force will kick off. What about us.

We want the Chinese copy of the f35.

So on and so on, to hell with infrastructure, we dont care what the people want.

We just want our new toys.

Thailand's spending on the military is well below the 2% of GDP (and more) spent by its neighbours and ASEAN counterparts. I appreciate you like to bash or ridicule all things Thai with nearly every one of your posts but the fact is the governement is simply renewing old equipment and bringing their own military capabilities up to a regionally competitive standard - this is an especially relevant thing to do given the current frictions to our East. 

 

Here's an older article on the subject, the situation has only worsened since: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-31/asia-military-spending-rises-in-china-s-shadow-spurring-deals

Edited May 9, 2017 by simoh1490

[mark131v]

Is a main battle tank overkill for suppressing the civil populace? 

 

lets be honest that is the only possible use for it but it's still more useful than the sub at least when this breaks down they have a ready made checkpoint.....

[clockman]

But nobody has ever fought a war, Except civil?

[overherebc]

1 hour ago, pentap said:

Could yet more military purchases, be a sign of something yet to materialise?

Why do so many governments/leaders etc have to be hell-bent on investing in what is termed, national security?

What about World security?

Why can't we, humans, as a collective, protect our home, this planet we live on?????








Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

To quote 'Arnie' from one of his movies, it's in our nature to destroy ourselves.

Doesn't matter what country, what religion, what colour.

We do it because we can.

[Misterwhisper]

Regardless whether they have that Chinese hardware or not, I have not the slightest doubt that once that mythical foreign military invasion lands on Thai shores (if ever) they'll surrender after 13 hours just like back in  December 1941 and their 900+ brave generals will either go into hiding or side with the enemy. 

[simoh1490]

12 minutes ago, clockman said:

But nobody has ever fought a war, Except civil?

Not according to Thai history which has involved wars with all of its neighbours, not that history could ever possibly repeat itself of course!.

[mark131v]

A conscript army lead by untested, uneducated badly trained leaders who are picked by having the right connections rather than any ability what could possibly go wrong, not sure they would last 13 hours before crumbling to be honest.....

[Eric Loh]

43 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

Thailand's spending on the military is well below the 2% of GDP (and more) spent by its neighbours and ASEAN counterparts. I appreciate you like to bash or ridicule all things Thai with nearly every one of your posts but the fact is the governement is simply renewing old equipment and bringing their own military capabilities up to a regionally competitive standard - this is an especially relevant thing to do given the current frictions to our East. 

 

Here's an older article on the subject, the situation has only worsened since: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-31/asia-military-spending-rises-in-china-s-shadow-spurring-deals

I think you hv to consider the affordability factor. All the countries mentioned in the article have GDP growth above 5% except Thailand. The words of President Widodo best explained that increase in defence spending depends on the country GDP growth or revenue collected. Don't you think a 7.3% increase in budget allocation at the expense of education, social and health is irresponsible. Thailand will continue to have a budget deficit for a long time due to this increase defenses spending and that will mean other more useful allocations will be sacrificed. 

[Eric Loh]

8 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

Not according to Thai history which has involved wars with all of its neighbours, not that history could ever possibly repeat itself of course!.

Those ancient wars were fought on horseback and elephants. Recent hostilities were border skirmishes not war.

[Orac]

It is not so much the money that is being spent - there has always been a huge black hole that swallows a vast part of Thailands money - it is the worry that once they have got bored of their Wang Nam Kiaw national forest villa that some future military strongman will decide to try them out because some regional potentate looked at him 'in a funny way'.

[robblok]

5 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

I think you hv to consider the affordability factor. All the countries mentioned in the article have GDP growth above 5% except Thailand. The words of President Widodo best explained that increase in defence spending depends on the country GDP growth or revenue collected. Don't you think a 7.3% increase in budget allocation at the expense of education, social and health is irresponsible. Thailand will continue to have a budget deficit for a long time due to this increase defenses spending and that will mean other more useful allocations will be sacrificed. 

There was already a  deficit under YL and her goons, so don't act like its the military who has unbalanced spending. Don't forget the 500 billion wasted off budget.. twice the size of the health budget.. quite extreme more as any Thai government before off books.

 

But I do agree that there should not have been an increase in the army its budget just the normal budget should be enough. 

 

Where do you get the 7,3% increase.. from.. i did not see it it but seems all the other countries increased their spending with far more than 7.3%

[Eric Loh]

2 minutes ago, robblok said:

There was already a  deficit under YL and her goons, so don't act like its the military who has unbalanced spending. Don't forget the 500 billion wasted off budget.. twice the size of the health budget.. quite extreme more as any Thai government before off books.

 

But I do agree that there should not have been an increase in the army its budget just the normal budget should be enough. 

 

Where do you get the 7,3% increase.. from.. i did not see it it but seems all the other countries increased their spending with far more than 7.3%

Read the article Robblok. Geez. 

Off topic alert on. 

[simoh1490]

19 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

I think you hv to consider the affordability factor. All the countries mentioned in the article have GDP growth above 5% except Thailand. The words of President Widodo best explained that increase in defence spending depends on the country GDP growth or revenue collected. Don't you think a 7.3% increase in budget allocation at the expense of education, social and health is irresponsible. Thailand will continue to have a budget deficit for a long time due to this increase defenses spending and that will mean other more useful allocations will be sacrificed. 

When all your neighbours are increasing their military spending, some quite massively, that's no time to be pedantic about whether your GDP is up to their levels or not, especially when your own budget is in otherwise such good shape and your own borrowings so low, by comparison. But hey Eric, I know you wanna bash the governement and their spending so don't let a few facts get in your way.

[simoh1490]

18 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Those ancient wars were fought on horseback and elephants. Recent hostilities were border skirmishes not war.

Past performance is no guarantee of .......!

[robblok]

Just now, Eric Loh said:

Read the article Robblok. Geez. 

Off topic alert on. 

Not off topic.. Thailand was in a deficit before the junta.... you blame the army for it while there was a deficit before AND 500 billion (twice the yearly health budget) during YL her tenure. You should not state lies blaming someone for a deficit that already existed. There was actually a 4.1% of GDP deficit in 2012 (highest in a while) during YL her reign. So could you please accept you were wrong about the junta having caused the deficit. 

 

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/thailand/government-budget

Thanks I reread the article.. Thailand increase was the lowest of everyone in the Asian area.

[simoh1490]

Just now, robblok said:

Not off topic.. Thailand was in a deficit before the junta.... you blame the army for it while there was a deficit before AND 500 billion (twice the yearly health budget) during YL her tenure. You should not state lies blaming someone for a deficit that already existed. There was actually a 4.1% of GDP deficit in 2012 (highest in a while) during YL her reign. So could you please accept you were wrong about the junta having caused the deficit. 

 

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/thailand/government-budget

Thanks I reread the article.. Thailand increase was the lowest of everyone in the Asian area.

Agreed, 2008 (financial crisis)  was the key and that was independent of governement.

[seajae]

unfortunately any military force needs to keep its hardware up to date or at least able to match what those that are close by have, its common sense really. Doesnt matter who is running the country a military force does need modern equipment even if some people dont like it. The fact that they are doing this just after the subs is a bit off but they cant sit on the bums and do nothing when and if their current ones are obsolete & do need replacing. Maybe if the govt actually raised more money by making people pay their taxes etc instead of having a cash society that allows so much corruption they would be in so much sh*t and could afford to put more into everything needed by the country

[JAG]

1 hour ago, mark131v said:

A conscript army lead by untested, uneducated badly trained leaders who are picked by having the right connections rather than any ability what could possibly go wrong, not sure they would last 13 hours before crumbling to be honest.....

 

I wonder whether they have thought of the logistic support, communications equipment, self propelled artillery support, armoured engineer support ('cos these MBTs will certainly be too heavy for 90% of the bridges off major roads), armoured infantry units, workshop facilities and all the other elements required to support and operate a modern armoured formation in the field. It is eye wateringly expensive, and requires constant training and exercising to keep it all working..

 

Maybe they will just line them up on a range once a year, pop off a few rounds, and then drive past a grandstand before the General stands up on top of one and makes a speech?

Edited May 9, 2017 by JAG

[mark131v]

4 minutes ago, JAG said:

 

I wonder whether they have thought of the logistic support, communications equipment, self propelled artillery support, armoured engineer support ('cos these MBTs will certainly be too heavy for 90% of the bridges off major roads), armoured infantry units, workshop facilities and all the other elements required to support and operate a modern armoured formation in the field. It is eye wateringly expensive, and requires constant training and exercising to keep it all working..

 

Maybe they will just line them up on a range once a year, pop off a few rounds, and then drive past a grandstand before the General stands up on top of one and makes a speech?

To think about the logistics would need a level of forethought and professionalism I fear is lacking if their glorious leaders are anything to go by.... 

 

I would be willing to bet all that stuff is way down the list same as maintenance, training, and combined exercises. Still they will look nice parked up/broken down by the camp gates and will give the illusion of an effective fighting force....

[mark01]

The hardware is just some undisclosed dealings with China as is often the case with costly procurement.

"We will scratch your back. You buy our stuff".

[grumbleweed]

The tanks are useless as part of any invasion force. All the defending countries have to do is set up a couple of roundabouts along their borders. By the time this lot have negotiated them they'll have forgotten what the hell they came for.

[robblok]

11 hours ago, JAG said:

 

I wonder whether they have thought of the logistic support, communications equipment, self propelled artillery support, armoured engineer support ('cos these MBTs will certainly be too heavy for 90% of the bridges off major roads), armoured infantry units, workshop facilities and all the other elements required to support and operate a modern armoured formation in the field. It is eye wateringly expensive, and requires constant training and exercising to keep it all working..

 

Maybe they will just line them up on a range once a year, pop off a few rounds, and then drive past a grandstand before the General stands up on top of one and makes a speech?

You might well be right as you have far more army training then me, however I doubt news about logistics and communications equipment would make a nice news article.. I havent seen any about guns or bullets but I am sure they still buy those. Point being we don't know everything they buy and agree on a news agency is not going to put out news that is not interesting (for you it would be).

 

I hate military spending I am Dutch we never spend too much on our army there are far more useful things to do with that kind of money. However when everyone around you is starting to spend more its better to keep up a bit. Thailand was still the country that grew the least in military spending. 

 

Maybe if they cleaned the army up it would need less money same goes for education and healthcare too much bureaucratie and dead weight. It wont happen of course because being a civil servant is a job for life.

[worgeordie]

I think everyone  will know the real reasons for all this military spending,

and why most of it seems to be with China,just think what Thailand is

famous for,no not sex,the other thing.no not road accidents,begins with C.

regards worgeordie

[Xobtsiwt]

2 hours ago, grumbleweed said:

The tanks are useless as part of any invasion force. All the defending countries have to do is set up a couple of roundabouts along their borders. By the time this lot have negotiated them they'll have forgotten what the hell they came for.

I think they'd find roundabouts no obstacle at all. In any case, everyone knows that Thai tanks only go in straight lines.

 

 

[sanukjim]

15 hours ago, clockman said:

But nobody has ever fought a war, Except civil?

The Vietnam War proved that tanks in mostly swampy areas or hilly and mountainous terrain and jungle areas (which South East Asia mostly is) were useless except as fortified armed check points and pill bunkers.The US army Cobra helicopters wiped out the large tank force that the NVA had in a matter of days,using the new wire guided missiles.This tank deal is to supply the army Generals with their own billions in their pockets the same as did the submarine deal did for the Admirals.New Ferraris and Lamborghini's all around.