How serious is Thailand's illegal drug use?

[Scott]

There has been a lot of focus on illegal drugs world wide and special attention on countries such as the Philippines.   In your estimation, how serious is the problem with the use of illegal drugs in Thailand?

 

Please feel free to leave a comment.

[NoshowJones]

I would doubt if there are any countries who do not have drug problems, the only thing that might lessen the problem is very long jail time sentences for the dealers, say a minimum of five years.

[overherebc]

10 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

I would doubt if there are any countries who do not have drug problems, the only thing that might lessen the problem is very long jail time sentences for the dealers, say a minimum of five years.

Agree, probably no worse than anywhere else.

[SiamBeast]

We've seen it with the US, long jail sentences do not deter drug users. An addiction is an addiction just like nicotine - at this point, people are in love with their substance and cannot let it go. Throwing them in jail will allow them to learn the ropes of criminality. We all know that there are no rehab programs in Thai jails - it's just a lock & forget place. I think we should focus on rehabilitation a lot more - forced rehab for first-time offenders.

 

We gain nothing by piling people up in jails, except separating families.

[Shiver]

When I was renting a place in Jomtien several years back, I had this horrible realisation that most of the people I associated with were using Meth.  That included my then GF, my Business partner, two employees, a husband and wife team (breast feeding her twins at the same time) and several of the neighbours in houses both next to and opposite me (the latter turned out to be the supplier).  I suddenly felt like I was in a zombie movie and I couldn't trust anyone who I'd previously thought were close to me.

 

I tried rational discussion, veiled threats to cut off their finances, arguments,  or any other futile measure I could get my hands on.  It didn't take too long to realise that it was fruitless.  Meth is more important than even close family, let alone Thai friends, farang and each other.  I got the hell out of there, they lost their jobs, and I sold my half of the company, which until that point had been growing very nicely (he then managed to run it solo into the ground in 4 months flat due to insolvency where it previously has >$100K in excess income after salaries.  My business partner was getting through 400K baht per month, and his new GF was also a heavy user so presumably that only went up after my exit (non drinker non smoker and almost a non eater and non sleeper for days at a time).  He refused to let me take a look at the accounts (yes, of a company that was half mine!).

 

I tried so save one of them from prison (at great financial and even greater emotional expense).  Lasted 1 month back on the outside then was back inside with multi-year conviction, so I left them to do the time second time around.

If you know anyone using it, stay away from them and change your number if necessary.  They'll steal from you then help you look for the money 'you' lost.  There were no happy endings.  All of their lives were scarred or destroyed and nobody got out unharmed (not me, not family or their 'clean' friends, or society in general I would imagine).

 

Bear in mind I'm talking specifically about Meth-Amphetamine here (aka crystal, or ice), not a relaxing toke of Mary Jane.

 

I voted for 'Serious' in the above poll, as the majority of the population aren't like that, but birds of a feather...  There are more people than perhaps you'd like to believe using ice or Yaa Baa not too far from you though.  Once you know what to look for it is unmistakeable, otherwise you could be oblivious.  Get out and never look back.  Especially if you're a stranger in a strange land as farangs are..

 

[Shiver]

48 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

I would doubt if there are any countries who do not have drug problems, the only thing that might lessen the problem is very long jail time sentences for the dealers, say a minimum of five years.

They don't consider that at all, they're all too smart to get caught, until they are caught.

[AGareth2]

do a Portugal

[sirmud63]

i went with not to serious, you could measure any countrys drug problem by there crime rate . 

theres alot worse out there than thiland.

[hobz]

Usually drugs are not the root cause of problems. 

Drugs just takes a bad person and makes the situation worse. 

Take away the drugs and you still have a broken person.

It's not black and white... But the point is, if you find that you have massive drug problems in a population, i guarantee that trying to take away the drugs will not fix the real problems.

Also i dont think thailand has serious drug problems except that i think its seriously problematic that weed is illegal.

[johnnysunshine]

I agree that ice and meth are problems and they are drugs...just like pharmaceutical drugs which are man made of chemicals and are over prescribed and misprescribed so many times.

These should not be confused with plants like weed or mushrooms which grow in the ground or under lights for the plants and cow poop for the mushrooms (elephant poop works well too I have heard).

So, everyone, remember, there is a difference between plants and drugs...let us choose to be more specific for clarity!

[halloween]

58 minutes ago, johnnysunshine said:

I agree that ice and meth are problems and they are drugs...just like pharmaceutical drugs which are man made of chemicals and are over prescribed and misprescribed so many times.

These should not be confused with plants like weed or mushrooms which grow in the ground or under lights for the plants and cow poop for the mushrooms (elephant poop works well too I have heard).

So, everyone, remember, there is a difference between plants and drugs...let us choose to be more specific for clarity!

By all means avoid aspirin and penicillin. But hemlock and datura should be OK, right?

[wump]

Look at Portugal and see what happens if you decriminalize all drugs. Not advocating meth use (seen pretty bad examples myself) but there will always be some % of the population turning to substances, got zero to do with availability .

[Tapster]

2 hours ago, Shiver said:

Once you know what to look for it is unmistakeable,

@Shiver

 

Seriously (this is not a troll wind-up), what are the signs to look for.

 

And are we talking about here: meth being smoked or snorted, or do you mean ya-ba, not crystal meth?

 

Cheers

[Sapporillo]

41 minutes ago, wump said:

Look at Portugal and see what happens if you decriminalize all drugs. Not advocating meth use (seen pretty bad examples myself) but there will always be some % of the population turning to substances, got zero to do with availability .

I've always been an advocate of legalization of all drugs, but I have to admit that meth (yaba) is a tough one. It can turn good people into lying, thieving and sometimes murdering monsters, although it is only psychologically addictive. That's why I think that programs like forced rehab won't necessarily help, it's easy to quit taking meth, what these people need is a reason to not start taking it again.

I guess that even with yaba, prohibition is doing much more harm than good. Instead of financing drug cartels and corruption, the same money could be used for prevention and treatment...just my opinion. 

[Laab Muu]

3 hours ago, SiamBeast said:

I think we should focus on rehabilitation a lot more - forced rehab for first-time offenders.

 

It already is exactly that in Thailand.

[Thongkorn]

Look at the Cause, Poor living standards Poor wages and  bad Education ,

[impulse]

Substitute the word "alcohol" for "drug" and answer the question again.

 

Then substitute "prohibition" for "war on drugs" and figure out how effective it's likely to be in solving the root issues.

 

Legalize it, tax it, control the quality and distribution, take the money away from the bad guys and put it into the public coffers, quit spending $$ billions and tearing apart families to warehouse flawed but otherwise decent human beings in prison.

 

Maybe if there were legal and affordable alternatives to meth and yaba, people wouldn't have to rob their friends to ingest very dodgy crap to get some relief from whatever they're seeking relief from.

Edited May 14, 2017 by impulse

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, AGareth2 said:

do a Portugal

That undoubtedly costs a great deal of public money to implement. Can't see the Thai government being willing to fund it.

 

My solution, as always, is to allow people to use as many drugs as they wish, and only penalise them if they do something bad under the influence. Of course people that are in positions of importance like pilots and bus drivers would have to be tested before doing anything affecting safety of others.

If someone wants to kill themselves using dangerous substances, who is anyone else to stop them?

Most deaths on the roads of Thailand involve alcohol, a legal drug, so addiction obviously can't be "cured" by laws.

[morocco]

3 hours ago, hobz said:

Usually drugs are not the root cause of problems. 

Drugs just takes a bad person and makes the situation worse. 

Take away the drugs and you still have a broken person.

It's not black and white... But the point is, if you find that you have massive drug problems in a population, i guarantee that trying to take away the drugs will not fix the real problems.

Also i dont think thailand has serious drug problems except that i think its seriously problematic that weed is illegal.

You don't have a clue about what you are talking about. I have not heard so much dribble as you talk. I have seen good and intelligent people lose everything due to hard drugs. Most of them did not start drugs because they were broken people. Fortunately many people make it back to reality.  Many don't. Weed is just another gateway drug like tobacco and alcohol. The most common problem is excess use due to addiction. 

Edited May 14, 2017 by morocco

[maewang99]

kids are told that doing drugs is naughty.  it's "bad". 

if you don't have the details on something..... it's easy to tell yourself whatever convenient narrative fits your desires. think of Trump. 

when you read up on something.... the more you know and learn... detailed... the better it sticks with you. we're not talking memorization, just getting the details.... by reading. it's the only way. even if you were the son or daughter of a narc officer.... let's say.. or medical doctor.... you and your kids only have the time, energy and patience for a few hours of discussing how f%^ked up you can get on drugs and why folks use them etc....

 

..... but with books ****you**** can spend many many hours, at your ****own**** pace... and discover on your own... ON YOUR OWN... discovering rather than being told..... not just somebody saying "don't be a naughty boy.... just say no"...  and there is a much higher propensity for drug use to the inverse of a person's friend's family and personal reading habits..... and not just s*&t like comic books... or Shakespeare "wonderful" plays... but books on life, people, biology, fiction, nonfiction..... this is the crux of everything.

look at a Thai bookstore at the mall.  how big is the shop? does everyone use Amazon? what kind of books do they have? Buddhist tomes... and a few western sleepers translated into Thai such as "The Amazing And Great Donald Trump's 24 Hour TV Exercise Diet" etc..... and what sells at the bookstore? books? no. coloring pens, coloring pencils and various plastic widgets. 

it's the biggest thing in Thailand.  it's what the education system inculcates quite carefully and successfully. make jokes and piss on books. which everywhere else in the world... reading books only vies with travel... and not even sex... or drugs... or alcohol.... as most folks favorite pastime..... 

are they exporting Yabba pills from the North in the millions?

in the millions of pills in one truck load?

just the other month?

 

problem? helloooooooo.

 

same applies to marriage.... bad family? bad background someone says..... you can't just get a broad and sophisticated world view by talking to a few buddies at school and listening to dreary ajarn.  the more someone reads, the more they ****connect**** with ****all**** of us.... ****broader**** perspectives.... discovered on their own...... why is it that college grads are more liberal? easy... uuummm....

real college grads... not the local kind. no matter how many "degrees" they have or whether they are or are not wearing a white shirt and black shorts or skirt. how much they have learned to love learning and gaining a wider perspective... that is what a student is.







 

Edited May 14, 2017 by maewang99

[Laza 45]

4 hours ago, Shiver said:

When I was renting a place in Jomtien several years back, I had this horrible realisation that most of the people I associated with were using Meth.  That included my then GF, my Business partner, two employees, a husband and wife team (breast feeding her twins at the same time) and several of the neighbours in houses both next to and opposite me (the latter turned out to be the supplier).  I suddenly felt like I was in a zombie movie and I couldn't trust anyone who I'd previously thought were close to me.

 

I tried rational discussion, veiled threats to cut off their finances, arguments,  or any other futile measure I could get my hands on.  It didn't take too long to realise that it was fruitless.  Meth is more important than even close family, let alone Thai friends, farang and each other.  I got the hell out of there, they lost their jobs, and I sold my half of the company, which until that point had been growing very nicely (he then managed to run it solo into the ground in 4 months flat due to insolvency where it previously has >$100K in excess income after salaries.  My business partner was getting through 400K baht per month, and his new GF was also a heavy user so presumably that only went up after my exit (non drinker non smoker and almost a non eater and non sleeper for days at a time).  He refused to let me take a look at the accounts (yes, of a company that was half mine!).

 

I tried so save one of them from prison (at great financial and even greater emotional expense).  Lasted 1 month back on the outside then was back inside with multi-year conviction, so I left them to do the time second time around.

If you know anyone using it, stay away from them and change your number if necessary.  They'll steal from you then help you look for the money 'you' lost.  There were no happy endings.  All of their lives were scarred or destroyed and nobody got out unharmed (not me, not family or their 'clean' friends, or society in general I would imagine).

 

Bear in mind I'm talking specifically about Meth-Amphetamine here (aka crystal, or ice), not a relaxing toke of Mary Jane.

 

I voted for 'Serious' in the above poll, as the majority of the population aren't like that, but birds of a feather...  There are more people than perhaps you'd like to believe using ice or Yaa Baa not too far from you though.  Once you know what to look for it is unmistakeable, otherwise you could be oblivious.  Get out and never look back.  Especially if you're a stranger in a strange land as farangs are..

 

Yep.. that is serious.. I hear a bit of domestic violence going on in the near neighborhood.. and I am told that ya-ba use is widespread.. but it is not really obvious.. there are reports of busts of hundreds of thousand of pills.. maybe millions.. so somebody is obviously taking it.. if the reports are true..  it seems most of it is coming from the hill tribe people in Burma.. the Wa and Shan in particular.. easier to produce and transport than opium/heroin  .. and a good source of revenue to support their wars and lifestyle.. so I guess.. serious.. especially if you are on the road and someone high on ya-ba and lao khao is coming at you.. what can be done when so many that are supposed to be doing the policing are making a lot of money out of it??   

Edited May 14, 2017 by Laza 45
spelling..

[impulse]

21 minutes ago, Laza 45 said:

what can be done when so many that are supposed to be doing the policing are making a lot of money out of it??   

 

Legalize it and take away their revenue stream?  Let Pfizer or Phillip Morris or Chang sell it.

 

Edit:  And make them put a tiny little bit of Ex-Lax in each dose, so nobody's too tempted to overdo it...

 

Edited May 14, 2017 by impulse

[maewang99]

for folks who only buy simple physical laws.....

no..... having a broader self discovered perspective on life....

doesn't mean you won't take drugs.

but there sure as f*&k is a correlation.

same with alcohol. how much you wanna bet the average Thai alcoholic has no appreciative sense at all of the first of the 5 precursors to a horrific death is an inflammatory response in a single cell.... a single what? inflama what? 

that plus some real knowledge and ****appreciation**** (in your GUT) of statistics and probabilities.....

you need to know. the details. only way to get them. buds and ajarn and mommie and daddie only have time and energy for stuff like "just say no"...... you gotta discover and share... you gotta be with those who discover and share... NOT drugs.... discover and share a connection with the rest of the 10 billion or so people who still live..... or have ever lived..... and wrote something down for you to enjoy and benefit from.... or to get you pissed off, that's okay too......... in a book.

 

and not in any ONE book..... or even a few dozen..... we read um by the dozens a year.... and never stop...... by the hundreds and thousands of books... and not just what you want to read.

anything and everything.

 

not just comic books.

 

and I'm not just talking about Shakespeare's stuff and crap like that. read everything, even the ONE book books that other folks live by... some of them.  and choose.. something other than drugs.... and TV and alcohol.... and instead connect and share.

  

Edited May 14, 2017 by maewang99

[bangkokairportlink]

I knew from very poor Thai to very rich Thai, all doing dope, so I guess it is more than anyone can think about.

And I think all countries with stupid retarded anti drugs laws deserve all the troubles.

Let people do what they want at home, but send them to jail for years if they do it on the road !

 

 

[penco]

I can't say I've personally been aware of those around me using drugs but the TGF says that yaba (a form of meth I believe) is an increasingly common amongst Isaan younger people both in Isaan and among the Isaan people in BKK. I can well believe it when you're doing 12 hours shifts 6 days a week in a factory in Pathum Thani or Ayutthaya with only enough money for a room, a TV and meals from the 7-11, life must seem pretty grim.

[Laza 45]

4 minutes ago, penco said:

I can't say I've personally been aware of those around me using drugs but the TGF says that yaba (a form of meth I believe) is an increasingly common amongst Isaan younger people both in Isaan and among the Isaan people in BKK. I can well believe it when you're doing 12 hours shifts 6 days a week in a factory in Pathum Thani or Ayutthaya with only enough money for a room, a TV and meals from the 7-11, life must seem pretty grim.

I'd need something to get me through the day too..  lol..   ...for 300 or 350Bt a day..  not a lot left over for treats..

[penco]

1 minute ago, Laza 45 said:

...for 300 or 350Bt a day..  not a lot left over for treats..

Spot on. That's exactly what my TGF earns. With only public holidays and her other days off are basically the bridging days between switching from day to night shift and vice versa

It makes me realise how "feather-bedded" I am in the West in comparison.

[Laza 45]

4 minutes ago, penco said:

Spot on. That's exactly what my TGF earns. With only public holidays and her other days off are basically the bridging days between switching from day to night shift and vice versa

It makes me realise how "feather-bedded" I am in the West in comparison.

Yes.. it makes you realize how fortunate we are..  my GF has her own small business.. gets up 3AM  5 days a week to go to the market to get supplies.. gets the shop going by 7.. gets home at 2:30 or 3 .. makes f-all but likes to make her own money.. and the social life that goes with the job.. she does't have to do it but she wants to..  many in her family work much harder for not much more..  and basically they are happy!! ... in Australia my friends make mountains more and are stressed out! 

[Laab Muu]

2 hours ago, impulse said:

take the money away from the bad guys and put it into the public coffers

It's the real bad guys who control the public coffers.

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, morocco said:

You don't have a clue about what you are talking about. I have not heard so much dribble as you talk. I have seen good and intelligent people lose everything due to hard drugs. Most of them did not start drugs because they were broken people. Fortunately many people make it back to reality.  Many don't. Weed is just another gateway drug like tobacco and alcohol. The most common problem is excess use due to addiction. 

I'm not saying anything about good or bad people, but addictive personalities will suffer. Luckily I never took the opportunity to try, so didn't get hooked, but it's not that hard to say no if one knows the consequences. It's much harder to stop. Trouble is, there is almost no education about the subject in schools and young people think it's cool to use drugs like e etc.

All schoolchildren should be taken to see corpses of drug users that died.

 

Disagree 100% about mj, tobacco and alcohol being gateway drugs.

Lifestyle would be the most important factor. Associating with people that use drugs socially would be much more influential in starting.

Young people are more likely to take it up if their parents and friends use it, and not if visa versa.

I know tobacco smokers that have never used any thing harder and same for alcohol.

 

While mj might be no better for one than alcohol or tobacco, it's time to stop criminalising people that use it. No one I know got violent on it and beat other people up like they do on alcohol.

Edited May 14, 2017 by thaibeachlovers