British police says responding to serious incident at Manchester Arena

[simple1]

9 hours ago, Grouse said:

Maybe English is not your first language? An apologist is someone who justifies something. In this case the slaughter of teenage girls. What possible justification can there be for that? Those attitudes need to be rooted out.

 

I am vehement but in no way irrational. My concern is that such appalling acts can be condoned by certain people. It is clear to me that perpetrators are assisted by their communities and responsibility is therefore mutual.

 

When those "scapegoated" standup and decry such an atrocity, I may moderate my stance. I shan't hold my breath.

No one in this topic has sought to justify the attack, only posted their thoughts of possible motivations by the killer and his helpers. Surely people can post their opinions on the root cause/s of this attack & other mass causality attacks in the EU, without being subjected to the known methodologies of attempted right wing social media censureship.

 

As you & other will know by now a number of people within the orbit of the killer in the UK did contact authorities to warn them of the killer's support of religious/political violence.

[RickBradford]

We know the motivation of these people, because they keep telling us.

 

They are following a toxic Islamist jihadist ideology which justifies blowing up children, or mowing down pedestrians, or shooting down  concert-goers. 

 

Khalid Masood, the Westminster Bridge terrorist, said openly on social media that he was "carrying out jihad". People who knew Salman Abedi have gone on the record to say that he was increasingly in thrall to extremist Islamist groups.

 

The problem is that politicians and the media refuse in any way to listen to what they are being told by the perpetrators themselves. In most cases, they can't even utter the word "Islam" in connection with these atrocities.

 

If we can't recognise the problem for what it is, we have no hope of combatting it.

 

 

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, simple1 said:

No one in this topic has sought to justify the attack, only posted their thoughts of possible motivations by the killer and his helpers. Surely people can post their opinions on the root cause/s of this attack & other mass causality attacks in the EU, without being subjected to the known methodologies of attempted right wing social media censureship.

 

As you & other will know by now a number of people within the orbit of the killer in the UK did contact authorities to warn them of the killer's support of religious/political violence.

Oh well that's OK then

 

 

In the meantime, here's another lot; I wonder if there's a common denominator? Can't see one myself

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-40054249

 

[stevenl]

17 minutes ago, RickBradford said:

We know the motivation of these people, because they keep telling us.

 

They are following a toxic Islamist jihadist ideology which justifies blowing up children, or mowing down pedestrians, or shooting down  concert-goers. 

 

Khalid Masood, the Westminster Bridge terrorist, said openly on social media that he was "carrying out jihad". People who knew Salman Abedi have gone on the record to say that he was increasingly in thrall to extremist Islamist groups.

 

The problem is that politicians and the media refuse in any way to listen to what they are being told by the perpetrators themselves. In most cases, they can't even utter the word "Islam" in connection with these atrocities.

 

If we can't recognise the problem for what it is, we have no hope of combatting it.

 

 

Those same people already reported him before this happened. So in this case it seems the mosque, friends and family warned authorities, who for some reason ignored the warnings.

[simple1]

34 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Oh well that's OK then

 

 

In the meantime, here's another lot; I wonder if there's a common denominator? Can't see one myself

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-40054249

 

Silly comment by you. Good work by the security forces

[bert bloggs]

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

Those same people already reported him before this happened. So in this case it seems the mosque, friends and family warned authorities, who for some reason ignored the warnings.

The problem is that you can warn the authorities all day long that someone has been radicalized ,but what can they do about it , follow him 24/7? raid his house ? lock him up ? we all know what will happen ,people will start screaming racism ,or religous hatism ? etc etc .it was well known who the main culprits where for carrying knives ,so stop and search was implemented , look what happened there .

[Grouse]

6 minutes ago, RickBradford said:

In many past events of this kind, the "some reason" that warnings are ignored are just as I have stated — politicians, public servants and the media are in denial over suggestions that members of their sacred Religion of Peace could be about to go on a jihadist killing spree of civilians.

 

For similar reasons, Muslim pedophile gangs were allowed to roam unchallenged for a decade in a town near Manchester, grooming and gang-raping thousands of young white girls while the police turned a blind eye. Social workers begged the police to get involved, to no avail.

 

The pathology is the same. The West has become so enfeebled by political correctness that it can no longer defend itself.

I don't think a majority of British males are enfeebled in any way. There is likely to be a backlash if authorities don't get a grip very quickly. I don't agree with any kind of violence / vigilante response, but, the communities must be held to account, jointly and severally. I am looking forward to a much stronger Prevent program and automatic quarantine for males returning from a list of countries by whichever route.

 

One way or another, The British will not tolerate barbarism in their midst.

[transam]

6 minutes ago, Grouse said:

I don't think a majority of British males are enfeebled in any way. There is likely to be a backlash if authorities don't get a grip very quickly. I don't agree with any kind of violence / vigilante response, but, the communities must be held to account, jointly and severally. I am looking forward to a much stronger Prevent program and automatic quarantine for males returning from a list of countries by whichever route.

 

One way or another, The British will not tolerate barbarism in their midst.

You cannot castigate communities because of a few nutters in the UK. If you go down that route you will be as bad as the ISIS mob who are doing exactly that.

 

Yes there is a problem with a few radicals that must be fished out, but that will be a very difficult job, but one that our secret service is probably doing a good job behind the scenes and am sure Muslim folk are playing a big part to help, behind the scenes..

[Prbkk]

3 minutes ago, RickBradford said:

^^

Note that Andy Burnham, the mayor of Manchester, called last year for the Prevent program to be scrapped as it was 'discriminatory' and 'toxic'.

 

 

The uncomfortable truth is that everyone is going to have to give up some freedoms. No one likes the idea of greater surveillance, intrusions, queues, searches, travel delays and restrictions, hotlines, scrutiny, ..but necessary IMO as a small part in the fight to keep everyone safe ( but NOT a carte blanche for the control freaks and martinets to snoop and harass without cause).

[Peterw42]

These attacks are about 3 groups, nutters, Muslims and non-Muslims.

 

The goal of the nutters is to turn non-Muslims against Muslims.

 

They are achieving there goals and 90% of the population is helping them achieve their goals. 

 

By condemning Muslims or associating these nutters as Muslims, you are supporting the terrorists goals.

 

Dont even mention the terrorists name or acknowledge the religion they are "acting in the name of", and you take away their power.

 

 

[Grouse]

47 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

These attacks are about 3 groups, nutters, Muslims and non-Muslims.

 

The goal of the nutters is to turn non-Muslims against Muslims.

 

They are achieving there goals and 90% of the population is helping them achieve their goals. 

 

By condemning Muslims or associating these nutters as Muslims, you are supporting the terrorists goals.

 

Dont even mention the terrorists name or acknowledge the religion they are "acting in the name of", and you take away their power.

 

 

I used to take that stance; it doesn't work

 

We need to take a hard line now. I don't give a damn what the Islamists think. Behave or take the consequences 

[kevkev1888]

1 hour ago, Peterw42 said:

Dont even mention the terrorists name or acknowledge the religion they are "acting in the name of", and you take away their power.

Tell that to the families of the hundreds killed and maimed in recent attacks throughout  Europe in recent times.

Just ignoring it will not make it go away.

 

35 minutes ago, Grouse said:

By condemning Muslims or associating these nutters as Muslims, you are supporting the terrorists goals.

These nutters are Muslims. How can ignoring that fact help? 

Muslims can only be accepted if they disassociate themselves from ideologies of permanent war with non-Muslims and moderate Muslims.

 

[bert bloggs]

2 hours ago, Prbkk said:

The uncomfortable truth is that everyone is going to have to give up some freedoms. No one likes the idea of greater surveillance, intrusions, queues, searches, travel delays and restrictions, hotlines, scrutiny, ..but necessary IMO as a small part in the fight to keep everyone safe ( but NOT a carte blanche for the control freaks and martinets to snoop and harass without cause).

Unfortunatly ,that is what they will use it for , 1984 was just a little late coming ,it will get far far more intrusive as the years go by .

[simple1]

2 minutes ago, Flustered said:

If only it were a few we could probably nip it in the bud.

 

Wake up and look around you. As soon as any attempt is made to interview suspects, the Luvvie Liberal PC brigade is screaming "Racial Discrimination".

 

Still, if it's an Islamic State of Britain that you want, just sit back and let it happen. That's what millions of Muslims want and it will happen. The proof has already been posted on the expansion of Islam in the UK.

So far police have arrested eight suspects. who has objected to their interrogation? As to the rest of your post , again the usual right of centre blah, blah

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed.  

[Grouse]

39 minutes ago, simple1 said:

So far police have arrested eight suspects. who has objected to their interrogation? As to the rest of your post , again the usual right of centre blah, blah

What about their supporters, the ones who provide succour and aid and money and expertise??

 

What about their fans, the ones who applauded such atrocities on social media?

 

No, sorry, we need strong action. Now!

 

I am left wing apparantly 

[onthesoi]

As election campaign resumes, Labour leader to draw link between UK foreign policy and terror attacks...

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2017/may/26/general-election-2017-terror-corbyn-may-g7-sicily-politics-live

[AGareth2]

1 minute ago, onthesoi said:

As election campaign resumes, Labour leader to draw link between UK foreign policy and terror attacks...

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2017/may/26/general-election-2017-terror-corbyn-may-g7-sicily-politics-live

very bad timing!!!

 

[onthesoi]

22 minutes ago, Grouse said:

What about their fans, the ones who applauded such atrocities on social media?

 

Is applause illegal?

[onthesoi]

1 minute ago, AGareth2 said:

very bad timing!!!

 

Somebody needs to tell the truth.....although will probably go down like a lead balloon as people like to blame other people for their mistakes.

[Caps]

35 minutes ago, onthesoi said:

 

Is applause illegal?

Not a very bright post

unless of course you think it should be applauded.  

Grouse did not mean it that way 

So stop playing with words 

Edited May 26, 2017 by Caps

[transam]

5 minutes ago, Caps said:

Not a very bright post

unless of course you think it should be applauded.  

Grouse did not mean it that way 

So stop playing with words 

[onthesoi]

9 minutes ago, Caps said:

Not a very bright post

unless of course you think it should be applauded.  

Grouse did not mean it that way 

So stop paying with words 

Grouse was replying to a post which said arrests have been made, he asked what was being done about those applauding the attack online ...try to keep up.

 

Btw I always pay in cash...

[Caps]

Just now, onthesoi said:

Grouse was replying to a post which said arrests have been made, he asked what was being done about those applauding the attack online ...try to keep up.

 

Btw I always pay in cash...

Oh, i am keeping up alright, looking at your trolling posts

 

...and good for you 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 5/25/2017 at 3:24 AM, simple1 said:

Off Topic. However, again you are one of the people talking about a very conservative version of Islam /Sharia Law.  I personally know many Thai Muslim families in Pattaya over the past twenty years, some of whom have inter married with Buddhists with minimal issues. Most of the Thai Muslims I know attend a mosque at least once a week on a Friday,. they do not view themselves as Muslim in name only. As Thaihome has pointed out there are a number of posters who talk about Muslims as though they are all the same in their religious and cultural practices which is absolute nonsense. 

There is only ONE version of Islam, and that is the Koran. The Koran has never been altered or reformed, unlike the Bible.

A "good" Muslim is by definition one that follows the Koran to the letter.

There is no "conservative vs moderate" version of Islam.

 

Allah says: “Do not marry idolatresses (al mushrikāt) till they believe; and certainly a believing maid is better than an idolatress even though she would please you; and do not marry idolaters (al Mushrikīn) till they believe (hata yūminū), and certainly a believing slave is better than an idolater, even though he would please you. These invite to the Fire, and Allah invites to the Garden and to forgiveness by His grace, and makes clear His revelations to mankind so that they may remember.”Qur’an 2:221.

 

http://www.asma-lamrabet.com/articles/what-does-the-qur-an-say-about-the-interfaith-marriage/

[onthesoi]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

There is no "conservative vs moderate" version of Islam.

 

Utter nonsense...

[onthesoi]

5 minutes ago, Caps said:

Oh, i am keeping up alright, looking at your trolling posts

Yes, everyone who doesnt accept your extremist right wing view of the world must be a troll.....my arguements have been defeated, you win.

Edited May 26, 2017 by onthesoi

[transam]

4 minutes ago, onthesoi said:

Yes, everyone who doesnt accept your extremist right wing view of the world must be a troll.....my arguements have been defeated, you win.

That's a relief......

[simple1]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

What about their supporters, the ones who provide succour and aid and money and expertise??

<snip>

What on earth are you on about - it's exactly what UK security forces do - try to track down all those involved. 

 

[simple1]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

There is only ONE version of Islam, and that is the Koran. The Koran has never been altered or reformed, unlike the Bible.

A "good" Muslim is by definition one that follows the Koran to the letter.

There is no "conservative vs moderate" version of Islam.

<snip>

Well then, according to your definition, there will be hundreds of millions who are not good Muslims. Your other comment is ill-informed, there are many variations of compliance to Islam / Sharia Law practised. e.g.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberalism_and_progressivism_in_the_Muslim_world

Edited May 26, 2017 by simple1