It's a wait and see game - smokers and drinkers will discover tax fate on Saturday

[robblok]

7 minutes ago, PREM-R said:

These price increases will, no doubt, have been worked out by accountants,  As  I am sure you will know Robbie Block, accountants know the cost of everything.... and the value of nothing.

If you say so, but usually accountants follow orders.. they are not the ones making the plans.. and price elasticity is a commercial thing.. not an accounting thing. If my clients tell me to calculate something I will, not my job to tell them how to run their company. I would give advice.. but the clients decide.. kinda like here.. goverment decide... accountants just calculate and maybe give some advice.

[rkidlad]

4 minutes ago, robblok said:

Never said the subs were a good Idea I am against them, but the put the blame of this tax increase on the subs is crazy. They are peanuts compared to the losses fromt he rice program and the extra cost the health program has. Thailand has a small tax base.. and too many costs (should cut military spending for sure). 

Would be less need for such increases if subs weren't being purchased. 

 

When the balance is low, be frugal. Don't be frugal and buy subs. It's the definition of careless. What Ying Luck was. 

[Jack Mountain]

2 Weeks ago my alcohol dealer said only 20 Baht more for a case of Singha (small). Just called them and now they don't know :-)  Ordered a couple of cases which are still the old price. 

Had a beer at a moms & pops yesterday and they charged 5 Baht more for a large Singha.

[Thian]

19 minutes ago, rkidlad said:

When you tax too much on products people want (and boy do people want alcohol and smokes) you just create black markets. This could backfire massively if the tax is too much. Could backfire so quickly that we have something similar to the recent labour law changes where they're stumbling and stuttering literally hours after the law change. 

 

Wine is already way overpriced. This could destroy the wine market which is mostly wine from abroad. If they do, I hope foreign governments reciprocate with Thai products that are exported. Only fair. 

 

If people really believe that this money is to make up from the loses of the rice scheme, there's a simple solution - don't buy submarines. 

Winelovers should go to the mediterraneancoast of Europe....very cheap and everything is perfect there. No humid air, great beaches, all safe and controlled by police, polite people with good manners, cigarettes for 4 euro, not many traffic accidents, good transport..and of course a very clean sea with great blue clear water.

[SABloke]

Just now, Thian said:

Winelovers should go to the mediterraneancoast of Europe....very cheap and everything is perfect there. No humid air, great beaches, all safe and controlled by police, polite people with good manners, cigarettes for 4 euro, not many traffic accidents, good transport..and of course a very clean sea with great blue clear water.

I'm there (as soon as a purchase a 8,000 km chain) 

[robblok]

19 minutes ago, rkidlad said:

Would be less need for such increases if subs weren't being purchased. 

 

When the balance is low, be frugal. Don't be frugal and buy subs. It's the definition of careless. What Ying Luck was. 

Your right, as I said the subs are a bad idea.. but not the cause of this. Anyway I have always been for less military spending.. just don't see it happening. 

 

 

[fforest1]

Its pathetic really that the tax is so convoluted that no one here fully understands it.....All by design no doubt.....  

[overherebc]

Local corner shop says 10 to 15baht on a twenty pack of cigs.

[fforest1]

9 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Local corner shop says 10 to 15baht on a twenty pack of cigs.

I think many smokers might draw the line at 100 baht a pack..

Below 100 baht a pack smoking can be viewed as a hobby above 100 baht a pack smoking might be viewed as a financial burden... 

Edited September 15, 2017 by fforest1

[rkidlad]

2 hours ago, webfact said:

Sanook said that the fundamental reasoning behind the new measures was to raise the health of the Thai people

Yes. And if you ridiculously tax wine, I can see Som Chai and co will definitely reap the health benefits of not being able to guzzle as much Chianti or Pinot noir. 

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

This is nuts. No authority will reveal, and no tax specialists and no bars know what alcohol prices are going to be the day before they are imposed. I have a bad feeling about this. 

 

Quote

I think many smokers might draw the line at 100 baht a pack..

Below 100 baht a pack smoking can be viewed as a hobby above 100 baht a pack smoking might be viewed as a financial burden... 

 

Marlboro and Mild Seven are already 125/130 baht a pack. Which puts them at two and a half times the price of the same cig brands in Cambodia and Vietnam. Looks like it will be three times starting tomorrow.

Edited September 15, 2017 by Kaoboi Bebobp

[Thian]

22 minutes ago, fforest1 said:

I think many smokers might draw the line at 100 baht a pack..

Below 100 baht a pack smoking can be viewed as a hobby above 100 baht a pack smoking might be viewed as a financial burden... 

Well actually i hope the new price can make me stop  smoking....In that case they get even less tax from me...

 

I think the next step is to forbid any taxfree cigarettes to be brought to Thailand. If the new price is too high it's worth to go shopping over the borders.

 

Also i wonder if it's illegal to buy/sell thai tobacco on local markets. Or to make/sell cigarettes from thai grown tobacco of 80 baht a kg.

 

And what about the black cat tobacco? That always was very cheap...

[idman]

Pile as much taxes on to the price of cigarettes as they want and hopefully a lot less people will die. The only way to stop people from killing themselves and others with their second hand smoke is to make it economically painful to continue with this horrible habit. As for small increase in the price of alcohol, <deleted>, if you are penny pinching just make small changes in other areas and continue on. Or, instead of your Tiger, Carlsburg, Beer Lao, Corona, etc. lower your bloody standards and drink Archa. You can actually drink less and feel just as bad in the morning with Archa and you have outwitted the increase in price.

[Bastos60]

2 hours ago, robblok said:

Yes it would, but excessive tax will backfire and result in lower tax income. I am not sure how stupid they are here but there must be some people who have heard of price elasticity of demand and studied commerce. So I would hope they are not going to shoot themselves in their foot. 

The tax increase is not so much aimed at Thai people but more at tourists. Are they going to smoke less? Absolutely not, but they are going to drink a lot less. 

The real downside to this all is that wholesalers are going to put an increase on top of the tax increase to make more money/trying to compensate. 

My estimates on some cigarettes will be Camel going from 100 Baht to 125 Bath, Marlboro from 125 baht 150 baht. A thai local brand will go from 60 baht to 80 baht.

 

Beer will increase with about 5 baht a bottle (33cl). 

 

That is what I think the new prices will become. But I am no expert so we will compare when new prices become official.

[Bastos60]

6 hours ago, idman said:

Pile as much taxes on to the price of cigarettes as they want and hopefully a lot less people will die. The only way to stop people from killing themselves and others with their second hand smoke is to make it economically painful to continue with this horrible habit. As for small increase in the price of alcohol, <deleted>, if you are penny pinching just make small changes in other areas and continue on. Or, instead of your Tiger, Carlsburg, Beer Lao, Corona, etc. lower your bloody standards and drink Archa. You can actually drink less and feel just as bad in the morning with Archa and you have outwitted the increase in price.

And they should triple the increase of tax on gasoline and even less people will die. 

[quadperfect]

2 hours ago, robblok said:

Yes it would, but excessive tax will backfire and result in lower tax income. I am not sure how stupid they are here but there must be some people who have heard of price elasticity of demand and studied commerce. So I would hope they are not going to shoot themselves in their foot. 

Ha hah hah hah hah. Youre joking

[isco]

75c a pint in cambodia and $5 for a nice bottle of wine, byeeeeee

 

[nursebob]

i wonder how long before the government back peddle on this one?

 

[les Dennis]

Don't forget the extra tax on a deck of cards ! As if we needed anything else to prove how ridiculous this is, they threw the cards in too. !

[1337markus]

Every wine department in supermarkets seems to sell to expats. I have never seen Thais buy wine, not sure who they are targetting with huge increase on wine as it wont be the health of Thai people?

[LennyW]

If they were serious about protecting the health of the people then the tax should be on sugar, the amount of sugar consumed here is beyond belief!!

[baansgr]

Since the last increase in cigarettes of 19 Baht there has been a gradual increase again in people buying from bootleggers, If it is indeed 40Baht increase this will just make more money for them and less for the Government.

When the restrictions were lifted in the UK to allow personal use rather than 400 the bootleggers went to town. By the late 90s it was estimated that upto 30% tobacco purchases was illegal imports, same will happen here.

[korkenzieher]

Guess I will have to switch to drinking fruit juice. Of course, much of it will have to be treated before hand, to make it safe for consumption - too much sugar!

 

Now, what consumes sugar to leave a non-hazardous by-product and something that can be easily vented off, say CO2...? Ideas and suggestions on the back of a postcard...

[Baerboxer]

4 hours ago, Dmaxdan said:

I always thought that a glass of red wine a day was supposed to be healthy

 

Indeed. Many medical professionals support that theory.

 

But although more especially young affluent Thais have become wine aficionados it's still regarded more as a foreigners tipple. Wonder if they'll differentiate between real wine and the cheaper fruit wines that pack the supermarket shelves.

 

 

[heybruce]

I'm confidant that the very rich and well-connected families that own the Chang and Singha breweries will see to it that the tax on beer won't be that bad.

[Baerboxer]

3 hours ago, Thian said:

Winelovers should go to the mediterraneancoast of Europe....very cheap and everything is perfect there. No humid air, great beaches, all safe and controlled by police, polite people with good manners, cigarettes for 4 euro, not many traffic accidents, good transport..and of course a very clean sea with great blue clear water.

 

You forgot to mention the hordes of illegal economic migrants masquerading as refugees!

[Baerboxer]

Just now, heybruce said:

I'm confidant that the very rich and well-connected families that own the Chang and Singha breweries will see to it that the tax on beer won't be that bad.

 

Probably. But notice they're moving the tax burden away from the brewers and distillers and collecting it at the wholesale point. 

I'm sure your right and "influence" from those with expertise in the industry will have been sought before finalizing the new rules; and of course "consultants" to the industry would've been involved 

[boooker]

Rock science tax invasion vs tourist income ...mean tourist down tax up tourist more down and business say goodbye to revenue result in GOV. increase revenue to get greedy politician paid.

Mandela said.....people shall not be afraid of GOV the GOV should be afraid of people .....one day even the Thais catch up to have enough

[recycler]

Just back from a short stay in the Netherlands where beer already is more than 40% cheaper in the supermarket than here!

 

And it wasn't just beer that was cheaper.....

[Wiggy]

I've just been to Big C (Rama 4) to buy a couple of boxes of fruit wine. If the tax was going to be as heavy as suggested I'm sure the Thais (and expat bar owners who sell the fruit wine as proper stuff) would've cleared the shelves by now. There was only one other person in the liquor section and wine and everything else was in abundance. They would only sell 24 cans of Leo to each customer though, which I thought was strange. Maybe it's all a bit of a storm in a teacup?