Had an extensive tug at immigration this week...

[Chivas]

Never ever been spoken to by immigration inbound (no reason to) but arriving earlier this week I got the full works.

 

In 2017 I arrived 1st January for 30 days hard up against visa exempt left on day of expiry.

Arrived again March 6th again hard up against visa exempt left on day of expiry

3rd trip arrived with my lad June 20th for 22 days

 

Thats it.....no tourist visas in play at all this year

 

Current extended trip needed visa duly applied and granted

 

Fast forward to earlier this week and I had a grilling. Dressed smartly as always I was somewhat taken aback. Shes gone right through the passport not that many entries (compared to some) 14 since September 2013.

"what are you doing here again" was first question and I answered politely holiday with big smile and open palms.

 

Long story short I got the lot including having to bring out a wadge of cash in full view of others not best pleased..... Flight email, boarding cards of BOTH sectors (good job I retained) hotel reservation email plus the cash. I can bet the people behind me were not amused good 10 minutes probably longer

 

Could have been a random tug but somewhat fortunate in my opinion that I had all the printed matter with me. Good 20 questions at least

Edited November 5, 2017 by Chivas

[scubascuba3]

I avoid bird IOs

[Rhys]

 

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

I avoid bird IOs

..they seem to have that extra chip...

[worgeordie]

36 minutes ago, Rhys said:

 

..they seem to have that extra chip...

Yes, I always avoid the lady officers when I can,I think

its just they take their job more seriously than the guys. 

regards worgordie

[Kieranmc]

Good to see immigration taking things seriously. 

[Chivas]

58 minutes ago, Kieranmc said:

Good to see immigration taking things seriously. 

Absolutely but will take few guys advice above just avoid females next 4-5 trips and see if I get a further tug.  There was me in the snake queues bemoaning the numbnuts who slow things down with incompleted immigration cards and I get the longest tug I've ever seen lol....

Edited November 5, 2017 by Chivas

[scubascuba3]

Absolutely but will take few guys advice above just avoid females next 4-5 trips and see if I get a further tug.  There was me in the snake queues bemoaning the numbnuts who slow things down with incompleted immigration cards and I get the longest tug I've ever seen lol....

You had 3 visa exempts in one calendar year which seems to be the reason, I guess the IO lady was just doing her job and quizzing you. I'd get a visa plus avoid the lady IOs.

[Chivas]

9 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

16 minutes ago, Chivas said:

Absolutely but will take few guys advice above just avoid females next 4-5 trips and see if I get a further tug.  There was me in the snake queues bemoaning the numbnuts who slow things down with incompleted immigration cards and I get the longest tug I've ever seen lol....

You had 3 visa exempts in one calendar year which seems to be the reason, I guess the IO lady was just doing her job and quizzing you. I'd get a visa plus avoid the lady IOs.

lol whilst not in this passport have had PLENTY of years where I've had double digit entries......Questioning no problem with that at all it was the final word of first question "again" which sounds alarm bells. 3 exempt entries in 2017 will be exceeded by many reading this thread

 

Can I just add this is only for public information for those reading. If I'm getting a tug with just 3 entries dressed smartly big smiles open palms then perhaps those turning up in T shirts and shorts might be in order to print all documents in advance.....In my opinion it turned out all good as I was immediately able to produce everything she asked though she probably wasnt expecting to get 3 large passed to her in bank seals tightly wrapped in elastic bands lol

Edited November 5, 2017 by Chivas

[mstevens]

I was questioned flying in to Suvarnabhumi last night, which is not something that has happened before.  In the last 10 years my visa history to Thailand includes several years where I split my time between my country and Thailand, often spending 2 or 3 months in Thailand, back home for a month or two and then back to Thailand again.  Almost always came to Thailand on a tourist visa.  I had not visited Thailand since earlier in the year and returned last night for the first time in several months.  I was asked similar questions to the OP except I was not asked to show cash.  I was only asked questions for about 30 - 45 seconds, not the rigmarole the OP experienced.  I would describe the IO's questions as probing, his conduct professional and similar to what I'd expect an IO to ask someone with a regular travel history arriving in Australia.

[JackThompson]

5 hours ago, Chivas said:

Thats it.....no tourist visas in play at all this year ...

Fast forward to earlier this week and I had a grilling. ...

Were you applying for entry Visa-Exempt, again?   If so, I would recommend against this.  I would encourage you to always have a Tourist Visa when entering Thailand, given you take more than 1 or 2 short vacations here per-year. 

 

Visa-exempts are granted at the discretion of the IO.  To reject entry to someone on a Tourist Visa who has 20K Baht in cash (required) is a larger hurdle for an IO to cross.  It has happened exactly once, as reported on this forum.  It is also less-expensive to use a Tourist Visa to stay for 60-days, vs an extension on a visa-exempt (60-days for ~1000 Baht with a Visa, vs 1900 Baht for a 30-day extension) - so nothing to lose, and everything to gain.

 

If you want to avoid the stress of this type of situation all together, don't fly into Thailand.  Enter via a friendly land-border, instead (all except the Poipet/Aranyaprathet entry-point).  You can do 2 Visa-Exempts at those per year, and there is no restriction on the number of entries, if entering with a valid Tourist Visa.  After entry to the country, domestic-air flights can be used to get to your final destination.

[Chivas]

1 minute ago, JackThompson said:

Were you applying for entry Visa-Exempt, again?   If so, I would recommend against this.  I would encourage you to always have a Tourist Visa when entering Thailand, given you take more than 1 or 2 short vacations here per-year. 

 

Visa-exempts are granted at the discretion of the IO.  To reject entry to someone on a Tourist Visa who has 20K Baht in cash (required) is a larger hurdle for an IO to cross.  It has happened exactly once, as reported on this forum.  It is also less-expensive to use a Tourist Visa to stay for 60-days, vs an extension on a visa-exempt (60-days for ~1000 Baht with a Visa, vs 1900 Baht for a 30-day extension) - so nothing to lose, and everything to gain.

 

If you want to avoid the stress of this type of situation all together, don't fly into Thailand.  Enter via a friendly land-border, instead (all except the Poipet/Aranyaprathet entry-point).  You can do 2 Visa-Exempts at those per year, and there is no restriction on the number of entries, if entering with a valid Tourist Visa.  After entry to the country, domestic-air flights can be used to get to your final destination.

No I said in OP I had first TV of the year available and needed

[JackThompson]

11 minutes ago, Chivas said:

No I said in OP I had first TV of the year available and needed

Ok, "duly applied and granted" = "arrived with a Tourist Visa" - got it. 

 

In that case, the best workaround to the potential for more of this type of treatment upon entry, is to use friendly land-borders. 

 

The Chang Mai airport might also work, given we have no reports of them being unfriendly to those arriving with Tourist Visas - but if rejected-entry at any airport, you will be forced to buy a last-minute ticket back where you came from, and held in detention until the flight leaves.

 

Glad you were prepared with the cash to show, or it appears you would have been denied entry.

Edited November 5, 2017 by JackThompson

[Chivas]

2 hours ago, JackThompson said:

Ok, "duly applied and granted" = "arrived with a Tourist Visa" - got it. 

 

In that case, the best workaround to the potential for more of this type of treatment upon entry, is to use friendly land-borders. 

 

The Chang Mai airport might also work, given we have no reports of them being unfriendly to those arriving with Tourist Visas - but if rejected-entry at any airport, you will be forced to buy a last-minute ticket back where you came from, and held in detention until the flight leaves.

 

Glad you were prepared with the cash to show, or it appears you would have been denied entry.

lol why would I have been denied entry on what possible grounds ??  Why on earth do I want to go via land borders......I've landed over 160 times from the UK either non stop or 2 sector flights. First time I have ever been spoken to period. I'm just mentioning that having printed documents may have made life somewhat easier. Plus retaining both boarding cards and speaking very politely I might add

Held in detention ??   For what arriving with £3000 hard cash the minimum I always carry in addition to cards !!  You put in me in a detention centre for having the audacity to use my first tourist visa of the year and the fallout will be heard in Mongolia

Edited November 5, 2017 by Chivas

[YetAnother]

6 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

I avoid bird IOs

there are some super members hereabouts that Very Much share your opinion; thanks for your sharing

Edited November 5, 2017 by YetAnother

[ukrules]

5 hours ago, Chivas said:

lol why would I have been denied entry on what possible grounds ??  Why on earth do I want to go via land borders......I've landed over 160 times from the UK either non stop or 2 sector flights. First time I have ever been spoken to period. I'm just mentioning that having printed documents may have made life somewhat easier. Plus retaining both boarding cards and speaking very politely I might add

Held in detention ??   For what arriving with £3000 hard cash the minimum I always carry in addition to cards !!  You put in me in a detention centre for having the audacity to use my first tourist visa of the year and the fallout will be heard in Mongolia

The reason she asked to see the money and extensive documentation is that she was looking for any excuse she could find to deny you entry.

 

Is she found any reason then you would have been denied.

 

What clothes you're wearing and your level of politeness are irrelevant, if you didn't have enough cash you would have been leaving on the next flight. It's happened before and will absolutely without a doubt happen again. They won't let you go to the ATM to get it either.

 

 

[mvdf]

10 hours ago, Chivas said:

lol why would I have been denied entry on what possible grounds ??  Why on earth do I want to go via land borders......I've landed over 160 times from the UK either non stop or 2 sector flights. First time I have ever been spoken to period. I'm just mentioning that having printed documents may have made life somewhat easier. Plus retaining both boarding cards and speaking very politely I might add

Held in detention ??   For what arriving with £3000 hard cash the minimum I always carry in addition to cards !!  You put in me in a detention centre for having the audacity to use my first tourist visa of the year and the fallout will be heard in Mongolia

You're not special. If you fail to satisfy any of the requirements and if they deem you inadmissible, you will be on that next flight out of Thailand. As for detention until that flight, try having the audacity to making a brouhaha out of it, physically, that is, with the detaining officers. I would love to see or read about the fallout of such a situation.

 

Not sure why some here find it impertinent and rude of Thailand's frontline border guards to deny them admission or interrogate them with probing questions when this is the norm in your own countries. As I have posted countless times earlier, this is a sovereign country with their own legitimately enacted laws which are to be complied with, adhered to and respected in the same exact way visitors coming to your countries are expected to do.

 

The clothes you wear, your appearance and financial resources do have a bearing but they are not conclusive and exclusive factors in determining admissibility. If you live here, live with the correct visa.

 

 

 

Edited November 5, 2017 by mvdf

[Chivas]

10 hours ago, ukrules said:

The reason she asked to see the money and extensive documentation is that she was looking for any excuse she could find to deny you entry.

 

Is she found any reason then you would have been denied.

 

What clothes you're wearing and your level of politeness are irrelevant, if you didn't have enough cash you would have been leaving on the next flight. It's happened before and will absolutely without a doubt happen again. They won't let you go to the ATM to get it either.

 

 

"any excuse to deny you entry"

 

Again for what possible reason.....??  In addition another one incapable of reading. ATM ??   I had 3k on me what do I need an ATM for....??

 

The point of the OP was purely to point out that it might be worth spending 5 minutes prior to each trip printing out your documents.

[Chivas]

4 hours ago, mvdf said:

You're not special. If you fail to satisfy any of the requirements and if they deem you inadmissible, you will be on that next flight out of Thailand. As for detention until that flight, try having the audacity to making a brouhaha out of it, physically, that is, with the detaining officers. I would love to see or read about the fallout of such a situation.

 

Not sure why some here find it impertinent and rude of Thailand's frontline border guards to deny them admission or interrogate them with probing questions when this is the norm in your own countries. As I have posted countless times earlier, this is a sovereign country with their own legitimately enacted laws which are to be complied with, adhered to and respected in the same exact way visitors coming to your countries are expected to do.

 

The clothes you wear, your appearance and financial resources do have a bearing but they are not conclusive and exclusive factors in determining admissibility. If you live here, live with the correct visa.

 

 

 

Another one totally incapable of reading......I wont even bother to retort to most of it but will just point you in the sole direction of your last sentence....." If you live here, live with the correct visa."

 

At what point did I say or indicated I lived here  ??  In 2017 prior to this current trip I complied as always with visa expiry dates with a total of just 82 days here. What part of that constitutes "living here"

[burgdawg]

7 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

I avoid bird IOs

...scuba..spot on! I landed at DMK last May 2017. No air con, everything was sweltering hot. I was on crutches coming from medical in India. I was pushing a cart with my kit. The front bar of my cart broke the vertical plane of the dodgy taped line on the floor. The female immigration had a hissy fit, throwing papers and pens. Scowling. I knew I would be cooked if stayed in line.

 

I feigned needing a bathroom and got into a line manned by a Tai male. The femanazis have penetrated Thailand! They are outta their minds.

Edited November 6, 2017 by burgdawg
mispelling

[JackThompson]

15 hours ago, Chivas said:

lol why would I have been denied entry on what possible grounds ?? 

"Not having proof of the ability to support oneself in the Kingdom." is what would have gone in your passport if you hadn't had the cash.  Evidently, they had some detention-cells open, and she was told to fill them up.  You narrowly escaped - Congrats.

 

But they could have claimed they "suspected" you were coming here to work illegally (even though "suspicion" is not in the statute - it has happened).

 

15 hours ago, Chivas said:

Why on earth do I want to go via land borders......I've landed over 160 times from the UK either non stop or 2 sector flights. First time I have ever been spoken to period.

That is exactly why - because you come here often, you may be singled-out again.  And next time you could be denied like this guy, to spite having the 20K+ Baht:

 

 

Note, there is no law or rule about having "too many tourist visas in the past" - so when you enter at Bangkok airports (or the Poipet/Aranya entry-point), be aware you are entering a lawless zone, as one might expect in an undeveloped country.  Whoever is in charge in these areas thinks they know what the laws "should be" - and is apparently willing to apply "their laws" versus the ones actually put in place by their superiors.  We have many reports of travelers being told non-laws/rules, as if fact, in these locations.

 

The OP in the thread I linked was eventually deported with a stamp in his passport indicating he "came to work illegally," though no evidence of this was presented.  Note that his "appeal" was never allowed to proceed, either. 

 

If you had 3000 USD, that may have been why you did not get this treatment, because they must put how much money you had on their denial-of-entry paperwork, and 3K ( over 4x the minimum) would not have been "congruent" with "came here to take an under-the-table job." 

 

15 hours ago, Chivas said:

I'm just mentioning that having printed documents may have made life somewhat easier. Plus retaining both boarding cards and speaking very politely I might add

Yes - they may have saved your bacon.  And speaking politely = 100% important.  Get loud and rude, and there is a different clause they can use to deport you.  It was recently used on a fellow who complained to a superior when an IO tore a page in his passport (sorry, can't find the link).

 

Thank you for reporting your experience, so that others may learn how it may be possible to avoid being detained and forced-out if they choose to risk entering Thailand at unfriendly points of entry.

 

15 hours ago, Chivas said:

Held in detention ??   For what arriving with £3000 hard cash the minimum I always carry in addition to cards !!  You put in me in a detention centre for having the audacity to use my first tourist visa of the year and the fallout will be heard in Mongolia

The questions are, who will hear it, and who will care?  If you can get articles in major newspapers - maybe it would have an effect.  That is what shut down the "stop and pee-test or pay" routine on foreigners in Bangkok, awhile back.

 

4 hours ago, mvdf said:

this is a sovereign country with their own legitimately enacted laws which are to be complied with, adhered to and respected in the same exact way visitors coming to your countries are expected to do.

Unfortunately, the laws are not being followed in some cases.  Here are some of the "reasons" given to travelers at lawless-checkpoints, which are not laws/rules:

• Too many tourist visas (not just in one year, either)
• Too many days in the country
• "Must fly in only" - because of a reason above, or even with a Multiple-Entry type visa (non-o OR tourist) (Poipet/Aranya)

Also, "Denial of access to an ATM" was clearly not the "spirit of the law," when written.  ATMs did not exist then, and people used travelers checks for trips.  Most of those denied entry at airports recently for "not having the funds to support themselves" could have pulled out 20K Baht to show, if allowed to go to an ATM.  Clearly, they were denied/detained for a reason other than stated/stamped - and not letting them get the cash from an ATM is proof of the ill-will in the equation.

[JackThompson]

23 minutes ago, Chivas said:

...What part of that constitutes "living here" ...

Note that "living here" is not in the immigration-laws which govern entry with a Tourist Visa - though some seem to think it is.  So, according to the law, it wouldn't matter how long you "lived here." 

Unlike some countries (my passport-country, included), IOs cannot make up any reason under the sun to randomly deny-entry to people holding Tourist Visas.  Entering Visa-Exempt is another story, as there is additional language added via ministerial orders for those.  The language regarding multiple entries by air is vague, so if they want to deny you, it is easy.  This is why I addressed these in my first post in this thread.

 

I understand your point, though, which is that you had been out for some time before this trip, so it seemed irrational/illogical to give you a hard time.  Many (including myself) often make the mistake of thinking logic and reason play some part in things here, when they often don't.  In this case it could be (pure-speculation) that the boss said, "Let's fill up those detention cells," so it looks like they are doing their job and stopping those "bad guys."  Or maybe he told this IO (again, speculation), "You have a low detention-rate - need to fix that ASAP."

[ubonjoe]

Topic closed at OP's request.