Greenhorn's guide – Relationships with Thai young lady's

[Been there done that]

3 hours ago, Thaidream said:

Young or old- they don't think with their head... go ahead buy the gold or whatever.  It's your money spend it.  However, if you are looking for love- forget about it. Most Thais have no concept of love in a Western sense. Their concept is- I love you ..but how much?  After 50 years in Thailand- I am not cynical just realistic. No more advice... you won't listen anyway!!

How much did it cost you then ?

[marko kok prong]

Look one thing is for sure,they will expect money and gold,how much you give is up too you,but if neither are forthcoming it will be a very short romance.

[OneMoreFarang]

Lots of men spent a lot of money to make them happy and feel loved. And some time later they realized that the girl(s) were lying most of the time. Would these men do it again even if they would know the end of the story? For many of them the answer is: YES

 

Good advise is mostly useless because "my girl is different".

[Thaidream]

Many millions of Baht-  when I arrived decades ago there was no social media and few foreigners in Thailand  to trade stories with and I couldn't speak a word of Thai.  Experience taught me and the learning of the Thai language opened a whole new view and understanding of all things Thai.  Like I said- most people refuse to listen because they cannot believe it is happening to them.  

They do not meet a cross section of Thai women from every walk of life and they do not understand how to communicate with them leading to massive misunderstandings and getting the wrong messages.  Most of the time- those who are deceitful and liars are doing it right in front of you and you don't realize it or refuse to believe the truth.

[OneMoreFarang]

3 minutes ago, marko kok prong said:

Look one thing is for sure,they will expect money and gold,how much you give is up too you,but if neither are forthcoming it will be a very short romance.

Not necessarily. I heard this story from the guy who met a girl and spent 3 weeks on holiday with her. She didn't want any money - what a great girl! But then some time after the holiday there was this wonderful message that she expects a baby and obviously she wants to keep it and take care of it...

[OneMoreFarang]

3 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Many millions of Baht-  when I arrived decades ago there was no social media and few foreigners in Thailand  to trade stories with and I couldn't speak a word of Thai.  Experience taught me and the learning of the Thai language opened a whole new view and understanding of all things Thai.  Like I said- most people refuse to listen because they cannot believe it is happening to them.  

They do not meet a cross section of Thai women from every walk of life and they do not understand how to communicate with them leading to massive misunderstandings and getting the wrong messages.  Most of the time- those who are deceitful and liars are doing it right in front of you and you don't realize it or refuse to believe the truth.

Obviously it's good to know the Thai language. But that is no guarantee that bad things won't happen.

 

Some time ago I thought Thais only tell lies to gullible foreigners. But that is not true. Lots of Thais get cheated by other Thais. A good example for this is when innocent Thais from up country arrive at the bus terminal and all these helpful Thais are around with special prices for taxi fares. And next are the people who want to borrow a little money and will give it back tomorrow, sure...

 

Some Thais cheat foreigners and other Thais. And to be fair there are also some foreigners in the land of smiles who have all these great investment tips for foreigners who just arrived and who are looking for advise from people who live here ...

 

[dfdgfdfdgs]

On 12/15/2017 at 4:57 PM, chickenslegs said:

My "snippet of wisdom" is - let the guys learn from their own mistakes. If you give them advice they won't listen anyway. I didn't.

 

Depends what type of person they are.  If they're sure of themselves and arrogant, they'll do it anyway.  If they're more open-minded and willing to listen to people with experience, they'll at least take what you say on board.

[theguyfromanotherforum]

Wall of text...where's the guide?

[473geo]

40 minutes ago, dfdgfdfdgs said:

 

Depends what type of person they are.  If they're sure of themselves and arrogant, they'll do it anyway.  If they're more open-minded and willing to listen to people with experience, they'll at least take what you say on board.

Then do it anyway 

 

Did you know guys, those of us who are currently enjoying a good relationship find your 'advice' rather depressing and defeatist.......go on fellas..... save up..... and give it another go....life is fun 

[Thaidream]

There are many situations of Thais lying to Thais but at least when they communicate they can understand completely what is being said.  The dynamic of Thai and Foreigner is that they cannot communicate adequately and often much of what needs to know to determine if one is involved in a firm relationship cannot be determined.

 

Thais often do lie and it is mostly to avoid lengthy explanations that the foreigner may need to make a decision but which their Thai 'partner' is not only unable to articulate but fearful if one knows the full truth- the foreigner will say no. We all know the story of the sick buffalo or other common lies but sometimes Thais lie about the most mundane things where the truth will get the same result. Then once lied to and the foreigner finds out- it causes a lack of trust to develop and when the foreigner  informs the Thai partner that he knows she is lying loss of face comes into play. The relationship then goes down hill.

 

If  someone asks me now if they should marry a Thai partner- I tell them don't do it unless you either bring your partner to you own country or stay in Thailand forever and learn Thai well and understand the ins and outs of Thai societal norms and expectations. After 3 marriages, 2 of which were and are good-  I can attest that it sometimes takes the patience of  near sainthood to deal with all the  drama that can exist with Thai women and Thai society.  A foreigner and Thai are so completely different that it is no wonder that most marriages breakdown.

 

Money and stature is so important in Thai society that foreigners are almost overcome with its constant discussion. If you don't believe me, and you can understand Thai, stop sometime and listen to Thai people converse- there is hardly a conversation in which money is not mentioned or sought after.  As a foreigner- Thais expect that you have money and plenty of it. Even educated Thais cannot get their head around the fact that  most foreigners are not wealthy and have stacks of money to spend. In fact many Thais still believe all you have to do is go to the ATM and the money will come out. If you don't give it to them when they need it or want it- you're cheap.

 

In addition, most foreigners do not form relationships with the HiSo girls of Thailand. These are the super wealthy who wouldn't look at a foreigner unless they were of equal wealth and of course neither would they marry into the family of a lower class Thai. They are generally stuck about; selfish and would run over a dog if it got in their way.

 

That leaves we foreigners with the average girls of Thailand who are less educated; less inclined to understand Western ways; and some who work in bars, clubs, etc. and  others who work in factories or other jobs but work as sideline girls. In addition, Thais have an ironclad duty to family. Blood counts for everything.  There really are sick buffalo and sick family members and rural family who need houses and cars etc etc and no Thai woman will ever understand why you can't provide it. These are not 'bad' people but are high maintenance.

 

Then there are the career bar girls- those who go into it and stay in the business because they want to find that foreigner and get money and sure as heck could care less about love and responsibility and when they get all of it- move onto the next foreigner or come back to the business becuase of the 'fun'; or are hooked on drugs and/or alcohol. These Thai women are the worst - because they have no conscience and as a result are the most adept at the big smile; the actors while in bed (it isn't real-they learn from porn movies) and the huge lies. They run around on you- have Thai boyfriends who  are in league with them and are generally real bad 'folk'. 

 

I can usually spot all types by simply looking at the way they smile; the clothes they wear; their body language and if and how they speak both Thai and English. 

 

The bottom line- don't jump into a permanent relationship and vet your prospective partner and learn Thai because then you can really find out how they think. (be prepared because many will switch to the Isaan dialect but you can learn that to) Ignorance maybe bliss but in the end it will cost you plenty.

[dfdgfdfdgs]

51 minutes ago, 473geo said:

Did you know guys, those of us who are currently enjoying a good relationship find your 'advice' rather depressing and defeatist.......go on fellas..... save up..... and give it another go....life is fun 

 

If it's so fun why do so many of them come on here depressed and borderline suicidal when they lose all their money.

[473geo]

6 minutes ago, dfdgfdfdgs said:

 

If it's so fun why do so many of them come on here depressed and borderline suicidal when they lose all their money.

Face

[dfdgfdfdgs]

You mean they want to lose face?  Why would they want to do that.

[473geo]

1 minute ago, dfdgfdfdgs said:

You mean they want to lose face?  Why would they want to do that.

Nope they lost it already, They conveniently forget the good times so that they can come on here to apportion blame, by way of 'warning' others about their misfortune  experience of Thai women.

 

Do you know there are pensioners who choose to spend thousands of dollars on a cruise, and come back with nothing other than memories - do you think they feel robbed by the cruise line?

[dfdgfdfdgs]

Depends where the cruise called at.  Did it dock at Pattaya?

[Thaidream]

Yes- it can be depressing but as they say the truth hurts and the truth will also set you free. 

 

I, for one and many others are not apportioning blame and I do not sit around blaming others because I was misinformed; stupid or whatever adjective one may use.I don't even blame the 'ladies' that lied and cheated- that's their job. And I am not depressed- I have a good Thai wife now  but I am keenly aware of all the issues that exist between Thais and foreigners. I have had plenty of good times with Thais over many decades and some real bad times but I don't live in ignorance and ignore the facts of life being married to a Thai. 

Thais have constant drama in their lives for  more reasons than I have the time to discuss. If you are unaware of this- you do not understand what is going on around you.

 

As they say in Thailand - up to you how you live- the topic is relationships and everyone has an opinion based upon a multitude of experiences but I  can tell you for a fact- there are plenty of foreigners in Thailand living in total ignorance of what is happening around them.

[flynn]

Ignorance is bliss,,,,


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[MaeJoMTB]

40 minutes ago, dfdgfdfdgs said:

 

If it's so fun why do so many of them come on here depressed and borderline suicidal when they lose all their money.

The magic of a pension, next month you have more money.

[473geo]

12 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Yes- it can be depressing but as they say the truth hurts and the truth will also set you free. 

 

I, for one and many others are not apportioning blame and I do not sit around blaming others because I was misinformed; stupid or whatever adjective one may use.I don't even blame the 'ladies' that lied and cheated- that's their job. And I am not depressed- I have a good Thai wife now  but I am keenly aware of all the issues that exist between Thais and foreigners. I have had plenty of good times with Thais over many decades and some real bad times but I don't live in ignorance and ignore the facts of life being married to a Thai. 

Thais have constant drama in their lives for  more reasons than I have the time to discuss. If you are unaware of this- you do not understand what is going on around you.

 

As they say in Thailand - up to you how you live- the topic is relationships and everyone has an opinion based upon a multitude of experiences but I  can tell you for a fact- there are plenty of foreigners in Thailand living in total ignorance of what is happening around them.

 

"the topic is relationships and everyone has an opinion based upon a multitude of experiences"

 

Oh yes but those who screwed up sure feel the need to 'force' their "experiences" as the norm, and give short thrift to those who have successful marriages.....  That is what I see as depressing.

Edited December 18, 2017 by 473geo

[MaeJoMTB]

23 minutes ago, 473geo said:

Oh yes but those who screwed up sure feel the need to 'force' their "experiences" as the norm, and give short thrift to those who have successful marriages.....  That is what I see as depressing.

I have a successful Thai marriage (9 years), but agree bad relationships are the norm.

[Thaidream]

Sorry- I don't see anyone forcing any experience on anyone else- this is an open forum for discussions related to various topics. There are plenty of good experiences out there and from time to time we hear of them.

Unfortunately- cross cultural marriages have a greater than normal chance of failing for all the reasons discussed. Many of the marriages/relationships in Thailand are based on -money only.  That is a fact and one can't ignore it.

Ignorance maybe bliss but it's also costly. If one is in a happy relationship- keep it going.

[473geo]

Ah yes thank you, those of us that have the ability to turn a relationship, that may well have started out based on money, into something more substantial must stand head and shoulders above the failures. You know guys we are not lucky, we work at it on a daily basis.....so when you guys are talking about failure being the norm, look in the mirror fellas, and quit bleating about understanding the language, bar girls being 'no good' and I can't stand the in laws......you just didn't have what it takes

 

Admit it guys - it would appear there are a lot of you out there who are just not capable of making the grade 

[Thaidream]

I didn't know there was a test and I would get a grade-  my first marriage to a Thai was 25 years and very happy- unfortunately she passed away.  My second marriage was to a Thai and after a few years ended in divorce- she cheated on me and I divorced her-   My third marriage to a Thai has now been 15 years-  mostly happy-sometimes some drama but both faithful like my first marriage. 

Most of my opinions have been gleaned from many decades in Thailand and listening to the good, the bad and the ugly.  

Not all bar girls are bad and not all girls not working in bars good.

It appears some people are upset because the truth is being discussed- I don't know why - everyone is in charge of their own relationship and how to handle it.

Experiences of others dealing with cross cultural issues have great merit- the language issue is brought up because when 2 people can communicate in the same language it makes it make easier to diffuse issues or see them clearly for what they are.

If you don't want to learn Thai- don't. There is no grade for not learning.

 

[473geo]

3 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

I didn't know there was a test and I would get a grade-  my first marriage to a Thai was 25 years and very happy- unfortunately she passed away.  My second marriage was to a Thai and after a few years ended in divorce- she cheated on me and I divorced her-   My third marriage to a Thai has now been 15 years-  mostly happy-sometimes some drama but both faithful like my first marriage. 

Most of my opinions have been gleaned from many decades in Thailand and listening to the good, the bad and the ugly.  

Not all bar girls are bad and not all girls not working in bars good.

It appears some people are upset because the truth is being discussed- I don't know why - everyone is in charge of their own relationship and how to handle it.

Experiences of others dealing with cross cultural issues have great merit- the language issue is brought up because when 2 people can communicate in the same language it makes it make easier to diffuse issues or see them clearly for what they are.

If you don't want to learn Thai- don't. There is no grade for not learning.

 

You are seeing your truth

Here is something to consider for you, you are keen to assess others as not being aware.....

How many Thai farang marriages go down the pan because of

 

1) Alcohol

2) Husband unfaithful

3) Insufficient funds

 

Learning the Thai Language may well be beneficial but only if non of the above are already in play

 

[Thaidream]

No I am not seeing my truth- the majority of my life in Thailand has been very happy- I am seeing the truth of what happens when Foreigners get involved with Thais and I am also aware that there are situations when the foreign husband is an alcoholic/drug user; unfaithful and provides no support.

In fact, over the last 10 years- Thailand has become a haven for foreign deadbeats who enter into sham marriages; are abusive; and are generally poor excuses for a husband.  I have 2 Thai step daughters 18 and 23 respectively and have taught them to be very careful when choosing a partner.

I will leave it up to you to decide which party is at fault more than the other from your own experience.

[MaeJoMTB]

9 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

I am also aware that there are situations when the foreign husband is an alcoholic/drug user; unfaithful and provides no support. In fact, over the last 10 years- Thailand has become a haven for foreign deadbeats who enter into sham marriages; are abusive; and are generally poor excuses for a husband. 

Seems we foreigners have been learning how to be proper Thai husbands!

Edited December 18, 2017 by MaeJoMTB

[473geo]

Thaidream  - You are a reasonable man I accept you pass on your observations - I guess I am just highlighting the fact that omissions in the true cause of the deterioration in relationships, are all too common, even perhaps the norm when stories of relationship collapse are evidenced on Thai visa.

 

Edited December 18, 2017 by 473geo

[Thaidream]

Because the majority of the people on the board are men we are going to hear mostly about the relationships from their viewpoint- we seldom hear of the other side.

 

There was a time between marriages when I hung out with a bunch of girls who not only worked the bars and clubs but  were also sideline girls who were occasional  girls who went with foreigners. Some of them were factory workers; accountants and nurses

.

Once you get them out of their business surroundings they will tell you many things truthfully and some had some real horrible stories of abuse from both foreigners and Thai men. Under these circumstances- there is no reason for them to lie especially when drinking.

 

I do know that when I see a relationship between a Thai and a foreigner that I am sure is based upon deceit- I never get involved.or try and interfere. They won't believe me anyway and it's best to stay neutral and let it play out.

[473geo]

Hence why I would not heed too much 'advice' on the forum 

One big give away is when people try to attach the label 'pussy whipped' usually because you prefer to spend more time with your wife and family than in bars. I do not know of any men who called me 'pussy whipped' that are still married. Probably still in bars though. 

Again very difficult on the relationship comment, a friend talked me out of a relationship, best thing he ever did and I will always be grateful as while staying at his place I met my now wife. However when I, albeit reluctantly, informed him his wife had made some poor financial decisions, he cut me off, accused me of being nasty and listening to rumor (My source was taking a big risk telling me and that is how I knew it was true) Friendship ruined, marriage failed, yes he was one who called me 'pussy whipped'  

Many years ago now and I am still very happy with my wife  - in fact don't drink these days - it makes a difference 

[xylophone]

On 17/12/2017 at 12:58 PM, Ulic said:

My advice would be the same many give regarding real estate. Rent don't buy. 

True enough with regard to the girls here and I have often said to newbys coming here that they should treat the plethora of available girls/women as something akin to a car hire pool.

 

There will be good and bad lookers and some who will prove to be a great ride and others not, some reliable and some not, and one will never know unless one experiments, so hire one at a time for a few days at a time and then hand/put her back in the pool.

 

Do this until you have got the hang of the place!

 

OR you could read and learn from my bar girl poem....................

 

Thai Bargirl Poem

 

In Thailand the the ugly, lame and insane can all get laid,

It’s not about what or who you are, but how much you paid.

 

The farangs go home and send monthly cash,

So their new-found girlfriends will not mix with the trash.

 

But the girls still work at their favourite bar,

Enticing new farangs who come from afar,

With offers of sex and the night full of fun,

While her other farangs think they're the only one.

 

What the farang doesn’t know or understand,

And the Thai girl will never show her hand,

Is that she needs to earn as much cash as she can,

And she can never get enough from only one man.

 

So the cycle goes on and farangs come and go,

Each with a broken heart because they just didn’t know,

That the girls at the bars are for temporary rent,

Not for the long-term, nor heaven sent.