UK's May says 'highly likely' Russia behind nerve attack on spy

[BuaBS]

Spies and double agents getting killed is ok , it's what they do , but involving ordinary civilians with this attack goes too far. What happened to a good old fashion gun 'em down (with silencer) .

[Thongkorn]

I would have thought that Mrs  May telling the Russians they have 24 hours to come clean and tell the truth . Or else. Would have been big news on here but the interests are more on America. As usual.

[buick]

i can't believe this is an issue.  just forget about it and move on.  bigger problems to deal with.  there is no way that russian held assets in the UK will be seized as a result of this.  putin is laughing at this really hard.  and he should.

Edited March 13, 2018 by buick

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed. 

[dunroaming]

42 minutes ago, BuaBS said:

Spies and double agents getting killed is ok , it's what they do , but involving ordinary civilians with this attack goes too far. What happened to a good old fashion gun 'em down (with silencer) .

Or the spike on the end of the umbrella trick.  Does seem extremely excessive to use a nerve gas unless that was part of the message?

[sawadeeken]

If Russia didn't do it then it may have been North Korea........ They are 'good' with Nerve Agents.............

[overherebc]

48 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Or the spike on the end of the umbrella trick.  Does seem extremely excessive to use a nerve gas unless that was part of the message?

Not actually a gas. It's either a liquid or a powder. 

[juice777]

The more I think about this the more I can only come to the conclusion this a act of war against a Natio country. There is talk of England pulling out of the world cup in my opinion if this is our only Action it makes us look weak and Putin wouldn't care. How ever if a attack on one Natio country is a attack on all there is 11 Natio countrys in the world cup If I counted them right including 4 pervious winners If we all pulled out then that would really embarrass Putin, the World Cup would be a Joke or Canceled especially if the likes of Japan South Korea Australia Switzerland Sweden Joined us. Are we going to let him use the world cup as a stage the same way Hitler used the the Olympics. We would have to more action like freezing all Russian Assets in the UK and other measures can't expect the world to go with out the world Cup if we are still dealing with Russian billionaires who have to be gangstas to get there money.

 

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[overherebc]

26 minutes ago, juice777 said:

The more I think about this the more I can only come to the conclusion this a act of war against a Natio country. There is talk of England pulling out of the world cup in my opinion if this is our only Action it makes us look weak and Putin wouldn't care. How ever if a attack on one Natio country is a attack on all there is 11 Natio countrys in the world cup If I counted them right including 4 pervious winners If we all pulled out then that would really embarrass Putin, the World Cup would be a Joke or Canceled especially if the likes of Japan South Korea Australia Switzerland Sweden Joined us. Are we going to let him use the world cup as a stage the same way Hitler used the the Olympics. We would have to more action like freezing all Russian Assets in the UK and other measures can't expect the world to go with out the world Cup if we are still dealing with Russian billionaires who have to be gangstas to get there money.

 

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Not arguing really but too many people on both sides would lose too much money.

[Grouse]

4 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Not arguing really but too many people on both sides would lose too much money.

Who cares 

[juice777]

Not arguing really but too many people on both sides would lose too much money.

Yep probably while nothing would happen but at least the world cup option gives The Natio Countrys a Weapon to use with out Damaging what all the leaders only really care about.

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[overherebc]

16 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Who cares 

Too be honest I don't really. The ones who do live in a different world and what the general public think doesn't exist in their minds.

[juice777]

I think the money thing is the biggest issue here and all the leaders know it. If you ask me I Basically think we are in some new Bizarre Cold war the Difference is this time we actually still need each other because of financial reasons and to keep a lot of Europeans warm. And is seems we slowly can't rely on our old allies as much as we could before.We are burning our Bridges in Europe and we have a US President who has been worrying quite on this Especially as he usually cant shut up about anything else on Twitter. I wonder why he is slinet dose he owe them something if it was a musslim country he wouldn't be quite wound he, he would be calling for Travel bans Etc.

 

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[juice777]

 

 

 

I have no feel for the events one way or the other, but the thing I cannot understand is why Putin would do this now, unless he wanted to prod at an already weak, crisis riddled government?

 

I think that your description of him raping and pillaging the nation is somewhat hyperbolic. I lived and worked in Russia for 8 years - I knew nobody who was ignorant of the inherent corruption in Russian politics, but the Russian way was, believe it or not, more akin to grudging admiration rather than condemnation. The simple fact is though, that the quality of life for just about everyone across the country has improved enormously, and more importantly for Russians, their sense of national pride has been restored. The reports of his popularity among the masses are not, to my experience, overblown.

 

Maybe so but he is still the Richest or one of the richest men in the world somehow on a Salary of 100000US a year. And they Dennfily love him just last month I saw a Young Russian man walking around Jomtien with a T-shirt with a picture of putun saying our great leader. What a absolute Genius Demanding his Cut of the money stolen form the Russian people from the Oligarchs becoming the Richest man in the world (maybe if not one of them) and still haveing the love of the people by manipulating them through RT news Channel.

 

Sounds like raping and pillaging to me even if they do have a bit more money in there pockets they probably would have more if got rid of corruption instead of having his cut.

 

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[Basil B]

Not forgetting the disgraceful response from the leader of the opposition... 

Quote

Mr Corbyn told MPs: "We need to continue seeking a robust dialogue with Russia on all the issues dividing our countries, both domestic and international - rather than simply cutting off contact and simply letting tensions and divisions get worse, and potentially even more dangerous."

To cries of "shame" and "disgrace" from Conservative MPs, he added: "We're all familiar with the way huge fortunes, often acquired in the most dubious circumstances in Russia, sometimes connected with criminal elements, have ended up sheltering in London and trying to buy political influence in British party politics.

"Meddling in elections, as the prime minister put it, and there has been over £800,000 worth of donations to the Conservative Party from Russian oligarchs and their associates."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43380217

Maybe he should engage  brain before opening his big mouth...

 

What is the point of engaging in "dialogue" with compulsive liars???

 

And yes the way political parties are funded does need reviewing, but has he not forgotten all suitcases full of dirty money the Labour Party and the Unions got from Moscow???

 

Edited March 13, 2018 by Basil B

[sambum]

11 hours ago, Orac said:

 

The aim is to destablise UK govt which is possibly why it is so obvious.  Wouldn't surprise me if TM finds herself in the unenviable position of pulling England out of the World Cup which, in an already divided country, would create further discord.

They probably won't be in it for long anyway!

[Orac]

Useful bit of analysis here from Chatham House

https://www.chathamhouse.org/expert/comment/skripal-attack-test-uk

“What it says to the British government is: we believe you are weak, and we have no respect for you.”


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[RuamRudy]

13 hours ago, juice777 said:

 

Maybe so but he is still the Richest or one of the richest men in the world somehow on a Salary of 100000US a year. And they Dennfily love him just last month I saw a Young Russian man walking around Jomtien with a T-shirt with a picture of putun saying our great leader. What a absolute Genius Demanding his Cut of the money stolen form the Russian people from the Oligarchs becoming the Richest man in the world (maybe if not one of them) and still haveing the love of the people by manipulating them through RT news Channel.

 

Sounds like raping and pillaging to me even if they do have a bit more money in there pockets they probably would have more if got rid of corruption instead of having his cut.

 

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With all due respect, what is it that gives you an insight to their country that the majority of Russians do not have? Do you honestly think that they are blind to, or ignorant of the corruption in their country and that you better understand the dynamics? Like in Thailand, corruption permeates every level of society in Russia. It is a daily fact of life. As such, I would suggest that Russians are far more aware of the corruption that their leaders are invoved in than we westerners are of our own corrupt leaders' practices.

 

But they are pragmatists: don't want to pay bribes to the traffic police? Then pay higher taxes and pay the cops a higher salary. That's the sort of grass roots pragmatism they consider. Likewise, it is assumed that all leaders steal (and they do, and not only in Russia), so why elect an ineffective thief when a highly effective thief brings so many more benefits?

[juice777]

With all due respect, what is it that gives you an insight to their country that the majority of Russians do not have? Do you honestly think that they are blind to, or ignorant of the corruption in their country and that you better understand the dynamics? Like in Thailand, corruption permeates every level of society in Russia. It is a daily fact of life. As such, I would suggest that Russians are far more aware of the corruption that their leaders are invoved in than we westerners are of our own corrupt leaders' practices.
 
But they are pragmatists: don't want to pay bribes to the traffic police? Then pay higher taxes and pay the cops a higher salary. That's the sort of grass roots pragmatism they consider. Likewise, it is assumed that all leaders steal (and they do, and not only in Russia), so why elect an ineffective thief when a highly effective thief brings so many more benefits?

So what part of what I said wasn't true?
He got super rich my robing his own people and they still love him that's a magic trick and a half even more amazing if they know how corrupt he is. Just because they don't care don't make it OK. And when did I say I had a better insight then the Russian people just pointing out the facts.

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[RuamRudy]

3 minutes ago, juice777 said:

And when did I say I had a better insight then the Russian people just pointing out the facts.

14 hours ago, juice777 said:

What a absolute Genius Demanding his Cut of the money stolen form the Russian people from the Oligarchs becoming the Richest man in the world (maybe if not one of them) and still haveing the love of the people by manipulating them through RT news Channel.

[juice777]

Are you suggesting that RT today isn't a propaganda station controlled by him and the Kremlin used to manipulate the Russian public?

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[RuamRudy]

6 minutes ago, juice777 said:

Are you suggesting that RT today isn't a propaganda station controlled by him and the Kremlin used to manipulate the Russian public?

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Yes, I am saying that. RT is not transmitted within Russia, and Russian is not one of the languages that the channel is transmitted in.

Edited March 14, 2018 by RuamRudy

[juice777]

Yes, I am saying that. RT is not transmitted within Russia, and Russian is not one of the languages that the channel is transmitted in.

OK what about the other Meida the Russian oligarchs own. They used to turn around Boris Yeltisn popularity so he won a second Term so they could carry on robing the people and they are probably doing it now. Even if it ant RT today (in Russia) its still the same principle.

 

 

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[RuamRudy]

4 minutes ago, juice777 said:

OK what about the other Meida the Russian oligarchs own. They used to turn around Boris Yeltisn popularity so he won a second Term so they could carry on robing the people and they are probably doing it now. Even if it ant RT today (in Russia) its still the same principle.

 

What are they doing differently from the likes of Fox, CNN, Brietbart, BBC etc etc?

[Scott]

RT is not a permitted source on this site.  

 

[juice777]

What are they doing differently from the likes of Fox, CNN, Brietbart, BBC etc etc?

OK there might be media with agendas as bad as that is but then there is opposing media with different agendas or at least different views. And if you are talking about the UK and America then it is never certain who is going to win the Election there is at least another party with a fighting chance. But thanks to complete control of the media by Putin and Killing the opposition leaders and banning them from running and knocking of reporters. He has managed to stay in control for 18 years all the time getting richer and richer by Demanding money from the oligarchs who nicked it all from the masses when he promised to stamp out corruption, And maintain a 80% approval rate ( or it was a few years ago) that's a hell of a trick.

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[juice777]

RT is not a permitted source on this site.  
 

There you ago they are even banned form Here and quite right as well.

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[nahkit]

On 3/13/2018 at 11:21 AM, baboon said:

...and enjoy freezing to death next winter when they switch off the gas. May can strut all she wants but when it comes down to it there is nothing she can do. Jesus, how can a country that cannot afford to keep the street lights on or empty the bloody bins more than once a fortnight possibly think they can rattle Russia? What next - Bangladesh declaring war on China? Talk about the mouse that roared...

" The first-ever shipment of Russian gas to the UK looks likely to head straight back out on another ship, disproving Moscow’s claims that Britain will be reliant on it for supplies this winter. "

 

Printed in the guardian newspaper, dated Dec 29th 2017

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/dec/29/russian-liquified-natural-gas-shipment-unlikely-remain-uk

 

According to the British Gas website, the UK does not directly import any gas from Russia (figures as of Dec 2017)

[RuamRudy]

2 minutes ago, juice777 said:

OK there might be media with agendas as bad as that is but then there is opposing media with different agendas or at least different views. And if you are talking about the UK and America then it is never certain who is going to win the Election there is at least another party with a fighting chance. But thanks to complete control of the media by Putin and Killing the opposition leaders and banning them from running and knocking of reporters. He has managed to stay in control for 18 years all the time getting richer and richer by Demanding money from the oligarchs who nicked it all from the masses when he promised to stamp out corruption, And maintain a 80% approval rate ( or it was a few years ago) that's a hell of a trick.
 

When my company first sent me to the Russian far east in around 2000, I was honestly stunned by what I saw. It was like the UK 20 or 30 years previously, but without the care and maintenance. In a city of 100,000 people, seemingly all the buildings were crumbling and the roads in bits, there were many houses still without running water or indoor toilets; every car was either an Uaz or a Lada, the people had a weather-worn, weary look upon their faces. Pensioners, who had worked their entire lives under the Soviet system in the expectation of a comfortable retirement would beg on street corners for a few coins. And that was things on the up. The 1990s were, by all accounts, hellish, brutal times. I knew one guy who left school in 1990 at the age of 13 to go and work down the mines because there was literally no money coming into his home.

 

BY the time I left in 2009, the contrast between my arrival and departure was vast. People were prosperous, modern buildings were appearing everywhere, there were only Japanese or Western cars on the streets and there was genuine optimistic about the future.

 

Like him or not, Putin turned around the chaos and brought stability and prosperity to the masses. For them, his excesses are ignored as long as their lot continues to improve.

[RuamRudy]

39 minutes ago, juice777 said:

There you ago they are even banned form Here and quite right as well.

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But this discussion is not about the journalistic integrity of RT, but whether the Russians are blind to the excesses of Putin.

 

Are you aware that Theresa May's husband's investment firm, which facilitates British oligarchs tranferring billions out of the UK and away from the tax man, has not paid a penny in corporation tax in 8 years? If you think that we are squeaky clean in the UK, then you are sadly mistaken.