Pattaya expat threatened with jail after posting negative restaurant review online

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, maximillian said:

 

Or the attitude of the TV moderator...

No comment! 

[Jack Mountain]

7 minutes ago, Marley01 said:

And unfortunately that is the problem with the media in Thailand, too gutless to report the facts for fear of being sued. 

Grow a set and take it head on with these cretins and if you get sued, report that too.

Just wait for Andrew Drummond ...

[Parsve]

3 hours ago, crazykopite said:

I will keep my thoughts to myself ! yet another reason why I will never visit Pattaya.

Wasnt that a thought

[sambum]

Ridiculous! Does this restaurant owner think HE is the one that can not be criticised for fear of "attitude adjustment"? 

[midas]

2 hours ago, outsider said:

The restaurant owner could have addressed the situation more positively - use the same platform (social media), invite the expat to go back so the owner can personally see to it that the customer gets what he was expecting (within reason) and turn the whole episode into a positive spin. And win more customers. Instead, he has chosen to do it the Thai way - silencing critics with threats of violence, lawsuit etc. His stupidity and childishness may just cost him the very thing he is trying to protect - his restaurant.

 

Speaking of silencing critics and strict defamation laws, our neighbour Malaysia has just tabled an 'Anti-Fake News Bill 2018' in what is seen as a thinly-veiled attempt at silencing critics and coverage on anything negative on the Malaysian government - including its well-publicised financial scandals etc. Who determines what fake news is? The government. See the point? It seems this new law will also enable the Malaysian authorities to catch and prosecute 'offenders' of other nationalities in other countries though I have no idea how the hell that is going to work and who the hell Malaysia thinks it is.

 

I guess Malaysia and Thailand are in a race to win the 'Most Oppressive State' award.

It's like a cancer spreading throughout Southeast Asia with the Philippines and Singapore heading in the same direction

 

https://rsf.org/en/news/singapores-anti-fake-news-bill-must-not-tighten-gag-dissent

 

http://www.khmertimeskh.com/50104529/leaders-use-fake-news-crutch-to-control-media-critics-charge/

 

[Becker]

3 hours ago, crazykopite said:

I will keep my thoughts to myself ! yet another reason why I will never visit Pattaya.

Yet you're active in a Pattaya forum. Very strange.

[StefanBBK]

Ok, I am officially intrigued which restaurant may be the one we cant talk about. Please pm me if known.  

[The Teacher]

Another day of people not handling the truth well again, blah, blah , blah lets move on God damn it 

[tropo]

4 hours ago, Anythingleft? said:

Defamation, which is a criminal offence in Thailand, is punishable by up to two years in jail.

Commentators have said previously that Thailand’s strict defamation laws have been used as a weapon by the powerful to silence critics.



This law in its current presentation is crippling Thailand from moving forward...

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk
 

Irrespective of what you or anyone else thinks of this law, it is real, and people are imprisoned because of it.

 

I'm aware of one expat serving time because he defamed his ex-girlfriend. Because the case was held in a lower court he couldn't appeal.

 

I went through a defamation case myself recently. They are no fun, but they must be taken very seriously.

 

If you publish negative stuff online and they know who you are, the prosecution is easy.

 

The person who made the negative review should offer an apology and some compensation, rather than taking his current stand.

Edited March 27, 2018 by tropo

[Anythingleft?]

Irrespective of what you or anyone else thinks of this law, it is real, and people are imprisoned because of it.
 
I'm aware of one expat serving time because he defamed his ex-girlfriend. Because the case was held in a lower court he couldn't appeal.
 
I went through a defamation case myself recently. They are no fun, but they must be taken very seriously.
 
If you publish negative stuff online and they know who you are, the prosecution is easy.
 
The person who made the negative review should offer an apology and some compensation, rather than taking his current stand.

Note post #68....


Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

[tropo]

7 minutes ago, Anythingleft? said:

Note post #68....

1

What of it? I'm not covering the moral issues here, just the legal ones.

 

He's a slam dunk for a civil and a criminal case, and the civil claims could be huge. The typical legal ploy is to bring them both at once and get you to negotiate the civil demand to stay out of jail. In the meanwhile, they take your passport and you lose your visa.

Edited March 27, 2018 by tropo

[evadgib]

15 minutes ago, tropo said:

Irrespective of what you or anyone else thinks of this law, it is real, and people are imprisoned because of it.

 

I'm aware of one expat serving time because he defamed his ex-girlfriend. Because the case was held in a lower court he couldn't appeal.

 

I went through a defamation case myself recently. They are no fun, but they must be taken very seriously.

 

If you publish negative stuff online and they know who you are, the prosecution is easy.

 

The person who made the negative review should offer an apology and some compensation, rather than taking his current stand.

Was it your resteurant?

Edited March 27, 2018 by evadgib

[Easy Come Easy Go]

send in Gordon Ramsey, I'd like to see this owner handle that situation 

[tropo]

2 minutes ago, evadgib said:

Was it your resteurant?

Yes it is...  Mr Tropo's Pizza Place.

[VocalNeal]

My mother would say. "If you can't say anything good don't say anything"  So one solution in future might be for the Breakfast Club and other FarceBook groups to agree to make it clear that they will only accept and only post reviews of establishments that rate a say  6 or better. If this was their published policy then restaurants with "negative" reviews would not be on their page/site and thus would not get visited by their followers.

Edited March 27, 2018 by VocalNeal

[Ridler]

Instead of specilulating which restaurant please tell us which restaurant it is

[evadgib]

5 minutes ago, tropo said:

Yes it is...  Mr Tropo's Pizza Place.

So you've just outed yours as the gaff in the OP?

Edited March 27, 2018 by evadgib

[Easy Come Easy Go]

10 minutes ago, tropo said:

Irrespective of what you or anyone else thinks of this law, it is real, and people are imprisoned because of it.

 

I'm aware of one expat serving time because he defamed his ex-girlfriend. Because the case was held in a lower court he couldn't appeal.

 

I went through a defamation case myself recently. They are no fun, but they must be taken very seriously.

 

If you publish negative stuff online and they know who you are, the prosecution is easy.

 

The person who made the negative review should offer an apology and some compensation, rather than taking his current stand.

So the internet should be a place where only posting positive things like images of puppies or cats is permitted? Nobody can voice their opinion on a meal they have just eaten?? If you run a business such as a restaurant, you should expect and deal with differing opinions and reactions. It is par for the course, especially if you serve up a shoddy or subpar service 

[Skeptic7]

Guess I'd best watch out! Have posted not exactly positive reviews on Trip Advisor and Happy Cow about a particular vegetarian restaurant in Patts. Won't mention any names for fear of retribution, but it's initials are...FIVE STAR J Vegetarian Food, corner of South Pattaya & 3rd Road. 

Edited March 27, 2018 by Skeptic7

[janpharma]

Thai can't handle criticism anyway...

[midas]

42 minutes ago, Internatltraveler said:

I do not read these articles on a daily basis because it seems we expats are full of outhouse attorneys, experts in the world of everything and quite often just full of crap with our complaining about living in Thailand. I am not going to defend or argue about what is said here but maybe an intelligent objective comment is called for when there are so many crazies out there who sit around and have nothing more to do than just to complain and bash wherever they live at the time.

 

We may not agree with our host country and we try to measure how it is in the countries where we hail from against the laws, standards, and beliefs in our host country. The huge issue that is obviously just passed over so often in these discussions is that every country (and I have lived in 10 countries now) has their own standards of conduct, their rules of society, their own laws to which people are expected to abide by. We cannot legitimately say they are wrong and we are right since this country has the perfectly legitimate right to establish laws and standards the government sees fit to establish.

 

Each of our countries has laws that are strange to foreigners and often even to the citizens of our countries, and often time they are not strictly enforced and subject to ridicule for being outdated, irrational and otherwise downright stupid. But they are still the laws that we are held accountable to. Comments defining legal terms by the definitions of our own countries mean nothing outside the boundaries of our countries in reality. Yes, they may be dated and even need to be changed, but to sit and quibble about these issues as a foreigner in a host country is not going to make things better. We have no voting rights here, we do not influence the laws here very much, even with our egotistical thinking that all the money we are spending as expats will make a difference in the government.

 

I suggest that we learn to abide by the laws and contribute answers to the issues facing this country (unless all you want to do is sit around, drink your beer and complain all the time). Most of us live here because we have gotten tired of our own cultures or maybe we are hiding from someone or just are undesirable nomads seeking hidden asylums in far away places. I love to travel and have never had conflict in any country anywhere in the world. I first become knowledgeable about the laws that are going to affect me in my new host country to make sure I can live there personally; that I feel relatively safe and secure and can experience the local culture close up and real. If you just sit around and complain you are not going to enjoy the wonders of Thailand and its beauty. But you certainly can find other expats that have nothing better to do then support your negativity.

 

You always have choices in life. A choice you have here, as you did in the country you came from, is to be positive and understand what is expected of you here, abide by the rules, honor the society and respect the differences in Thailand from your own country or quite honestly just move on to another place that you can complain about again. Do you really think all of your pissing and moaning is going to change things in a culture that is over 5000 years old? Come on and get real!!! All we do is to alienate more Thais who already don't want us here and sit other foreigners up as "rich people who think they can buy anything including the Thai culture with their pension checks."

 

I have found out in my long years of living that we have a choice to be negative about most everything or we can be positive. It seems to me that life is so much more worth living and our experiences become much more rewarding when we do things for others first of all, get away from our own narcissistic thinking, our holier than thou attitudes and learn about the country we are living in. Look to its good side, to the friendly people, those that will help us in our moment of emergency, those that are sincerely well meaning people who want to please and serve us the best they know how. Why not be thankful for this opportunity that we have been given to enjoy the remaining years of our lives rather than sit around and complain about every little ant that crawls across our thresholds?

 

I know these words will probably be ridiculed and more negative comments made, but I have developed a huge shield against negativity that the best of you cannot penetrate, so read, think, and maybe life could be so good if you really wanted it to be! I bet if I were to live in any country any of you have come from, I could sit and find so much to complain about that you would want me to exit out of the nearest border as fast as I could move. And I would hear the resounding comment, "well if you don't like it here, just move on."

" We cannot legitimately say they are wrong and we are right since this country has the perfectly legitimate right to establish laws and standards the government sees fit to establish."

 

You have a very  unique perspective on things

But how do you reconcile this viewpoint with the case of the two guys in Phuket (as reported by the BBC) who both were cheated out of millions of pounds through fraud carried out by their own wives? I am sure those guys  would have liked to have some insight into the " laws and standards the government sees fit to establish "before they put their money here

[BobBKK]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Basically, the answer is YES.

They wouldn't use the word allowed.

They've written about this several times.

What they say is that if they visit a place and it's awful, they won't review it.

They also indicated that people can read between the lines to figure out that they're not excited about a place.

That is true.

But they still won't say anything strongly negative.

 

 

What a sad state of affairs and what a sad reflection on Thailand. All shim sham and face. 

 

Next is don't criticize the football team?  music? beer?

[iforget]

5 hours ago, Anythingleft? said:

Defamation, which is a criminal offence in Thailand, is punishable by up to two years in jail.

Commentators have said previously that Thailand’s strict defamation laws have been used as a weapon by the powerful to silence critics.



This law in its current presentation is crippling Thailand from moving forward...

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk
 

More accurately, defamation may be a criminal offence. It's up to the plaintiff ("victim" of the defamation), who may decide to bring only a civil suit. A criminal accusation is definitely scarier, but if the plaintiff goes down that route, he/she is less likely to get a big payoff from a concurrent civil suit.

So, if you want to scare everyone, go for criminal defamation. If you want big bucks, go for a civil suit.  

[Jack Mountain]

Just vote with your feed no need for a negative review other then directly to the owner. Reviews from others isn't always the same as your own review btw. So take them with some salt or soja.

[dfdgfdfdgs]

3 hours ago, Crash999 said:

That would prevent the review from being taken down but unfortunately wouldn’t stop the restaurant owner from filing a defamation case against the author. 

 

They wouldn't know who the author was.

[catman20]

5 hours ago, PatOngo said:

Telling the truth comes with a heavy price, as witnessed on numerous occasions.

YOU  cant handle the truth ! Jack Nicholson 

[DJ54]

Perhaps someone could talk to the restaurant owner and explain a “Bad” review should be looked as a good thing in some cases. Maybe there is just cause from changes/improvement or the critic got it wrong. Either way it’s a learning curve. 

[Jingthing]

13 minutes ago, Jack Mountain said:

Just vote with your feed no need for a negative review other then directly to the owner. Reviews from others isn't always the same as your own review btw. So take them with some salt or soja.

There are thousands of restaurants in Pattaya. Nobody can realistically eat at a high percentage of them, even me, and I do try. The public depends on information provided by people that HAVE eaten at places. Mature restaurant owners understand that they will be getting some negative reviews and also understand that's not a big deal and that the public is capable of filtering that in context of other comments. If a restaurant is getting mostly negative comments, they had best look into their operation rather than irrationally lash out at others.

Edited March 27, 2018 by Jingthing

[chilli42]

Why is anyone taking this seriously?  There is no defamation case here.

[Skeptic7]

15 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

 

What a sad state of affairs and what a sad reflection on Thailand. All shim sham and face. 

 

Next is don't criticize the football team?  music? beer?

This IS Thailand nowadays. A sad Police State of affairs. Overly sensitive and thin skinned, hypocrtical, way too easily offended and outraged while personal liberties and free speech are disappearing or flat out not permitted.