Boris Johnson slammed over Islamophobic comments

[CG1 Blue]

15 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Suddenly stops making any sense as soon as a woman chooses of her own free will to wear a Burqa.

That depends how you define 'own free will'. From what I hear the vast majority who wear it are choosing to do so because of pressure from family and/or husbands/boyfriends. I hear this from Muslims. The rest have been brainwashed from a young age into thinking it is a good thing to wear, to get closer to God.

The fact remains it is a symbol of misogyny and enslavement to men.  Why encourage this?  

[CG1 Blue]

From 2016:

 

Sadiq Khan, the Labour candidate for London mayor, has said there is “a question to be asked” about why some Muslim women in the capital wear hijabs and niqabs.

 

In an interview with the London Evening Standard, the frontrunner in next month’s mayoral contest contrasted the way Muslim women dressed when he was growing up in London in the 1970s and 80s with the way many women dressed today.

 

“When I was younger you didn’t see people in hijabs and niqabs, not even in Pakistan when I visited my family. In London we got on. People dressed the same. What you see now are people born and raised here who are choosing to wear the jilbab [a loose gown] or niqab.

 

“There is a question to be asked about what is going on in those homes. What’s insidious is if people are starting to think it is appropriate to treat women differently or that it has been forced on them. What worries me is children being forced to adopt a lifestyle.”

 

Asked whether women should be allowed to cover their faces, he said: “It’s not for me to tell women what to wear. But I do think that in public service we should be able to see each other’s faces. Eye contact matters. You should be able to see the face.”

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/apr/14/sadiq-khan-question-to-be-asked-about-hijabs-veils-london

 

 

[vogie]

If ISIS have banned the burqa, I think we should seriously consider it a problem.

[Chomper Higgot]

9 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

That depends how you define 'own free will'. From what I hear the vast majority who wear it are choosing to do so because of pressure from family and/or husbands/boyfriends. I hear this from Muslims. The rest have been brainwashed from a young age into thinking it is a good thing to wear, to get closer to God.

The fact remains it is a symbol of misogyny and enslavement to men.  Why encourage this?  

From what you’ve hear!

 

 

[CG1 Blue]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

12 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

That depends how you define 'own free will'. From what I hear the vast majority who wear it are choosing to do so because of pressure from family and/or husbands/boyfriends. I hear this from Muslims. The rest have been brainwashed from a young age into thinking it is a good thing to wear, to get closer to God.

The fact remains it is a symbol of misogyny and enslavement to men.  Why encourage this?  

From what you’ve hear!

What makes you think it is their own free will?  Please explain.

[Chomper Higgot]

5 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

What makes you think it is their own free will?  Please explain.

It is you making the assertion of ‘what you hear’ followed by your generalized ‘vast majority’.

 

It is for you to back up the statement that you yourself admit is ‘hearsay’.

 

 

Edited August 10, 2018 by Chomper Higgot

[Chomper Higgot]

19 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

From 2016:

 

Sadiq Khan, the Labour candidate for London mayor, has said there is “a question to be asked” about why some Muslim women in the capital wear hijabs and niqabs.

 

In an interview with the London Evening Standard, the frontrunner in next month’s mayoral contest contrasted the way Muslim women dressed when he was growing up in London in the 1970s and 80s with the way many women dressed today.

 

“When I was younger you didn’t see people in hijabs and niqabs, not even in Pakistan when I visited my family. In London we got on. People dressed the same. What you see now are people born and raised here who are choosing to wear the jilbab [a loose gown] or niqab.

 

“There is a question to be asked about what is going on in those homes. What’s insidious is if people are starting to think it is appropriate to treat women differently or that it has been forced on them. What worries me is children being forced to adopt a lifestyle.”

 

Asked whether women should be allowed to cover their faces, he said: “It’s not for me to tell women what to wear. But I do think that in public service we should be able to see each other’s faces. Eye contact matters. You should be able to see the face.”

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/apr/14/sadiq-khan-question-to-be-asked-about-hijabs-veils-london

 

 

Interestingly where Boris Johnson ridicules people, Sadiq  Khan suggests examination to understand.

 

Who can argue with that.

Edited August 10, 2018 by Chomper Higgot

[Naam]

10 hours ago, cmsally said:

10 hours ago, Naam said:

your whining won't stop any dress code. ask your Mum for a cookie and a glass of hot milk.

But we do still have the power to stop it from becoming an accepted part of European society.

by using Thaivisa as an islamophobic wailing wall? personally i agree that a full face veil is for various reason not acceptable. wearing any other garment, e.g. that hides body contours, is nobody else's business although i rather look at female contours than at an abaya.

 

when we lived in Saudi Arabia my wife used to tell amusing stories after returning from a "kitty party". her friends were pitying her because she had to work hard in the gym and do her 120 laps in the pool to keep in shape in order to wear western dresses when abroad.

 

now when we are visiting there's no more talk about pity but pure envy. all her friends have doubled or tripled in size. and the latter applies to my male Saudi friends too.  

[Naam]

11 hours ago, cmsally said:

But we do still have the power to stop it from becoming an accepted part of European society.

"we have the power". please define "we".

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, Naam said:

"we have the power". please define "we".

Why are you asking such questions, the majority of brits don't agree with it, doesn't their opinion count. Its something like 64% of brits want the burqa banned and about 26% are ok with it. So "we" I would have thought meant the majority of the country. I am not sure of the figures from Germany but I would be interested to know what those figures are.

 

[Naam]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

Why are you asking such questions, the majority of brits don't agree with it, doesn't their opinion count. Its something like 64% of brits want the burqa banned and about 26% are ok with it. So "we" I would have thought meant the majority of the country. I am not sure of the figures from Germany but I would be interested to know what those figures are.

 

my question (singular) is logical because neither in the U.K. nor in Germany the majority of the population have no say in this matter. as far as Germany is concerned i am sure that the figures of "no burqa!" are at least the same or even higher than U.K.

[Chomper Higgot]

10 minutes ago, vogie said:

Why are you asking such questions, the majority of brits don't agree with it, doesn't their opinion count. Its something like 64% of brits want the burqa banned and about 26% are ok with it. So "we" I would have thought meant the majority of the country. I am not sure of the figures from Germany but I would be interested to know what those figures are.

 

As a general rule, if someone quotes a percentage but doesn’t provide a source for the percentage, they are making it up.

 

Source?

[vogie]

1 minute ago, Naam said:

my question (singular) is logical because neither in the U.K. nor in Germany the majority of the population have no say in this matter. as far as Germany is concerned i am sure that the figures of "no burqa!" are at least the same or even higher than U.K.

Well it's about time "we" did have a say in the matter, doesn't the opinion of the host country matter any more.

[My Thai Life]

Dr Taj Hargey, an Imam at the Oxford Islamic Congregation, says Boris Johnson has nothing to apologise for. In a letter to The Times, Dr Hargey wrote: "The burka and niqab are hideous tribal ninja-like garments that are pre-Islamic, non-Koranic and therefore un-Muslim."

 

Dr Hargey added Boris "did not go far enough", and said he shouldn't "apologise for telling the truth".

 

And he pointed out the burka — which he called a "deliberate identity-concealing contraption is banned at the Kaaba in Mecca but it is permitted in Britain, thus precipitating security risks, accelerating vitamin D deficiency, endorsing gender-inequality and inhibiting community cohesion.”

 

He called on Britain to join "France, Belgium, Austria, Bulgaria, and Denmark in banning the burka."

[nong38]

1 hour ago, nong38 said:

He as said what most people think but are not allowed to say these days thanks to the PC brigade.

Just looking at the express.co.uk and anything to do with this event you cannot comment on, anything with any muslim content or Gina Miller "comments unavailable." Free speech and Free press, really?

[vogie]

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

As a general rule, if someone quotes a percentage but doesn’t provide a source for the percentage, they are making it up.

 

Source?

Enjoy.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/01/british-public-back-a-ban-on-burqa-by-two-to-one-poll-finds/

[Brian Allen]

.... Boris Johnson slammed over "islamophobic" comments .... 

 

All that's "offensive" about this storm in a teacup, is that the Lying Swine are still chattering about it a week after it happened and that for stating a simple fact,  Mr Johnson is being verbally assaulted by ridiculous headlines like that displayed here. 

 

Worth noting, meanwhile, that, having become much worn only from the 1970s, berkers are not "religious" garments but are a politically-motivated middle finger to both the poor berks imprisoned in them -- and to every civilized state and/or nation. 

 

[Opl]

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

As a general rule, if someone quotes a percentage but doesn’t provide a source for the percentage, they are making it up.

 

Source?

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2016/08/31/majority-public-backs-burka-ban/

[Chomper Higgot]

Here’s something rather curious.

 

I’ve spent a lot of time in Jeddah, Makkah Province (a fabulous city).

 

Burqa’s and Niqabs in this fine city near the epicenter of Islam (and Whahhabism) are common but by no streatch of the imagination are they universal.

 

Which presents something of a problem to the arguments that this is dictated by Whahhabism and underscores Sadiq Khan’s call for examination to understand.

[Chomper Higgot]

5 minutes ago, vogie said:

Enjoy.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/01/british-public-back-a-ban-on-burqa-by-two-to-one-poll-finds/

I did enjoy, especially finding you’d over stated the numbers.

[vogie]

12 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I did enjoy, especially finding you’d over stated the numbers.

Chomper, you cannot be gracious even in defeat.

[Chomper Higgot]

9 minutes ago, vogie said:

Chomper, you cannot be gracious even in defeat.

I gave you a like, what more do you want.

 

[vogie]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I gave you a like, what more do you want.

 

Blood! ?

[My Thai Life]

Associate Professor Elham Manea, a Swiss-Yemeni citizen and the author of Women and Sharia Law, argues it is naïve — even racist — to regard the wearing of a burka as a sincere act of faith.

 

"The burka is not Islamic," she told the Religion and Ethics Report. "It's a tradition that comes from the heart of Saudi Arabia, a region called Nejd." Dr Manea says the veiled garment was not worn by women outside of Nejd until Saudi Arabia's Wahabi regime came to power in the late 1970s."

 

"The re-Islamisation of Saudi Arabia according to the Wahabi Salafi fundamentalist principles led to the mainstreaming of the burka," she said. "With Gulf money you had a promotion of this ideology and a reading of Islam that turned the burka into an 'Islamic' tradition."

 

"The burka is a sign of segregation, separation, rejection of the values we see all around us — values of acceptance and tolerance and otherness," she said. "It reflects a culture that treats woman as a sexualised object that has to be covered.”

 

Amen to that, professor!

Edited August 10, 2018 by My Thai Life

[CG1 Blue]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It is you making the assertion of ‘what you hear’ followed by your generalized ‘vast majority’.

 

It is for you to back up the statement that you yourself admit is ‘hearsay’.

 

 

So you're ok to assume that a woman is perfectly happy to walk around covered head to toe in black sheets, with only a slit to look through, even in the 30+ degrees heat we've seen across Europe this year? You think this is the choice of a liberated woman in 2018?

[blazes]

Fear not, fear not, all threaders, we can close the thread down right now:  The Conservative Party is considering whether to send Boris on a "diversity training course".......

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/08/10/boris-johnson-could-given-diversity-training-instead-sanctioned/?WT.mc_id=e_DM820337&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_FPM_New_AEM_Recipient&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_FPM_New_AEM_Recipient_2018_08_10&utm_campaign=DM820337

[7by7]

 I have to admit I have not read every post since my last visit. But I would like to make some points based on those I have read.

 

1) Many people are saying that wearing a burka, niqab, chador or hajib shows that the wearer has no desire to integrate into British society. Presumably because the wearers are not dressed in the British way.

 

But members of other religions dress differently to the British norm; orthodox Jews, Sikhs, Rastafarians etc. Are these people also refusing to integrate?

 

How many of those accusing these Muslim women of not integrating live in Thailand? How many of those speak Thai; how many post in the General Forum laughing at or complaining about the peculiarities of Thais; How many complain about bars closing on election days and other state occasions; etc., etc.?

 

Of course, no doubt those that fit this description will come up with the usual excuse that they do not have to integrate into Thai society as their are not immigrants; their visas say so! Despite the fact that they have lived in Thailand for many years and intend doing so for many more.

 

2) Then there is the feminist argument; no women should be forced to wear such a garment. 

 

What happened to a woman's right to choose? Isn't that one of the foundations of feminism?

 

 

 

Two opposing views from a Muslim woman and an Imam.

 

OK, I accept that some men may force their wives and daughters to wear it and punish them if they refuse.

 

But wife beating is not just committed by Muslim men. Certain members wont like it, but even men from white Christian backgrounds commit spousal abuse.

 

Furthermore, women in the orthodox Jewish community have no more, if not less, rights than those in orthodox Muslims ones.

 

UK Haredi rabbis ban women drivers

Quote

Under new directive in north London, children driven to school by their mothers will be expelled; rabbis say policy upholds modesty

Where was the outrage over that?

 

3) Women cannot wear what they like in some Muslim countries, so Muslim women should not be allowed to wear what they like here in the UK.

 

True. Oppressive regimes exist, no one denies that. But the UK is not one, and I hope never will be. My father served in the RAF from 1939 to 1945 to keep this country free. He'd be turning in his grave if he read some of the comments here!

 

How can anyone justify that because women have few, or no, rights in some countries then we should restrict women's rights here in the UK?

 

 

[blazes]

Roger Scruton, in The Spectator, makes some good points:

 

 

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/08/the-art-of-taking-offence/?utm_source=Adestra&utm_medium=email&utm_content=Evening Blend 10082018&utm_campaign=Evening_Blend

[sambum]

20 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 

 

 

 

 

Under new directive in north London, children driven to school by their mothers will be expelled; rabbis say policy upholds modesty

"Where was the outrage over that?"

 

The Mayor of London is a Muslim as is the Home Secretary - any outrage would be quickly nipped in the bud, as was shown by the lady asking the the police to stop Muslims praying in Hyde Park a few weeks ago!

 

"How can anyone justify that because women have few, or no, rights in some countries then we should restrict women's rights here in the UK?"

 

Because the wearing of a burka "offends" a great number of UK people?

Edited August 10, 2018 by sambum

[Opl]

18 minutes ago, blazes said:

Roger Scruton, in The Spectator, makes some good points:

 

 

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/08/the-art-of-taking-offence/?utm_source=Adestra&utm_medium=email&utm_content=Evening Blend 10082018&utm_campaign=Evening_Blend

Thanks for sharing,

very true