U.S. Senator John McCain, ex-POW and political maverick, dead at 81

[colinneil]

I am horrified and disgusted at how many members on here can be so callous making disgusting uncalled for comments, therr is no need for that vicious bile some members spew out.

I am not American, never normally post about the politics in the US, but feel this time i need to speak.

Thank you to the mods for doing your best to contain the bile/ hatred shown by some on here.

I was brought up to never sp[eak ill of the dead, his obituary has just been made public and some of you cant wait to have a go, shame on you.

[Ulic]

While I do see him as a person of integrity, I do not see him as a statesman. There was

never a war he did not want the US to be involved in. A real warmonger as far as I am concerned.

 

[Throatwobbler]

An old guy died who was nice on some issues but also a warmonger on other issues. You can not praise his wanting to talk cross party with serious domestic issues without also acknowledging is desire to bring war to other countries.

[Jingthing]

He's a role model of republican resistance against a president that thinks and acts like a King. Too bad he couldn't have hung around longer in these dark times that are reminiscent of the civil war.

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[mtls2005]

We've been at war for ~ 17 years, and there is plenty of blame to share. Said blame extends all the way down to citizens like you and me who've kind of gone along, demanded little of our leaders and are arguably just as war-monger-ish.

 

The new generation of lawmakers who've served may be a blessing (Seth Moulton, Tammy Duckworth), or a curse (Tom Cotton, Duncan Hunter, Eric Greitens)?

 

 

[Jingthing]

Like I said not great timing.

 

"John McCain leaves the stage when we need him most

 

McCain’s passing, tragic at any time, is all the sadder now. His dedication to America’s global leadership, advocacy for human rights, steadfast opposition to despots, devotion to bipartisanship, willingness to break with his own party, insistence on putting the nation’s interest above self-interest, and, above all, his unwavering sense of right and wrong — all are desperately needed at a time when his party has embraced an amoral, narcissistic demagogue who fawns over tyrants and flirts with isolationism and protectionism and white nationalism. Trump hated McCain and insulted him at every turnbecause McCain was everything Trump is not — and everything that we need in our politics today but tragically lack."

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/mccain-leaves-the-stage-when-we-need-him-most/2018/08/25/a67793c0-a8cd-11e8-97ce-cc9042272f07_story.html

 

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[Spidey]

2 hours ago, Ulic said:

While I do see him as a person of integrity, I do not see him as a statesman. There was

never a war he did not want the US to be involved in. A real warmonger as far as I am concerned.

 

That was his belief. His solution to problems. He stood fast by his beliefs. Admire him for that.

[Tug]

I hope John knew trumps cfo had immunity before he passed I have a feeling he was hanging on till he knew we were safe fair winds and following seas thank you you will be celebrated and missed 

[Jingthing]

I hope John knew trumps cfo had immunity before he passed I have a feeling he was hanging on till he knew we were safe fair winds and following seas thank you you will be celebrated and missed 

That's an interesting observation but we really don't know that yet. Unfortunately.

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[pedro01]

John McCain.

 

The fella who sang about bombing people, right "bomb, bomb, bomb... bomb, bomb Iran"

 

And went on to choose Sarah Palin as running mate.

 

I have nothing bad to say about him - but nothing nice either. Just another career politician.

[faraday]

There are some truly appalling members on tvf.

 

[Jingthing]

A role model in life.

A role model in death.
 

Quote

 

In death, John McCain shows an alternative to Trump

...

Like Scrooge, Trump will see other vivid contrasts between his narrow, selfish life and the expansive joy of a life lived in service. At McCain’s funeral, Trump will see Democrats and Republicans; most, if not all, former living presidents; and hundreds of lifelong friends sitting together in unity and celebration of a man, his service and ideals. Grown men and women will cry, because they loved McCain and what he stood for.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2018/08/26/in-death-mccain-shows-an-alternative-to-trump/

[balo]

One of the few good people in American politics , as a European I can only observe what's going on in your country and a lot of it is crazy and absurd. 

 

McCain were one of the good guys, liked by both republicans and democrats.  R.I.P.  

 

Btw I read that President Trump is not invited to his funeral . It was his wish . McCain was a true war hero and Trump did not even recognize it,   so I can understand his decision . 

 

 

 

[Jingthing]

46 minutes ago, balo said:

One of the few good people in American politics , as a European I can only observe what's going on in your country and a lot of it is crazy and absurd. 

 

McCain were one of the good guys, liked by both republicans and democrats.  R.I.P.  

 

Btw I read that President Trump is not invited to his funeral . It was his wish . McCain was a true war hero and Trump did not even recognize it,   so I can understand his decision . 

 

 

 

Yep, the creepy troll criminally corrupt president days before McCain's death had a rally about a military spending bill named for John McCain. The sleazy con man president intentionally failed to mention the name McCain in multiple mentions of the bill. What kind of person is that? Not one that should have ever been to the oval office even as a visitor. 

[geriatrickid]

I dislike the use of hyperbole and grand statements when someone dies. There is often an embellishment  of the person's life and a glossing over of serious errors. Senator McCain took his role as a senator seriously, and put his responsibility to his country above  partisan politics.  However, before he got there, he made some serious errors, one of the most notable  was his involvement in the Lincoln Savings and Loan collapse of 1989 which saw 23,000 bondholders defrauded and  elderly people bankrupted as they lost their life savings. The US taxpayers were on the hook for $3 billion+. The principal of the S&L had  made  "donations" to multiple senators in excess of $1 million each. McCain was one of them, and he acted favourable to the S&L Although cleared of wrongdoing by a Senate investigation, he was taken to task for his actions.

 

The use of the term maverick is overused. A maverick would have said no to the selection of Sarah Palin as a VP running mate. He regretted that decision, but  boy oh boy, had he been a maverick, he could have picked a much, much better choice.  Despite claims to "independence" he was more likely to vote along party lines than not. He talked alot, but when the time came to vote, he sided with his party on the key issues.

 

My point being that yes, there was much to respect about the gentleman,  but some of the  comments being made on the news were just over the top. However, what cuts through all this, was that he was indeed a decent human being. He was a good and loving father, and a true friend. His support  for Ted Kennedy during his dying months, and his friendship and support of Joe Biden after the death of his son Beau speak to that. His friendship and loyalty to decorated veteran and former Senator Kerry also stands out. People who have gone to war and been in combat have a common bond that politics cannot break. Despite what detractors may say, he had a desire for peace that others cannot appreciate.

 

I know that his fellow senators will do the right thing, and thankfully there are three former presidents (Bush, Clinton, Obama) who have class and will make sure he gets the honours he deserves. The US Senate and the USA has lost a decent man who made America great.

 

[sirineou]

10 minutes ago, geriatrickid said:

I dislike the use of hyperbole and grand statements when someone dies. There is often an embellishment  of the person's life and a glossing over of serious errors. Senator McCain took his role as a senator seriously, and put his responsibility to his country above  partisan politics.  However, before he got there, he made some serious errors, one of the most notable  was his involvement in the Lincoln Savings and Loan collapse of 1989 which saw 23,000 bondholders defrauded and  elderly people bankrupted as they lost their life savings. The US taxpayers were on the hook for $3 billion+. The principal of the S&L had  made  "donations" to multiple senators in excess of $1 million each. McCain was one of them, and he acted favourable to the S&L Although cleared of wrongdoing by a Senate investigation, he was taken to task for his actions.

 

The use of the term maverick is overused. A maverick would have said no to the selection of Sarah Palin as a VP running mate. He regretted that decision, but  boy oh boy, had he been a maverick, he could have picked a much, much better choice.  Despite claims to "independence" he was more likely to vote along party lines than not. He talked alot, but when the time came to vote, he sided with his party on the key issues.

 

My point being that yes, there was much to respect about the gentleman,  but some of the  comments being made on the news were just over the top. However, what cuts through all this, was that he was indeed a decent human being. He was a good and loving father, and a true friend. His support  for Ted Kennedy during his dying months, and his friendship and support of Joe Biden after the death of his son Beau speak to that. His friendship and loyalty to decorated veteran and former Senator Kerry also stands out. People who have gone to war and been in combat have a common bond that politics cannot break. Despite what detractors may say, he had a desire for peace that others cannot appreciate.

 

I know that his fellow senators will do the right thing, and thankfully there are three former presidents (Bush, Clinton, Obama) who have class and will make sure he gets the honours he deserves. The US Senate and the USA has lost a decent man who made America great.

 

Indeed a dignified person with a lot of personal integrity but still a politician.To listen to  the news he is next in line for beatification .

He voted Thumbs down on the repeal of ACA but then voter on the repeal of the individual mandate thus effectively killing ACA.

   In his time of need I am sure he received the best care available courtesy of the US government I wonder how many others uninsured had the same privilege. 

 

 

[Scott]

Troll posts removed.  

[pegman]

RIP

[NanLaew]

Lost Harbor
by Leslie Nelson Jennings
There is a port of no return, where ships
May ride at anchor for a little space
And then, some starless night, the cable slips,
Leaving an eddy at the mooring place . . .
Gulls, veer no longer. Sailor, rest your oar.
No tangled wreckage will be washed ashore. Edited August 27, 2018 by NanLaew

[puck2]

It's a pity that the USA doesn't have more McCains   ..... in both parties.

 

I remember that even some Dems voted for the new tax law.  Self interest or pressure from the financial ghosts (paying and lobbying in the background), would never have been a reason for McCain to do so.

 

Playing, voting for groups/sharks  with some special financial or political self-interest wasn't his style.

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, puck2 said:

It's a pity that the USA doesn't have more McCains   ..... in both parties.

 

I remember that even some Dems voted for the new tax law.  Self interest or pressure from the financial ghosts (paying and lobbying in the background), would never have been a reason for McCain to do so.

 

Playing, voting for groups/sharks  with some special financial or political self-interest wasn't his style.

No, don't paint McCain as a saint. He had his share of political sins. The biggest one was picking Palin for VP instead of who his heart wanted to pick, democrat Lieberman. It's been argued that the antics of the bizarre fake populist Palin laid the psychology ground for the national tragedy we're now experiencing with our current president. 

[puck2]

When I said "It's a pity that the USA doesn't have more McCains   ..... in both parties." I referred to  his maverick style.

 

He didn't do what was ordered by the party or its political leaders. At now you recognize the style of sheeple all over the parties, especially in the the SOP (not GOP). You don't know SOP? The Sordid Old Party which doesn't stand up against a reprobate "leader", as McCain did?

 

But if you and I don't or didn't agree with his very conservative views, that doesn't mean "political" sins" in general. I'm aware that McCain made mistakes and has had  flaws . But who is free of them?

 

 

[Jingthing]

I think the opposite. He was the most powerful republican moral voice to try to check the insanity of the authoritarian white nationalist "trump" hostile takeover of the republican party. 

 

 

Quote

 

John McCain's final message for the President
In that context, the ceremonies marking McCain's passing seem sure to become more than a lament for a departed political giant. They are likely to become a debate about political morality and the comportment and principles expected of public figures in an already polarized political age that has been further roiled by Trump's disruptive influence.

...

If those plans hold, McCain will be sending a clear final message to Trump, after making clear when he was alive that he saw the President's demeanor, populist style and global outlook as antithetical to America's founding values and global role.

 

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/08/27/politics/mccain-message-trump/index.html

 

[dirtynomad]

the amount of warmongering on McCain's twitter page was scary at times.

 

if he was elected president we would be in world war 3 by now.

[Silurian]

This picture popped up on my Twitter feed...I just had to share it. The man did have a bizarre sense of humor.

 

 

[Esso49]

As a non US man I am saddened at his passing.  A true American, fighting for his countries ideals whether in SE Asia or within the political scene.  Ridiculed by the present cowardly incumbent President yet he rose above them all.  RIP

[BritManToo]

I'm sad about this, enjoyed his movies, 'Yippie ki yay mother%$#@'

Edited August 27, 2018 by BritManToo

[Opl]

https://www.newsweek.com/john-mccain-vietnamese-jailer-pays-tribute-i-liked-him-personally-1091523

 

 Vietnam's 81-year-old war veteran Pham Minh Chuc extends his condolences to late Senator John McCain during a memorial tribute at the U.S. embassy in Hanoi on August 27.

Edited August 28, 2018 by Opl

[Opl]

"Honor guard David Carrasco, 78, of Phoenix, Arizona stands with the flag outside the A.L. Moore-Grimshaw Mortuary in Phoenix, Arizona where the body of the late Senator John McCain has been held on August 26, 2018. Carrasco gave his own military medallion to McCain's wife, Cindy McCain, in a show of respect for her late husband. " LAURA SEGALL/AFP/Getty

https://www.newsweek.com/vietnam-veteran-gives-john-mccains-wife-his-military-medallion-1092227

[Scott]

Posts and replies removed and suspensions given.