Britain's May seeks to cut deal on future EU ties in Brussels

[webfact]

Britain's May seeks to cut deal on future EU ties in Brussels

 

Britain's Prime Minister Theresa May replies to questions after speaking at the Confederation of British Industry's (CBI) annual conference in London, Britain, November 19, 2018. REUTERS/Toby Melville

 

BRUSSELS (Reuters) - British Prime Minister Theresa May arrives in Brussels on Wednesday to attempt to agree a blueprint of Britain's post-Brexit ties with the European Union, which the bloc's diplomats said was being held up by disagreements over Gibraltar, fisheries and trade.

 

All EU leaders are due to meet on Sunday to rubber-stamp the Brexit deal, consisting of Britain's withdrawal agreement and an outline of the two sides' new relationship after Britain exits the EU.

 

The fate of the withdrawal accord is uncertain. British lawmakers are stepping up a fight over the terms of departure, with some trying to open the way for the country to change course.

 

While the EU is trying to discourage Britain from any renegotiation of the nearly 600 pages of dense legal text that forms the divorce deal, some of the remaining 27 member states also have issues with it.

 

Attempting to address those issues in ongoing talks on the document that will outline future ties, national EU envoys of the 27 states met on Brussels in Tuesday.

 

"Still some work is needed on three aspects: fish, goods and Gibraltar," one diplomat said of the meeting, held on the eve of May's talks with Jean-Claude Juncker, the head of the EU's executive. "Juncker and May will try to sort it out tomorrow."

 

Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez on Tuesday threatened to vote against the overall Brexit accord on Sunday unless it makes clear that the future of the disputed British territory of Gibraltar would be settled through direct talks between Madrid and London.

 

"Spain does have a very real problem on Gibraltar," said another diplomat.

 

Many in the EU's political hub Brussels said they thought Sanchez was trying to score points with voters at home before a looming domestic election.

 

They believed the issue could be solved by the leaders and warned Madrid not to push so far as to put the whole Brexit agreement at risk.

 

"We are following the latest developments with growing concern," said a third EU diplomat after Madrid said it would want changes to the already-negotiated divorce deal.

 

"No one wants to reopen the withdrawal agreement. That would lead to the crumbling away of the whole Brexit agreement and lead us all into no-man's land."

 

Within the EU, a withdrawal treaty is adopted by qualified majority and not unanimity, so formally a single state like Spain cannot block it. However, EU leaders are seeking unanimity on the deal.

 

With the fate of the tentative Brexit agreement still far from clear, both sides have also been advancing their contingency plans for the most damaging scenario under which Britain would crash out of the EU with no deal in place.

 

Another diplomat who took part in Tuesday's meeting said Britain was seeking an easy flow of goods post-Brexit that was too close to that enjoyed by bloc members only.

 

"The UK wants free movement of goods, which they won't get because that's back to discussing partial access to the single market, which we don't do," the person said.

 

In addition, France has called for more guarantees on future access to Britain's rich fishing waters, which London wants to keep firmly under control after Brexit.

 

EU members with pending issues to be resolved are seeking to either address them through the blueprint that is now being negotiated, or via separate EU statements that would not formally be part of the deal with Britain. France has backed such extra declarations, while Germany opposed them, saying the focus should be on finalising the outline of the future EU-UK relations.

 

Following May's meeting with Juncker, EU envoys will meet to discuss the approximately 20-page blueprint on Thursday, and then the leaders' negotiators will look at it again at a meeting scheduled on Friday, two days before the summit.

 

(Reporting by Gabriela Baczynska, Alastair Macdonald, Jan Strupczewski, Editing by Rosalba O'Brien)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-11-21

[nobodysfriend]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

"The UK wants free movement of goods, which they won't get because that's back to discussing partial access to the single market, which we don't do," the person said.

 

bravo ... !!!

I hope the Brits will need visas to visit Europe , too .

 

[wombat]

May wants democracy to fail.

[Andrew65]

40 minutes ago, nobodysfriend said:

 

bravo ... !!!

I hope the Brits will need visas to visit Europe , too .

 

Well, 13 million Brits visit Spain on holiday every year, I'm sure the cash-strapped Spaniards would be over the moon if that number were reduced by visa requirements.

 

That translates as £13 billion pa into the Spanish economy.

Edited November 21, 2018 by Andrew65

[the guest]

The Brits still don't get it, they chose to leave EU and now they are groveling back realizing that without Europe UK is stuffed.

 

Unfortunately it's the EU way or the highway!

[Krataiboy]

1 hour ago, nobodysfriend said:

 

bravo ... !!!

I hope the Brits will need visas to visit Europe , too .

 

I can see how you got your avatar name!

[Krataiboy]

11 minutes ago, the guest said:

The Brits still don't get it, they chose to leave EU and now they are groveling back realizing that without Europe UK is stuffed.

 

Unfortunately it's the EU way or the highway!

The Brits are not grovelling, and we won't let our traitorous leader sell us out, either. Then we'll see who ends up getting stuffed!

Edited November 21, 2018 by Krataiboy

[OneMoreFarang]

May needs to make a deal with her own party, and with the rest of the UK. Is there a majority for anything in that country? I guess the only majority is to have the cake and eat it and to pick lots of cherries.

 

If and when she has a majority to any reasonable deal then, and only then, should she talk with the EU.

Why should the EU leaders spend even more time and effort for any idea which the UK will reject? It's a waste of resources.

 

 

[OneMoreFarang]

16 minutes ago, the guest said:

The Brits still don't get it, they chose to leave EU and now they are groveling back realizing that without Europe UK is stuffed.

 

Unfortunately it's the EU way or the highway! 

Why is that unfortunate? Should the EU do what little UK demands only to make Brexiters happy?

[Brunolem]

6 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

Why should the EU leaders spend even more time and effort for any idea which the UK will reject? It's a waste of resources.

 

The EU is a waste of resources!

Tens of thousands of unelected bureaucrats living the high life to talk and produce more printed paper than all the newspapers put together!

[Brunolem]

Great Britain should be towed away and connected to the US state of Maine in order to officially become the 51st state, which it has been unofficially for a long time!

[dunroaming]

11 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

The Brits are not grovelling, and we won't let our traitorous leader sell us out, either. Then we'll see who ends up getting stuffed!

The Brits are not grovelling at all.  They are trying to salvage something from the dire mess created when they decided to leave the EU in the way they are doing.  The EU is mightily flawed and we can see on a daily basis dissent rising in the 27 remaining members.  Of course the UK should have remained inside fighting for change that must inevitably come, but instead they voted to leave and this is the fallout.

[OneMoreFarang]

1 minute ago, Brunolem said:

The EU is a waste of resources!

Tens of thousands of unelected bureaucrats living the high life to talk and produce more printed paper than all the newspapers put together!

The EU is far away from perfect but all those bureaucrats do what elected politicians tell them to do.

And it seems the EU did lots of good things because even the Brexiters what to cherry-pick many of those things.

 

The main question is not how good the EU is. The question is if the UK will have a better future within or outside the EU. The facts are on the table. Now it's really difficult to ignore reality.

[OneMoreFarang]

1 minute ago, dunroaming said:

but instead they voted to leave

Many voted for a fantasy which was never realistic.

And many voted leave because the UK politicians told the UK voters all the time the EU is to blame for everything.

In a way I hope the UK crashes out. Because then the UK politicians can't blame the EU anymore for their own incompetence.

[jesimps]

41 minutes ago, the guest said:

The Brits still don't get it, they chose to leave EU and now they are groveling back realizing that without Europe UK is stuffed.

 

Unfortunately it's the EU way or the highway!

The majority of Brits aren't grovelling back, only the remainers. The leave voters want a clean break with the evil empire.

[jesimps]

10 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Many voted for a fantasy which was never realistic.

And many voted leave because the UK politicians told the UK voters all the time the EU is to blame for everything.

In a way I hope the UK crashes out. Because then the UK politicians can't blame the EU anymore for their own incompetence.

We don't crash out. We revert to WTO rules.

[dunroaming]

9 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Many voted for a fantasy which was never realistic.

And many voted leave because the UK politicians told the UK voters all the time the EU is to blame for everything.

In a way I hope the UK crashes out. Because then the UK politicians can't blame the EU anymore for their own incompetence.

I agree with some of that. People didn't vote on a fantasy but they did vote (in good faith) based on the lies they were told.  As for politicians blaming the EU, yes of course they do but they are politicians that are trying to justify the lies they told in the first place.  On the other hand the EU politicians are no better.

[dunroaming]

5 minutes ago, jesimps said:

We don't crash out. We revert to WTO rules.

We would only crash out if there was no deal and there won't be a no-deal.

[Andrew65]

46 minutes ago, Brunolem said:

Great Britain should be towed away and connected to the US state of Maine in order to officially become the 51st state, which it has been unofficially for a long time!

Israel's the 51st state of the US, when Jerusalem says jump, DC says how high?!

 

Britain would be the 52nd state, probably hitched up to Louisiana!????????

[Brunolem]

6 minutes ago, Andrew65 said:

Israel's the 51st state of the US, when Jerusalem says jump, DC says how high?!

 

Britain would be the 52nd state, probably hitched up to Louisiana!????????

A bit of a confusion here: Israel is the Master of the US Blaster (see Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome)...a different kind of relationship...

 

The US has 4 unofficial extra states/vassals, and all together they form the so-called "Five Eyes"...

 

[Nigel Garvie]

1 hour ago, jesimps said:

We don't crash out. We revert to WTO rules.

In a way it would be quite charming to live in a world where things were as simple as this. Revert to WTO rules? ...let's do it before lunch! The reality is that all the internationally respected economic assessment bodies say it would be a financial disaster. Loss of £70 billion a year is an oft repeated figure (Annual pensions cost the government c £90B I believe).   I would hate to disturb anyone's comforting illusions but it just isn't simple. Here is one paragraph from a longer article. "The UK would have to start from scratch in brokering its own trade deals, which require considerable capacity and time, with the potential for significant delays even between signing and implementation. Plus, the UK would be likely to find it harder to make deals when outside a large trade block. While these new deals are being struck, it would be left with just the WTO rules in place." (The longer article comes in a separate post.) Are the Brexiteers incapable of understanding that there are really serious financial implications of any sort of Brexit for us, (The Boomers mostly) let alone the youth to whom we have given a huge kick in the teeth while their tax, subsidies our vastly inflated pensions (Given what we paid for them).

[Nigel Garvie]

A bit of effort required to read this, just try hard to concentrate.

 

http://theconversation.com/no-deal-seven-reasons-why-a-wto-only-brexit-would-be-bad-for-britain-102009

[JAG]

2 hours ago, Andrew65 said:

Israel's the 51st state of the US, when Jerusalem says jump, DC says how high?!

 

Britain would be the 52nd state, probably hitched up to Louisiana!????????

What's more, Brunolem, it's certainly open to debate as to whether that would be preferable to becoming a vassal of the ,"Fourth Reich"...

[Brunolem]

28 minutes ago, JAG said:

What's more, Brunolem, it's certainly open to debate as to whether that would be preferable to becoming a vassal of the ,"Fourth Reich"...

You are quoting Andrew and yet referring to me?

And what has Germany (reich) got to do with this?

[IssanMichael]

6 hours ago, nobodysfriend said:

 

bravo ... !!!

I hope the Brits will need visas to visit Europe , too .

 

And Vise Versa

[IssanMichael]

1 hour ago, Nigel Garvie said:

A bit of effort required to read this, just try hard to concentrate.

 

http://theconversation.com/no-deal-seven-reasons-why-a-wto-only-brexit-would-be-bad-for-britain-102009

 

[IssanMichael]

 

[Nigel Garvie]

9 minutes ago, IssanMichael said:

 

Andrew Neil " You mean we would get rid of our tariffs, even if other countries kept theirs against us."

Professor Minford "Exactly................etc etc

My god this Minford man is a total idiot, no wonder Clegg and to some extent Neil are too gobsmacked to challenge a lot of his absurd assertions, where do you start!

 

BREXITERS keen on leaving the EU with no deal have been told to try walking away without a deal in their personal transactions. 

Tory MPs, Daily Telegraph writers and ordinary Leave voters have agreed to threaten shopkeepers, train conductors and energy providers with walking away deal-free, which they are certain will be brilliant. 

Nathan Muir, from Birmingham, said: “The deal at Starbucks this morning was not in my interests, so I told them they needed me more than I needed them and left. Kept my money. Didn’t get a coffee though. 

“It was much the same story at lunchtime at Subway, and at Pret, and at Greggs. The woman there said to me ‘You’re not our only customer,’ which I felt was rude like the EU but I was too hungry to argue. 

“The bus driver wouldn’t even let me on. Even though I told him ultimately he would be hurting the viability of his bus if I walked away. ‘Go on then, <deleted>#k off,’ he said. 

“So it’s 7pm, I’m still in the city centre, I’m starving, I don’t know how I’m going to get home but I’ve still got some pocket change. If this is some kind of a metaphor then I don’t get it.” 

[nontabury]

1 hour ago, Nigel Garvie said:

In a way it would be quite charming to live in a world where things were as simple as this. Revert to WTO rules? ...let's do it before lunch! The reality is that all the internationally respected economic assessment bodies say it would be a financial disaster. Loss of £70 billion a year is an oft repeated figure (Annual pensions cost the government c £90B I believe).   I would hate to disturb anyone's comforting illusions but it just isn't simple. Here is one paragraph from a longer article. "The UK would have to start from scratch in brokering its own trade deals, which require considerable capacity and time, with the potential for significant delays even between signing and implementation. Plus, the UK would be likely to find it harder to make deals when outside a large trade block. While these new deals are being struck, it would be left with just the WTO rules in place." (The longer article comes in a separate post.) Are the Brexiteers incapable of understanding that there are really serious financial implications of any sort of Brexit for us, (The Boomers mostly) let alone the youth to whom we have given a huge kick in the teeth while their tax, subsidies our vastly inflated pensions (Given what we paid for them).

“All the international respected????economic assessment bodies”

 would these be the same people who failed to see the 2008 economic crash, or the people who predicted the complete crash of the U.K economy, including mass unemployment should we vote to leave the hated R.u.

 

 

[IssanMichael]

14 minutes ago, Nigel Garvie said:

Andrew Neil " You mean we would get rid of our tariffs, even if other countries kept theirs against us."

Professor Minford "Exactly................etc etc

My god this Minford man is a total idiot, no wonder Clegg and to some extent Neil are too gobsmacked to challenge a lot of his absurd assertions, where do you start!

 

BREXITERS keen on leaving the EU with no deal have been told to try walking away without a deal in their personal transactions. 

Tory MPs, Daily Telegraph writers and ordinary Leave voters have agreed to threaten shopkeepers, train conductors and energy providers with walking away deal-free, which they are certain will be brilliant. 

Nathan Muir, from Birmingham, said: “The deal at Starbucks this morning was not in my interests, so I told them they needed me more than I needed them and left. Kept my money. Didn’t get a coffee though. 

“It was much the same story at lunchtime at Subway, and at Pret, and at Greggs. The woman there said to me ‘You’re not our only customer,’ which I felt was rude like the EU but I was too hungry to argue. 

“The bus driver wouldn’t even let me on. Even though I told him ultimately he would be hurting the viability of his bus if I walked away. ‘Go on then, <deleted>#k off,’ he said. 

“So it’s 7pm, I’m still in the city centre, I’m starving, I don’t know how I’m going to get home but I’ve still got some pocket change. If this is some kind of a metaphor then I don’t get it.” 

Think Oxford should sack him then if he is such an idiot.