Rejected at the airport, what is next?

[Gilsh]

Hi,

I have been staying in Thailand on tourist visas for the last 4 years. I did it in the framework of the Thai immigration rules - or at least I think I did. I didn't stay more than 9 months a year and i normally did the 6-month multiple entry visa in my country (9 month with border runs and extensions). The last time i went to the airport they stopped me, asked me questions, said It is not ok to stay for that long on a tourist visa, and eventually expel me basing it on not having 20K bhat on me in cash (I did have a bank statement and credit card). I think they used it as an excuse because I didn't stay more than 9 months. 

I am not on the blacklist - only expelled. do they often mark it on the computer? does this mean I will be questions every time from now on?

 

All my stuff is in Thailand and I want to go back. what is the best option for me?

I don't really want to do elite visa as I am not sure i am going to stay for 5 years.

I DO NOT work in Thailand. 

 

I am thinking to signup to a 12-month English class and get a student visa. will that allow me to stay? or would I be expelled again?

I am also thinking to make a new passport with no visas and to wait until the beginning of next year.

What if I take a flight directly(connection) to Kho Samui? do people get stopped there often?

 

Thank you in advance :)

 

 

 

 

 

[cowbee]

ED visa can help you but i suggest dont go often to any borders. Except for extensions or laos border. They are much more friendly than other borders.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ubonjoe]

A post flaming the OP and a reply to it have been removed.

[OneMoreFarang]

Couldn't you just go to an ATM and get 20,000B?

Or was the no 20k not the only reason they refused entry?

[DrJack54]

Just now, OneMoreFarang said:

Couldn't you just go to an ATM and get 20,000B?

Or was the no 20k not the only reason they refused entry?

Firstly they don't let you go to ATM. Secondly the op after 4 years should know they only accept currency and travelers cheques. As for op suggestion new pp, that will be OK only at land border crossings.

If refused entry I would have imagined pressing concerns is what to do when flown back to country he entered from. Didn't mention it. Also country of his pp. It is relevant.

[ubonjoe]

What was the reason for denial of entry show on the stamp in your passport? If you could post a pic or scan of the stamp we could tell you if there was more than one reason for denial of entry.

Not having the equivalent of 20k baht in cash is a common reason for denial of entry.

Getting a non-ed visa would help for your next entry. Just be sure you have the equivalent of 20k baht in cash when you enter the country.

[edwardandtubs]

5 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Couldn't you just go to an ATM and get 20,000B?

Or was the no 20k not the only reason they refused entry?

If it was that easy, don't you think he would have done it? There are no cash machines before immigration. This has been explained many times on this forum.

[DrJack54]

BTW. OP, why do you keep mentioning you have never stayed more than 9months in any given year. I am not familiar with that "law". I don't expect a response. Hasn't been any so far to any advice.

[edwardandtubs]

4 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

BTW. OP, why do you keep mentioning you have never stayed more than 9months in any given year. I am not familiar with that "law". I don't expect a response. Hasn't been any so far to any advice.

The first response was 29 minutes ago. Do you expect the OP to reply instantly?

[DrJack54]

4 minutes ago, edwardandtubs said:

The first response was 29 minutes ago. Do you expect the OP to reply instantly?

What thread are you reading. The op has posted NOTHING since starting thread. Can you correct me. I would love info to help this poor chap out of bad situation.

[OneMoreFarang]

22 minutes ago, edwardandtubs said:

If it was that easy, don't you think he would have done it? There are no cash machines before immigration. This has been explained many times on this forum.

A simple answer that there are no ATMs before immigration would have been sufficient.

I asked a simple question.

Maybe it was explained many times. But I don't read lots of entries in this forum all the time.

[scorecard]

47 minutes ago, cowbee said:

ED visa can help you but i suggest dont go often to any borders. Except for extensions or laos border. They are much more friendly than other borders.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

"I am thinking to signup to a 12-month English class and get a student visa. will that allow me to stay?"

 

Questions for the experts:

 

1. Can a foreigner who is a native speaker of English sign up for a 12 months English course? Do 12 month courses exist? (Note, just a hypothetical, who knows if the OP is a native speaker of English, however his writing is quite advanced.)  

 

2. Is an ED visa available for folks to study a TEFL / or similar course to gain a qualification to teach English? 

Edited December 1, 2018 by scorecard

[DrJack54]

15 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

"I am thinking to signup to a 12-month English class and get a student visa. will that allow me to stay?"

 

Questions for the experts:

 

1. Can a foreigner who is a native speaker of English sign up for a 12 months English course? Do 12 month courses exist? (Note, just a hypothetical, who knows if the OP is a native speaker of English, however his writing is quite advanced.)  

 

2. Is an ED visa available for folks to study a TEFL / or similar course to gain a qualification to teach English? 

You have a few good questions in your post. In reality the native English speaking requirement is bit of a joke. The OP types correct English. Maybe he is from Scotland or Ireland or even worse a jordy from England and no one farang included understands single word.

I haven't heard of ed visa learning English. There should be one. The op has been los for 4 years. Yeah time to enrol in Queens English course.

[onera1961]

Even multiple entry METVs are under attack.

So, I guess, OP has four METV from his home country and he had only extended his entries to stay 9 months/year. OP may attempt to do a land crossing if his passport allows visa exempt entry. His best course of action will be to go back to his home country, get a new passport, and get another METV to enter Thailand.

Bottom line, for young folks, there is really no best option left for long-term stay in Thailand (OP does not want elite or cannot afford). Those days are coming to an end. Not sure if it is a temporary thing or something that immigration wants to make it permanent. 

I think OP is a remote worker, and if so, he can look into iglu or coffee asia for a B visa with WP. Without an elite, this is the only course left for remote worker. 

Edited December 1, 2018 by onera1961

[jackdd]

Take 20k THB in cash with you and enter at any land border except Poipet and you should not have a problem.

Edited December 1, 2018 by jackdd

[steve187]

no mention about what type of entry he was trying to make, other than 

2 hours ago, Gilsh said:

I have been staying in Thailand on tourist visas for the last 4 years

 

[JackThompson]

 

1 hour ago, jackdd said:

Take 20k THB in cash with you and enter at any land border except Poipet and you should not have a problem.

Yes -  @Gilsh - This is your answer.  The business about getting a new passport in other posts is irrelevant.  Immigration knows your full history, regardless.  You could stay here 350 days/yr, and not be violating any published law or rule regarding Tourist Visa entries.  The only use of a new passport is getting Tourist Visas at nearby consulates for an extended period.  If getting METVs from your home-country, this is not reported to be an issue.

 

The above assumes this was a rejection of an METV-entry.  If you did not have a Tourist Visa and have not made 2 land-border Visa-Exempts this year, you could also enter with that method - at any Land Border except the Poipet/Aranyaprathet crossing.

 

At the airports, they are known to reject-entry for unpublished reasons, such as "time spent in Thailand" - which is not referenced in the relevant laws or published police-orders. 

But, in your case, they got you on a rule which is published - though likely motivated by the other reasons.  Although bank-statement money is needed to obtain Tourist Visas, when entering the country, Cash or Travelers Checks are the only accepted form of showing the cash.

 

3 hours ago, Gilsh said:

I am not on the blacklist - only expelled. do they often mark it on the computer? does this mean I will be questions every time from now on?

You should expect to be questioned on your next entry - which should be made at a friendly land-border.  Explain you did not have the cash, but you do have it now (show cash to the IO at this point), and you should be allowed in.  Be able to explain how you can afford to live here without working, by spending from an overseas income source.

Given the current state of affairs, I would avoid entering by-air - especially to the Bangkok airports - if you intend to stay here more than a couple short trips (1 or 2 weeks) per year as a Tourist. 

 

3 hours ago, Gilsh said:

I am thinking to signup to a 12-month English class and get a student visa. will that allow me to stay? or would I be expelled again?

If English is not your passport-native language, you could do this.  There are other languages available.  It is offered at several language-schools. 

 

Be sure the school you choose will handle your extensions for you, because you only get 3 mo from the first Visa, then must extend with immigration - and many offices have a racket going to get extra-money for these.  If you don't pay, reports indicate you could get shorter-extensions and other hassles. 

 

At the locations where the 'extra fee' extensions are needed, immigration reportedly don't really care if you actually attend the classes (just want the tea-money) - but I would recommend attending and documenting your attendance, so your legitimacy as a student can never be questioned in the future.

 

Also, if you go this route, get your ED Visa at a Thai consulate in Laos, and enter by land, then fly where ever you need to go on a domestic (no immigration) flight.

Edited December 1, 2018 by JackThompson

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

A simple answer that there are no ATMs before immigration would have been sufficient.

I asked a simple question.

Maybe it was explained many times. But I don't read lots of entries in this forum all the time.

I can understand why you would have assumed this, because it is an illogical requirement, given electronic banking.  It is logical that "of course" one could just pull out the cash to show - but, if immigration at the Bangkok airports let folks go to the ATM, they couldn't use not having it as an excuse to deny-entry, put them in detention, and force them on a return-flight - which is all this rule is "for" (in this day and age).

 

Because it is a written-rule, though, anyone entering on a Tourist Visa or Visa-Exempt should be sure to have the required cash.  So far, only one report of an airline (Thai Airways), in flights out of Laos, warning passengers to get it before getting on the plane.  All airlines should be doing this.  And, there should be warning-signs placed pre-exit of all land-border countries when/if the Thai border-post on the other side will be enforcing the rule (so far, only reported coming in from Malaysia).

[elviajero]

2 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Couldn't you just go to an ATM and get 20,000B?

Or was the no 20k not the only reason they refused entry?

They would probably been denied even if they had 20K. They were denied because they spent too much time in the country as a tourist.

[OneMoreFarang]

12 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

I can understand why you would have assumed this, because it is an illogical requirement, given electronic banking.  It is logical that "of course" one could just pull out the cash to show - but, if immigration at the Bangkok airports let folks go to the ATM, they couldn't use not having it as an excuse to deny-entry, put them in detention, and force them on a return-flight - which is all this rule is "for" (in this day and age).

 

Because it is a written-rule, though, anyone entering on a Tourist Visa or Visa-Exempt should be sure to have the required cash.  So far, only one report of an airline (Thai Airways), in flights out of Laos, warning passengers to get it before getting on the plane.  All airlines should be doing this.  And, there should be warning-signs placed pre-exit of all land-border countries when/if the Thai border-post on the other side will be enforcing the rule (so far, only reported coming in from Malaysia).

Interesting. That sounds like you think immigration officers basically want to deny entry to some people and just have to find a reason why they can do this, correct?

Do you know why this happens or do you have maybe an unconfirmed idea?

I know traffic police officers have some quota of how many tickets they have to write. So they write those tickets any way they can do it. But I can't imagine that the immigration officers have some quote to deny entry to people.

They should know that they upset people and they should know that people talk about this.

And it seems they also don't do it to collect bribes (at least I didn't see it mentioned).

So what is their motivation? Just to show that they are powerful and can do it?

[OneMoreFarang]

5 minutes ago, elviajero said:

They would probably been denied even if they had 20K. They were denied because they spent too much time in the country as a tourist.

What is "too much time"?

If it would be illegal to spent over x days as a tourist then they could deny entry for that reason.

But that's not what they did.

[JackThompson]

59 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Interesting. That sounds like you think immigration officers basically want to deny entry to some people and just have to find a reason why they can do this, correct?

Do you know why this happens or do you have maybe an unconfirmed idea? 

We have many reports of IOs at the Bangkok airports stating there are limits on "how many days" one can be in the country as a tourist.  The reports indicate the IOs look up the history of their prey, then make up a rule that fits that person's particular history - because the time-frame and day-count has varied from one report to the next.

 

Then, they deny entry and cover their tracks for denying for non-legal reasons by stamping something in their victim's passport which has nothing to do with a day-count, or any questions they asked of the person.  Example: a stamp for not having the money to afford their stay (valid, published reason), without asking anything about the persons income-source or amount - sometimes without even asking about the 20K Baht.

 

In this case, they caught the guy on a published-reason - the 20K Baht necessary to show in cash or travelers checks upon entry.  But BritTim is correct - they might have just denied him anyway, even if he had the cash.  Still, better to have it than not.  In fact, better to have a lot of cash - or avoid the risk all together, by entering at land-borders where we have no reports of this problem.

 

Quote

I know traffic police officers have some quota of how many tickets they have to write. So they write those tickets any way they can do it. But I can't imagine that the immigration officers have some quote to deny entry to people.

We don't know if they do / if those paying them to do this have set a quota.

 

Quote

They should know that they upset people and they should know that people talk about this.

We can only guess as to whose money is paying for this policy - but it would be naive to think money is not changing hands to make this happen, since there is no logical reason to prevent people entering to spend foreign-sourced funds (as the OP may have tried to prove with a bank-book). 

 

And, yes, wrecking Thailand's reputation.  I was warned about arbitrary immigration policy years ago - before it got worse - by people who had moved elsewhere because of it.

 

Quote

And it seems they also don't do it to collect bribes (at least I didn't see it mentioned).

So what is their motivation? Just to show that they are powerful and can do it?

Not bribes from those whose entry is rejected, anyway.  As to Guesses:

They make 800 Baht / night for the detention-cells, so the "quota" could be keeping them near-full.  The agent-visa sellers would benefit from this, given Western snowbirds staying 6-mo/yr are now being targeted.  The Chinese want Western people out of "their" zone of influence, and a briefcase of cash could do wonders.  A fraction of under-50s could be forced to elite-visas. 

 

It's likely some combination of those, with Xenophobia / race-issues used as the emotional justification.  Notice this is absent at most checkpoints, staffed by folks who are on the "outside" of Thai society?  There's a clue.  Poipet/Aranya is the outlier, in terms of location, but it was put under new supervision, after letting a bomber in - probably from the same hard-liner clique running the airports. 

Edited December 1, 2018 by JackThompson

[Gilsh]

Wow guys im so greatful for all your answers. sorry, I didn't respond.  I am new to this forum and didn't realize how amazingly quick things happen around here. I will now respond to all. 

[DrJack54]

16 minutes ago, Gilsh said:

Wow guys im so greatful for all your answers. sorry, I didn't respond.  I am new to this forum and didn't realize how amazingly quick things happen around here. I will now respond to all. 

Yes, we realize. Regarding members trying to assist...where are you now? After rejected entry to Thailand what happened? 

What country were you returned to?

What happened next?

What nationality is your passport?

Etc etc. 

You mention "respond to all"

So far you have responded to zero.

[elviajero]

51 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

What is "too much time"?

Whatever the IO decides.

 

51 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

If it would be illegal to spent over x days as a tourist then they could deny entry for that reason.

There doesn’t have to be a specific law. The OP has — by their own admission — stayed most of the last 4 years as a ‘tourist’. That is the underlying reason for denial even though another qualifying reason was given.

[Gilsh]

So from what I understand:

1. there is no benefit from making an ED visa. I should just continue doing METV

2. I should not take a direct flight to Samui (which doesn't go through the immigration in Bangkok). instead, it is better to get a flight to Laos(still have a connection in bangkok) and from there travel by land

3. I should have more than 20k bhat in cash with me (can it be in USD?)

4. I should be able to prove that i have income from abroad and do not need to work in Thailand

 

can you please comment on each point if it is correct?

 

I couldn't find any stamps on my visa.. does this mean it is still valid? If so, can i make a new one while it is still valid? I attached both the visa and the paper they made me sigh

 

 

 

 

 

[Gilsh]

14 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Yes, we realize. Regarding members trying to assist...where are you now? After rejected entry to Thailand what happened? 

What country were you returned to?

What happened next?

What nationality is your passport?

Etc etc. 

You mention "respond to all"

So far you have responded to zero.

I was flying from Vietnam and they said I have to go back there with the same company the next day and spend the night in detention. fortunately, the Israeli consul helped me and convinced them to let me fly back to Israel on the same day. now I'm in Israel 

[Gilsh]

11 minutes ago, elviajero said:

Whatever the IO decides.

 

There doesn’t have to be a specific law. The OP has — by their own admission — stayed most of the last 4 years as a ‘tourist’. That is the underlying reason for denial even though another qualifying reason was given.

Do you think that if now I change to ed visa it will make a difference? 

[Gilsh]

ok, found this in my passport. I think it is related, anyone knows what it means?

[DrJack54]

7 minutes ago, Gilsh said:

I was flying from Vietnam and they said I have to go back there with the same company the next day and spend the night in detention. fortunately, the Israeli consul helped me and convinced them to let me fly back to Israel on the same day. now I'm in Israel 

First of all I wish to apologize to you and TV generally. I 100% thought this op was a wind up. You are very lucky you were not returned to Vietnam, only to maybe refused entry there (as per recent thread on TV from other member)

You have lot of advice already from members "ways to get around things". Fact is you haven't really come clean as to why your in Thailand 75% over last 4 years. If I was an io you would be sent back. Lucky for you got to avoid returning to Vietnam. Can you give us a tip how you managed that. Mainly because I have never heard of that concession