CONFIRMED: Here is exactly what’s needed for retirement & marriage extensions (income method) from 2019

[steve73]

40 minutes ago, DrTuner said:

Is that as in 65k back to outside Thailand? Remitting in that direction needs extra arrangements with a bank, one of the multitude of reasons I never transfer any more $ here than I immediately need.

Try "Dee money". 

https://www.dee.money/

Edited January 7, 2019 by steve73

[onera1961]

2 minutes ago, steve73 said:

Try "Dee money".  I'll add a link later.

Just type DeeMoney in Google. Go to Bangkok and open an account there with only your passport. After that you can use their mobile app to send money out of Thailand. There is an excellent report written by @Pib. Search for it in the forum

Edited January 7, 2019 by onera1961

[sometimewoodworker]

2 hours ago, damascase said:

 

2 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Read the translation, embassy letters are included.

I know they are included and that is why the quoted text is incorrect/misleading......

 

Which quoted text in the translation "Procedures" page 2 item 3

page 3 "Procedures" item 3

[pussycatdoll]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

That is still shown in the other police order 327/2557.

"(5) Must have an annual earning and funds deposited with a bank totaling no less than Baht 800,0000 as of the filing date."

Not mentioned the police order that has been amended since you still have to prove the income for it.

So Ubonjoe.....in your opinion as someone whose views I trust on here.

do you think that 500,000 in Kasikorn bank plus say 30,000 Baht into said account every month  from UK is going to be acceptable?

 

[touch]

@ubonjoe @webfact A link to the Thai original would be much appreciated

[sometimewoodworker]

2 hours ago, skatewash said:

Sometimes you have to explain things to people in a way they will understand rather than the way you think they should understand something. 

Sometimes you give the information and there is no requirement to explain it.

 

Certainly here there is no obligation to explain, it just a good will to try to help.

 

if you are unhappy with that then you can get back all the money you have paid to ThaiVisa,

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, wgdanson said:

Meaning that I can have 400k in the bank and show just 32.5k a month into a bank please?

Yes you can. But the 32.5k is not enough to reach the total of 800k baht. You would need about 10k more in the bank.

[elviajero]

20 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

what's the definition of "retired"? when you apply for the visa or extension? someone applying say Apr for the first time what do they have to prove?

 

They don’t provide a definition of ‘retired’. But they simply mean ‘not working’.

 

Anyone granted a family based or retirement extension to live in the country isn’t expected to be working — unless they are employed in Thailand. Therefore, any income is expected to be passive income from pension/investments act.

[bangsaenguy]

I am sure this has been asked and answered. Will SSA deposit to a foreign bank? If not, does one set up a monthly transfer to a Thai bank from a US bank?

[MikeOKitches]

7 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

So start worrying about it as if it will cure your anxiety. Don't worry about something you're not in control. You can keep sending 65K/month and go in March and see what happens. With the embassy letter, they may also reject if you come up blank in your bank book. 

For the past 7 Retirement Visa renewals, Thai Immigration has accepted my US Embassy notarized Income Affidavits without a problem. I never needed to show them my bank book. When I got my document on 30 November 2018, the US Embassy officer stated to me that the Income Affidavit he notarized for me is valid for 6 months (expires on or about 31 May 2019) and I wouldn't have any issues using it getting my visa renewal in late March 2019. It would be the same as before.  I've learned not to trust Uncle Sam about anything, and I put Thai Immigration in the same boat.  My consternation stems from my inability to find clear language in these Thai Immigration "directives" on this specific issue. Will a valid notarized US Embassy Income Affidavit be accepted by Thai Immigration in 2019 if it hasn't expired yet? I guess I'll have to contact a Thai Immigration lawyer on this matter to get a concrete answer. Hopefully, they will know the answer or someone in Thai Immigration who does. 

[scubascuba3]

They don’t provide a definition of ‘retired’. But they simply mean ‘not working’.
 
Anyone granted a family based or retirement extension to live in the country isn’t expected to be working — unless they are employed in Thailand. Therefore, any income is expected to be passive income from pension/investments act.

But for new extensions, it sounds like they will accept 1 month "income" ? which can also include a cash transfer i.e. taken from a UK bank account. When they refer to "income" i assume they mean money

[steve73]

20 minutes ago, steve73 said:

Try "Dee money". 

https://www.dee.money/

I just checked the latest rates...

If I send 1000GBP to THB using Transferwise @40.78569 then I'd get 40501.82 bt (after fees).

If I send back using Dee, there's a 150bt fee, and a GBP rate of 41.25, so I'd get 978.22 GBP back.

Total cost 22.78GBP (or just 2.3%)

Obviously the rate could change between receiving the THB and sending it back, so this overall cost is indicative only.

 

Currencies other than GBP entail different fees with both TW & DM, so you should check your own particular needs.

 

[Sheryl]

I note that the phrase "average monthly income" is used for marriage but not for retirement. Is this intentional, i.e. is an average of 40K acceptable for marriage extension even if some months were less than 40K but for retirement each month must be 65k or more? Or was this just a translation glitch?

 

Can anyone confirm based on the Thai language original?

 

 

[xylophone]

51 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

But people will be transferring cash as well, prior income or capital proceeds

 

No problem IMO as they want to see funds coming into the country for one to qualify, no matter what it is.

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, bdenner said:

Been using Baht Smart for some time now for my AUD transfers. My KBank statements shows these funds coming from a variety of sources. eg.

DUMMY BRANCH

Chang Mia Branch

Head Office

Etc

Nothing actually showing an international transfer.

 

So what now???

You almost certainly have to start using an AU to Thai bank transfer 

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, ocddave said:

It would be nice if they handed you an official check list of items needed

Live in the Udon Thani area and they do, though there is the "we can ask for more" at the end.

Edited January 7, 2019 by sometimewoodworker

[ubonjoe]

1 minute ago, Sheryl said:

I note that the phrase "average monthly income" is used for marriage but not for retirement.

It is the same as stated in the police order for both extensions. A average is allowed for marriage but not retirement.

[scubascuba3]

I just checked the latest rates...
If I send 1000GBP to THB using Transferwise @40.78569 then I'd get 40501.82 bt (after fees).
If I send back using Dee, there's a 150bt fee, and a GBP rate of 41.25, so I'd get 978.22 GBP back.
Total cost 22.78GBP (or just 2.3%)
Obviously the rate could change between receiving the THB and sending it back, so this overall cost is indicative only.
 
Currencies other than GBP entail different fees with both TW & DM, so you should check your own particular needs.
 

Only by using Bangkok Bank it seems

[Sheryl]

3 hours ago, offset said:

...The other worry is that most people under 60 years old do not have a pension to show for the monthly income 

It is clear from this that monthly deposits from overseas are considered a "proof of pension" (even though obviously it is not).

 

You do not have to show anything regarding the source of the money other than that it came from abroad to a Thai bank every month.

[pussycatdoll]

24 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Yes you can. But the 32.5k is not enough to reach the total of 800k baht. You would need about 10k more in the bank.

Ok that is my question answered.

I called into my kasikorn branch today, having already checked the Mastercard rate for the day, it being 40.72 baht to GBP.

I asked about transfering larger amounts from my UK bank than I am a able to take from ATM,s which, clearly are not coming from overseas into a Thai bank, this has been my preferred method using a no fee UK credit card.

They told me a bank transfer, not Swift, of a ball park figure of 1000 pounds would convert to 40.32 baht plus a 200 baht fee.

I believe my Uk sending bank is free, but will check again...

Seems like combo using this method is going to be my best bet. with my 500,000 already here.

 

Edited January 7, 2019 by pussycatdoll
addition

[scubascuba3]

Ok that is my question answered. I called into my kasikorn branch today, having already checked the Mastercard rate for the day, it being 40.72 baht to GBP.

I asked about transfering larger amounts from my UK bank than I am a able to take from ATM,s which, clearly are not coming from overseas into a Thai bank, this has been my preferred method using a no fee UK credit card.

They told me a bank transfer, not Swift, of a ball park figure of 1000 pounds would convert to 40.32 baht plus a 200 baht fee.

I believe my Uk sending bank is free, but will check again...

Seems like combo using this method is going to be my best bet.

 

 

Mastercard rate is not known until the following day. What UK bank gives you free transfers? Santander would charge me £25. I'm going to check whether a Starling bank transfer (similar to transferwise) is shown as an intl payment at Kasikorn

 

 

[ubon farang]

3 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

It is a directive that only changes the option for using ia income of 65k baht or 40k baht.

Everything else in the existing police order has not been changed.

jo i am off to savanna ket next week to get a non 0 visa multiple entry visa based on marriage has that changed in savanna ket

[Sheryl]

48 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

what's the definition of "retired"? when you apply for the visa or extension? someone applying say Apr for the first time what do they have to prove?

 

Actually there has never been a requirement that you be fully retired, only that you cannot work in Thailand. For many years I was semi-retired and still did periodic work outside of Thailand, while on an extension of stay for reason of retirement. As long as you are over 50 years old and not working in Thailand, and meet the financial requirement, they do not care.

[Pib]

12 minutes ago, bangsaenguy said:

I am sure this has been asked and answered. Will SSA deposit to a foreign bank? If not, does one set up a monthly transfer to a Thai bank from a US bank?

Yes, SSA will direct deposit to a foreign bank in many countries.  For Thailand they currently deposit to only Bangkok Bank if using the ACH (Automated Clearing House) method.  No other Thai banks support ACH format. 

 

If using the ACH method come 1 Apr 19 the SSA deposit must be in ACH "IAT" format which means International ACH Transaction format versus the PPD format used for transfers to banks in the U.S.   You will need to have your Thailand address on-file with SSA....you are saying you live in Thailand....in order to get them to change it to IAT format.  

 

Due to this IAT policy change effective 1 Apr 19 and some problems associated with it, sometime in the first quarter of 2019 SSA will implement International Direct Deposit (IDD) to supplement ACH.  ACH and IDD are two different programs. 

 

With IDD you must have a Thailand address on-file with SSA.  They have not announced yet which Thai banks will be involved in the IDD program, but I expect it will be more than just Bangkok Bank.   A possible downside to the IDD for Thailand is it must be deposited to a Foreign Currency Deposit account only; not a regular savings/checking account.

 

If not wanting to Direct Deposit to a Thai bank you will need to do pricy International Wire (SWIFT) transfers from your US bank to any Thai bank.   You can still do low cost "ACH" transfer to Bangkok Bank if you already have an ACH ibanking transfer link setup with your US bank.  However, after 1 Apr 19 you will not be able to do ACH transfers as no US bank or credit union uses ACH "IAT" format....they only use ACH "PPD" format which is for transfers within the U.S....funds do not leave the US like is currently happening when routing thru the Bangkok Bank New York branch----Bangkok Bank is closing that door 1 Apr 19 unless the ACH transfer is in IAT format the transfer will be rejected back to your US bank, SSA, or anywhere it comes from.

 

 

 

  

[pussycatdoll]

15 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

20 minutes ago, pussycatdoll said:

Ok that is my question answered.
I called into my kasikorn branch today, having already checked the Mastercard rate for the day, it being 40.72 baht to GBP.
I asked about transfering larger amounts from my UK bank than I am a able to take from ATM,s which, clearly are not coming from overseas into a Thai bank, this has been my preferred method using a no fee UK credit card.
They told me a bank transfer, not Swift, of a ball park figure of 1000 pounds would convert to 40.32 baht plus a 200 baht fee.
I believe my Uk sending bank is free, but will check again...
Seems like combo using this method is going to be my best bet.
 

Mastercard rate is not known until the following day. What UK bank gives you free transfers? Santander would charge me £25. I'm going to check whether a Starling bank transfer (similar to transferwise) is shown as a intl payment

Ok The current mastercard rate live online isn't going to be far away, I would have thought, especially as Kasikorn may vary slightly too. I was just trying to highlight the difference between the two.

I use First Direct, I did not see a rate quoted for overseas transfer, I will check thouroughly later.

Updated with what I just found from First Direct Q&A.

Outgoing international transfer (online)⁴

To any bank account - £0

 

Edited January 7, 2019 by pussycatdoll
update

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, DrTuner said:

Is that as in 65k back to outside Thailand? Remitting in that direction needs extra arrangements with a bank, one of the multitude of reasons I never transfer any more $ here than I immediately need.

65k in and then straight out again, all of it, would surely raise questions.

 

In my mind as well (what do you live on?)

 

But a portion of it out each month with various draw downs on the rest should be fine.

 

You can transfer I think up to 15K USD via Dee Money.

[mojaco]

22 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

I note that the phrase "average monthly income" is used for marriage but not for retirement. Is this intentional, i.e. is an average of 40K acceptable for marriage extension even if some months were less than 40K but for retirement each month must be 65k or more? Or was this just a translation glitch?

 

Can anyone confirm based on the Thai language original?
 

The translation to English provided to us is exactly what the original Thai document says.  It uses "average" for marriage and does not say "average" for retirement.  Who knows if Immigration did this deliberately or just weren't too careful in their wording in both instances.

 

[racyrick]

HELP!! I only have a Wells Fargo account in the US. Online will NOT allow me to do a wire transfer or a transfer to another bank account unless it's in my name. I can ONLY transfer money using ZELLE.

Therefore, I can't use TransferWise, Dee money etc.

Right now, I know my only option is to have my SS deposited to a Bangkok Bank account, which is currently not the case.

Also, possibly the IDD into Thailand when it begins.

Does anybody have any other options for me to use? I am now scared to death!

Also, how do I change the deposit of my SS from my current bank to Bangkok Bank in the US?

Can it be done online, can I call the US SSA office or can I just call the Manila SSA office?

Thanks so much for your help!!

 

[wgdanson]

14 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Mastercard rate is not known until the following day. What UK bank gives you free transfers? Santander would charge me £25. I'm going to check whether a Starling bank transfer (similar to transferwise) is shown as an intl payment at Kasikorn

 

 

 First Direct does free transfers either GBP to THB or GBP to my Foreign Currency Account at Bkk Bank. And Bkk Bank shows it as FTT, foreign transfer.

[Moonlover]

Ok this all makes sense to me and it's just as I expected. I've got one query though.

 

Does anyone understand what they mean by 'an affidavit of status'? It's mentioned toward the bottom of para 5.

 

I can understand the sensible precaution of preparing a 'power of attorney' in case of infirmity of the applicant for whatever reason. Do you think that this is what they mean?