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Brexit bedlam - May's EU divorce deal crushed by 230 votes in parliament


webfact

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Guys,

another porpit (piece of rambling put in text)

 

I watched very closely the Westminster Zoo debating and concluding on

the may-deal

and

the non conf in government

 

I am glad I did, I found it very very interesting.

Probably I am looking out for different signals than the average Brit (due to my prev jobs and not being Brit).

 

At any rate as we say in Yorkshire;

 

What I think I observed and learned from these debates;

 

I found the debates fairly shallow. Most interventions were on a cheap political slogan level.

Profound interventions few and far between.

MPs mostly making cheap points, maybe for their constituency or maybe for their pals in their local.

 

But I think I noted that they were very keen to speak, they loved it, the flowed over with lust to speak.

Politicians often do but this was kinda different.

The MPs spoke out of starvation, pretty much the first time since the referendum and the passing of

the A50 bill they had ample opportunity to exchange views on Brexit.

 

Brexit is no ordinary matter for parliament nor government.

 

Just thinking, if the champion of non cooperation had arranged for quarterly reports to parliament

inviting debates

would the situation today be different?

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

I read that Corbyn rejects to participate in May's Plan-B talks

unless he is given a guarantee that no-deal Brexit will not happen.

 

Can understand that he is careful, think this is more than just silly tactics,

he probably wants to ensure not being held to ransom re whatever comes out of the talks.

 

But nobody is really in a position to give such guarantee at this stage,

as far as I understand it;

the only way to ensure that no-deal is not happening is to revoke A50 or

to go back and accept May's deal.

In either case Plan-B talks are of no use.

 

 

 

What Corbyn wants is the chaos of a no deal Brexit, with the economic impact being blamed on the Tories, he can then sweep in and turn the UK into Venezuela. He has no desire to engage with May, he simply wants chaos. He’s conning his momentum followers into thinking that he’ll go for a second referendum (which they overwhelmingly desire) but he will never give them that option, he’s keener on a hard Brexit than the ERG.

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6 hours ago, Grouse said:

78% of Labour members want another referendum. 

 

Only fools want a no deal Brexit and they will be ignored by most MPs and encouraged by a few right wing bastards who see a way to make money out of them.

This is the really annoying thing about Corbyn. The majority of Labour MPs are remainers, the majority of their constituents are remainers, yet he abjectly refuses to join the remain camp.

 

It must be very frustrating for a Labour MP, sitting there watching Corbyn flushing your majority down the toilet.

 

Although the majority of MPs are remainers, they have no voice. Brexiteers leading both sides of the house.

 

Who is our voice in parliament? We, arguably the majority of voters, remainers? Vince Cable?

 

So much for British democracy!

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16 minutes ago, Spidey said:

This is the really annoying thing about Corbyn. The majority of Labour MPs are remainers, the majority of their constituents are remainers, yet he abjectly refuses to join the remain camp.

 

It must be very frustrating for a Labour MP, sitting there watching Corbyn flushing your majority down the toilet.

 

Although the majority of MPs are remainers, they have no voice. Brexiteers leading both sides of the house.

 

Who is our voice in parliament? We, arguably the majority of voters, remainers? Vince Cable?

 

So much for British democracy!

you get the sods you vote for

kinda like Trump, USAers get the sod they vote for

 

try to think before you cast your vote

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6 hours ago, evadgib said:

What transport delays?

 

More spin and half truths from Leave.EU!

 

Port of Dover 'prepared' for Brexit but appeals for government help

Quote

The Port of Dover says it is "prepared" for Brexit but still needs the government's help to keep the UK's most important port running smoothly.

Sky News has seen a joint statement it is due to release on Wednesday, along with the two main ferry companies that use Dover as the base for cross-Channel services - P&O and DFDS.

It is aimed at promoting contingency plans they have made, but also to push the government into offering more support to the industries that rely on moving goods between the UK and Europe.  ……..

Various models have predicted that delays on either side of the Channel could lead to huge queues of lorries trying to get into the port.

The port is expected to accept that "external factors such as border controls may slow things down", but will say that such delays will happen at "every EU-facing gateway" across the UK

 

One of the measures taken to reduce delays will be Operation Brock, the successor to Operation Stack

Operation Stack.jpg

 

Moral; check facts before accepting the word of a pressure group, especially one which still faces criminal charges over electoral offences during the referendum campaign.

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8 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

Moral; check facts before accepting the word of a pressure group, especially one which still faces criminal charges over electoral offences during the referendum campaign.

Your default position is to assume I have done so.

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4 minutes ago, evadgib said:

Your default position is to assume I have done so.

No, my default position is to assume that you have not checked any facts at all; as amply evidenced by the lack of them in many of your posts.

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1 hour ago, evadgib said:

Just when I thought we'd seen everything from the opposite camp....

 

That website is in appalling bad taste; but it is the work of a British expat living in Germany; nothing to do with Polly Toynbee.

 

She did write an article in today's Guardian, On Saturday the UK turns remain. Parliament must force a second referendum in which she includes the UK's changing demographic as one of the reasons for decreasing support for Leave and a corresponding increasing support for Remain; but to say she is 'rejoicing in the deaths of old people to further her cause' is typical Hartley-Brewer hyperbole.

 

Somewhat hypocritical of Hartley-Brewer as well, seeing as less than 6 months ago she used the deaths of the 29 victims of the Omagh bombing to score a minor political point! 

 

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22 minutes ago, nontabury said:

Can I suggest that that you watch this video. Kate Hoey a Labour M.P will give you her take, on where the money came from to support remain.

 

 

For those of you, who do not live in the U.K 

This rally.one of many, shows what those supporting the 17.4 million people who Democratically voted to leave this so called union,think of the shenanigans that is now taking place in the mother of all parliaments.

another clown blowing hot air about how great the uk WAS hundreds of years ago,he makes a big point about northern ireland ???????? the majority there voted remain,no shock that the next clown up was the founder of spoonies,his boozers are full of lazy benefit scrounging alcoholics with red noses from 0900am to 1700 everyday,the kind of people who won the vote for leave

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14 hours ago, luckyluke said:

I am Belgian/European.

 

Since a while I remark, here and on other fora, the hostility ( if not hate ) of some Brexiters towards the European Union leaders.

 

It won't take long ( if not already there ) this will revert to Europe, and by extension the Europeans.

 

This agressif feeling is not there in Europe ( for the moment );

at least not really noticeable.

 

However if something will altered ( due to Brexit ) the wellness of the Europeans,  I am afraid that, some/a lot,  will show also some kind of aversion towards The United Kingdom and his citizens ( not only the Leavers ).

 

Scary.

Belgium is not really a country (per Farage) and that's why you live in Thailand ????

There are some Dutch rumblings that Brussels has benefited greatly from the "European Union".

The EU also suits Belgium in that a zit, sits alongside a great power such as the UK and to an extent France/Holland and the olde powers such as Spain/Portugal.

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1 hour ago, nontabury said:

Can I suggest that that you watch this video. Kate Hoey a Labour M.P will give you her take, on where the money came from to support remain.

 

 

For those of you, who do not live in the U.K 

This rally.one of many, shows what those supporting the 17.4 million people who Democratically voted to leave this so called union,think of the shenanigans that is now taking place in the mother of all parliaments.

the rally has a couple of successful business men to shout for cause,its a shame 85-95% of business people in the UK think different to these few individual already wealthy men who have nothing to gain,then low and behold the scouse witch then spends an age telling the listeners how great the UK has been in the last 10 years,well if its not broken why try to fix it.What exactly do these people want? The leave vote won on the back of the immigration issue,yet this isnt mentioned once,52% of the UKs trade is with the EU yet mr forte says 94% of businesses dont trade with the EU,probably because those figures will include every self employed trader from ice an cream-man in jonn o groates to a taxi driver in penzance,sounds good for brain washing purpose's though,the true facts are 52 of britains trade IS with the EU,Rolls royce,nissan,airbus,jal,honda,ford,toyota are the companies that matter,not Mr Whippy

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49 minutes ago, bomber said:

the rally has a couple of successful business men to shout for cause,its a shame 85-95% of business people in the UK think different to these few individual already wealthy men who have nothing to gain,then low and behold the scouse witch then spends an age telling the listeners how great the UK has been in the last 10 years,well if its not broken why try to fix it.What exactly do these people want? The leave vote won on the back of the immigration issue,yet this isnt mentioned once,52% of the UKs trade is with the EU yet mr forte says 94% of businesses dont trade with the EU,probably because those figures will include every self employed trader from ice an cream-man in jonn o groates to a taxi driver in penzance,sounds good for brain washing purpose's though,the true facts are 52 of britains trade IS with the EU,Rolls royce,nissan,airbus,jal,honda,ford,toyota are the companies that matter,not Mr Whippy

Trade with the E.U and immigration are two separate issues though .

 

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1 hour ago, mshs said:

Belgium is not really a country

Don't understand what Belgium has to do with the content of my post. 

Forget the first sentence of my post as it is not really relevant. 

On the other side it is always interessant to read an opinion even if it is totally out of the subject. 

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1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

Latest news:-

 

"Soft Brexit cabinet ministers are quietly backing a parliamentary bid to make it legally impossible for the UK to leave the EU without a deal on 29 March, the Conservative MP behind the bid has claimed.

 

Cabinet ministers have remained publicly mute on the subject. However, speaking on a conference call with business leaders alongside the business secretary, Greg Clark, and the Brexit secretary, Stephen Barclay, the chancellor, Philip Hammond, admitted that the government was “not in control” of the process and suggested Boles’ amendment could lead to article 50 being “rescinded”, according to a transcript obtained by the Daily Telegraph."

Advertisement

"Boles said the transcript of the call “made quite plain that [Hammond] thought this was fantastic”."

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jan/17/nick-boles-tory-mp-plans-bill-make-no-deal-brexit-legally-impossible

 

Sorry about the advert in the middle - it's too early in the a.m. for me to figure out how to get rid of it!

The problem with a plan like this is that it needs the EU27 to act on it as well (unless article 50 is revoked before the 29th of March).

Always nice to see the UK busy negotiating with itself and forgetting about the EU27.

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10 hours ago, 7by7 said:

That website is in appalling bad taste; but it is the work of a British expat living in Germany; nothing to do with Polly Toynbee.

 

She did write an article in today's Guardian, On Saturday the UK turns remain. Parliament must force a second referendum in which she includes the UK's changing demographic as one of the reasons for decreasing support for Leave and a corresponding increasing support for Remain; but to say she is 'rejoicing in the deaths of old people to further her cause' is typical Hartley-Brewer hyperbole.

 

Somewhat hypocritical of Hartley-Brewer as well, seeing as less than 6 months ago she used the deaths of the 29 victims of the Omagh bombing to score a minor political point! 

 

FYI: Toynbee copped it from Piers Morgan among others for this too.

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6 hours ago, evadgib said:

Despite knowing that region extremely well I am in fact in THAILAND but nonetheless am pretty good at this IT lark and am as sure as can reasonably be expected that the ports are as ready as they claim to be and that the Y2k-esque chaos hoped for by your side will be minimal. Easter, Bank holidays & bad weather will still see well rehearsed stacks on the M20/M2 which will be ruthlessly exploited by the 'we told you so's but the reality is that they're there several times per year every year as explained.

HTH

brexit has cost you probably £8000-10000 plus and counting as opposed to £1500 plus for most,and you wont get to do any truck spotting on the M20,you might get to see some fellow brits sky diving though 

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