Death of 17-year-old British tourist: Patong bike rental shop fined Bt2000

[StevieAus]

1 hour ago, geriatrickid said:

In this case, the deceased can not be held liable because he was a minor and not legally allowed to enter into a rental contract. 

This then brings us to the  more important issue; The sanction. The agency  didn't just rent to an unlicensed individual, it rented to a minor. In the developed world, there would be manslaughter charges filed.

 

Perhaps, the deceased's elderly 'friend' might have rented the  motorbike on his behalf. However, as that man is not charged, it seems that the   rental agency really did rent to the  minor. Overall, another disgusting display of greed.

 

 

 

 

 

Elsewhere they might be able to fine him under other legislation but manslaughter I very much doubt.

[steve73]

Some example I personally know of...

A few years ago my girlfriend (Thai) fell off her motorcycle (which was correctly taxed with basic por-or-bor insurance), no helmet, no license, and was unconscious for a while.  Taken to a local private hospital and kept in for a couple of nights observation.  Thai insurance covered it fully (as it was less than 15k bt).

A friends daughter and her friend (both Thai, no helmets, underage so no license, etc) were both badly mangled by a car when they illegally crossed in front of it on a motorcycle.  Car insurance paid fully for their injuries.

 

But I would very much doubt that a foreign "holiday" insurance would cover an unlicensed tourist (although the motorcycles own por-or-bor may up to it's low limit).

 

My son, aged 19, visited T/L recently, having just just passed his UK motorcycle test (for upto 125cc - or maybe a HP equivalent), and was very restricted in which travel insurances would give him M/c cover, although as he found here, most places he rented from didn't even want to see his license - just his PP.

 

 

[bender92]

Fine his parents.

[Enoon]

9 minutes ago, StevieAus said:

 

But no I dont want a nanny state here let individuals accept responsibility for their own actions tourists or others.

 

USA sounds like the place for you.

 

Florida quite nice I believe.

 

Because your dream place is certainly, 100%, not here.

 

 

[stevenl]

27 minutes ago, Joe Mcseismic said:

Yes, you usually do when you are pushed to provide evidence.

Sigh

[KenKadz]

Superfluous investigation!

Why did the kid loose control?

Was alcohol involved?

Was the bike mechanically sound?

Apologies, this is logic, not Thainess!

[I am More Thai Than You]

It's a fun ride that one over Kamala hill. Scary as though late at night or in the rain.

[I am More Thai Than You]

1 hour ago, steve73 said:

But I would very much doubt that a foreign "holiday" insurance would cover an unlicensed tourist (although the motorcycles own por-or-bor may up to it's low limit).

If you read most of the fine prints only those who are covered must have a license valid for the country they are in. Meaning a bike license in your country is irrelevant unless you hold a Thai bike license.

[steve73]

10 minutes ago, I am More Thai Than You said:

If you read most of the fine prints only those who are covered must have a license valid for the country they are in. Meaning a bike license in your country is irrelevant unless you hold a Thai bike license.

A UK motorcycle license IS valid in Thailand, provided it is supported by an IDP, but only for the same class of motorcycle for which it was issued in the UK.  My son was VERY careful to ensure that he WAS adequately covered.

 

edit... UK license with IDP is only valid for upto 3 (or maybe 6) months - beyond that you're expected to get Thai license.

Edited February 11, 2019 by steve73

[stevenl]

15 minutes ago, steve73 said:

A UK motorcycle license IS valid in Thailand, provided it is supported by an IDP, but only for the same class of motorcycle for which it was issued in the UK.  My son was VERY careful to ensure that he WAS adequately covered.

 

edit... UK license with IDP is only valid for upto 3 (or maybe 6) months - beyond that you're expected to get Thai license.

To ride any motorbike in Thailand a full motorbike license is required. So a provision like 'up to 125 cc' means no valid Thai license and driving without license.

 

IDP is not legally required, although recommended since the BiB will often require it.

[steve73]

2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

To ride any motorbike in Thailand a full motorbike license is required. So a provision like 'up to 125 cc' means no valid Thai license and driving without license.

 

IDP is not legally required, although recommended since the BiB will often require it.

Hummmm.. 'tis an interesting point you make...but a tourist doesn't need a valid Thai license.. he need a valid UK license (for the class of motorcycle he's using).

 

Question... would a "limited" UK M/C license be suitable for issuing a Thai M/C license WITHOUT the need for the full driving test.?

 

I have a full unlimited UK M/C license from way back when it was just the one class, which I used to obtain a Thai M/C license with just the basic eyesight & reaction tests.   

 

[stevenl]

5 minutes ago, steve73 said:

Hummmm.. 'tis an interesting point you make...but a tourist doesn't need a valid Thai license.. he need a valid UK license (for the class of motorcycle he's using).

 

Question... would a "limited" UK M/C license be suitable for issuing a Thai M/C license WITHOUT the need for the full driving test.?

 

I have a full unlimited UK M/C license from way back when it was just the one class, which I used to obtain a Thai M/C license with just the basic eyesight & reaction tests.   

 

"Hummmm.. 'tis an interesting point you make...but a tourist doesn't need a valid Thai license.. he need a valid UK license (for the class of motorcycle he's using)."

No, for motorbikes he needs a valid UK motorbike license without limitations, so not 'for the class of motorcycle he's using'.

 

"Question... would a "limited" UK M/C license be suitable for issuing a Thai M/C license WITHOUT the need for the full driving test.?"

Officially no, could it still be issued, yes but not very likely.

 

"I have a full unlimited UK M/C license from way back when it was just the one class, which I used to obtain a Thai M/C license with just the basic eyesight & reaction tests.  "

Yes, unlimited license, so Thai license can be obtained on that basis since the Thai license is always unlimited. If somebody without license passes the test with a 125 Click they can ride away on a 1500 Harley.

Edited February 11, 2019 by stevenl

[MickeyR]

Unfortunately there has been a number of accidents that has resulted in death on that stretch of road. To blame for the accident was the young man, for hiring a bike without proper documents yes the Thai bike shop. 

[fouryesrs]

9 hours ago, scorecard said:

Both.

well is your local drivers license valid in thailand ? if u have a local license for car is it valid for bikes in thailand ? even if you have a bike license in ur country and did not extend it to an international license ( done by the car association valid one year ) it is not valid in thailand...!!!

well the question number one in los do u have money ?? everything else we worry once we scratch ur remains out of the gutter...enjoy ur holidays. .

[shy coconut]

7 hours ago, Lingba said:

that's right... 2000 baht should teach them

It "may" make them more vigilant in checking licenses.

 

[joecoolfrog]

9 hours ago, observer90210 said:

Who is to blame ? The rogue unscruplous vehicle rental crooks of Thailand or the stupid, mindless tourists, who loose all common sense when in Thailand ?

Both !

The difference being that one paid the ultimate price, the other got off practically scott free. Money really does seem to be the be all and end all in Thailand , how they think they are serving Buddha is beyond me.

[HAKAPALITA]

With or without hed still be dead.


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[gerritkaew]

But why the rental shop to blame?  who was driving the bike must be riding to fast at a road he did not know.

He is to blame, not the shop.

[Lokie]

8 minutes ago, gerritkaew said:

But why the rental shop to blame?  who was driving the bike must be riding to fast at a road he did not know.

He is to blame, not the shop.

Because they allowed their vehicle to be hired Illegally.

 

And the explanation in the full report that the Hire Co hired to an older man who presented valid licences for both bikes is BS. Is very unlikely that a 17 year old lad from UK would have a full bike licence to ride any bike (they just do not take tests in UK at that age for bikes as they can ride on L-Plates until 18 then normally go for a car test or full bike after that age) 

 

Blame actually lies with the thai authorities for allowing these types of operations to carry on in this country but - Money No1... 

 

 

[Lacessit]

9 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

If you read the linked story, the victums mate, a licensed rider, rented the bike.

I wonder how the mate feels now.

[stevenl]

32 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I wonder how the mate feels now.

The mate could easily be the other rider involved in the accident.

[NamKangMan]

59 minutes ago, Lokie said:

Because they allowed their vehicle to be hired Illegally.

 

And the explanation in the full report that the Hire Co hired to an older man who presented valid licences for both bikes is BS. Is very unlikely that a 17 year old lad from UK would have a full bike licence to ride any bike (they just do not take tests in UK at that age for bikes as they can ride on L-Plates until 18 then normally go for a car test or full bike after that age) 

 

Blame actually lies with the thai authorities for allowing these types of operations to carry on in this country but - Money No1... 

 

 

 

"Blame actually lies with the thai authorities" for not having any other affordable way to get around Phuket, without riding a motorbike. 

 

Sadly, just another road fatality statistic here, due to the lack of proper public transport.  

 

It's a disgrace. 

[Patriot1066]

11 hours ago, scorecard said:

Both.

Sad story for his family and friends, but true. If you take risks you must be prepared for that risk to go the way you didn’t expect.

 

Not just here though quiet easy to rent in most Asian South American and African countries with just your credit card.

 

I wonder if they have taken their damages from his credit card?

[wvavin]

Everyday there are people dying so after repair is business as usual, Who care as long as you are in Land!

[pi2005ni]

11 hours ago, leeneeds said:

 

Your insurance may be declared null and void if you:

• Ride a motorcycle without a licence that is valid. 
• Drive a car without a licence that is valid.
• Are a passenger in (or on) a vehicle that is being driven by an unlicenced person.
• Are under the influence of intoxicating liquor or drugs.
• Operate a rental vehicle in violation of the rental agreement.
• In any circumstance, admit that you are at fault, or offer to pay any money.

 

Onus is squarely on the hirer, how the insurance or third party is paid out on the hire motorcycle and damage to the mini van is an ethical question that requires greater control and policing, 

No licence sorry,  no can hire ! ( dream )

It’s the same for the many idiots in Thailand looking for these cheap taxi deals , has anybody even thought to check their insurance. They are private vehicles with ordinary insurance, which should you be involved in a accident and injured . YOU ARE NOT INSURED .

[NamKangMan]

7 minutes ago, pi2005ni said:

It’s the same for the many idiots in Thailand looking for these cheap taxi deals , has anybody even thought to check their insurance. They are private vehicles with ordinary insurance, which should you be involved in a accident and injured . YOU ARE NOT INSURED .

 

I have often wondered about the legalities of these "private taxis."  

 

How would a passenger know if the driver is licensed, and the car insured, and road worthy. 

 

If he's "private transport" it's as good as getting in the car with a "friend."  There is no Government framework of "official" control for this mode of transport, so who knows what a travel insurace company might do, in the event you are involved in a serious accident.

 

I suppose it's the same with Uber and Grab, but at least they "vet" their drivers and vehicles to some degree.

 

On Phuket, pay your "fees" to the "taxi association" and that's it, you are good to start operating.   

 

[balo]

18 hours ago, colinneil said:

Fining the rental company 2000 baht just shows how cheap life is here.

What do you want them to do ?

A stupid boy killed himself, why should they pay for the mess? 

 

[balo]

8 hours ago, Lokie said:

Because they allowed their vehicle to be hired Illegally.

Wrong !  It was hired legally by his older mate with a valid license!!!  This case got nothing to do with the rental company. 

 

It was stupidity from the boy and his older friend.  

 

 

[emptypockets]

16 hours ago, puukao said:

i blame the kid.  and maybe his parents.  17 should not be unsupervised with a motorbike in the LOS.  too young.  parents should set the bar at 25.  parents should have researched how dangerous it is here.....really, it's really easy to find how many die on the roads.  but, oh no, it won't happen to me....let my kid have some fun in LOS and experience life.  no, bad.  

 

if you had a kid and they said, 'parents, i'm 17...gonna rent a motorbike in LOS... ok?  we cool?'   no, we are not kool.  lol

 

it's a dangerous behavior, and all parents know 17 is very, very, very young.    maybe i sound bad, but i actually want this to stop.  

Only got to post 44 so far so this may have been mentioned later on.

Who in their right mind would allow a 17 year old kid to fly half way around the world to Thailand essentially by by themselves or in the company of possibly older but still quite young other people? Maybe I'm old fashioned but my kids would never have been permitted to do such a thing. Plus they wouldn't have been able to afford it as they were still in school and had small paying part time jobs.

Edited February 11, 2019 by emptypockets
Autospell sucks

[emptypockets]

13 hours ago, hottrader77 said:

the tourists life was worth 2,000 baht , life is cheap in thailand 

Absolute nonsense.