Pattaya Versus DaNang and the winner is?

[KittenKong]

12 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

800,000 baht left untouched for 5 months.  400,000 baht of it left untouched for 12 months.

 

Bank letters.

 

TM30's, even for living in your own house.

 

90 day reports.

 

Re Entry permits.

 

Hand drawn maps of where you live.

 

If on marriage visa, photos of you and your wife in the bedroom. 

 

10 photocopies of of everything.

 

Certified translated copies.

 

Visits from immigration officers.

 

And the list of bureaucratic red tape and paperwork continues, with insurance sure to be the next "fee" to pay and certificate needed.

 

The other countries, pay a flat fee and get your visa, or extension.  Nothing else to do.  You don't even need a local bank account. 

 

I know which one I am more comfortable with.  ????

You clearly live on another planet.

 

For my retirement extension I provide one letter from the bank, a handful of photocopies, a couple of photos, a completed form, 1900B and under one hour of my time. That's it.

 

The money on deposit earns me tax-free interest at a higher rate than I could get in my home country.

 

No maps required. No home visits. No translations.

 

Re-entry permit is optional and is available at the airport if required. No paperwork needed.

 

No TM30 needed in Jomtien for me as a condo owner.

 

10 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

You are not the only Thai expat that to think that just because another system is so cheap and easy, there must be something wrong with it, or it's not reliable. 

No, it's unreliable because it currently isn't available and because it has only been available erratically for a few years.

 

My Thai retirement extension has been permanently available for decades and the requirements have been largely unchanged for all that time. That is what "reliable" means.

[KhunHeineken]

1 hour ago, KittenKong said:

You clearly live on another planet.

 

For my retirement extension I provide one letter from the bank, a handful of photocopies, a couple of photos, a completed form, 1900B and under one hour of my time. That's it.

 

The money on deposit earns me tax-free interest at a higher rate than I could get in my home country.

 

No maps required. No home visits. No translations.

 

Re-entry permit is optional and is available at the airport if required. No paperwork needed.

 

No TM30 needed in Jomtien for me as a condo owner.

 

No, it's unreliable because it currently isn't available and because it has only been available erratically for a few years.

 

My Thai retirement extension has been permanently available for decades and the requirements have been largely unchanged for all that time. That is what "reliable" means.

You conveniently leave out the the financial requirements, and whilst 800,000 baht is not huge money, it is still money that has to be lodged into a Thai bank, that could be, or more to the point, should be, earning more than just a going towards a visa stamp for Thailand. 

 

The 400,000 baht that must be left in a Thai bank, perpetually, is nothing short of scam of expats. 

 

As for all the other things in your post, they do not exist in Vietnam's visa system.  Like I have said, easy and cheap does not necessarily mean unreliable. 

 

As for remaining largely unchanged, the financials have changed recently, with insure requirements imminent.  I also expect the 800,000 to go to 1 million and the 65,000 to be raised as well, but this is just my speculation. 

 

Vietnam's 3 month tourist visas that can be extended 3 times for a total of 12 months has been unchanged for years. 

[KittenKong]

2 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

You conveniently leave out the the financial requirements, and whilst 800,000 baht is not huge money, it is still money that has to be lodged into a Thai bank, that could be, or more to the point, should be, earning more than just a going towards a visa stamp for Thailand.

The 400,000 baht that must be left in a Thai bank, perpetually, is nothing short of scam of expats.

As for remaining largely unchanged, the financials have changed recently, with insure requirements imminent.  I also expect the 800,000 to go to 1 million and the 65,000 to be raised as well, but this is just my speculation. 

I didnt leave out the deposit requirement at all: it just isnt an issue for me. I have had my 800k on deposit here for nearly 10 years. I dont touch it. I dont need it. It earns me interest which is paid tax-free. If it wasn't on deposit here it would be on deposit somewhere else.

So the requirements here for me have not changed one jot since I started doing retirement extensions. The insurance requirement will apparently not affect those on retirement extensions, so I see no changes on the horizon for me.

 

I appreciate that some people might find the financial requirements difficult to satisfy and they do have the option of getting an agent to do the whole thing for about 13-15,000B. Not a recommendation but a possibility for those who need it.

 

So as I pointed out, for me the Thai retirement extension is quick, easy, simple and of reasonable duration (12 months). If Vietnam wants me and my retirement money it needs to introduce something similar or better. If it does I will look seriously at it. The idea of back-to-back tourist visas, or obligatory exits, simply does not interest me anywhere in the world. My money, my choice.

[KhunHeineken]

1 hour ago, KittenKong said:

I didnt leave out the deposit requirement at all: it just isnt an issue for me. I have had my 800k on deposit here for nearly 10 years. I dont touch it. I dont need it. It earns me interest which is paid tax-free. If it wasn't on deposit here it would be on deposit somewhere else.

So the requirements here for me have not changed one jot since I started doing retirement extensions. The insurance requirement will apparently not affect those on retirement extensions, so I see no changes on the horizon for me.

 

I appreciate that some people might find the financial requirements difficult to satisfy and they do have the option of getting an agent to do the whole thing for about 13-15,000B. Not a recommendation but a possibility for those who need it.

 

So as I pointed out, for me the Thai retirement extension is quick, easy, simple and of reasonable duration (12 months). If Vietnam wants me and my retirement money it needs to introduce something similar or better. If it does I will look seriously at it. The idea of back-to-back tourist visas, or obligatory exits, simply does not interest me anywhere in the world. My money, my choice.

Are we comparing Thailand's visa system to Vietnam's visa system, or your own personal circumstances, and visa preferences?

 

If we were to compare the individual visa circumstances of every member of TV, we would be here forever.

 

When simply compared, Vietnam's visa system is easier, cheaper, and in my opinion, just as reliable, but yes, there is currently one border run every 12 months, unless on a temporary residence card, which is easier to get than any residency in Thailand, which could be an option for many expats.

 

As for health insurance, it's only a matter of time before it's a requirement for a retirement visa and extension, and before you say "it's only 40,000 baht" once again, I am not talking about your personal circumstances, financial, or otherwise, but the difference in financials, costs and paperwork between the two countries, for a comparative visa.

 

Where this comparison is on topic is, for many, it simply may be easier and cheaper to live in Danang for 12 months, by way of visa requirements, than to live anywhere in Thailand. 

 

Put simply, an individual may prefer Pattaya to Danang, or believe Pattaya has better infrastructure etc, but if they can't meet Thailand's requirements, than Danang wins the comparison this thread is making, due to visa requirements, rather than what Danang has to offer over Pattaya, or vice versa.

Edited June 2, 2019 by KhunHeineken

[Destiny1990]

@KittenKong

Your comments on easier Visas in Pattaya than in Danang are getting pathetic.

Its actually one of the main reasons besides better temperatures and being an even more affordable place for some expats to relocate.

 

[KittenKong]

4 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

Are we comparing Thailand's visa system to Vietnam's visa system, or your own personal circumstances, and visa preferences?

I can only comment on how it applies to me. Turn the question around and you will see that you are only commenting about it in the way that it applies to you.

 

Surely this is obvious?

[Sandy Freckle]

On 4/28/2019 at 7:49 AM, Destiny1990 said:

..I am done over and out.

mate..., a chance would be a fine thing 

[brokenbone]

On 6/2/2019 at 1:52 PM, KhunHeineken said:

Are we comparing Thailand's visa system to Vietnam's visa system, or your own personal circumstances, and visa preferences?

 

If we were to compare the individual visa circumstances of every member of TV, we would be here forever.

 

When simply compared, Vietnam's visa system is easier, cheaper, and in my opinion, just as reliable, but yes, there is currently one border run every 12 months, unless on a temporary residence card, which is easier to get than any residency in Thailand, which could be an option for many expats.

 

As for health insurance, it's only a matter of time before it's a requirement for a retirement visa and extension, and before you say "it's only 40,000 baht" once again, I am not talking about your personal circumstances, financial, or otherwise, but the difference in financials, costs and paperwork between the two countries, for a comparative visa.

 

Where this comparison is on topic is, for many, it simply may be easier and cheaper to live in Danang for 12 months, by way of visa requirements, than to live anywhere in Thailand. 

 

Put simply, an individual may prefer Pattaya to Danang, or believe Pattaya has better infrastructure etc, but if they can't meet Thailand's requirements, than Danang wins the comparison this thread is making, due to visa requirements, rather than what Danang has to offer over Pattaya, or vice versa.

is there any organized visa runs in vietnam ?

how long do they take and how long do i have to walk and stand during that visa run ?

also how long has it been possible to extend within vietnam for up to 12 month ?

[KhunHeineken]

On 6/2/2019 at 8:58 PM, KittenKong said:

I can only comment on how it applies to me. Turn the question around and you will see that you are only commenting about it in the way that it applies to you.

 

Surely this is obvious?

No, I am not commenting on how it applies to me.  I am commenting on how it applies to everyone. 

 

I am commenting on the difference between Vietnam's and Thailand's visa systems. 

 

If one was to find Thailand's visa system costly and bureaucratic, when compared to Vietnam's visa system, than Danang "wins" by default, as visas are nation wide, in both countries, for foreigners.  

[KhunHeineken]

On 6/4/2019 at 8:10 AM, brokenbone said:

is there any organized visa runs in vietnam ?

how long do they take and how long do i have to walk and stand during that visa run ?

also how long has it been possible to extend within vietnam for up to 12 month ?

You need to stop thinking about Thailand's visa system.  Vietnam is a lot easier. 

 

You can make your own visa run.  Fly out and fly back, or, drive, or get a private driver, or get a bus, or ride etc to a land boarder, and come straight back in.

 

You have been able to extend a 3 month multi entry tourist visa, 3 times, inside Vietnam, for a long time.  Think of entering Thailand on a 2 month tourist visa, and being allowed to extend it 6 times, before you have to do a visa run, that's what Vietnam offers, but with a 3 month visa, extended 3 times. 

 

Where the difference is, there is no BS from immigration about how you must be working illegally, and which boarders are "friendly" and how many stamps or visas you have in your passport, if you can speak some Thai or not, and all of that grief that Thailand gives people. 

 

Vietnam's visa system is easy and cheap.

 

[gk10002000]

The winner is Jupiter Florida.  Clean beach water everywhere.  Plenty of international dining.  A great place to retire.  Now for holiday, still prefer Pattaya over DaNang.  The Thai government, being not duly elected nor representing the people by any western definition, is not a favorite of many people, but the Viet Government is even less duly elected

[uzynkotak]

How expensive is jupiter, FL, compared to Pattaya?

[KittenKong]

12 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

No, I am not commenting on how it applies to me.  I am commenting on how it applies to everyone. 

No, you aren't. I have already pointed out that your perceived problems with the Thai system do not apply to me, so clearly they dont apply to everyone and so you are indeed commenting about how they apply to you. This is entirely normal of course.

[KittenKong]

5 hours ago, gk10002000 said:

The winner is Jupiter Florida.  Clean beach water everywhere.  Plenty of international dining.  A great place to retire.

I've never been to Jupiter Florida but I have travelled extensively in some other parts of the US. All other things being equal I would move there like a shot and without a second thought. But the US puts significant obstacles in my way as far as retirement visas are concerned, and as far as income tax is concerned, and as far as the cost of health care is concerned, and as far as costs go generally (with a few exceptions). So unfortunately I wont be doing that.

[KC 71]

The winner is Jupiter Florida.  Clean beach water everywhere.  Plenty of international dining.  A great place to retire.  Now for holiday, still prefer Pattaya over DaNang.  The Thai government, being not duly elected nor representing the people by any western definition, is not a favorite of many people, but the Viet Government is even less duly elected

Gods waiting room !
Joking aside, i visitedFlorida 1990( 1st and only time in the U.S)
We hired an RV - i learnt to water ski( lake Hamilton)happy days [emoji106]


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[KhunHeineken]

On 6/11/2019 at 10:27 AM, KittenKong said:

No, you aren't. I have already pointed out that your perceived problems with the Thai system do not apply to me, so clearly they dont apply to everyone and so you are indeed commenting about how they apply to you. This is entirely normal of course.

Well, there must be some "perceived problems" for many.  Just check out the Visa Forum.  It's been running hot for months.

 

Luckily, I do not have such problems, but merely point out the difference between the bureaucracy and financial requirements for a 12 month Thai visa  / extension, versus a similar visa in Vietnam.

 

To put it into context for you, there are thousands of expats living in Vietnam, who don't need to even think about an 800k baht equivalent, and the equivalent of 400k baht perpetually, and all other associated TM's and re-entry permits BS etc.

 

They just pay a flat fee, and receive their visa.  It doesn't get any easier than that, for anyone, and whilst you say the associated paperwork doesn't both you, just next door, in Vietnam, they have NO paperwork and NO financials to comply with. 

 

I'm sure Vietnam expats are less bothered than you are, for their annual sticker.  ????

 

 

 

 

Edited June 12, 2019 by KhunHeineken

[Destiny1990]

2 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Well, there must be some "perceived problems" for many.  Just check out the Visa Forum.  It's been running hot for months.

 

Luckily, I do not have such problems, but merely point out that the bureaucracy and financial requirements for a 12 month Thai visa extension, versus a similar visa in Vietnam.

 

To put it into context for you, there are thousands of expats living in Vietnam, who don't need to eavem think about an 800k baht equivalent, and the equivalent of 400k baht perpetually, and all other associated TM's and re-entry permits etc.

 

They just pay a flat fee, and receive their visa.  It doesn't get any easier than that, for anyone.

 

 

 

 

Hopefully your clear post will finally silence Kittenkong and Marcelucus. ????.

[KhunHeineken]

On 6/13/2019 at 1:42 AM, Destiny1990 said:

Hopefully your clear post will finally silence Kittenkong and Marcelucus. ????.

I can understand people saying the 800k / 400k is not a problem for them, after all, it's not a life changing amount of money.  The same with all the red tape Thailand requires.  If you are used to it, it's not a big problem.

 

However, we are comparing requirements, not the impact of such requirements upon ourselves, and therefore, for ease of gaining a comparable visa, Vietnam is a lot easier, less paperwork, and cheaper, which could make Danang a better option than Pattaya, by default, due to Thailand's unfriendly visa requirements. 

[Destiny1990]

1 hour ago, KhunHeineken said:

I can understand people saying the 800k / 400k is not a problem for them, after all, it's not a life changing amount of money.  The same with all the red tape Thailand requires.  If you are used to it, it's not a big problem.

 

However, we are comparing requirements, not the impact of such requirements upon ourselves, and therefore, for ease of gaining a comparable visa, Vietnam is a lot easier, less paperwork, and cheaper, which could make Danang a better option than Pattaya, by default, due to Thailand's unfriendly visa requirements. 

Yes correct kittenkong is just very foolish to say Visas easier in Thailand. you know all these rules are okey to submit for 1 year but sooner or later we come (or at least i did) to a point of being fed up with always more new complicated visa rules.

Its easier to relocate to nearby elsewhere and only go to Thailand for nice holidays.

So what do you think about Dah lat? Its in mountain with lakes and cooler climate ryte? but seems to me not much condominiums there? Have you visited there?

But its highly likely that the cooler climate in DaNang is already fine for me in comparison with Pattaya.

Edited June 16, 2019 by Destiny1990

[marcusarelus]

2 minutes ago, Destiny1990 said:

Yes correct kittenkong is just very foolish to say Visas easier in Thailand. you know all these rules are okey to submit for 1 year but sooner or later we come (or at least i did) to a point of being fed up with always more new complicated visa rules.

Its easier to relocate to nearby elsewhere and only go to Thailand for nice holidays.

So what do you think about Dah lat? Its in mountain with lakes and cooler climate ryte? but seems to me not much condominiums there? Have you visited there?

In 20 years I have had one visa rule change and if I had never had heard about it on Thai Visa I would have never known because I've left my 800,000 in the bank for 20 years.  I take out the interest every year.  I put $16k in 20 years ago and it has earned interest every year.  If I had to do it now It would cost me $25 grand.  It's the truth sorry if it upsets people. 

[Carolina Reaper]

On 6/2/2019 at 8:40 AM, KittenKong said:

Anyone who leaves the country often may not even need to do the 90-day reporting at all (I travel so I generally only do it once or twice a year).

But then such person's landlord, the homeowner, or the person himself (e.g., if condo owner) must file a TM30.

[KhunHeineken]

20 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

In 20 years I have had one visa rule change and if I had never had heard about it on Thai Visa I would have never known because I've left my 800,000 in the bank for 20 years.  I take out the interest every year.  I put $16k in 20 years ago and it has earned interest every year.  If I had to do it now It would cost me $25 grand.  It's the truth sorry if it upsets people. 

Once again, your post focuses on the impact of the visa rules upon yourself, not a comparison between the two country's visa laws. 

 

In Vietnam, you don't need ANY money in a Vietnamese bank, at all.  You don't even need a Vietnamese bank account. 

 

So, what you did 20 years ago, doesn't even need to be done in Vietnam, in the present. 

 

This would make a Vietnam visa even easier than what Thailand had 20 years ago. 

[KhunHeineken]

20 hours ago, Destiny1990 said:

Yes correct kittenkong is just very foolish to say Visas easier in Thailand. you know all these rules are okey to submit for 1 year but sooner or later we come (or at least i did) to a point of being fed up with always more new complicated visa rules.

Its easier to relocate to nearby elsewhere and only go to Thailand for nice holidays.

So what do you think about Dah lat? Its in mountain with lakes and cooler climate ryte? but seems to me not much condominiums there? Have you visited there?

But its highly likely that the cooler climate in DaNang is already fine for me in comparison with Pattaya.

I prefer the beach to the countryside.  I have been to Dalat. It's a nice place, and definitely cooler, due to altitude.  It's very popular with domestic tourists, as well as foreign tourists.

 

I would not be surprised if many current, and future retirees, make Vietnam their base, and holiday very frequently to Thailand. 

 

They would have the benefit of keeping, and being able to use, their 800k / 400k, as well as a much lower cost of living, but without a reduction in living standards, as well as a lot less paperwork for their visa.  

 

The flights are cheap and short, and if Thai immigration want to get nasty, no big problem, you are just returned to Vietnam.

 

I can see this being an attractive option for many in the future.

 

[Destiny1990]

12 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

How is your post relevant to a comparison between Thailand's visa laws, and Vietnam's visa laws, for the purpose of ease of living in either Pattaya, or Danang?

 

Your post suggests a financial benefit to those who deposited 800k some years ago, but, since most just leave the 800k in the bank, and now 400k of it can't be used if you want next year's extension, that's not a great advertisement for Thailand for new retirees, who will have to deposit significantly more for a retirement visa.

 

You can spin your posts any which way, but paying an approximate $400USD flat fee for a visa, with no other requirements to meet, will always be easier than what Thailand is offering, regardless of currency fluctuations.    

That guy never contributed anything relevant..

Come chat Vietnam here in this new thread with us 

Da Nang, Vietnam - quality of life observations please?

By DonDoRondo,  Wednesday at 08:12 AM in Southeast Asia Forum

[KittenKong]

On 6/17/2019 at 5:04 PM, Carolina Reaper said:

But then such person's landlord, the homeowner, or the person himself (e.g., if condo owner) must file a TM30.

I own my condo. I have been told many times by immigration in Jomtien that I dont need to file a TM30 if I am returning to my own condo.

[KittenKong]

2 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

You can spin your posts any which way, but paying an approximate $400USD flat fee for a visa, with no other requirements to meet, will always be easier than what Thailand is offering, regardless of currency fluctuations.

USD400 is far more than I pay to stay in Thailand. Let me know when the yearly cost of staying in Vietnam gets down to the 1900B that I have to pay to stay here for a year.

[Sujo]

On 6/2/2019 at 9:21 AM, KhunHeineken said:

Correct.  So why do you feel so secure because your visa simply says "retirement?" 

 

Also, it's not so much about being kicked out, than about the goal posts being changed.  The health insurance requirement being the next change I think we will see, but also possibly an increase to the amount on deposit or the monthly income amount. 

Well its not really correct.

 

I was born in the UK but immigrated to Australia at age 3. I am an australian citizen. But if I commit a crime and sent to jail I can, and quite likely would be deported to UK.

 

There have been a few Australian citizens sent packing the last couple of years.

[Sujo]

37 minutes ago, KittenKong said:

USD400 is far more than I pay to stay in Thailand. Let me know when the yearly cost of staying in Vietnam gets down to the 1900B that I have to pay to stay here for a year.

So now you change your preference to Thailand because its cheaper for your visa.? Yet you have no concern about having to place money in a bank in Thailand.

 

This is about comparing the differences of how difficult or easy it is to get and keep a visa. Not how you personally are affected or not.

 

 

[KittenKong]

31 minutes ago, Sujo said:

So now you change your preference to Thailand because its cheaper for your visa.? Yet you have no concern about having to place money in a bank in Thailand.

? Ease and cheapness of obtaining a visa/extension is just one of the reasons I stay in Thailand. This has long been the case and I have not changed my preference.

 

32 minutes ago, Sujo said:

This is about comparing the differences of how difficult or easy it is to get and keep a visa. Not how you personally are affected or not.

The differences are entirely personal for everyone concerned. This is what some posters in this topic fail to understand. I am only commenting on how it affects me personally, just like everyone else. Those with few resources or who dont qualify for Thai retirement extensions may find Vietnam visas easier, but I am not one of them. For me the Vietnam visa would cost more. It might also be inconvenient for me to have to extend or renew my visa every 3 months. My Thai one only needs doing once a year and it takes me just one hour. This suits me.

 

[KhunHeineken]

On 6/23/2019 at 2:00 AM, KittenKong said:

USD400 is far more than I pay to stay in Thailand. Let me know when the yearly cost of staying in Vietnam gets down to the 1900B that I have to pay to stay here for a year.

It's been debated on many threads on TV, so I will not start another debate on it, but, with 800,000 baht in a Thai bank, paying next to nothing in interest, just to qualify for an extension, it's costing you a lot more than 1900 baht, and a lot more than $400USD.

 

Your 800,000 baht could easily be earning at least 6%.  Not to mention, the 400,000 baht you can no longer use, even if you wanted to, otherwise you don't get next year's extension.

 

I'm sure if we took a poll of who would prefer a flat $400USD per year for a 1 year multi entry Thai visa, versus the current 800,000 / 400,000 method, with TM30's, re entry permits, 90 reports, and all the other rubbish, I'm pretty sure most would prefer to pay the $400USD, one a year, with no other hoops to jump through.