Chinese continue to soak up Thailand’s condo glut

[losworld]

2 hours ago, Bert Jones said:

It's dead money...the condo prices will rise very very slowly. You can't beat the flexibility of renting...and at some point, buyers will try and flip.

yeah but the chinese don't trust their currency and their govt and many are simply laundering money... some think there is an endless supply of airbnb renters too... we shall see...

[ICELANDMAN]

26 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

This seems true from my experience. I have rented "The Base" units in Bangkok and Udon Thani, plus a mid level unit in Hua Hin, all via AirBNB. All were new buildings (less than 4 years old), and all were already showing signs of wear and tear, plus poor construction standards. Cracks in the walls, peeling paint, evidence of mold/damp rot, and worst of all were the doors! Can't Thais install good solid doors with hinges and proper pistons that don't slam shut?  And that aren't made of cardboard?

Yes of course, but not for building constructors go rich quickly

[losworld]

25 minutes ago, madmen said:

Wrong. The gap between new and used is not sustainable. Thais can no longer afford new condos in their preferred areas so the only option is to buy used so not equity rocket science

https://property.bangkokpost.com/news/1615950/resale-condo-market-growing

But thais and chinese don't like to buy used because of face and financing... i think you are wishful thinking...

[smedly]

7 minutes ago, utalkin2me said:

I do not see what is so scary about a Chinese buyer. Most likely a unit would be rented out to a Thai on a long term lease. Or, you have an empty unit next to you 90% of the year. The downsides are much less of a %, unless you are a Pattaya dweller or sumthin, that i am sure does not have to be pleasant (and yet it is probably what 95% of the opinions in these parts are made up by).

 

I gotta say, read some stuff around these parts and there is a whole lot to do about nothing. 

I know both owners and renters of several new buildings around pattaya and the story is the same

 

The renters are moving out and the owners wish they hadn't bought  - reason, Chinese short term renting on mass, it seems they are very hard to live with for multiple reasons.

[madmen]

12 minutes ago, smedly said:

I know both owners and renters of several new buildings around pattaya and the story is the same

 

The renters are moving out and the owners wish they hadn't bought  - reason, Chinese short term renting on mass, it seems they are very hard to live with for multiple reasons.

Extremely unlikely in New buildings with new juristic who have taken over AFTER the 1 month minimal Air Bnb rental terms were cemented in place. 

You must know a hell of a lot of landlords and renters (500+) to make a blanket statement like that and for it to be true across Pattaya or anywhere else

 

Im sure you meant much older buildings with non functioning Juristic and tenants that are there only for the 4k rent and couldn't give a rats about their neighbors.

 

 

[zydeco]

1 hour ago, utalkin2me said:

I gotta say, read some stuff around these parts and there is a whole lot to do about nothing. 

555

[zydeco]

So many would-be real estate moguls on this forum. Now I know why Trump is so popular on TVF.

[smedly]

1 hour ago, madmen said:

Extremely unlikely in New buildings with new juristic who have taken over AFTER the 1 month minimal Air Bnb rental terms were cemented in place. 

You must know a hell of a lot of landlords and renters (500+) to make a blanket statement like that and for it to be true across Pattaya or anywhere else

 

Im sure you meant much older buildings with non functioning Juristic and tenants that are there only for the 4k rent and couldn't give a rats about their neighbors.

 

 

new buildings - the Base being an example, there was a thread on the pattaya forum not so long ago

 

As for knowing a lot of Landlords/renters - even if I knew only one owner from one of these buildings they in turn know many owners in the same building who have meetings and are all saying the same thing and all have the same complaints - that is upward of 100 people in just one site

 

so go ahead - tell me I'm talking out my ass

[Pravda]

2 hours ago, madmen said:

Doesn't matter. Only thing that matters is the explosion in real estate pricing in BKK. 

 

 

 

Like I said. only with certain projects, not with the massive glut of ghetto condos aimed at Thai middle class. Dude, I have been on Lumpini site for the past 5 years and they are still trying to sell their inventory since I moved here. And I say Lumpini for a reason as they are one of the better ghetto builders at least when it comes to maintenance. Other buildings are literally falling apart after 10 years. 

 

It would actually help if you were a little objective as I do think that real estate in the major cities is always a good investment.... but not so if buildings are in complete disarray after a certain amount of time has passed. 

 

And they will be falling apart even faster because of AirBnB.

 

 

[soi3eddie]

2 hours ago, losworld said:

But thais and chinese don't like to buy used because of face and financing... i think you are wishful thinking...

My Bangkok condo was on sale in 2017 for 4 months during my divorce. During that time there were interested buyers. Both were rejected for finance by banks so nould not proceed. Many new projects are financed by banks who then offer more lenient funding to buyers. I think that if buyers don't have credit worthiness to buy new units then they definitely will not qualify for resale purchases and are almost certainly not going to be cash buyers.

 

How many on here have resold condos and how well did you do with pricing and ease of sale? 

 

In the end I purchased ex's share of my condo at a very reduced price. 

[Rod the Sod]

5 hours ago, zydeco said:

Just think, Chinese living above you, below you, and beside you. And you are stuck there because you own it.

....watching the price go up and up and up, or renting to another Chinaman counting the rent as it goes up and up and up. Never mind, you keep paying your rent. You will be fine...

[BuckBee]

I have a friend ratchada area who's condo and soi changed massively since large amount chinese bought into it .

Not worked out great for him or his wife (both working professionals) and current used selling price not that great either .

Was mainly thai and better working class westerners and peaceful atmosphere, Know it a lot of chinese screaming and doors slamming 24/7 .

[newnative]

5 hours ago, ThaiBunny said:

Poor Thai building standards and the refusal of many Thais to pay their annual maintenance fees means means many buildings will simply collapse over time

    Oh my lord. Not that old chestnut again.  I'm living in a 35 year old condo, oceanfront, and it's in excellent condition.  It will still be standing long after I have collapsed.  

[newnative]

4 hours ago, losworld said:

But thais and chinese don't like to buy used because of face and financing... i think you are wishful thinking...

     Another total myth.  I have sold 3 used condos to Chinese buyers--one went for 10.5MB paid in cash--and I've also sold 3 used condos to Thai buyers, all cash deals.  

[newnative]

3 hours ago, madmen said:

Extremely unlikely in New buildings with new juristic who have taken over AFTER the 1 month minimal Air Bnb rental terms were cemented in place. 

You must know a hell of a lot of landlords and renters (500+) to make a blanket statement like that and for it to be true across Pattaya or anywhere else

 

Im sure you meant much older buildings with non functioning Juristic and tenants that are there only for the 4k rent and couldn't give a rats about their neighbors.

 

 

    Actually Smedly is correct.  It's the new condo projects in Pattaya that are attracting most of the illegal short-term renters.  Think The Base, Unixx, Centric Sea, the Rivieras, etc.  And all  those 'theme park' low-rise condos too numerous to mention.  All large projects with around 1000 rooms. To make any kind of decent profit, you need to rent out 10 or more units in a building.  How many 1 room hotels do you know of?  In order to get 10 or more rooms, you need a new building--hard to acquire that many units in an old building where the units have already been sold.  I know of one newer condo project in Pattaya that sold at least 30 units to one owner--obviously he is running his own illegal boutique hotel within the condo.

[chama]

Better hope there is never a downturn in the Chinese economy or the sell of will be astronomical and have a huge impact on the Thai economy.

[rabas]

4 hours ago, BuckBee said:

I have a friend ratchada area who's condo and soi changed massively since large amount chinese bought into it .

Not worked out great for him or his wife (both working professionals) and current used selling price not that great either .

Was mainly thai and better working class westerners and peaceful atmosphere, Know it a lot of chinese screaming and doors slamming 24/7 .

Play Mahjong till 4am upstairs wearing high heals on a hard tile floor.

[lonewolf99]

If anyone cares to read the attached link - you will understand that that Chinese Gov do not want any money going abroad. - hence any property investment abroad above the value of 50,000 U.S. is basically illegal.

So how much of a Condo does that buy you in Bangkok ? A small studio at most.

 

The article clearly states that the Chinese person has lied to get the money out to buy in Bangkok. If there is one government not to mess with it is the Chinese one. They don't seem to bother with jails and just use bullets instead. So how many more Chinese will be willing to break the law to buy thousands of condos in Thailand....?

 

The question I have is - Why do governments like Australia and the U.K. allow people from a foreign country to break the law to obtain illegal funds to invest in Oz and the U.K. ? I can understand Thailand where money is number one and don't give a hoot where it comes from.

 

https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/society/article/2095827/why-are-middle-class-chinese-moving-their-money-abroad

[rabas]

7 minutes ago, lonewolf99 said:

If anyone cares to read the attached link - you will understand that that Chinese Gov do not want any money going abroad. - hence any property investment abroad above the value of 50,000 U.S. is basically illegal.

So how much of a Condo does that buy you in Bangkok ? A small studio at most.

 

The article clearly states that the Chinese person has lied to get the money out to buy in Bangkok. If there is one government not to mess with it is the Chinese one. They don't seem to bother with jails and just use bullets instead. So how many more Chinese will be willing to break the law to buy thousands of condos inThailand....?

 

https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/society/article/2095827/why-are-middle-class-chinese-moving-their-money-abroad

Chinese are experts at finding ways to divert money. They live under harsh conditions which makes them very resourceful.  The whole point to taking money out is that it's beyond Beijing's control. The Chinese Gov is the reason so many are buying condos outside.  It will not stop. How many more? How big is China?

[bapoboy]

In Bangkok a middle class income family can easily afford to buy a house,condo/apartment without affecting their income to much, and no most Thais earn well over 300 baht a day, the TVF people think that all Thais lives on minimum wage which is ridiculous, just show you have little knowledge about the average expat have about Thais in general.

 

in Paris,London and New York where only millionaires and billionaires can live unless you are willing to pay 90% of your wage to have a home, there is a shortage of property in those cities and the govemernt doesn’t seem to care at all, these cities only for the rich, the big real estate sharks win again.

 

One of the basic things you need in life is to have a home to stay in, but some people is all about making much money as possible and don’t care about the average John, they need to build more in those cities and build more affordable, so the average person have roof over he’s head..

 

thailand wins again, they are building to much, that’s what keeps the prices down, the less demand the less you can get. Most popular areas in Bangkok the prices have going through the roof, the base condo on sukhumvit 77, the prices started at 2,5million THB, now couple of years later, the prices have almost doubled, I use to live there, last year.

[bapoboy]

1 minute ago, bapoboy said:

In Bangkok a middle class income family can easily afford to buy a house,condo/apartment without affecting their income to much, and no most Thais earn well over 300 baht a day, the TVF people think that all Thais lives on minimum wage which is ridiculous, just show you have little knowledge about the average expat have about Thais in general.

 

in Paris,London and New York where only millionaires and billionaires can live unless you are willing to pay 90% of your wage to have a home, there is a shortage of property in those cities and the govemernt doesn’t seem to care at all, these cities only for the rich, the big real estate sharks win again.

 

One of the basic things you need in life is to have a home to stay in, but some people is all about making much money as possible and don’t care about the average John, they need to build more in those cities and build more affordable, so the average person have roof over he’s head..

 

thailand wins again, they are building to much, that’s what keeps the prices down, the less demand the less you can get. Most popular areas in Bangkok the prices have going through the roof, the base condo on sukhumvit 77, the prices started at 2,5million THB, now couple of years later, the prices have almost doubled, I use to live there, last year.

It’s always smarter to buy then rent, if you are planning to live here forever, only the ones that living on their poor pension will disagree on that... 

[LongTang]

11 hours ago, madmen said:

By the way I agree with you. Everybody should rent it certainly helps create wealth for us landlords ????

 

 

Now i understand why you so eagerly want the beggars off the streets, As that will increase the value of your property !  ????

[ThomasThBKK]

11 hours ago, losworld said:

yeah but the chinese don't trust their currency and their govt and many are simply laundering money... some think there is an endless supply of airbnb renters too... we shall see...

 

Yeez, thats not money laundering. It's capital flight. Same Thais do, every rich thai has his money in singapore and co and not in thailand. If my homecountry wouldnt let me transfer my money out how i want on my own terms i would do absolutely the same and bring it to a saner country. They don't care if it's a good investment, it's just a hedge against china failing.

 

it's just that no one told the chinese that their money will be stuck in here too -.-

[Pravda]

7 hours ago, bapoboy said:

 the base condo on sukhumvit 77, the prices started at 2,5million THB, now couple of years later, the prices have almost doubled, I use to live there, last year.

 

The base is not 5 million haha

 

It barely reaches 3 mil unless you are talking about 2 bedrooms. But then 2 bedroom was never starting at 2.5 mil

[GinBoy2]

37 minutes ago, Pravda said:

 

The base is not 5 million haha

 

It barely reaches 3 mil unless you are talking about 2 bedrooms. But then 2 bedroom was never starting at 2.5 mil

Ditto

 

A quick google search is all you need..

 

Problem is, as with all real estate, you can ask for whatever price you conjure up, but what it will actually sell for is often a very different matter!

 

And the telling number is, the number for sale!

[Peterw42]

9 hours ago, chama said:

Better hope there is never a downturn in the Chinese economy or the sell of will be astronomical and have a huge impact on the Thai economy.

A downturn in the Chinese economy would probably have the opposite effect, they would want to hang on to their non-Chinese assets or buy outside the Chinese economy.

[Assurancetourix]

8 hours ago, bapoboy said:

in Paris,London and New York where only millionaires and billionaires can live unless you are willing to pay 90% of your wage to have a home,

 

Strange, I have never been a millionaire or billionaire ;

I was living more than 30 years in Paris with an income of less than 2,000 euros each month ...

Living inside Paris in the 20* district and working inside Paris in the 1* one ;

15 minutes on my bicycle to go working ...respecting the traffic lights ...and wearing an helmet .

(maybe  it's why I'm still living  )

[emptypockets]

18 hours ago, yellowboat said:

Isn't Bangkok rather pass`e these days?  Its nightlife shackled.  Its street vendors hassled.  The only charm I am aware of is near Chinatown.  

 

It always seemed to me it was cheaper to rent than to buy in Bangkok for quite some time.  Now, it would seem buying is even less interesting.  

 

We all know many condos are not kept up with dingy and other common areas and the occasional elevator going unfixed due to residents not paying maintenance.  The Chinese will learn the hard way as we all have. 

'We all know' must be one of the most overused terms on this forum.  More correctly it should be ' We all assume so as everybody else on the forum says so, including those who have never been to Thailand and believe everything that is said is indeed a fact'. 

[bert bloggs]

I remember my wife renting a condo for a year to a Thai lady and a few weeks later her crying down the phone that she could not bear the noise ,Chinese making so much noise and even banging on her door , night and day , shame it was a lovely condo . ,but now so many blocks are like that here in Pattaya .

[madmen]

13 minutes ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

The problem is most Thais are already in debt to loan sharks, banks and other money-lenders for gambling debts, poor business decisions, just been screwed over, lending money to family and friends and a myriad of other poor life choices before they get anywhere near buying a house.

 

Most will not buy a condo to live in unless they have already got a house, buy it as an investment or have no other choice. 

 

As to Bangkok Sukhumvit prices, well if that is your barometer you need to get out more because that area is the exception rather than the rule, and those prices are buoyed by foreign investments, almost exclusively.

 

Middle class Thais have to enslave themselves to a Thai bank for 25 to 35 years because that is the only way they will afford property in Bangkok.

 

Easily afford? Erm, no. 

" problem is most Thais are already in debt to loan sharks, banks and other money-lenders for gambling debts, poor business decisions, just been screwed over, lending money to family and friends and a myriad of other poor life choices before they get anywhere near buying a house."

 

Nonsense