The horns of a dilemma.

[madmen]

13 minutes ago, sirineou said:

 As I understand it from what I have read , It is not for those who are here on extensions based on marriage. I think it is for extensions based on retirement. But I could be wrong on the retirement part.Anyway we will know soon enough.

But regardless of requirements or not, IMO ,one should not be without some insurance or the funds to self insure (min 1 mil baht perhaps more). Even though one might have great insurance back home, the occasion might arise where one might not be able to travel. Suppose you had the symptoms of a heart attack,  you certainly will not get on a plane and fly back home to have it checked. and if you don't have insurance or the funds you might not have it checked here, You might think "hey maybe it is only gas" do I want to spend my last baht?  But if you had the funds in the bank, or had insurance you might be more proactive.

  I am not being  critical,I understand all the pressures we all face, I live in the same world you all do,   but these are all things to think about. 

IMO it is not unreasonable to be required to have a $13k buffer fund, Not having any insurance is a sucker dice roll, and the required private insurance that does not cover preexisting conditions is crap. Why not be able for long term residents  to buy into the Thai government health plan?

Been discussed in a 1000 posts. Retirement extension already has the 400k in a Thai bank for emergencies

O-A dont have the 400k so they must buy it.

 

Either way you have the same coverage but the 400k for retirement extension doesn't cost 50-70k a year so that's the way to go for sure

 

[sirineou]

2 minutes ago, madmen said:

Been discussed in a 1000 posts. Retirement extension already has the 400k in a Thai bank for emergencies

O-A dont have the 400k so they must buy it.

 

Either way you have the same coverage but the 400k for retirement extension doesn't cost 50-70k a year so that's the way to go for sure

 

 I am sure you know this and it is simply a typing error, but so that we don't confuse others . or perhaps did I misunderstand your reply? 

Extension based on retirement is 800k in the bank 

Extension based on Marriage is 400K

then of course we have the income route 

[luckyluke]

18 minutes ago, madmen said:

Retirement extension already has the 400k in a Thai bank for emergencies

I don't, and  many I know, haven't either;

As we still get our extension based on a Letter of Income/Affidavit from our embassy/Consulate. 

[JaiLai]

How old are you ? The reason I ask is that perhaps you are either to young to have stepped on the ladder of life with its pitfalls for very long or else you are out of touch with economic reality. You say you are amassed at people not having those savings when they finish work. The facts in the UK should illustrate why you should not be too amassed based on reality that in the 55-64 age group 74% have less than 100 GBP in savings in 2017. Based on that I would think it highly unlikely they would have been able to build up a substantial saving in their last few years of working life.
https://www.finder.com/uk/saving-statistics

The people you mention normally don’t plan on retiring overseas.


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[JaiLai]

 
what about 20 years after their working lives.. or 30? still amazed?

Yes


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[geoffbezoz]

13 minutes ago, JaiLai said:

The people you mention normally don’t plan on retiring overseas.


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So you know all 20 million or so of them ? Your right, amassing indeed when facts destroy your story line I guess ????????????, as I wrote;

"The facts in the UK should illustrate why you should not be too amassed based on reality that in the 55-64 age group 74% have less than 100 GBP in savings in 2017. "

Edited June 2, 2019 by geoffbezoz

[Joe Mcseismic]

If you are British, Australian, or, some other nationality who's home currency has been depreciating against the Thai Baht, yet are still moaning about putting money in a Thai bank, you remind me of dirt poor Americans that vote Republican because they want to get rid of Obamacare.

[Kwasaki]

2 hours ago, GeorgeCross said:

more likely the problem is with the mongering 

 

doesn't look good now they've got the chinese paying the bills

You maybe right it's all over my head now I'm just into staying in Thailand now for myself other peoples problems are of their own making IMO they should keep up to date and not just think things will stay the same.

[watcharacters]

On 6/1/2019 at 3:50 PM, abizeus said:

I don't have many years behind me in Thailand like many here.

Been here since 2001 and there criteria for new visa's next year is absolutely beyond me.

They are expecting us to show 65,000bht coming from pension from your Country origin!!!

I actually do not know anyone receiving that much pension, in fact, I hardly netted that when working in UK.

Anyhow, hope all the farangs leave, like myself and leave's Thailand completely on its arse.

Good riddance to Thailand and I know for sure I won't even return for a short holiday in future.

Vietnam, Da Nang here I come - Marry a Vietnamese if you like and get 5 year visa.

They do actually want us there.

All the best Thailand - please sink.

 

A shade bitter?

 

 

[jerojero]

Same in Canada.

 
That's not true.
 
If a Thai lady marries a falang, and the couple moves to the falang's country, they will receive permanent residency after submitting the appropriate papers. In Australia, if they are still married after 2 years the permanent residency is confirmed. There is no English test.
 
All Thai spouses get full access to Medicare, can work in any job, can access all services that Australian citizens get. This is from the day their application for permanent residency in Australia, based on marriage to an Australian citizen, is accepted by their local Immigration office and they have paid the fee.
 
Compare that to Thailand. Falangs married to Thai woman get nothing except being able to stay in Thailand on a year by year basis with no gaurantees.

[jerojero]

Governments lead by imbeciles complicate it.

Or......
 
Life is easy people complicate it.... lol

[JaiLai]

So you know all 20 million or so of them ? Your right, amassing indeed when facts destroy your story line I guess [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23], as I wrote;
"The facts in the UK should illustrate why you should not be too amassed based on reality that in the 55-64 age group 74% have less than 100 GBP in savings in 2017. "

The facts of the UK don’t matter, we’re talking about requirements fir Thailand.


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[sirineou]

20 minutes ago, jerojero said:

Same in Canada.

 Same in the US

My now wife came on a fiance visa, we were married and she applied for a change of status, she was awarded a temporary permanent resident card Green card), two years later it was converted to a permanent resident card Green card). A couple of years later she had the required five years and applied for citizenship. She had to study a few questions (easy) and was asked if she wanted the interview in English or in Thai.

Never a problem, none of the Thai immigration nonsense.

I was reading about someone's application for Thai citizenship.

aside that he had to be able to read right and speak thai, He was asked "why they did not have any children" Are you kidding me?? what business is it of them , why they don't have children.  I would look at him in the eye and say " because I can't get a boner anymore, we only have oral sex". LOL

Being coming to Thailand for over 13 years, 

We have two houses there, One we build, and one we inherited  I love Thailand and the  Thai people but I will never sell my US  home, Never know when the Thai nonsense will become too much for me.

 

 

 

Edited June 2, 2019 by sirineou

[madmen]

12 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

If you are married and doing the 400k/40k, NOTHING HAS CHANGED. There are no tearful goodbyes at the airport, the family is not getting broken up by a ruthless and uncaring Thai Government. Its the same amount of money for the same amount of time.

 

If you are doing retirement and 800k/65k, leaving 800k in the bank to meet the requirements, NOTHING HAS CHANGED, leave the money in the bank, no tearful goodbyes or families being torn apart at the departure gate.

 

If you are doing retirement and 800k/65k, drawing down the money then topping back up from home country funds, relatively speaking, NOTHING HAS CHANGED. You can still use the funds at home to live off, top-up etc. if you were spending the 800k to live each year, where was the next 800k top-up coming from ?????

"where was the next 800k top-up coming from ?????"

Without doubt from stat decs and affidavits (the infamouse 4). Was a painless top up until the house of cards collapsed.

 

Its sad but surely those gambling there families future on it must have known it wouldn't last forever

[djayz]

On 6/1/2019 at 11:49 AM, ballpoint said:

Why abandon the family?  Why don't they sell their house here and move the family back to their home country?  Could it be because their own country's immigration requirements are far stricter than Thailand's?

Maybe they have made Thailand their home, planned on spending the rest of their lives here, are happy here and simply don't want to leave... 

[madmen]

8 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Only after you have sold it, or rented it out. I prefer to have my capital earning income in Australia, where I can sleep comfortably in the knowledge I am not going to be subject to capricious rules changes, and can liquidate easily.

Brexit has nothing to do with the fall in the GBP? News to me.

So your happy watching your money disappear into thin air as the baht continues to climb and the AUD is heading to 15bht???(historical low). had you have moved your money over here and invested in property or the Thai stock market you would be WAY better off and would have made a killing on currency exchange alone but instead your holding a currency that is in the toilet..GOOD move mate good move!!  

Edited June 2, 2019 by madmen

[geronimo]

A person in this situation simply goes to a Thai embassy and gets a multiple entry visa, as they do not have to show any funds.

[onera1961]

On 5/31/2019 at 11:00 PM, Gandtee said:

While I am in the fortunate position of being able to meet the Immigration Department's financial requirements, I suspect there are some who are not as fortunate as I. What about those who came to Thailand many years ago, married a Thai woman, bought a house here and sold their home in their homeland. They brought children into the world, raised and educated them. They even gave financial assistance to their Thai relatives when needed. The money they use comes from their homeland to do all these things, swelling Thailand's coffers, but not enough to maintain the baht 800,000 in the bank required by the Thai immigration laws. If they are now denied a visa extension what becomes of his family with noone to support them and deprived of their husband and father?  What becomes of him? He may be too old to work and has nothing in his own country. What is the answer?

Life goes on. Nothing changes in the grand scheme of things. At the local level, people adjust to the situation. Very people will leave due to the new requirements. A married person only needs 40K income per month or can get a Non-O from Laos without showing any balance.


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Edited June 3, 2019 by onera1961

[geoffbezoz]

19 hours ago, JaiLai said:

The facts of the UK don’t matter, we’re talking about requirements fir Thailand.


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Yes we are and just to refresh your memory in case you had forgotten you said that those 74% of the people I listed would not be coming to Thailand for marriage/retirement purposes, a pompous statement as clealrly you have no facts upon which to make that claim. Only your own predjudices. This was in the context of the thread being about people coming to Thailand and eventually having difficulties finding the resources. I disproved your glib statement that people who have worked all their lives would have 800/400k , as did others.

[Delight]

 The only answer is  a 'Visa to support a  Thai spouse ' and a partnership  effort.

If say 2  expats can between them raise the 400K -it may be possible to deposit that money in a  joint  bank account  and then in sequence use it. Moving it from bank account to bank account to satisfy immigration. The money only has to say in each partner's bank account for 2 months every year.

Clearly the timing will be critical.

The 400K will always return to the joint bank account-forever. It must be agreed that even if one partner dies -the money stays.Suitable wills being required when both partners have died.

That last part could be tricky

[JaiLai]

1 hour ago, geoffbezoz said:

Yes we are and just to refresh your memory in case you had forgotten you said that those 74% of the people I listed would not be coming to Thailand for marriage/retirement purposes, a pompous statement as clealrly you have no facts upon which to make that claim. Only your own predjudices. This was in the context of the thread being about people coming to Thailand and eventually having difficulties finding the resources. I disproved your glib statement that people who have worked all their lives would have 800/400k , as did others.

 

no we're not, we're posting about THAI requirements.

 

You can post whatever stats you want, that's fine.

 

i'm still amazed people don't have the 400/800K, it'a relatively small about of money.

 

my memory is fine by the way petal but thanks for showing concern, that's cute.

 

 

[Lacessit]

On 6/2/2019 at 8:48 PM, madmen said:

So your happy watching your money disappear into thin air as the baht continues to climb and the AUD is heading to 15bht???(historical low). had you have moved your money over here and invested in property or the Thai stock market you would be WAY better off and would have made a killing on currency exchange alone but instead your holding a currency that is in the toilet..GOOD move mate good move!!  

Rule one of investing is never invest in something you don't understand.

If you have made a motza from Thai property and shares, congratulations. Most of the people I know who "own" Thai property seem to be finding the paper capital gain they have made is ephemeral, because they can't sell it.

Your claim the AUD is heading to 15 is somewhat hysterical. IMHO it's more likely the Thai baht will get crunched when the Chinese start wanting their loans repaid. Having said that, my 800K on deposit was moved here when the AUD was 29 to the baht.

I am comfortable with how I invest, thank you.

[justin case]

there is no universal right in Thailand to be with your family, what is a given right to everybody who is married / have children in our western countries, that thais enjoy in our countries...

 

but even the powerful TV and its members do laugh with ideas of getting something organized for & fror the expat community in the real THAI - land to get some basic rights...

 

penniless or not, you should be able as a human being and a father to stay with your family... how many thais survive on 10-20k or less per month ? most I would say ?

 

[1FinickyOne]

17 hours ago, geoffbezoz said:

74% of the people I listed would not be coming to Thailand for marriage/retirement purposes, a pompous statement as clealrly you have no facts

ok - just curious not to get in the middle of your spat... if 74% as you say do not have 100 GBP - how will they afford the airfare to get here? 

[geoffbezoz]

12 minutes ago, kenk24 said:

ok - just curious not to get in the middle of your spat... if 74% as you say do not have 100 GBP - how will they afford the airfare to get here? 

I did not say "74% as you say do not have 100 GBP" . That figure came from the references that I gave in an earlier post based on research, I quoted that reference.

So tell me , when you buy anything, do you purchase it from your savings, or from your monthly salary ?, assuming you are still working. Most people I suspect pay for things from their monthly salaries I would think so perhaps that is why it is not unreasonable to assume that as they  spend most or perhaps all of that monthly salary they have none left over to put into a savings account.

Edited June 4, 2019 by geoffbezoz

[JaiLai]

there is no universal right in Thailand to be with your family, what is a given right to everybody who is married / have children in our western countries, that thais enjoy in our countries...
 
but even the powerful TV and its members do laugh with ideas of getting something organized for & fror the expat community in the real THAI - land to get some basic rights...
 
penniless or not, you should be able as a human being and a father to stay with your family... how many thais survive on 10-20k or less per month ? most I would say ?
 

Most Thais survive on 10-20k, have u seen how they live?

The loans and credit they have would scare you.


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[1FinickyOne]

32 minutes ago, JaiLai said:

Most Thais survive on 10-20k, have u seen how they live?

Yes, of course, I live in a village, but you are talking abt Brits coming here who don't have 100 GBP - I asked how they would afford the airfare to get here.... 

 

oops - sorry, I confused you with the other commenter on my post... 

Edited June 4, 2019 by kenk24

[JaiLai]

Yes, of course, I live in a village, but you are talking abt Brits coming here who don't have 100 GBP - I asked how they would afford the airfare to get here.... 

No, all I’m saying in this thread is I’m surprised people who’ve retired don’t have 400/800k to deposit in a bank account for visa purposes.




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[1FinickyOne]

1 hour ago, geoffbezoz said:

I quoted that reference.

So tell me , when you buy anything, do you purchase it from your savings,

Yes, I understood that you were not the researcher but quoting something you read... 

 

Yes, you could say that.. since I have both savings and profits from investments, the profits go into my savings... but I think people who do not have 100 GBP do not sit and wonder if they should retire in Thailand or The Maldives instead... 

[1FinickyOne]

3 minutes ago, JaiLai said:

 

No, all I’m saying in this thread is I’m surprised people who’ve retired don’t have 400/800k to deposit in a bank account for visa purposes.




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Yes, I agree  - - and so many of the angry stories posted here abt changing rules, I think are precipitated by the fact that people can no longer use embassy letters and never really met the qualifications in the first place. For me, the rules have not changed much at all... it is sort of sad but I too am surprised at how many retirees here never really met the requirements and now, when asked for proof, their life is disrupted. At retirement age, not having 400/800k to keep in the bank is sad... and as you say, surprising.