Entertainment tourism: Pattaya for Europeans is over - 30% down this year, official

[Roy Baht]

13 minutes ago, morrobay said:

The Big Mac index does not factor oversupply/demand. Don't need to elaborate on why what you like in Pattaya is cheap. Some internet searches show Big Mac Pattaya 150 baht/USA $4 = 37.5B/$. Then a little package of balloons in Tops Central/beach is 65 baht! Even if it was $1 in the U. S.... 

Price gouging at the most expensive areas of a tourist city is not related to exchange rates. Get off of Walking St and the beach road. Get out of Pattaya entirely. Thailand is still cheap. It's still a good value for the dollar. Hotels everywhere in Thailand are insanely cheap compared to anywhere in the US. Food in restaurants (even in Pattaya) is cheap and good. Try a meal at Fra Pattaya.

[Roy Baht]

24 minutes ago, morrobay said:

??? By the way Hoss, outside of Trumps weak dollar policy I am all for the wall and everything else Trump is trying to do ala/Fox news. 

So you're in favor of Trump policies as long as they don't require any sacrifice on your part? You want to MAGA? A weak dollar makes US exports cheaper overseas thus creating more jobs in the States. You like the idea of building a wall? Well, that's what Thailand is doing now so don't complain if you're on the wrong side of it.

[jacko45k]

16 hours ago, Percy P said:

But it's not the Baat that is strong against other currencies.Its other currencies that are weak against the Baat.

Tomhayto, tomhahto.

[morrobay]

5 hours ago, Roy Baht said:

 You want to MAGA? A weak dollar makes US exports cheaper overseas thus creating more jobs in the States. 

My take on MAGA / cheaper exports / putting people to work was by improving infrastructure: rails, ports, bridges. And more efficient production.  And also maintain cheaper imports. But like you suggest, why do all those fundamentals when all you have to do is sugar down the dollar. 

[Rimmer]

Multiple posts removed:

 

17) You will not discuss the specifics of prostitution. Though Thailand has a visible sex industry, and acknowledgement of that fact is not forbidden, ThaiVisa is not the place to seek or give information on this topic, regardless of your sexual habits, preferences or orientation.
 

[Guest]

16 hours ago, observer90210 said:

Booze and chicks much cheaper in many European beach cities

Where? Which ones?

[Guest]

15 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

I love Spain and Portugal but its euro land prices and girls and night life is more expensive and less accessible.  I spent ten years in Spain and Portugal...but the girly scene is lacklustre and the streets of Spain are violent.

Streets of Spain are violent? You can thank the uncontrolled and unstoppable mass immigration from Morocco, the northern africa and the rest of the african continent for it.

Wait until you get to the streets of France and specially Paris and Marseilles and pretty much everywhere else now. You're in for a rough wake-up call.

 

Europe as we know it is DEAD, Eurabia is coming.

[Guest]

12 hours ago, Roy Baht said:

So you're in favor of Trump policies as long as they don't require any sacrifice on your part? You want to MAGA? A weak dollar makes US exports cheaper overseas thus creating more jobs in the States. You like the idea of building a wall? Well, that's what Thailand is doing now so don't complain if you're on the wrong side of it.

MAGA all the way. Wish we had a MFGA politician.

Hint: F stands for France.

[Guest]

13 hours ago, morrobay said:

I am all for the wall and everything else Trump is trying to do ala/Fox news. 

Amen.

[bodymassagemyfriend]

On 7/14/2019 at 10:20 PM, sunnyboy2018 said:

A bargain, great fun, safe and always interesting with the most fun girls in the world.  A unique country. Some farang want Pattaya to fail. As do some influential Thais...

Bargain if you have dollars? 20 sqm condo for $500 per month, thats the price today. Had a house with 3 bedrooms in Spain for this price

[jacko45k]

10 hours ago, tcp7 said:

Where? Which ones?

Rhyl

[Skallywag]

According to reports at the Suvarnabhumi and DM airport, there is no 30% tourism drop as of July 10, 2019.  Significant drop in tourism from Chinese so far this year around 14.5%. Increases from a few countries over last year 

 

Edited July 16, 2019 by Skallywag

[denby45]

On 7/12/2019 at 8:13 PM, newnative said:

     I didn't say anything about 'mixing of hotels and condos'.  If you own a condo, in a condo project registered as a 'condominium' at the Land Office, it is illegal under the Thai Hotel Act to rent your condo for a period of less than 30 days.

    A few weeks ago I witnessed a raid by police at a condo project in Bangkok.  They fined the owners doing the illegal short-term rentals and they also fined the renters because the owners had not reported their addresses to Immigration, as required by law.   Of course, many are doing illegal short-term rentals in condominiums but it is illegal.  

Erm yes you did. I quote from your post.

 

"Why in a condominium? Because the real estate investor stopped one day to sell the apartments and transformed the condominium in Chinese group hotels.

And a lot of condominium are like this in Pattaya, half condos, half hotels.

Illegal but... like prostitution, illegal"

 

You actually raised some hope for me with your statement as like I said I have the same problem with my complex being mixed hotel and condo's. Please don't change the subject to people renting out their condo for short duration without a hotel license to make it look like statement was correct. Grow a pair and admit you mislead us.

 

Den

[newnative]

2 minutes ago, denby45 said:

Erm yes you did. I quote from your post.

 

"Why in a condominium? Because the real estate investor stopped one day to sell the apartments and transformed the condominium in Chinese group hotels.

And a lot of condominium are like this in Pattaya, half condos, half hotels.

Illegal but... like prostitution, illegal"

 

You actually raised some hope for me with your statement as like I said I have the same problem with my complex being mixed hotel and condo's. Please don't change the subject to people renting out their condo for short duration without a hotel license to make it look like statement was correct. Grow a pair and admit you mislead us.

 

Den

   Erm no, I didn't.  That is not an accurate quote from any of my posts.  I would not have used the word 'apartments', for one.  I'm from America and we usually call condos 'condos', not apartments.  Apartments are almost always considered rental units in America--usually the whole apartment complex is owned by a single company.  I would never call a condo an apartment because I always think of an apartment as something you only rent.  Occasionally apartments in America will 'go condo'. The apartment complex owner decides to get out of the business and he sells the apartments--which turn from apartments into condos.

    In addition, the quote you say is mine is not really grammatically correct, the language is awkward, and it sounds like it came from someone with a native language that is not English.  And, I would not have used the prostitution reference. Or call something 'Chinese group hotels'--not a term I would use and I'm not even sure what it is referencing.

    I have said several times that people are buying 10, 20, 30 or more condos in new projects and they are setting up what amounts to illegal hotel operations within the condo projects.  You have to be renting multiple illegal units to make any real money with illegal short-term rentals.  As I have also said before, how many 1 room hotels do you know?

    Whether it's multiple units or just one unit, renting a condo for less than a month is illegal under Thai law.  But, unfortunately, it is being done a lot and that results in your situation--living in what is suppose to be a residence but in reality is part residence and part hotel.  I, for one, hate that this illegal activity is going on.  I don't want to live in a hotel.

[lavezzi]

playing SimCity would help a lot

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎7‎/‎11‎/‎2019 at 8:31 PM, sahibji said:

ThreeEyeRaven you have nailed it.it is not the strong baht - it is the vicious attacks by gangs of thais on individuals that is a huge factor- cheap behaviour at the bars also keeps families away.if pattaya were so good destination hordes of malaysians and singaporeans would rush to that place.

 

Despite the day dreams of greedy Thais, Pattaya has never been a family destination as such, though obviously there are self contained resorts where families stay.

There are many far better places for families to stay in LOS.

[JayBird]

wow. so much truth in one article. amazing.
 
 

The accidentally published the redacted parts.

[transam]

3 minutes ago, JayBird said:

On 7/11/2019 at 8:48 AM, NCC1701A said:

wow. so much truth in one article. amazing.
 
 

The accidentally published the "redacted" parts.

I had to look that word up.....

[denby45]

20 hours ago, newnative said:

   Erm no, I didn't.  That is not an accurate quote from any of my posts.  I would not have used the word 'apartments', for one.  I'm from America and we usually call condos 'condos', not apartments.  Apartments are almost always considered rental units in America--usually the whole apartment complex is owned by a single company.  I would never call a condo an apartment because I always think of an apartment as something you only rent.  Occasionally apartments in America will 'go condo'. The apartment complex owner decides to get out of the business and he sells the apartments--which turn from apartments into condos.

    In addition, the quote you say is mine is not really grammatically correct, the language is awkward, and it sounds like it came from someone with a native language that is not English.  And, I would not have used the prostitution reference. Or call something 'Chinese group hotels'--not a term I would use and I'm not even sure what it is referencing.

    I have said several times that people are buying 10, 20, 30 or more condos in new projects and they are setting up what amounts to illegal hotel operations within the condo projects.  You have to be renting multiple illegal units to make any real money with illegal short-term rentals.  As I have also said before, how many 1 room hotels do you know?

    Whether it's multiple units or just one unit, renting a condo for less than a month is illegal under Thai law.  But, unfortunately, it is being done a lot and that results in your situation--living in what is suppose to be a residence but in reality is part residence and part hotel.  I, for one, hate that this illegal activity is going on.  I don't want to live in a hotel.

I know you were not the original poster of the quote it was a post by carabaothai He wrote

"Why in a condominium? Because the real estate investor stopped one day to sell the apartments and transformed the condominium in Chinese group hotels.

And a lot of condominium are like this in Pattaya, half condos, half hotels.

Illegal but... like prostitution, illegal"

 

I then posed the question "I didn't know it was illegal. Where is this written? I have the same problem where I live."

 

You replied in your post "It's in the Hotel Act" thereby misleading us.

Is it clear now what you wrote are are you going to deny it again.

 

Den

 

 

[StayinThailand2much]

On 7/11/2019 at 9:06 AM, LivinLOS said:

Yes yes.. everyone goes to Pattaya for the festivals !!! Its the new 'golf'.. 

 

I guess, the idea of the festivals was to attract Thai tourists, e.g. from Bangkok, but it seems that even they find Pattaya now too boring and dirty...

[StayinThailand2much]

On 7/11/2019 at 9:36 AM, chrisandsu said:

Europeans just don’t have the money anymore . It’s that simple . It’s not only Pattaya that’s suffering as Pattaya is still cheap compared to Phuket  .

Same old; can't manage own affairs or growth, blame others, esp. foreigners...

 

I know enough Europeans who earn their money in Thailand, but don't go to Pattaya anymore. For them, obviously, exchange rates do not matter.

[Destiny1990]

21 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

Same old; can't manage own affairs or growth, blame others, esp. foreigners...

 

I know enough Europeans who earn their money in Thailand, but don't go to Pattaya anymore. For them, obviously, exchange rates do not matter.

Many European Countries have in recent years very strong Economies with its citizens easily to afford long travels however nowadays  there is lots of choice in Asian destinations. 

Edited July 17, 2019 by Destiny1990

[newnative]

1 hour ago, denby45 said:

I know you were not the original poster of the quote it was a post by carabaothai He wrote

"Why in a condominium? Because the real estate investor stopped one day to sell the apartments and transformed the condominium in Chinese group hotels.

And a lot of condominium are like this in Pattaya, half condos, half hotels.

Illegal but... like prostitution, illegal"

 

I then posed the question "I didn't know it was illegal. Where is this written? I have the same problem where I live."

 

You replied in your post "It's in the Hotel Act" thereby misleading us.

Is it clear now what you wrote are are you going to deny it again.

 

Den

 

 

    Where am I misleading you?  You asked where it is written that it is illegal to rent rooms for less than 30 days.  The answer is the Thai Hotel Act, which is what I said before and will say again and have never denied saying.  Perhaps you are confused because you think it should be in the Thai Condominium Act but it is in the Thai Hotel Act.  The main point is not where in Thai law it is written but that it prohibits condos from being rented for less than 30 days.  I think we are both in agreement that having short-term illegal rentals in condominium projects is not a good thing.  The Thai government thinks it's not good, too; hence, the law prohibiting it.  Pity the law is not being enforced well.

    Thank you for clarifying that the quote you attributed to me was actually written by someone else but next time why not quote correctly to start?  I hate when I am quoted incorrectly but it's even worse when someone else's comments are incorrectly stated to be mine.  

[wotsdermatter]

On 7/10/2019 at 9:41 PM, webfact said:

The strength of the baht,

This is a bit strange considering that in today's list of subjects to read there is:

Stronger baht not keeping tourists away

By snoop1130

So, which comment is correct?

'nuf sed.

[denby45]

23 hours ago, newnative said:

    Where am I misleading you?  You asked where it is written that it is illegal to rent rooms for less than 30 days.  The answer is the Thai Hotel Act, which is what I said before and will say again and have never denied saying.  Perhaps you are confused because you think it should be in the Thai Condominium Act but it is in the Thai Hotel Act.  The main point is not where in Thai law it is written but that it prohibits condos from being rented for less than 30 days.  I think we are both in agreement that having short-term illegal rentals in condominium projects is not a good thing.  The Thai government thinks it's not good, too; hence, the law prohibiting it.  Pity the law is not being enforced well.

    Thank you for clarifying that the quote you attributed to me was actually written by someone else but next time why not quote correctly to start?  I hate when I am quoted incorrectly but it's even worse when someone else's comments are incorrectly stated to be mine.  

I apologize for misleading you about the first post and recognize that it was not you who posted about the mixing of hotel and residences being illegal. There see how easy it is for me to apologize. Some people are able to do that and others don't. 

His post had absolutely nothing to do with people renting out their condo's for less than 30 days. I have to say again, the subject of his post was the mixing of hotel rooms and residential condo's in the same complex being illegal in Thailand. Did you even read it because you said it was in the Hotel act? It is obviously not. I will say it again. You mislead us. You tried it 3 times already so no doubt rather than admitting your mistake you will again revert to spouting on about renting a condo out for less than 30 days. 

 

Den

 

[newnative]

1 hour ago, denby45 said:

I apologize for misleading you about the first post and recognize that it was not you who posted about the mixing of hotel and residences being illegal. There see how easy it is for me to apologize. Some people are able to do that and others don't. 

His post had absolutely nothing to do with people renting out their condo's for less than 30 days. I have to say again, the subject of his post was the mixing of hotel rooms and residential condo's in the same complex being illegal in Thailand. Did you even read it because you said it was in the Hotel act? It is obviously not. I will say it again. You mislead us. You tried it 3 times already so no doubt rather than admitting your mistake you will again revert to spouting on about renting a condo out for less than 30 days. 

 

Den

 

     I don't think I am understanding what you mean regarding 'mixing hotel and condo rooms'.  You can have a project that is set up from the start to have a separate legal hotel component and a separate legal condo component.

      Amari Residences in Cosy Beach is one example.  The hotel is on the lower floors and the condos are on the upper floors.  Condo buyers from the start  know when they buy that there is a hotel element.  In some cases the facilities are shared and some not. I think with Amari there is a separate entrance and gym for the condos but the pool is shared.  If I remember correctly, the hallways on the hotel floors at Amari are carpeted, I suppose to cut down on the noise from hotel guest dragging their suitcases down the halls day and night.  The condo floors are tiled, I suppose because they don't expect constant suitcase noise.

    With a project legally registered at the Land Office as just a condominium, it is illegal under Thai law to rent out a condo unit in the condominium for less than 30 days.  You mentioned that you are having problems at your project where you live.  Do you know if it is a legally registered condominium at the Land Office?  Or, is it a project like Amari that has a condominium component and also a registered hotel component with a hotel license?  If it is just a registered condominium, then if someone is renting a unit for less than 30 days they are breaking Thai law.

   I find it encouraging that some condo projects are making efforts to stop the illegal short-term rentals. If you are ever near the Centric Sea condo on Second Road, take a look at their entrance.  Right at the very front is a large sign that says This is Not a Hotel, along with some warnings.  All along the drive up to the project are banners about every 5 or 6 feet, in various languages, warning that short-term rentals are illegal, violators face fines,  we don't want you, and so on.

   However, what cheered my heart the most was the sign that said that the sky pools were for residents only and the short-term renters can't use them!  Good going!  If you know Centric Sea, the two sky pools are rightly famous. The one in the 'A' building, at floor 44, is I think still the highest condo sky pool in central Pattaya and the view is truly spectacular while you are swimming.  It's great they are saying no, you're illegal, and you can't use the sky pools.   Maybe word will get out and the illegal renters will book a hotel.

   Something of the same thing was recently done at a Bangkok condo also bothered by illegal renters.  Management put in a policy where all residents have to get a condo photo ID card to use the pool and gym and show it when using the facilities.  Getting the card involves filling out a form, showing your chanote or rental contract, and supplying 2 photos.  Obviously, someone illegally there for a day or 2 won't bother and the pool and gym will not have a constant flow of strangers using and abusing them.  

[MrMuddle]

On 7/11/2019 at 9:46 AM, NCC1701A said:

so if I go to Pattaya right now will I be the only white guy?

 

Think you're pretty fly ?    lol

 

[morrobay]

As far as the Europeans go it's really going to be about the July and August numbers in Pattaya. 

[brewsterbudgen]

As far as the Europeans go it's really going to be about the July and August numbers in Pattaya. 

I disagree. July and August are still low season for Pattaya. It might be the school holidays in Europe, but that is not Pattaya's market! The test will come in high season - November/December/January.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[denby45]

20 hours ago, newnative said:

     I don't think I am understanding what you mean regarding 'mixing hotel and condo rooms'.  You can have a project that is set up from the start to have a separate legal hotel component and a separate legal condo component.

      Amari Residences in Cosy Beach is one example.  The hotel is on the lower floors and the condos are on the upper floors.  Condo buyers from the start  know when they buy that there is a hotel element.  In some cases the facilities are shared and some not. I think with Amari there is a separate entrance and gym for the condos but the pool is shared.  If I remember correctly, the hallways on the hotel floors at Amari are carpeted, I suppose to cut down on the noise from hotel guest dragging their suitcases down the halls day and night.  The condo floors are tiled, I suppose because they don't expect constant suitcase noise.

    With a project legally registered at the Land Office as just a condominium, it is illegal under Thai law to rent out a condo unit in the condominium for less than 30 days.  You mentioned that you are having problems at your project where you live.  Do you know if it is a legally registered condominium at the Land Office?  Or, is it a project like Amari that has a condominium component and also a registered hotel component with a hotel license?  If it is just a registered condominium, then if someone is renting a unit for less than 30 days they are breaking Thai law.

   I find it encouraging that some condo projects are making efforts to stop the illegal short-term rentals. If you are ever near the Centric Sea condo on Second Road, take a look at their entrance.  Right at the very front is a large sign that says This is Not a Hotel, along with some warnings.  All along the drive up to the project are banners about every 5 or 6 feet, in various languages, warning that short-term rentals are illegal, violators face fines,  we don't want you, and so on.

   However, what cheered my heart the most was the sign that said that the sky pools were for residents only and the short-term renters can't use them!  Good going!  If you know Centric Sea, the two sky pools are rightly famous. The one in the 'A' building, at floor 44, is I think still the highest condo sky pool in central Pattaya and the view is truly spectacular while you are swimming.  It's great they are saying no, you're illegal, and you can't use the sky pools.   Maybe word will get out and the illegal renters will book a hotel.

   Something of the same thing was recently done at a Bangkok condo also bothered by illegal renters.  Management put in a policy where all residents have to get a condo photo ID card to use the pool and gym and show it when using the facilities.  Getting the card involves filling out a form, showing your chanote or rental contract, and supplying 2 photos.  Obviously, someone illegally there for a day or 2 won't bother and the pool and gym will not have a constant flow of strangers using and abusing them.  

I give up. Never mind.

 

 

Den