UK plans to end EU freedom of movement immediately in no-deal Brexit

[johnnybangkok]

2 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

Millions of cheap workers from Eastern Europe have seriously affected Joe's financial welfare.

 

We have more people not working than ever before, more getting in work benefits, tax credits. We have food banks accessible by working people on small money and the zero hours contract is a convenient way of saying that someone can get paid nothing if there is no work for him to do that day, week or month or ever.

 

Seeing as how you brought the matter up how about you explaining how a low-tax hub of free trade agreements worldwide will improve Joe's situation whether it's a Brexit model or not.

Absolute garbage. As usual.

As has been demonstrated in numerous threads before this and by a very nice graph provided by 7By7, unemployment in the UK has been declining at a steady and significant rate since the 2008 recession. Your assertion that we have 'more people not working than ever before' is your usual method of anecdotal nonsense backed up by no facts and no data.  Also, DWP statistics show that of people claiming benefits, only 2.2 percent were EU nationals (https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/dwp-statistical-summaries).

Food banks are primarily the fault of Tory austerity measures where the poor suffered due to the avarice of the rich and zero hour contracts would have been eventually banned under the Workers Time Directive, an EU policy that was purposely set up to protect the working man, if of course the UK was staying in the EU.

However none of this feeds into your echo chamber of xenophobia, Islamophobia and downright racism so in your mind it's always Johnny Foreigners fault, regardless of the facts. 

 

Next!

 

 

  

[johnnybangkok]

13 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

 

They are government figures published to keep the population convinced that their policies are successful and that "immigration benefits the economy".

 

The figures they don't publish are those that admit that there are now 8.6 million people in the UK of WORKING AGE who are classed as economically inactive.

 

They are figures quoted by the ONS (Office for National Statistics). You explain that. If you can. They can't all be housewives or crippled or sick and incapable of work!

 

Edit. The ONS is a government department as is the dept that tells you we have 1.4 million people unemployed.

You seemed confused so I'll clarify it for you. 

 

The main definition of economic inactivity is if a person is out of work and not looking for a job – in 2017, there were 8.6 million economically inactive people in England, with 6.9 million coming from White ethnic groups, and 1.7 million from all other ethnic groups combined.

https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/work-pay-and-benefits/unemployment-and-economic-inactivity/economic-inactivity/latest

 

The economically inactive population comprises all persons who were neither "employed" nor "unemployed" during the short reference period used to measure "current activity". This population is split into four groups: 
- Attendant at educational institutions- Retired - Engaged in family duties - - Other economically inactive. https://stats.oecd.org/glossary/detail.asp?ID=6252.

 

There you go. Better now?

 

 

 

[yogi100]

6 minutes ago, johnnybangkok said:

Absolute garbage. As usual.

As has been demonstrated in numerous threads before this and by a very nice graph provided by 7By7, unemployment in the UK has been declining at a steady and significant rate since the 2008 recession. Your assertion that we have 'more people not working than ever before' is your usual method of anecdotal nonsense backed up by no facts and no data.  Also, DWP statistics show that of people claiming benefits, only 2.2 percent were EU nationals (https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/dwp-statistical-summaries).

Food banks are primarily the fault of Tory austerity measures where the poor suffered due to the avarice of the rich and zero hour contracts would have been eventually banned under the Workers Time Directive, an EU policy that was purposely set up to protect the working man, if of course the UK was staying in the EU.

However none of this feeds into your echo chamber of xenophobia, Islamophobia and downright racism so in your mind it's always Johnny Foreigners fault, regardless of the facts. 

 

Next!

 

 

  

Is this link below 'absolute garbage' as well. They are government figure. 

------------------------------------------------------------------

"overall, in 2017, 22% of the working age population (people aged 16 to 64 years) were economically inactive, or around 8.6 million people – a person iseconomically inactive if they're out of work and not looking for a job, and theeconomic inactivity rate is the number of economically inactive people as a percentage ...21 Sep 2018

 

Economic inactivity - GOV.UK Ethnicity facts and figures

 

https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk › latest"

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

It's now said to be 8.7 million.

 

So if you want to refer to something as absolute garbage perhaps the government figures of 1.3 or 1.4 million on the dole are absolute garbage as well.

 

Explain how it can be described asxenophobia, Islamophobia and downright racism. The 'R' word means very little any more because it's usually used to stifle argument. But don't be discouraged it was still a nice try.

[transam]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

So was I right; you are upset because EU nationals are taking the illegal cash in hand work away from your mates?

 

How does this prove they are working illegally?

 

When the Surrey section of the M25 was being built I got to know some of the workers; British migrant workers from other parts of the UK. They lived 6 to a caravan on sites provided by the contractors. Does this prove they were working illegally? Of course not; because they weren't.

 

Because I know you silly billy, if I didn't I wouldn't write it, plus I am not talking about one instance....????

[yogi100]

10 minutes ago, johnnybangkok said:

You seemed confused so I'll clarify it for you. 

 

The main definition of economic inactivity is if a person is out of work and not looking for a job – in 2017, there were 8.6 million economically inactive people in England, with 6.9 million coming from White ethnic groups, and 1.7 million from all other ethnic groups combined.

https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/work-pay-and-benefits/unemployment-and-economic-inactivity/economic-inactivity/latest

 

The economically inactive population comprises all persons who were neither "employed" nor "unemployed" during the short reference period used to measure "current activity". This population is split into four groups: 
- Attendant at educational institutions- Retired - Engaged in family duties - - Other economically inactive. https://stats.oecd.org/glossary/detail.asp?ID=6252.

 

There you go. Better now?

 

 

 

Whatever way you want to put it they are still of working age and not contributing to the economic welfare and development of the nation.

 

8.6 million not working raises a lot less eyebrows than 1.3 so the politicians keep quiet about it and instruct the civil servants to do the same.

 

It amounts to over 20% of adults who are of working age in the country not doing so. That's one in five and many of them need welfare payments to survive. Payments that could be of better use in other areas like the NHS and industrial research and development.

[7by7]

52 minutes ago, Thongkorn said:

How can a British work compete with 10 people in a house , if they pay any Tax or community tax, When a Maried guy of 30 has a couple of kids and is on a No hours Contract, On minimum wages , if all the Company's and Farmers paid a living wage British workers would step forward, fact. Nothing to do with legality.

 So it's all the British employers fault and nothing to do with the EU, then?

 

[7by7]

14 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

Whatever way you want to put it they are still of working age and not contributing to the economic welfare and development of the nation.

 

8.6 million not working raises a lot less eyebrows than 1.3 so the politicians keep quiet about it and instruct the civil servants to do the same.

 

It amounts to over 20% of adults who are of working age in the country not doing so. That's one in five and many of them need welfare payments to survive. Payments that could be of better use in other areas like the NHS and industrial research and development.

 

@JohnyBangkok provided actual figures to back up his data; were is the evidence to back up your claims?

 

One example of who is economically inactive is those in further or higher education; according to this survey in the academic year 2017/18 that was 2.34 million people.

 

But, as can be seen, that is based on data from just 164 higher education institutions; add all the further education and sixth form colleges (see here for those just in England) to that and the actual number could easily be doubled at least; more likely trebled or above when you include the other three nations!

 

Which takes a big chunk out of the 8.6 million.

 

Another big chunk is people who stay at home. One group being carers, of whom there are around 7 million (source). Now many of those work or are in full time education; but a significant number are neither. They do receive some state aid, but it is not JSA. They are not counted as unemployed for the simple reason that, like my sister in law who was my brother's full time carer up until the day he died, they are not available for work.

 

But based upon your final paragraph, "It amounts to over 20% of adults who are of working age in the country not doing so. That's one in five and many of them need welfare payments to survive. Payments that could be of better use in other areas like the NHS and industrial research and development." you believe that she and those in her position should have had her carers allowance and other benefits stopped and been forced out to work leaving her critically ill, bed ridden and disabled husband at home alone to fend for himself as best he could!

 

 

 

[7by7]

48 minutes ago, transam said:

Because I know you silly billy, if I didn't I wouldn't write it, plus I am not talking about one instance....????

 Translation "I have no proof and made it up!"

 

45 minutes ago, transam said:

Well we know you don't like the folk in the UK, that is evident from your posts.

 Your ignorant prejudice against anyone who not only disagrees with you but challenges your statements is showing again!

 

48 minutes ago, transam said:

So now UK natives working cash in hand is the best you can come up with..

EU workers working cash in hand was the best you could come up with. My plst was in response to that.

 

Do you deny that there are British workers working cash in hand?

 

And who employs them and the EU nationals doing the same? It may be EU gang master, but it's usually native Brits they're working for!

 

51 minutes ago, transam said:

Blimey, no wonder so many here have you on ignore...

Feel free to join those who cannot deal with having their, often ignorant, assumptions challenged.

[yogi100]

54 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

Whatever way you want to put it they are still of working age and not contributing to the economic welfare and development of the nation.

 

8.6 million not working raises a lot less eyebrows than 1.3 so the politicians keep quiet about it and instruct the civil servants to do the same.

 

It amounts to over 20% of adults who are of working age in the country not doing so. That's one in five and many of them need welfare payments to survive. Payments that could be of better use in other areas like the NHS and industrial research and development.

 

I should have written 8.6 million would raise a lot MORE eyebrows etcetc.

[yogi100]

44 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 So it's all the British employers fault and nothing to do with the EU, then?

 

It's the time honoured quest for an constant supply for cheap labour. 

 

We do the same when we hire the services of a girl in the LOS, it's human nature no matter whatever ever commodity you may be in the market for.

[candide]

2 hours ago, yogi100 said:

Millions of cheap workers from Eastern Europe have seriously affected Joe's financial welfare.

 

We have more people not working than ever before, more getting in work benefits, tax credits. We have food banks accessible by working people on small money and the zero hours contract is a convenient way of saying that someone can get paid nothing if there is no work for him to do that day, week or month or ever.

 

Seeing as how you brought the matter up how about you explaining how a low-tax hub of free trade agreements worldwide will improve Joe's situation whether it's a Brexit model or not.

Unemployment figures have been extensively discussed already so I will abstain from it.

 

As for minimal wages regulation, zero hours contract, etc.. It is strictly a matter of national regulation, nothing to do with the EU.

 

As for the Brexit model, the only arguments I read were about making new free-trade deal and cancelling EU regulations that impose too much constraints on British firms (we all know what it means, don't we?). Have I been mislead?

[7by7]

2 hours ago, yogi100 said:

2 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 So it's all the British employers fault and nothing to do with the EU, then?

 

It's the time honoured quest for an constant supply for cheap labour. 

 

So why do you and your Brexiteer mates blame the EU?

 

Do you honestly believe that after Brexit unemployment in the UK will fall even further whilst at the same time wages will increase?

 

2 hours ago, yogi100 said:

We do the same when we hire the services of a girl in the LOS, it's human nature no matter whatever ever commodity you may be in the market for.

Speak for yourself; personally I don't hire the services of a girl anywhere, nor do I treat people, whatever their gender and age, as commodities.

[7by7]

There is much confusion in certain quarters over the difference between unemployed and economically inactive.

 

Here in the UK the difference is simple.

 

An unemployed person is someone who isn't working, but wants to be. They are actively seeking paid work.

 

An economically inactive person is also not working, or at least not working for a wage, but, and this is the crucial difference, for one reason or another doesn't want to or can't be. They are not seeking paid work at all.

 

This could be for a number of reasons:

• they are in full time education,
• they are the full time carer of an elderly or disabled person,
• they have a disability which prevents them from working
• they are a homemaker (horrible Americanism!)

being perhaps the most common.

 

Of course, non working pensioners are also economically inactive and are by far the largest group; but are not included in the 8.6 million figure of those aged between 16 and 64 which has been quoted.

[zorrow424]

4 hours ago, Thongkorn said:

How can a British work compete with 10 people in a house , if they pay any Tax or community tax, When a Maried guy of 30 has a couple of kids and is on a No hours Contract, On minimum wages , if all the Company's and Farmers paid a living wage British workers would step forward, fact. Nothing to do with legality.

Freedom of movement for foreigners or more importantly benefits to foreigners brought the UK to where it is now..Brexit.

  Needs controlling, foreign workers,give them visas,but Boris in the past has spoken favourably of ID cards,will become a necessity if immigration wants controlling,not necessarily compulsion,but access to benefits,banks,renting, house purchase etc will be a requirement

[Handsome Gardener]

On ‎8‎/‎22‎/‎2019 at 4:41 AM, johnnybangkok said:

I agree. There is never an explanation because fundamentally the real reason is a pathological and unsubstantiated distrusts of Johnny foreigner. They hate being called racist or xenophobic but that's the real driving force behind the typical Brexiters rhetoric. There is literally no other reason as if you look at the facts; from the Working Time Directive, to the championing of better working conditions to women's equality, to global warming initiatives, clean air acts and the pushing of minimum wages throughout it's member states, this EU 'Federal State' that your typical Brexiter wants so desperately to demonize has done more for the man on the street than any UK government has in an awful long time.

'We voted leave and that's what democracy demands!' sounds much better than 'I've been racist/xenophobic/Islamophobic all my life and this gets me what I want'. 

I have called out many a Brexiter on this forum when they have slipped their mask (have a look at my Post 192 on this thread) and shown their true identity but it never matters. They continue on in with their uninspiring rhetoric and pseudo facts, cheering on the upper class as they literally drive the UK off an economic cliff. 

They have seen their UK pensions dwindle as the pound slowly but surely collapses. They are seeing every major economist warn of the disaster of a no-deal. You see health leaders warning of chaos. The NHS stockpiling medicines and desperate about staffing levels. The CBI and TUC all warning about a no-deal Brexit yet they just don't care passing it off as 'Project Fear".. as long as those pesky foreigners are kept out, and the Federalist Superstate is brought to heel, economic and social disaster is a small price to pay.

 

I'm done with them and their selfish, myopic idiocy. There's no changing them. There's no real debate. The will quite happily let the UK burn for generations to come because of right-wing propaganda that played perfectly to their echo chambers. I only wish they would at least have the guts to admit it.

Beautifully put Sir.

 

I'm now up to my 19th request for a brexiteer to explain why the pound isn't going up as we approach their well researched, costed and universally applauded new dawn - nothing yet !

 

It was a vote predominently based on racism - they would gain a smidgeon of respect if they just admitted it instead of cowering behind jingoistic baloney to divert the blindingly obvious!

[zorrow424]

25 minutes ago, Handsome Gardener said:

Beautifully put Sir.

 

I'm now up to my 19th request for a brexiteer to explain why the pound isn't going up as we approach their well researched, costed and universally applauded new dawn - nothing yet !

 

It was a vote predominently based on racism - they would gain a smidgeon of respect if they just admitted it instead of cowering behind jingoistic baloney to divert the blindingly obvious!

 

..but the £is going up,and as has been explained many times if you care to read,the uncertainty of Brexit contains doubt,once that is put to bed and a clear way ahead the £ will surge,it has been explained many times,just ignore it for yourself,keep pumping BS.   Was always in the planning the £s movements,keep asking and you sure will be answered,not in the way you suggest tho

...and if Brexit is racist,so what?,go report it to PC Plod,nothing you or anyone can do about it ,except blowing off on TVF,there ,that will get you worldwide respect  

[yogi100]

3 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

So why do you and your Brexiteer mates blame the EU?

 

Do you honestly believe that after Brexit unemployment in the UK will fall even further whilst at the same time wages will increase?

 

Speak for yourself; personally I don't hire the services of a girl anywhere, nor do I treat people, whatever their gender and age, as commodities.

"So why do you and your Brexiteer mates blame the EU?"

 

Cos if we were not in the EU their citizens and passport holders would not be taking British manual workers' jobs and everything else our politicians allow them to get their hands upon.

 

If the EU and our politicians had approached the policy of mass immigration in a sensible and responsible manner there would have been little or no clamouring for Brexit.

 

But 65% of our MPs and their lackies in the civil service thought they could ride rough shod over the man in the street ignoring the problems associated with immigration and Brexit was the result.

 

To turn things around will take time and a lot of measures that liberals will possibly find offensive and unacceptable.

[Scott]

Racist post removed.

 

[55Jay]

Well, good.  As the fertile nations continue spitting out kids by the dozen, without a pot to <deleted> in or a window to throw it out of, they cast their eyes to Uncle Sugar in the west, somewhere, anywhere, for a "better life". 

 

I don't blame them, but sorry you must apply, and be vetted for suitability. 

 

Good on ya' Boris.  The US of A should have tightened the net a long time ago.

[7by7]

2 hours ago, yogi100 said:

"So why do you and your Brexiteer mates blame the EU?"

 

Cos if we were not in the EU their citizens and passport holders would not be taking British manual workers' jobs and everything else our politicians allow them to get their hands upon.

 So here we are, going round in circles and back at your claim that mass immigration has taken the jobs of British workers.

 

A claim which has been proven to be false.

 

Mass immigration has not led to mass unemployment; a fact which is proven by the falling unemployment rate since the early 1990s.

 

I know you can't accept that fact, but that is your problem; one shared by many Brexiteers who simply cannot accept the truth because it shatters their prejudices. 

 

The ignorant rant which makes up the rest of your post is confirmation of that prejudice.

 

A rant in which you have failed to answer the important question: do you honestly believe that after Brexit unemployment in the UK will fall even further whilst at the same time wages will increase? 

 

The reason for your failure to answer is obvious; even you know that Brexit will not remove unemployment from the UK, will not see an increase in UK wages.

 

Employers who pay minimum wage will continue to do so after Brexit. And it is the UK government who sets the minimum wage in the UK, not the EU.

[yogi100]

2 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 So here we are, going round in circles and back at your claim that mass immigration has taken the jobs of British workers.

 

A claim which has been proven to be false.

 

Mass immigration has not led to mass unemployment; a fact which is proven by the falling unemployment rate since the early 1990s.

 

I know you can't accept that fact, but that is your problem; one shared by many Brexiteers who simply cannot accept the truth because it shatters their prejudices. 

 

The ignorant rant which makes up the rest of your post is confirmation of that prejudice.

 

A rant in which you have failed to answer the important question: do you honestly believe that after Brexit unemployment in the UK will fall even further whilst at the same time wages will increase? 

 

The reason for your failure to answer is obvious; even you know that Brexit will not remove unemployment from the UK, will not see an increase in UK wages.

 

Employers who pay minimum wage will continue to do so after Brexit. And it is the UK government who sets the minimum wage in the UK, not the EU.

Here is the answer I gave you.

 

"To turn things around will take time and a lot of measures that liberals will possibly find offensive and unacceptable."

 

Things will not be put right until Brexit has been achieved and politicians act on policies that will put us first in our country just like Trump is putting Americans first in his country. 

 

Then we won't have to answer to anyone and with the right leaders in power we'll be able to move on.

 

You won't like it but that's what happens when and if the people get a chance to demand change. Brexit is just the preliminary hurdle that needs to be crossed.

 

And how is that claim been proven to be false?

[tomacht8]

On 8/22/2019 at 5:41 AM, johnnybangkok said:

I agree. There is never an explanation because fundamentally the real reason is a pathological and unsubstantiated distrusts of Johnny foreigner. They hate being called racist or xenophobic but that's the real driving force behind the typical Brexiters rhetoric. There is literally no other reason as if you look at the facts; from the Working Time Directive, to the championing of better working conditions to women's equality, to global warming initiatives, clean air acts and the pushing of minimum wages throughout it's member states, this EU 'Federal State' that your typical Brexiter wants so desperately to demonize has done more for the man on the street than any UK government has in an awful long time.

'We voted leave and that's what democracy demands!' sounds much better than 'I've been racist/xenophobic/Islamophobic all my life and this gets me what I want'. 

I have called out many a Brexiter on this forum when they have slipped their mask (have a look at my Post 192 on this thread) and shown their true identity but it never matters. They continue on in with their uninspiring rhetoric and pseudo facts, cheering on the upper class as they literally drive the UK off an economic cliff. 

They have seen their UK pensions dwindle as the pound slowly but surely collapses. They are seeing every major economist warn of the disaster of a no-deal. You see health leaders warning of chaos. The NHS stockpiling medicines and desperate about staffing levels. The CBI and TUC all warning about a no-deal Brexit yet they just don't care passing it off as 'Project Fear".. as long as those pesky foreigners are kept out, and the Federalist Superstate is brought to heel, economic and social disaster is a small price to pay.

 

I'm done with them and their selfish, myopic idiocy. There's no changing them. There's no real debate. The will quite happily let the UK burn for generations to come because of right-wing propaganda that played perfectly to their echo chambers. I only wish they would at least have the guts to admit it.

Very good contribution. Brexit has become an ideology of British nationalists. All of Brexit has long since left the level of rational consideration. There are now more hate statments and personal insults. Instead of dealing soberly and rationally with the topic, any criticism of Brexit automatically leads to a confrontation.

And if you ask a Brexiteer what is improving for him personally, quite concretely. You never get a clear answer. 

At best only the statement copies of their fundalist preachers. 

 

But common hatred for certain groups like

- Remainers

- Polish plumbers

- Dark-skinned

- Romanians

- French people

- Germans

- EU politicians

- EU workers

- Muslims

connects the Brexit mass.

Hate is the kit of the nationalistic mass.

The image of the well behaved Brit who has shown the world how to line up in a queue has been lost.

 

[zorrow424]

3 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 So here we are, going round in circles and back at your claim that mass immigration has taken the jobs of British workers.

 

A claim which has been proven to be false.

 

Mass immigration has not led to mass unemployment; a fact which is proven by the falling unemployment rate since the early 1990s.

 

I know you can't accept that fact, but that is your problem; one shared by many Brexiteers who simply cannot accept the truth because it shatters their prejudices. 

 

The ignorant rant which makes up the rest of your post is confirmation of that prejudice.

 

A rant in which you have failed to answer the important question: do you honestly believe that after Brexit unemployment in the UK will fall even further whilst at the same time wages will increase? 

 

The reason for your failure to answer is obvious; even you know that Brexit will not remove unemployment from the UK, will not see an increase in UK wages.

 

Employers who pay minimum wage will continue to do so after Brexit. And it is the UK government who sets the minimum wage in the UK, not the EU.

You do not know precisely how Brexit will develop. Not only employment,but housing too. The tipping point for housing when the Slavic women accompanied by 8 offspring landed on(think Luton ) doorstep demanded public housing ,and got it

   No good keeping on building,there is a limit to how much the UK can absorb without destroying the environment   Mass immigration is finished,what Brexit was all about,nothing else

[FritsSikkink]

12 hours ago, zorrow424 said:

 

..but the £is going up,and as has been explained many times if you care to read,the uncertainty of Brexit contains doubt,once that is put to bed and a clear way ahead the £ will surge,it has been explained many times,just ignore it for yourself,keep pumping BS.   Was always in the planning the £s movements,keep asking and you sure will be answered,not in the way you suggest tho

...and if Brexit is racist,so what?,go report it to PC Plod,nothing you or anyone can do about it ,except blowing off on TVF,there ,that will get you worldwide respect  

The pound has declined to the THB since 2005. After Brexit, Scotland will leave the UK and the UK will loose a lot of revenue. this means the pound will nose dive even more.

[johnnybangkok]

10 hours ago, yogi100 said:

"So why do you and your Brexiteer mates blame the EU?"

 

Cos if we were not in the EU their citizens and passport holders would not be taking British manual workers' jobs and everything else our politicians allow them to get their hands upon.

 

If the EU and our politicians had approached the policy of mass immigration in a sensible and responsible manner there would have been little or no clamouring for Brexit.

 

But 65% of our MPs and their lackies in the civil service thought they could ride rough shod over the man in the street ignoring the problems associated with immigration and Brexit was the result.

 

To turn things around will take time and a lot of measures that liberals will possibly find offensive and unacceptable.

Well we can at least now put to bed your previous statement of 'Explain how it can be described asxenophobia, Islamophobia and downright racism. The 'R' word means very little any more because it's usually used to stifle argument. But don't be discouraged it was still a nice try.'' Your statement above is literally the definition of xenophobia (dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries).

But at least you are owning your prejudice now and although of course you are completely wrong and have been brainwashed by right-wing propaganda, I at least have some respect for someone like yourself who isn't at least pretending it was about something other than Johnny Foreigner and their own inherent prejudices.

Fact:- The average European migrant arriving in the UK in 2016 will contribute £78,000 more than they take out in public services and benefits over their time spent in the UK (assuming a balanced national budget), and the average non-European migrant will make a positive net contribution of £28,000 while living here. https://www.oxfordeconomics.com/recent-releases/8747673d-3b26-439b-9693-0e250df6dbba.

 

Migrants contribute more to Britain than they take, and will carry on doing so https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2018/09/26/migrants-contribute-more-to-britain-than-they-take-and-will-carry-on-doing-so.

 

https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/the-fiscal-impact-of-immigration-in-the-uk/

 

https://emerging-europe.com/news/eu-migrants-in-uk-are-net-contributors-to-economy/

 

I know you like to ignore them thar fancy facts and figures, preferring to class the whole of the UK from your own personal observations (example;- no white people on a ward when visiting your mate, Polish people undercutting your builder mates etc) but believe it or not, the UK is actually made up of more than the 5 square miles you get to see and experience. I have no doubt you absolutely believe whatever feeds into your prejudice but facts and stats matter and until you can actually produce some to corroborate your assertion that EU immigration has been a bad thing for the UK, we are only left with your heavily prejudice, myopic and ultimately wrong point of view.   

[johnnybangkok]

5 hours ago, zorrow424 said:

You do not know precisely how Brexit will develop. Not only employment,but housing too. The tipping point for housing when the Slavic women accompanied by 8 offspring landed on(think Luton ) doorstep demanded public housing ,and got it

   No good keeping on building,there is a limit to how much the UK can absorb without destroying the environment   Mass immigration is finished,what Brexit was all about,nothing else

Again I appreciate the fact you have been honest and said that Brexit was all about immigration. I'm glad you are owning your prejudice. However it is very easy to cherry pick and your delightful story about the Slavic woman (I can't find this anywhere on the internet so a source would be appreciated thank you) doesn't again lend to the overall picture of the situation https://www.statslife.org.uk/social-sciences/1616-despite-what-many-believe-immigrants-don-t-get-preferential-access-to-social-housing.

 

What I don't get though is why all of you guys keep blaming other disadvantaged people for your personal problems? It's literally the oldest trick in the political book; get the working man to blame the immigrants for all the problems in their life even though the country is run by billionaires and corporations. Let me ask you this? Personally, what effected you more?

1. The 2008 economic crisis that saw businesses go under and wide spread unemployment because a few City bankers needed a $2 million bonus instead of a $1 million bonus?

2. The ensuing recession that has seen wages stagnate for almost a decade with the average UK citizen seeing their purchasing power decrease to it's lowest in 40 years? 

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-economy/uk-consumers-suffer-longest-decline-in-spending-power-since-1970s-idUKKBN19L0XG.

3. Some of the harshest austerity measures implemented that literally penalised the poor for the faults of the rich.

4. A few immigrants who have been nett contributors to the economy.  

 

Yet you people can't see it. You just continue to fight among yourselves blaming and demonising people who have little choice in their life but to try and improve themselves and give a better start to their children. At the same time the billionaires and corporations get either huge tax breaks or in many cases don't pay any at all. They're just sitting back and laughing about how they are still getting away with all this and that YOU are focused on an exaggerated problem that pits worker against worker.

 

It's a non-problem created to keep your eyes away from where the real action is and your falling for it every single time. 

[dick dasterdly]

I agree with a lot of your post, but the FOM policy (influx of cheap workers from poor EU countries) certainly hasn't helped the poor/average in the UK.

 

But yes, UK politicians are equally as guilty as EU politicians in allowing this to happen as it suits their interests (and make no mistake, their interests are aligned to the wealthy.....) to ensure a supply of cheap labour.

 

This issue is not a "non-problem" for the lowest paid.

[johnnybangkok]

18 minutes ago, <deleted> dasterdly said:

I agree with a lot of your post, but the FOM policy (influx of cheap workers from poor EU countries) certainly hasn't helped the poor/average in the UK.

 

But yes, UK politicians are equally as guilty as EU politicians in allowing this to happen as it suits their interests (and make no mistake, their interests are aligned to the wealthy.....) to ensure a supply of cheap labour.

 

This issue is not a "non-problem" for the lowest paid.

The UK (like most of the EU) has a minimum wage. This means that no one is allowed, by law, to be paid under this amount. How does an 'influx of cheap workers from poor EU countries' effect this then?  If the job pays minimum wage (which defines the 'lowest paid') then EU nationals can't undercut UK nationals as there is a minimum.

Is it not more to do with the fact they are more willing to do the jobs that many UK nationals turn their noses up at?   

[bristolboy]

5 minutes ago, johnnybangkok said:

The UK (like most of the EU) has a minimum wage. This means that no one is allowed, by law, to be paid under this amount. How does an 'influx of cheap workers from poor EU countries' effect this then?  If the job pays minimum wage (which defines the 'lowest paid') then EU nationals can't undercut UK nationals as there is a minimum.

Is it not more to do with the fact they are more willing to do the jobs that many UK nationals turn their noses up at?   

Also has to do with the fact that the UK government is unwilling to aggressively enforce wage laws. 

[Handsome Gardener]

15 hours ago, zorrow424 said:

 

..but the £is going up,and as has been explained many times if you care to read,the uncertainty of Brexit contains doubt,once that is put to bed and a clear way ahead the £ will surge,it has been explained many times,just ignore it for yourself,keep pumping BS.   Was always in the planning the £s movements,keep asking and you sure will be answered,not in the way you suggest tho

...and if Brexit is racist,so what?,go report it to PC Plod,nothing you or anyone can do about it ,except blowing off on TVF,there ,that will get you worldwide respect  

Sorry come again ? where is the pound going up ? Do you live in a bubble ?

 

So the decimation of the pound was 'all in the planning' when Brexit happened correct ? What planning ? Where did this 'planning' take place ? When you made your vote the pound crashed on the back of the stupidity - it was nothing to do with planning.

 

Sorry for missing the explanation, run it past me again in detail - so the UK leaves the EU without a deal and you reckon the pound will surge correct ?  it would be pretty difficult for anyone to be more clueless than you are on this. 

 

Oh your uncertainty - the uncertainty centres around deal or no deal - if the latter you haven't seen anything yet when it comes to currency drops. To suggest the pound will rise in a no deal scenario is insane. 

 

Still at least you've admitted Brexit was racist and got 'Likes' from the others - so hats off to you, your mates are still cowering behind clichés rather than admit they're racist.