Transfering 800k bhat via Transferwise--not a good experience

[lopburi3]

13 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

T/W is all about lower sums, like monthly pension payments for which they are ideal. The O/P's experience. whilst unfortunate, isn't very typical.

Will add that did a 1k USD transfer late yesterday Bangkok time (ACH draw from bank) and it is due today - which is fast for US transfers.

[lopburi3]

6 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

I don't believe that to be true at all. What determines the code is which bank receives the and from which bank it came from. 

From reports it has been 100% for those using Bangkok Bank (which is the FTT code user) - if you select Thai reason from drop down menu the money will be sent directly to BBL and appear at FTT transaction.

[lopburi3]

12 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

0.25% of whatever you have sent.

1/4% of the baht amount after conversion but normally limited to not less than 200 baht nor more than 500 baht per transaction.

[dimitriv]

13 hours ago, OZinPattaya said:

Transferwise cannot do a direct debit on your originating bank account if the amount is larger than 15,000 USD (I'm only talking here of American Bank accounts, not sure if this applies to other western countries).

 

So, if you try to transfer the equivalent of 800k bhat you will have to initiate a wire transfer with your American bank, which means you will incur a wire transfer fee from your originating bank.

 

In the EU they cannot do direct debits, even not for small amounts.

 

We can wire the money. And because it is inside the EU we do not have to pay transaction fees for this.

 

 

 

[soalbundy]

12 hours ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

Americans certainly have more issues with Thai banks. I opend an account at a rural branch of Bangkok Bank and the manager popped to ask if I was American. I replied that I wasn't and he said "That's OK then......... we don't like Americans"..

 

I was slightly taken aback but was aware that Thais can be direct (to the point of racist) at times.

It's nothing to do with racism, banks in many countries don't like having Americans as customers due to all the yearly form filing they have to do to satisfy the the American tax people since Americans are taxed by America on all income whether earned in the states or abroad, Americans cause unnecessary expense to the banks compared to a European.

[yogavnture]

my wells fargo banker does not charge me any wire fees. the only fee i pay is when i get screwed on the exhange rate.  i dont know who does this but i suspect its the bank onthe other side

[lopburi3]

7 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

Americans cause unnecessary expense to the banks compared to a European.

Actually once information is on computers it is no extra expense at all - much ado about nothing and something banks are paid to do.  

11 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

I replied that I wasn't and he said "That's OK then......... we don't like Americans"..

That sounds more like I don't like anyone asking questions - I am the manager thinking/talking than actual policy.

[lopburi3]

2 minutes ago, yogavnture said:

my wells fargo banker does not charge me any wire fees. the only fee i pay is when i get screwed on the exhange rate.  i dont know who does this but i suspect its the bank onthe other side

The Thai exchange rate is clearly posted on every banks website - suspect if getting hit your exchange is not being made in Thailand but your bank is sending baht at a bad exchange rate.

[Longcut]

Not sure why it would matter if it showed up as FTT. Since you are sending the whole 800,000 at one time. 

 The only reason to show up as an FTT transfer, is if you are sending monthly amounts that equal 65,000 baht or greater and you were needing proof of that.

[Sheryl]

I too had bad exoerience.

 

First, like you, I tried to do a transfer by direct debit over the 15k threshold because I did not know about it and as I recall it was not readily apparent why it did mot go through.

 

Once I learned about the threshold I then tried again with amount just below it. At that point, having obtained all my banking and personal data, they abruptly closed my account and refused to give a reason. Or to delete my data.

 

Presumably something triggered a risk algorithm but I have no idea what. I was transferring from a US  bank account in my own name to a Thai bank account also in my own name.

[jacko45k]

14 minutes ago, Longcut said:

Not sure why it would matter if it showed up as FTT. Since you are sending the whole 800,000 at one time. 

 The only reason to show up as an FTT transfer, is if you are sending monthly amounts that equal 65,000 baht or greater and you were needing proof of that.

If converting a Visa Exempt or Tourist Visa Entry to that of a Non-Imm-O Entry, I believe you have to show the money came in from overseas. If doing an Extension, not. 

I believe FTT tag is pretty certain into Bangkok Bank if a person selects the last 'Long Term Stay in Thailand' drop down option. 

Edited October 30, 2019 by jacko45k

[Moonlover]

56 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

51 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

I don't believe that to be true at all. What determines the code is which bank receives the and from which bank it came from. 

 

56 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

From reports it has been 100% for those using Bangkok Bank (which is the FTT code user) - if you select Thai reason from drop down menu the money will be sent directly to BBL and appear at FTT transaction.

Of course BBK users will get a FTT because it's a direct route, BBK to BBK. And I do believe it was thus before T/W introduced that new category.

 

However when the final destination is another Thai bank it becomes a domestic transfer and thus losses it's 'foreign status'. I bank with Krungsri and have never a FTT code, but as I've said, in the end it did not matter,

 

Personally, I think it is just a bit of kidologoly on the part T/W due to all the pestering they received on this subject. All these transfers are done automatically. There is no human in the chain to read the 'reason why'.

 

 

Edited October 30, 2019 by Moonlover

[digbeth]

13 hours ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

Americans certainly have more issues with Thai banks. I opend an account at a rural branch of Bangkok Bank and the manager popped to ask if I was American. I replied that I wasn't and he said "That's OK then......... we don't like Americans"..

 

I was slightly taken aback but was aware that Thais can be direct (to the point of racist) at times.

There's actually extra paperwork with tax compliance if Amerians open bank account in Thailand

[kevin612]

Transfer wise and expensive for Americans.

[lopburi3]

13 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Of course BBK users will get a FTT because it's a direct route, BBK to BBK. And I do believe it was thus before T/W introduced that new category.

The reason for the category is TW uses 3 banks for transfers and in July they routed all BBL transfers via another so they appeard as local transfer.  They still use other banks for transfer to BBL if you do not select the Thai option - but if you do it gets direct routing and appears as FTT.  They have tried to help people - it does not require human intervention to read computer code.

[lopburi3]

1 hour ago, lopburi3 said:

Will add that did a 1k USD transfer late yesterday Bangkok time (ACH draw from bank) and it is due today - which is fast for US transfers.

Actually see that it arrived at 0518 - reason for transfer selection was medical so not direct.  Was also not listed as SMART (as has been the case in the past when not direct) but as "Transfer from Account at Other Bank".

[Moonlover]

8 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

The reason for the category is TW uses 3 banks for transfers and in July they routed all BBL transfers via another so they appeard as local transfer.  They still use other banks for transfer to BBL if you do not select the Thai option - but if you do it gets direct routing and appears as FTT.  They have tried to help people - it does not require human intervention to read computer code.

Maybe, maybe not. But as I've said repeatedly, it doesn't matter. Immigration know about T/W and will accept the transaction slip as proof of foreign remittance. The coding is irrelevant.

[Martyp]

I used the 800,000k method and, as others have said, there is no need to show that it is a foreign transfer. More specifically, that is the case when you purchase an O-A visa in your home country and then eventually apply for a 1 year extension of stay.

 

I wouldn't assume that a direct transfer to your Thai bank will show up as a foreign transfer. I transfer money directly from Bank of America to Kasikorn bank every other month and it shows up as a local transfer every time presumably because it is being routed through another Thai bank. If necessary you can request something called a credit advise which, I think, will document the money transfer back to the US.

 

Just a warning about Wells Fargo. I was a Wells Fargo customer for 35 years. The first week I got to Thailand in 2017 I set up wire transfers and tried a test transfer of $200. For various reasons they tagged the transfer as fraudulent and froze all of my accounts and credit cards. I called them and provided my verbal password but they insisted that I return to the US and show two forms of ID to unfreeze the accounts. They acknowledged that my verbal password was correct. I flew back to the US to unfreeze the accounts. I later got reimbursed when I filed a complaint with the US Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. In any case, the point is that in 2017 Wells Fargo had no way to identify me when I was outside the country (in spite of my decades as a customer). I hoped this has changed. A couple of months later I switch to Bank of America and have been happy with them.

[wgdanson]

1 hour ago, Moonlover said:

And I do believe it was thus before T/W introduced that new category.

It was in July/Aug this year when some tramsfers to Bkk Bank went via Kasikorn bank first due to a 'software malfunction'' so did not show as an FTT on Bkk Bank book.

Edited October 30, 2019 by wgdanson

[lopburi3]

1 minute ago, wgdanson said:

It was in July/Aug this year when some tramsfers to Bkk Bank went via another bank first due to a 'software malfunction''

Not just in the past - I have made a number of transfers in the last several months not using the Thailand option and most have not arrived as FTT - the transfers I did select as Thailand have indeed arrived as FTT.

[JimGant]

18 hours ago, OZinPattaya said:

So, if you try to transfer the equivalent of 800k bhat you will have to initiate a wire transfer with your American bank, which means you will incur a wire transfer fee from your originating bank.

Which, at those amounts (+$26,500), a wire transfer for Americans is much superior than TW. For the OP's 800k baht ($26,500), a TW would cost $181. For a SWIFT wire of the same amount, it would be in the neighborhood of $45 wire fee, 500 baht ($17) backend fee. Yeah, a few dollars savings due to the TW superior FX rate; but certainly not enough to noticeably affect the nearly $120 difference. Plus, with the wire, you'll get the FTT coding.

 

Do Americans read the glowing European reports on the cost of TW transactions -- and just assume the same applies to them? [the actual crossover favoring a wire for Americans is between $4 to $5,0000]. Actually, TW could just take your $26,500; walk to the bank next door; do a SWIFT transfer (cost: 45+17=$62); charge you the advertised $181; and pocket as profit the $119 (less two dollars for shoe leather from the walk next door). Apparently this model works, otherwise they'd have used the huge $119 buffer to make their rates more competitive with SWIFT transfers. Meanwhile, these Baltic State geniuses are laughing all the way to their yacht broker.

[LivinLOS]

19 hours ago, OZinPattaya said:

Secondly, and there has much discussion on this forum about this, is that in no way, shape, or form, can Transferwise guarantee that the transfer will show up as an international/foreign/FT transfer. There is no "hard-coding" this as has been suggested by some on TVF. This means that if you transfer your 800k bhat you have no guarantee whatsoever that it will show for visa purposes as an FT transfer and you will receive no refund from Transferwise if it does not.

Theres no requirement for the 800k seasoned in the bank to have been sent that way ??! 

 

The entire premise seems off.. 

[Nyezhov]

9 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Which, at those amounts (+$26,500), a wire transfer for Americans is much superior than TW. For the OP's 800k baht ($26,500), a TW would cost $181. For a SWIFT wire of the same amount, it would be in the neighborhood of $45 wire fee, 500 baht ($17) backend fee. Yeah, a few dollars savings due to the TW superior FX rate; but certainly not enough to noticeably affect the nearly $120 difference. Plus, with the wire, you'll get the FTT coding.

 

Do Americans read the glowing European reports on the cost of TW transactions -- and just assume the same applies to them? [the actual crossover favoring a wire for Americans is between $4 to $5,0000]. Actually, TW could just take your $26,500; walk to the bank next door; do a SWIFT transfer (cost: 45+17=$62); charge you the advertised $181; and pocket as profit the $119 (less two dollars for shoe leather from the walk next door). Apparently this model works, otherwise they'd have used the huge $119 buffer to make their rates more competitive with SWIFT transfers. Meanwhile, these Baltic State geniuses are laughing all the way to their yacht broker.

Transferwise is an easy way for me to cheaply get normal amounts Thai baht into my accounts. I would never use it for amounts that would raise their fees over a wire.

[Jip99]

5 hours ago, soalbundy said:

It's nothing to do with racism, banks in many countries don't like having Americans as customers due to all the yearly form filing they have to do to satisfy the the American tax people since Americans are taxed by America on all income whether earned in the states or abroad, Americans cause unnecessary expense to the banks compared to a European.

 

I can assure you that this manager of BKB, Ban Kruat was racist.

[JimGant]

5 hours ago, lopburi3 said:

Will add that did a 1k USD transfer late yesterday Bangkok time (ACH draw from bank) and it is due today - which is fast for US transfers.

Lop, at these lower numbers TW is indeed the best option -- for most. However, if you have a free domestic wire option with your bank, as I do, a $2000 transfer by domestic wire via Bangkok Bank NY would cost $5 plus 200 baht ($7-), for a total of $12. A similar TW transaction would cost $19.30. Free FTT encoding with wire transfer. Also, my last domestic wire thru BB NY took only 18 hours to arrive in country.

 

Yeah, most don't have free domestic wire options. But probably more than realize, as I didn't know I'd been granted that option 'til I initiated my first domestic wire. Check it out.

[hansnl]

19 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Americans always seem to have more problems than Europeans.

I guess it's your country being 'money laundering' difficult.

The Thai Bank uses a description for the transfer into your account unique to TW transfers.

In KTB it get the BDS22 code.

The tax office ought to know these codes, or ask the bank to give you a letter which code is used for TW transfers.

And yes, the difficulties come from the US banks, and the federal government, both want to track money flowing for taxation, money laundering etc.

[JimGant]

6 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Transferwise is an easy way for me to cheaply get normal amounts Thai baht into my accounts. I would never use it for amounts that would raise their fees over a wire.

For the sake of my fellow Americans, allow me to interject "knowingly" between your "never" and "use."  After all, we smart Americans stumbled into WWI, and lost 120,000 young men, for an Old World cause. Not too bright, at (many) times.

[Jeffrey346]

18 hours ago, seajae said:

TW actually state that the money is not sent internationally but simply deposited in your account from a thai account after it is deposited/transferred to their account by you in the originating country, this is how they keep the prices down. All my TW transfers to my Bangkok bank account used to show up as foreign transfers until recently when they changed their banks but you can still show the correlation of your original deposit in the US and the arrival in your thai account to show it is from overseas. I am sure someone in here on another thread said they are able to get bank statements also showing it is originally from overseas. Been with TW for several years, they have always been very transparent about what they do

I transfer 2 times a month from the US to BKK Bank. All my transfer except 1 came in as International transfers.

[lopburi3]

26 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Lop, at these lower numbers TW is indeed the best option -- for most. However, if you have a free domestic wire option with your bank, as I do, a $2000 transfer by domestic wire via Bangkok Bank NY would cost $5 plus 200 baht ($7-), for a total of $12. A similar TW transaction would cost $19.30. Free FTT encoding with wire transfer. Also, my last domestic wire thru BB NY took only 18 hours to arrive in country.

 

Yeah, most don't have free domestic wire options. But probably more than realize, as I didn't know I'd been granted that option 'til I initiated my first domestic wire. Check it out.

Actually your figures do not make TW more expensive even with your free wire - you got an exchange rate of 30.215 from TW yesterday when TW made - todays rate from Bangkok Bank would be 30.05 for money received today.

Total baht into account 59,846 using TW

Total baht into account 59,749 using BBL

[scubascuba3]

11 hours ago, thinktoomuch said:

 

It's good news that some IOs will accept the Transferwise transaction slip as proof that they are foreign remittances. Hopefully they all will allow this in future.

 

When looking at transfer costs from the UK I find that transfers of about £5,000 or more are currently cheaper when using other methods like transferring from a Starling Bank account rather than using Transferwise but it's marginal even for £21,000 at current exchange rates.

 

For example at the time of writing the amount received from £21,000 sent to Thailand as Thai Baht would be 

 

813,331.25 Starling Bank (less any receiving bank SWIFT fee)

812,164.33 Transferwise

 

Both estimated delivery dates are the 31st of October 2019.

You may also have to deduct any SWIFT receiving fee for your Thai bank (I think it is fairly small with Bangkok Bank).

Of course these numbers will change as the exchange rate does.

 

The difference isn't huge and using Transferwise you would have some certainty over the costs and if you have used them before, the process too.

 

 

 

Thanks for posting about this.

 

There is indeed now as "Funds for long term stay in Thailand" option.

 

I didn't see that option when I sent funds across a couple of weeks ago so either it's very new or I missed it.

 

Is there a place on this site where useful information like this is collated?

 

I used Starling Bank for a test transfer and it didn't go well, it took a week to settle and didn't settle as foreign, plus the rate wasn't the best available plus charges added at the thai bank account