Compulsory Third Party Insurance - What driver (s) is/are covered

[gdhm]

Hi I have searched the internet but still am confused. Perhaps someone can clarify situation for me.

 

I appreciate all registered vehicles must have CTPI otherwise a Road Tax disc will not be issued. I also appreciate CTPI only covers injuires to people not property so is very limited..

 

What I do not understand is Although my motorcycle and Pickup both have CTPI taken out in my name in my name does that cover cover ONLY me driving my vehicles or does it cover over any person with drivers license for my class of vehicle who I allow to use my vehicle OR does a different driver need to have CTPI in their own name for their own vehicles in same group which would cover them if suing my vehicle.

 

Essentially what I am asking does my CTPI in my name cover only me to drive my Pickup or Motorcycle (and others vehicles) OR does it cover me and any driver holding a drivers license for class of my vehicle, who drive my vehicle.

 

Example

1) if I wanted a friend with a drivers license to drive my pickup to get its road worthiness certificate does My CTPI cover them whilst driving my pickup.

2) If I was taken ill and someone wanted to drive me to hospital in my pickup are they automatically covered to drive under MY CTPI  if they hold a driving license for my class of vehicle?

 

My apologies if my questions sound confused or ignorant.

 

Many thanks

 

 

 

 

Edited December 28, 2019 by gdhm

[MeePeeMai]

4 minutes ago, gdhm said:

cover over any person with drivers license for my class of vehicle who I allow to use my vehicle

This is the way I understand it.  It is on the vehicle itself and any licensed driver operating that vehicle is covered under that insurance.

 

This also applies to optional insurance such as the 1st class coverage I have on my vehicle.  When asked, my insurer stated that it does not matter who is driving the vehicle as long as they are properly licensed (and not drunk or high on drugs) then the insurance is in effect (should there be an accident).

[scubascuba3]

7 minutes ago, MeePeeMai said:

This is the way I understand it.  It is on the vehicle itself and any licensed driver operating that vehicle is covered under that insurance.

 

This also applies to optional insurance such as the 1st class coverage I have on my vehicle.  When asked, my insurer stated that it does not matter who is driving the vehicle as long as they are properly licensed (and not drunk or high on drugs) then the insurance is in effect (should there be an accident).

This is my understanding too, maybe the op can double check the RVP website

 

https://www.rvp.co.th/index_en.php

[MeePeeMai]

For por ror bor coverage, see this thread -

 

 

[sirineou]

I will admit I don't know the answer  and and would be interested in the answer since when we are not in Thailand others drive our car.

I don't know in Thailand , but insurance is insurance and I don't think Thai insurers are stupid.

In insurance, your driving record, affects your premium, so how would a insurance company determine the premium for drivers it does not know? I would say drivers that are not included in the policy are not covered, but I don't know that for a fact.

[gdhm]

Thanks all.

 

My understanding has always been the same as MeePeeMai and scubascuba3. I only became concerned/confused when in a different topic i mentioned if someone else drove my pickup in an emergency" and a poster asked whether I'd allow an uninsured person to drive my pickup. I had always thought to that point. Current Driving License holder of same class of vehicle is allowed to drive my pickup with min CTPI but that question threw me. Not that I consider CTPI adequate but is a matter of legality as well.

 

I actually have Comprehensive insurance on my Pickup but it is only for me as named driver (so only I would be covered under that)

Edited December 28, 2019 by gdhm

[MeePeeMai]

24 minutes ago, sirineou said:

I will admit I don't know the answer  and and would be interested in the answer since when we are not in Thailand others drive our car.

I don't know in Thailand , but insurance is insurance and I don't think Thai insurers are stupid.

In insurance, your driving record, affects your premium, so how would a insurance company determine the premium for drivers it does not know? I would say drivers that are not included in the policy are not covered, but I don't know that for a fact.

 

In the USA, policies are issued to the registered owner(s) of the vehicle for which they usually require traffic abstract(s), proof of driving licenses, current tax and safety or smog inspection stickers for vehicle at least for the initial (or first time) coverage. 

 

The rate you pay is affected by the driving records/ages/previous DWI's etc. of those listed on your policy (think high risk teen aged drivers and great grandpa who is 90 yrs old).  Any additional driver's must usually be listed as "additional drivers" on your policy (as easy as calling your insurance company and adding someone who will be driving your car/truck). 

 

If your vehicle is being loaned to a friend or neighbor (who is not listed on your policy as an additional driver) and is involved in an accident then it is usually his/her own policy that pays for the injuries and damages as your insurer can deny coverage for the unlisted driver who you loaned your vehicle to. 

 

Same goes when renting a vehicle for example.  If I am involved in a fender bender in a rent a car in my state or country and I opted out of the "optional additional insurance coverage" for the rental, my insurance will cover me for the accident (as long as it is a similar vehicle i.e. not a high dollar racing sports car etc), or if I borrow the neighbor's vehicle and have an accident then my insurer would cover me (for any injuries and/or damages to the borrowed vehicle) in that case.

 

Obviously it is not done that way here (at least for now).  I paid the same rate for my vehicle here as the person who owned the vehicle before me and I did not need to add my wife or anybody else as an additional driver as I was told that it doesn't matter who drives the vehicle as long as they have a driving license.  It seems that they care not about your driving record or who is driving the vehicle here.

 

This may or may not change now since the "points" based driving license rule is now in effect here in Thailand.  I suspect and I am surprised that they have not caught on to this golden goose opportunity (yet).  It is a real cash machine for the insurance industry in the USA.

Edited December 28, 2019 by MeePeeMai

[Peterw42]

OP, its any driver for the por lor bor insurance. You can think of it as the vehicle is insured for anyone injured in an accident involving that vehicle. I have made claims, the vehicle was in my wifes name at the time and driven by me. Nobody even asked for licenses or who was driving..

A non licensed person can own a car and pay the por lor bor insurance, my mother inlaw does just that, her son dries her around in it. Por lor bor covers the person in the drivers seat, or the passenger seat, or someone you run over, whether the accident victum has a license is irrelevant.

 

 

Edited December 28, 2019 by Peterw42

[KhaoYai]

1 hour ago, MeePeeMai said:

This also applies to optional insurance such as the 1st class coverage I have on my vehicle. 

Yes, on your vehicle but times are changing. My 1st class motorbike insurance only covers me - no other riders. The last car I insured in Thailand also had a limit of 6 drivers - and all of these had to be named.  Vehicle insurance in Thailand is not the same as it used to be and people may not even be aware their vehicle is not covered 'for any driver'. Whilst I believe the majority of policies are still 'any driver' - many aren't. Compulsory insurance though. still covers anyone legally entitled to drive the particular vehicle.

[Peterw42]

8 minutes ago, MeePeeMai said:

 

In the USA, policies are issued to the registered owner(s) of the vehicle for which they usually require traffic abstract(s), proof of driving licenses, current tax and safety or smog inspection stickers for vehicle at least for the initial (or first time) coverage. 

 

The rate you pay is affected by the driving records/ages/previous DWI's etc. of those listed on your policy (think high risk teen aged drivers and great grandpa who is 90 yrs old).  Any additional driver's must usually be listed as "additional drivers" on your policy (as easy as calling your insurance company and adding someone who will be driving your car/truck). 

 

If your vehicle is being loaned to a friend or neighbor (who is not listed on your policy as an additional driver) and is involved in an accident then it is usually his/her own policy that pays for the injuries and damages as your insurer can deny coverage for the unlisted driver who you loaned your vehicle to. 

 

Same goes when renting a vehicle for example.  If I am involved in a fender bender in a rent a car in my state or country and I opted out of the "optional additional insurance coverage" for the rental, my insurance will cover me for the accident (as long as it is a similar vehicle i.e. not a high dollar racing sports car etc).

 

Obviously it is not done that way here (at least for now).  I paid the same rate for my vehicle here as the person who owned the vehicle before me and I did not need to add my wife or anybody else as an additional driver as I was told that it doesn't matter who drives the vehicle as long as they have a driving license.  It seems that they care not about your driving record or who is driving the vehicle here.

 

This may or may not change now since the "points" based driving license rule is now in effect here in Thailand.  I suspect and I am surprised that they have not caught on to this golden goose opportunity (yet).  It is a real cash machine for the insurance industry in the USA.

The OP is talking about the compulsory 3rd party insurance, not a policy you may take out to cover damage or liability. There is no nominating a driver/s with the 3rd party insurance, its the insurance thats built into the car registration.

[MeePeeMai]

8 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

The OP is talking about the compulsory 3rd party insurance, not a policy you may take out to cover damage or liability. There is no nominating a driver/s with the 3rd party insurance, its the insurance thats built into the car registration.

Right... and I may have gone off topic a bit but the OP did state that " I actually have Comprehensive insurance on my Pickup but it is only for me as named driver (so only I would be covered under that)."

[impulse]

I took a look at the coverage limits for compulsory, and I concluded that it doesn't really cover anyone for anything significant. 

 

Strangely, to register my truck, compulsory insurance was required in addition to my voluntary policy that covered me for 10 million baht per accident.  My truck was too old the get comprehensive or collision coverage, which was fine by me since I could replace the truck out of pocket.

 

Edit:  I'd also add that my voluntary coverage had a provision to pay my bail if I got arrested for any traffic violations.  That, alone, was good reason to pay the money.  To anyone looking at auto insurance- do your diligence.  It's different in Thailand.

 

Edited December 28, 2019 by impulse

[MeePeeMai]

10 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

Yes, on your vehicle but times are changing. My 1st class motorbike insurance only covers me - no other riders. The last car I insured in Thailand also had a limit of 6 drivers - and all of these had to be named.  Vehicle insurance in Thailand is not the same as it used to be and people may not even be aware their vehicle is not covered 'for any driver'. Whilst I believe the majority of policies are still 'any driver' - many aren't. Compulsory insurance though. still covers anyone legally entitled to drive the particular vehicle.

Yes my 1st class insurance on my bike only covers myself (as you stated).  My 1st class insurance on my vehicle is Viriya.  Thanks for the info, I was unaware that they are slowly moving away from the "any driver" stance.

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, MeePeeMai said:

This is the way I understand it.  It is on the vehicle itself and any licensed driver operating that vehicle is covered under that insurance.

 

This also applies to optional insurance such as the 1st class coverage I have on my vehicle.  When asked, my insurer stated that it does not matter who is driving the vehicle as long as they are properly licensed (and not drunk or high on drugs) then the insurance is in effect (should there be an accident).

My understanding also.

[impulse]

33 minutes ago, MeePeeMai said:

In the USA, policies are issued to the registered owner(s) of the vehicle for which they usually require traffic abstract(s), proof of driving licenses, current tax and safety or smog inspection stickers for vehicle at least for the initial (or first time) coverage. 

 

That may be true in some states, but last year when I bought a van in Texas, I had to present proof of insurance to get it registered.  That meant I had to get insurance before I could present them with tax or registration documents.

 

So it's a case of "which came first, the chicken or the egg?"

 

 

[jackdd]

The compulsary insurance covers everybody using this vehicle, it doesn't even matter if the driver is underage, unlicensed or whatever

[MeePeeMai]

1 minute ago, impulse said:

 

That may be true in some states, but last year when I bought a van in Texas, I had to present proof of insurance to get it registered.  That meant I had to get insurance before I could present them with tax or registration documents.

 

So it's a case of "which came first, the chicken or the egg?"

555 it's the opposite in Hawaii,

 

In Hawaii they don't ask for proof of insurance when you register the vehicle, they only ask to see the safety inspection paperwork (must be up to date) and your driver's license.  If your safety inspection is expired, one must go get a safety inspection done first and get a temporary inspection paper to show the DMV to get the reg/tax sticker and paperwork. 

 

Then you must go back to the safety inspection station and show them the new vehicle registration sticker/paperwork in order to get the safety inspection sticker put on your car and get the appropriate inspection paperwork to show the cops if you get stopped.

 

The only time you are asked to see proof of car insurance is when you go to get your safety inspection done or you get stopped by the police (I know, it's ridiculous). 

[impulse]

2 minutes ago, MeePeeMai said:

555 it's the opposite in Hawaii,

 

In Hawaii they don't ask for proof of insurance when you register the vehicle, they only ask to see the safety inspection paperwork (must be up to date) and your driver's license.  If your safety inspection is expired, one must go get a safety inspection done first and get a temporary inspection paper to show the DMV to get the reg/tax sticker and paperwork. 

 

Then you must go back to the safety inspection station and show them the new vehicle registration sticker/paperwork in order to get the safety inspection sticker put on your car and get the appropriate inspection paperwork to show the cops if you get stopped.

 

The only time you are asked to see proof of car insurance is when you go to get your safety inspection done or you get stopped by the police (I know, it's ridiculous). 

 

In Texas, it's all tied to your VIN.  They actually plug your car's ODB into the state's computer via the interweb when you get it inspected.  So there's no cheating by the inspection stations.  The insurance companies report whether your car has insurance tied to it- by VIN.  So the cops know all about your car's legal status even before they ask to see any documents.  All they need to know is who's driving it.

 

It was actually a little spooky how much info they had even when I signed up for insurance.  My policy had several exclusions (drivers NOT covered) that I recognized as related to the previous owner of the van.  Then when I took it in to get it registered, they looked up the insurance and inspection records on the state computer.  Scary...

 

[MeePeeMai]

Just now, impulse said:

 

In Texas, it's all tied to your VIN.  They actually plug your car's ODB into the state's computer via the interweb when you get it inspected.  So there's no cheating by the inspection stations.  The insurance companies report whether your car has insurance tied to it- by VIN.  So the cops know all about your car's legal status even before they ask to see any documents.  All they need to know is who's driving it.

 

It was actually a little spooky how much info they had even when I signed up for insurance.  My policy had several exclusions (drivers NOT covered) that I recognized as related to the previous owner of the van.  Then when I took it in to get it registered, they looked up the insurance and inspection records on the state computer.  Scary...

 

Wow, I wondered how they did that in Texas!  I visited my Mom there a couple of years ago and I got stopped for speeding...

 

I was doing 55 in the left lane of a 4 lane divided hwy (in a 55 MPH zone at night) when a car came flying up behind me with his brights on so I sped up a little to pull over into the right lane ahead of the traffic that was to my right when I got lit up and stopped.  I actually was thinking that this must either be a cop or a drunk so I'm getting out of his way.  It was a cop and I got a warning for doing 60 in a 55.

 

He asked for my driver's license and registration so I gave them to him along with my insurance papers and then he said "I didn't ask to see your insurance, I know the vehicle is insured."  I didn't ask him but I wondered how in the hell he knew it was current.

 

Thanks for the education!

[Kwasaki]

https://www.frank.co.th/en/car-insurance/ctpl-insurance

[digbeth]

even with the 'voluntary' 1st or 2nd class insurance, the default coverage is anyone appropriately licenced and not under influence of drugs/alcohol, you can then add a named driver(s) for additional discounts of the premiums.

 

only no claims history and how long you have been with the insurer of the vehicle is used in calculating discounts of the premium so age and driving history of the driver hardly matters 

[impulse]

27 minutes ago, MeePeeMai said:

He asked for my driver's license and registration so I gave them to him along with my insurance papers and then he said "I didn't ask to see your insurance, I know the vehicle is insured."  I didn't ask him but I wondered how in the hell he knew it was current.

 

The way it used to be, people would get an annual policy with monthly payments, make the first payment to get the card, then quit paying.  Or get a fake card for a few bucks... 

 

No more.

 

[MeePeeMai]

7 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

The way it used to be, people would get an annual policy with monthly payments, make the first payment to get the card, then quit paying.  Or get a fake card for a few bucks...

And this is still happening in Hawaii to this day.  Hawaii is a "no fault state".  Many just get insurance to get the safety inspection and the card and then cancel it but keep driving... that is why (those of us that are insured year round) have to pay for additional coverage called "Uninsured" and "Underinsured" motorist coverage... which adds up quite a bit.

 

Estimates are that around 20% of all Hawaii drivers are uninsured.

 

Sounds like Texas has closed these loopholes.  I wonder if Thailand will soon mandate more than just the compulsory insurance for trucks and cars as it seems quite inadequate and if you can afford to drive a truck or a car here then you should be able to afford some real insurance.

Edited December 28, 2019 by MeePeeMai

[impulse]

11 minutes ago, MeePeeMai said:

And this is still happening in Hawaii to this day.  Hawaii is a "no fault state".  Many just get insurance to get the safety inspection and the card and then cancel it but keep driving... that is why (those of us that are insured year round) have to pay for additional coverage called "Uninsured" and "Underinsured" motorist coverage... which adds up quite a bit.

 

Sounds like Texas has closed these loopholes.  I wonder if Thailand will soon mandate more than just the compulsory insurance for trucks and cars as it seems quite inadequate and if you can afford to drive a truck or a car here then you should be able to afford some real insurance.

 

One thing I'll say about Thailand is that, for the same liability limits, my insurance payment in Thailand was about 1/8 of my cost in Texas.  Keeping in mind I had (and have) 3rd class insurance (no collision, theft, etc), I paid peanuts for some hefty coverage in Thailand.  There are advantages to living in countries that aren't lawsuit happy.

 

Edited December 28, 2019 by impulse

[stevenl]

9 hours ago, jackdd said:

The compulsary insurance covers everybody using this vehicle, it doesn't even matter if the driver is underage, unlicensed or whatever

Exactly.

For these things, please leave thoughts 'this is how this is done in ...' at home.

Everybody is covered, license or not.

[gdhm]

Once again thanks everybody for you input. Its been very helpful.