Top 10 building mistakes in Thailand and SE asia. 2019

[Don Chance]

This is useful list if you are building new or buying used. I've noticed after years in Asia.

 

1. Roofing.

- No roof. Flat roofs are not water proof. Need black tar or rubber membrane or water will leak through columns into top floor.

- Roof too small. Like a yamaka, water runs over building or onto roof. Roof should extend over building and balconies.

- Roof should be vented on the sides and or ridge vents.

- Concrete panel roofing. Beware of asbestos. Common in Thailand.

 

2. Exterior.

- Exterior walls should be water proofed with rubberized paint or even tar.. Water resistant paint will not be good enough. Ideally foam board insulation glued onto the walls will keep the building cool. Stucco or spray foam onto exterior walls also will work.

- Strange ledges extending from the floor to the exterior. Bad design will allow water to enter structure and under neath flooring. Can be cut off completely removed. Or water proofed with rubber or tar. This is just lazy ways of building so they can work more easily on the exterior.

- Balconies. Tiles are not water proof will leak eventually and enter the floor. Needs underlay, water proof slab or Schluter-DITRA Tile Underlayment.

 

 

3. Foundations. Avoid slab foundation. Rather pier style raised or crawl space.  Slab foundation need to be have rubber water shield under neath before pouring concrete. Barrier should extend up the side of the building.  Thailand is prone to monsoon floods. Other wise you have a wet, damp slab. Moisture will rise up into the house and cause problems.

 

4. Septic.  Never put a septic under the build it self should be set away from the house. Avoid buying a unit with the septic underneath, it will smell and mold will rise up into the house.

Septic tanks should be away from the structure a 2-3 meters, needs 3" vents intake and out take (google septic venting diagram)

Sewage connected to municipality should have back flow protection to prevent snakes and odors from entering the building.

 

5. Plumbing

Asian plumbing does not include stack vent. This will make the drains function much better and also displace sewer gas. Otherwise sewer gas will rise up to various parts of the building, infect structure will mold. (google stack venting plumbing for diagram.)

 

6. Floor tiling.

Most building have mold under the tiles in Asia ( more western people suffer from mold allergies than Asians.) This is because the slab is wet and is unable to dry out, so mold grows. There needs to a air gap, a dimpled plastic sheet such as DMX air gap. There are also chemical sealants that can be applied to the sub floor.

 

Another issue i see in new builds is the adhesive or mortar used for the tiles is wet. The tile go over it and the glue can not dry because no air can reach. The adhesive or mortar needs to be put down then left to dry awhile so it is sticky. There are new building that still smell of adhesive years after completion. Creates unhealthy VOC's.

 

Use Schluter-DITRA Tile Underlayment or other in the shower and bathroom, this is never done in Thailand and will fail in a few years with heavy water use. Bathroom becomes full of mold.

(google tile floor underlay installation for diagram.)

 

7.  Kitchen and bathroom vents. A lot of kitchens in Thailand don't have vents. This is good idea to control fires and humidity.

 

8. Interior. If you have concrete walls, ideally finish with dry wall and 1/2" gap will allow interior, unfinished concrete walls to dry out. Do not put wall paper on the interior or there will be mold growth in no time.

Ceiling should have dropped space so unfinished concrete can dry out and allow for venting of humidity from the floor.

 

9. Wood on concrete. Another common mistake wood on concrete should always have a plastic barrier you will see this with wood windows on the concrete form. Sometime wood  piers sit in concrete for fences, decks or foundation, they should have tar painted to protect. The concrete will corrode the wood with water and cause it rot quickly.

 

10. Grading and run off. Beware of monsoon may flood the building. I've seen this many times during the monsoon, building are constructed too low.

 

 

 

 

[Artisi]

Only 10, with a bit more thought this could be doubled, and with some critical in-depth thinking doubled again. 

[emptypockets]

I've never had a problem with a flat slightly sloping roof over a patio. Colourbond sheeting no leaks.

 

[sirineou]

They are not so much mistakes as it is improper code enforcement and supervision.

That's why when we were ready we opted not to buy ready built from a developer, and to build our own. 

and even then strict supervision is required.

The selection of a professional builder is paramount, and a fair for both parties ,price needs to be negotiated , otherwise the builder will cut corners to make a profit.   

[canopy]

I think these things have merit, but I would not necessarily rank them all in the top 10. Just getting thai's to properly make arbitrary concrete seems so hopeless. Often mixing entails nothing more than a few strokes with a hoe in a tub, wrong proportions, never consolidated, wrong rebar strategy, never cured, etc could go on and on. Concrete is such a basic part of any house and builders were never taught, never inspected, and just never learn their whole lives how to use it properly and have no idea they are doing anything wrong. Sort of like driving I guess. The sad part about it is doing concrete right can be cheaper, stronger, more attractive, and more long lasting than doing it wrong.

 

I watched them build a water tower once. They dumped little buckets of concrete into forms as they went along. No tamping or vibrators were used. When the forms came off, predictably the concrete beams were a chunky rock surface rather than smooth. I then got a kick out of them spending the extra time, manpower, materials, and associated costs to render every beam to make them look smooth! What a waste and a weaker structure to boot. Unbelievable.

 

[Henricus]

NORMAL IT`S T.I.T. 

[LNKDES1]

17 hours ago, Artisi said:

Only 10, with a bit more thought this could be doubled, and with some critical in-depth thinking doubled again. 

And nothing mentioned about electrical.

[StevieAus]

I am somewhat surprised that you you fail to mention under plumbing the common problem of the failure to install U traps in showers, baths, sinks etc to prevent smells, there is even a question about it on today’s page.

In relation to the use of tar to seal a roof that sounds like a procedure from many years ago and whilst I am not a builder I would have thought that the temperatures in Thailand would cause it to melt.

[Artisi]

1 hour ago, LNKDES1 said:

And nothing mentioned about electrical.

Farangs can't comment on electrics, because Thai electricity is different. 

[Artisi]

3 hours ago, canopy said:

I think these things have merit, but I would not necessarily rank them all in the top 10. Just getting thai's to properly make arbitrary concrete seems so hopeless. Often mixing entails nothing more than a few strokes with a hoe in a tub, wrong proportions, never consolidated, wrong rebar strategy, never cured, etc could go on and on. Concrete is such a basic part of any house and builders were never taught, never inspected, and just never learn their whole lives how to use it properly and have no idea they are doing anything wrong. Sort of like driving I guess. The sad part about it is doing concrete right can be cheaper, stronger, more attractive, and more long lasting than doing it wrong.

 

I watched them build a water tower once. They dumped little buckets of concrete into forms as they went along. No tamping or vibrators were used. When the forms came off, predictably the concrete beams were a chunky rock surface rather than smooth. I then got a kick out of them spending the extra time, manpower, materials, and associated costs to render every beam to make them look smooth! What a waste and a weaker structure to boot. Unbelievable.

 

Normal. 

[transam]

I do miss those 6x2 loft rafters where you can actually shimmy along to sort wiring out....????

[kekalot]

15 minutes ago, Artisi said:

Farangs can't comment on electrics, because Thai electricity is different. 

lol this made me laugh

 

I used to have a Bull Terrier and my friend (who is Thai) asked me if I wanted her to bring my dog for the free neutering they had in her village nearby. I said yes

like an hour later she calls me saying that they wouldn't do it -- because "they said cannot! because they only have medicine for Thai dogs".

 

so I asked her if her dogs were Thai Bangkaews (i knew they weren't) and then told her "you better ask them to put the balls back in your dogs then because your dogs are not Thai dogs either"

 

but yeah, no grounding on houses is a deal breaker for me, sad to say that so far most of the places I have been renting have not done it and when i inquire about it .. they ALWAYS ask "why you need it?" and when I explain that it's because I have expensive computers and electronics they always tell me "oh, don't need it!" and act like I am asking them to do brain surgery if I push for it

 

all I am thinking is "ok dude, if the most expensive thing you have is a 129 baht rice cooker from Big C then maybe YOU don't need it" but I certainly do not enjoy getting shocked every single time i touch my metal microphone,  monitor stand or try to plug USB cables

 

funny thing is that the 2.5 meter copper rods are sold about 150 baht, 3 prong sockets same price and the cable is usually sold in a big spool and maybe 200-300 baht for like 100 meters spools and you can do this job by yourself (but not cleanly) in 10 minutes if you are not a total idiot. add 150 baht and few more minutes for per additional outlets.

[448glb]

You forgot one of the most important and dangerous, ELECTRICAL....

[Artisi]

50 minutes ago, 448glb said:

You forgot one of the most important and dangerous, ELECTRICAL....

Already addressed. 

Edited January 26, 2020 by Artisi

[GreasyFingers]

Good luck if you think you can get a builder to do everything you mention. Your farang price would be double the normal farang price. Currently doing an extension and it is impossible to get Thais to do what you ask/demand. Even though they can do good work their mentality is that of cowboys.

No worry about the electrical though, the BIL is actually licensed and rewired the old house before we moved in.

[Foexie]

Wish i could rate this topic minus whatever.

 

So stupid to make it an "only in Thailand" ( yeah right asia) issue again like those things not happen all over the world!

[SoSoCNX]

If you are building new, bring construction crew from your home country, and supervise all the time

If you are buying pre-owned, -inspect,inspect,inspect- and buy only during rainy season. Never buy Thai or Expat renovated property!

[sometimewoodworker]

6 hours ago, Foexie said:

So stupid to make it an "only in Thailand" ( yeah right asia) issue again like those things not happen all over the world!

There is no suggestion that it’s only in Asia or THAILAND. Please untwist your knickers.
 

But builders in Asia often don’t have the oversight of inspections to correct the problems or, in Thailand, the responsibility to correct them at no extra cost.

 

However there are some much bigger mistakes that could be examples. Though in this one the building was OK but trying to dig an underground car park too near was not.

[mike787]

And that is why I recommend do not buy anything you cannot afford to lose or walk away from.

[Artisi]

50 minutes ago, SoSoCNX said:

If you are building new, bring construction crew from your home country, and supervise all the time

If you are buying pre-owned, -inspect,inspect,inspect- and buy only during rainy season. Never buy Thai or Expat renovated property!

What a lot of BS, please explain how you can bring your own workers from O/S to be employed in Thailand? 

[Don Chance]

On 1/26/2020 at 8:04 PM, Artisi said:

What a lot of BS, please explain how you can bring your own workers from O/S to be employed in Thailand? 

miniaturize them.

[canopy]

On 1/27/2020 at 12:58 AM, Foexie said:

like those things not happen all over the world!

 

These things don't happen all over the world. You have no idea what you are talking about. The country I come from workers are required to get thorough training and licensing to do plumbing, electrical, etc. And there are building inspectors who must approve all work is done to stringent codes that assures the house is safe, long lasting, and ergonomic before anyone can live in it. In Thailand the workers have no particular training whatsoever and the first thing they do is throw away the manuals and make up everything like a caveman. This is no joke. And there are no inspections. Most things are done sub-standard with poor fit and finish. Even the roofs leak. The solution is people put buckets down to catch the dripping water. Everything is like this--the home owner is supposed to fix up and put up with the things that go wrong. Every part of the way a house is made in Thailand would fail code in a modern country and no one would be allowed to live in such third world junk. There is no safety net in building a house in Thailand and the home owner must assure the important things get done right and the materials are of high quality. It's a complete zoo and totally opposite of how building happens in the developed world where the experts are the builders, not the homeowners.

 

[Andrew Dwyer]

A Thai friend is a supervisor for a local building firm ( moobahn’s ) and confirms that the migrant workers used in many construction projects are not vetted for experience in any way . Jobs will be given based on numbers required irrespective of gender/age and mobility etc ( a real Equal Opportunities employer ????), a willingness to work is the only requirement . 

Obviously some don’t make the grade but firing them is a complicated process, in a registered business, and demotion to the more menial tasks is the easy option.

 

 The results of poor quality labour become obvious over time but sometimes waiting is not required :

When we bought our house in a moobahn 3 years ago several tasks had to be completed over a month period:

Day 4 :

A more experienced worker finishes one of 4 decorative panels on the exterior.

 

 

Day 7:

A young Cambodian girl proudly shows off her handiwork .

 

 

Close but no cigar !!

Felt quite sorry for the poor girl when after walking her the 5 metres to show her the example she was supposed to be copying and the penny dropped.

 

Here , unless you can accompany the build from day one you pay your money and take your chances.

[itsari]

On 1/25/2020 at 3:28 PM, Don Chance said:

This is useful list if you are building new or buying used. I've noticed after years in Asia.

 

1. Roofing.

- No roof. Flat roofs are not water proof. Need black tar or rubber membrane or water will leak through columns into top floor.

- Roof too small. Like a yamaka, water runs over building or onto roof. Roof should extend over building and balconies.

- Roof should be vented on the sides and or ridge vents.

- Concrete panel roofing. Beware of asbestos. Common in Thailand.

 

2. Exterior.

- Exterior walls should be water proofed with rubberized paint or even tar.. Water resistant paint will not be good enough. Ideally foam board insulation glued onto the walls will keep the building cool. Stucco or spray foam onto exterior walls also will work.

- Strange ledges extending from the floor to the exterior. Bad design will allow water to enter structure and under neath flooring. Can be cut off completely removed. Or water proofed with rubber or tar. This is just lazy ways of building so they can work more easily on the exterior.

- Balconies. Tiles are not water proof will leak eventually and enter the floor. Needs underlay, water proof slab or Schluter-DITRA Tile Underlayment.

 

 

3. Foundations. Avoid slab foundation. Rather pier style raised or crawl space.  Slab foundation need to be have rubber water shield under neath before pouring concrete. Barrier should extend up the side of the building.  Thailand is prone to monsoon floods. Other wise you have a wet, damp slab. Moisture will rise up into the house and cause problems.

 

4. Septic.  Never put a septic under the build it self should be set away from the house. Avoid buying a unit with the septic underneath, it will smell and mold will rise up into the house.

Septic tanks should be away from the structure a 2-3 meters, needs 3" vents intake and out take (google septic venting diagram)

Sewage connected to municipality should have back flow protection to prevent snakes and odors from entering the building.

 

5. Plumbing

Asian plumbing does not include stack vent. This will make the drains function much better and also displace sewer gas. Otherwise sewer gas will rise up to various parts of the building, infect structure will mold. (google stack venting plumbing for diagram.)

 

6. Floor tiling.

Most building have mold under the tiles in Asia ( more western people suffer from mold allergies than Asians.) This is because the slab is wet and is unable to dry out, so mold grows. There needs to a air gap, a dimpled plastic sheet such as DMX air gap. There are also chemical sealants that can be applied to the sub floor.

 

Another issue i see in new builds is the adhesive or mortar used for the tiles is wet. The tile go over it and the glue can not dry because no air can reach. The adhesive or mortar needs to be put down then left to dry awhile so it is sticky. There are new building that still smell of adhesive years after completion. Creates unhealthy VOC's.

 

Use Schluter-DITRA Tile Underlayment or other in the shower and bathroom, this is never done in Thailand and will fail in a few years with heavy water use. Bathroom becomes full of mold.

(google tile floor underlay installation for diagram.)

 

7.  Kitchen and bathroom vents. A lot of kitchens in Thailand don't have vents. This is good idea to control fires and humidity.

 

8. Interior. If you have concrete walls, ideally finish with dry wall and 1/2" gap will allow interior, unfinished concrete walls to dry out. Do not put wall paper on the interior or there will be mold growth in no time.

Ceiling should have dropped space so unfinished concrete can dry out and allow for venting of humidity from the floor.

 

9. Wood on concrete. Another common mistake wood on concrete should always have a plastic barrier you will see this with wood windows on the concrete form. Sometime wood  piers sit in concrete for fences, decks or foundation, they should have tar painted to protect. The concrete will corrode the wood with water and cause it rot quickly.

 

10. Grading and run off. Beware of monsoon may flood the building. I've seen this many times during the monsoon, building are constructed too low.

 

 

 

Most common problem with Thai construction is roof leakage . Reason is it is very rare to see a secondary roof design . Roof tiles can not be relied on in heavy rain and wind . Yet I do understand this would raise the price of the house , but not more than 5 percent .

 

[hotchilli]

On 1/25/2020 at 3:28 PM, Don Chance said:

This is useful list if you are building new or buying used. I've noticed after years in Asia.

 

1. Roofing.

- No roof. Flat roofs are not water proof. Need black tar or rubber membrane or water will leak through columns into top floor.

- Roof too small. Like a yamaka, water runs over building or onto roof. Roof should extend over building and balconies.

- Roof should be vented on the sides and or ridge vents.

- Concrete panel roofing. Beware of asbestos. Common in Thailand.

 

2. Exterior.

- Exterior walls should be water proofed with rubberized paint or even tar.. Water resistant paint will not be good enough. Ideally foam board insulation glued onto the walls will keep the building cool. Stucco or spray foam onto exterior walls also will work.

- Strange ledges extending from the floor to the exterior. Bad design will allow water to enter structure and under neath flooring. Can be cut off completely removed. Or water proofed with rubber or tar. This is just lazy ways of building so they can work more easily on the exterior.

- Balconies. Tiles are not water proof will leak eventually and enter the floor. Needs underlay, water proof slab or Schluter-DITRA Tile Underlayment.

 

 

3. Foundations. Avoid slab foundation. Rather pier style raised or crawl space.  Slab foundation need to be have rubber water shield under neath before pouring concrete. Barrier should extend up the side of the building.  Thailand is prone to monsoon floods. Other wise you have a wet, damp slab. Moisture will rise up into the house and cause problems.

 

4. Septic.  Never put a septic under the build it self should be set away from the house. Avoid buying a unit with the septic underneath, it will smell and mold will rise up into the house.

Septic tanks should be away from the structure a 2-3 meters, needs 3" vents intake and out take (google septic venting diagram)

Sewage connected to municipality should have back flow protection to prevent snakes and odors from entering the building.

 

5. Plumbing

Asian plumbing does not include stack vent. This will make the drains function much better and also displace sewer gas. Otherwise sewer gas will rise up to various parts of the building, infect structure will mold. (google stack venting plumbing for diagram.)

 

6. Floor tiling.

Most building have mold under the tiles in Asia ( more western people suffer from mold allergies than Asians.) This is because the slab is wet and is unable to dry out, so mold grows. There needs to a air gap, a dimpled plastic sheet such as DMX air gap. There are also chemical sealants that can be applied to the sub floor.

 

Another issue i see in new builds is the adhesive or mortar used for the tiles is wet. The tile go over it and the glue can not dry because no air can reach. The adhesive or mortar needs to be put down then left to dry awhile so it is sticky. There are new building that still smell of adhesive years after completion. Creates unhealthy VOC's.

 

Use Schluter-DITRA Tile Underlayment or other in the shower and bathroom, this is never done in Thailand and will fail in a few years with heavy water use. Bathroom becomes full of mold.

(google tile floor underlay installation for diagram.)

 

7.  Kitchen and bathroom vents. A lot of kitchens in Thailand don't have vents. This is good idea to control fires and humidity.

 

8. Interior. If you have concrete walls, ideally finish with dry wall and 1/2" gap will allow interior, unfinished concrete walls to dry out. Do not put wall paper on the interior or there will be mold growth in no time.

Ceiling should have dropped space so unfinished concrete can dry out and allow for venting of humidity from the floor.

 

9. Wood on concrete. Another common mistake wood on concrete should always have a plastic barrier you will see this with wood windows on the concrete form. Sometime wood  piers sit in concrete for fences, decks or foundation, they should have tar painted to protect. The concrete will corrode the wood with water and cause it rot quickly.

 

10. Grading and run off. Beware of monsoon may flood the building. I've seen this many times during the monsoon, building are constructed too low.

 

 

 

 

So just about everything from the foundation up....

[RocketDog]

On 1/26/2020 at 12:08 PM, LNKDES1 said:

And nothing mentioned about electrical.

Right, Like burying unglued electrical conduits and plumbing in concrete floors and walls. An ongoing nightmare. Glue is often not used in joints or properly cured, insane. 

If I ever built a house here all those things would run on exterior and interior walls and to hell with the appearance. 

[RocketDog]

On 1/27/2020 at 12:58 AM, Foexie said:

Wish i could rate this topic minus whatever.

 

So stupid to make it an "only in Thailand" ( yeah right asia) issue again like those things not happen all over the world!

You are just so, so wrong. I'll leave it at. 

[brianthainess]

On 1/26/2020 at 1:51 PM, transam said:

I do miss those 6x2 loft rafters where you can actually shimmy along to sort wiring out....????

Yep and I miss Joist Hangers  where can I buy them Without paying ridiculous shipping? 

[1FinickyOne]

On 1/25/2020 at 3:28 PM, Don Chance said:

Roof too small. Like a yamaka

Geez. I thought I told the builder to make it bigger than that... and then I wondered why he didn't understand... 

[johng]

Anti gravity drain pipes that drain uphill !! ????

They also do a similar  thing in wetrooms   where the floor slopes in the opposite direction to the drain hole.

 

Edited November 30, 2020 by johng