Video: Pattaya ghost town...Coronavirus decimates tourism as staff go home for high season

[Gweiloman]

27 minutes ago, Leaver said:

My mental health is fine, it is you who is in denial.

 

Have you not read the several, and recent, news articles on TV where senior members in the tourism industry, and senior management of hotels, have come out and said publicly how quiet it is here now, and this was pre virus?  This is a new thing, especially with the "loss of face" in Thai culture.  Some have even been critical of officials. 

 

Are all these Thai people in the industry wrong? 

 

Do you know better than them?

Oh, so now you believe all the Thai professionals that you previously regarded as idiots? Just so that you can prove your point? To be honest, I don’t even know anymore what you are trying to say. 

[Leaver]

4 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Oh, so now you believe all the Thai professionals that you previously regarded as idiots? Just so that you can prove your point? To be honest, I don’t even know anymore what you are trying to say. 

I'll take your post as a no response. 

[Traubert]

1 hour ago, Leaver said:

With so many flights to China, that means when I am at the airport for my flight, I get to see several of their flights. 

 

The maths in your post actually supports my observations.  I would say maths and statistics is something you are not very conversant with.  ????

 

Like Central and T21, I don't see Chinese buying expensive brand name items at the airport, either.  Rather, I see them in a panic rearranging and sharing the kilo's of luggage weight of dried fruit and seaweed before checking in and avoiding an excess luggage fee.   After check in, I do see them filling up their water bottles with free water from the drinking water fountains, and eating food bought from a 7/11 outside the airport.   

 

As for King Power, I haven't stepped foot inside one at the airport since the shop lifting scam, but when walking past I don't see Chinese in there spending.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8154497.stm

 

 

Really, as though China doesn't have it's own seaweed and dried fruit, cheaper and better quality

 

But, if you are reverting to personal insults it's conversation over. I prefer a more convivial dialogue.

 

You maintain your illusion and I'll stick with what I know.

[Leaver]

48 minutes ago, Traubert said:

Really, as though China doesn't have it's own seaweed and dried fruit, cheaper and better quality

 

But, if you are reverting to personal insults it's conversation over. I prefer a more convivial dialogue.

 

You maintain your illusion and I'll stick with what I know.

The Chinese have their own baby formula as well, until babies were poisoned and died.  Now, the Chinese buy foreign manufactured baby formula.  I don't know about dried fruit and seaweed in China, but I see them with suitcases full of it. 

 

You have contradicted yourself buy saying, "cheap and better quality" back in China, but yet, the Chinese are all shopping up big in Thailand.  Most of what is for sale in Thailand is cheaper in China, even sex, so like you say with the dried fruit and seaweed, why would they buy it here?

 

There's no personal insult.  It's simple maths.  You say, 32 flights to China every day.  24 hours in a day.  That's around 1.3 flights an hour.  I am usually at the airport 3.5 hours before my flight leaves.  So, I see hundreds of Chinese checking in.  You see them on the floor, near their check in desk, rearranging their suitcase because they are over weight, so they spread the kilos among themselves.     

 

I am not sure what illusion you are alluding to.  The Chinese FIT's are not going to keep Pattaya sustainable.  Once again, I'm talking pre virus. 

 

We have closures of some prominent restaurants and pubs. 

 

For Sale signs everywhere, on commercial and residential properties. 

 

Recently, I am sure you read a well known bar was given away for free here. 

 

Hotels are cutting rates drastically, although I accept some of these discounts were post virus. 

 

No enforcement of daily rental, so condo's are full of Chinese, with the daily rental profit going into a Chinese bank account, when these people should be staying in a hotel.  Further proving the zero baht tourist issue. 

 

There's been a rise in reported (media) pick pocketing and snatch theft lately. 

 

Now, probably Central Pattaya's most popular sports bar, Retox Game On, is also for sale.

 

I haven't even touched on the strong baht and the visa laws causing an expat exodus.

 

Are economic indicators an "illusion?"   Is the above a lie, or and exaggeration, or pessimism?  Is it opinion, or fact?

 

Senior members of the tourism industry have stated publicly occupancy and revenue is down.  Are they wrong, or lying, or exaggerating? 

 

Short of a run on the banks, what would YOU personally have to see to say, the local Pattaya tourism industry / economy is tanking?    

 

Edited February 4, 2020 by Leaver

[Leaver]

1 hour ago, Gweiloman said:

Oh, so now you believe all the Thai professionals that you previously regarded as idiots? Just so that you can prove your point? To be honest, I don’t even know anymore what you are trying to say. 

The people who I think are idiots are way above the senior Thai's speaking out in the media, and are based in Bangkok.

 

Briefly, my basic point is, virus aside, this was never going to be a high season.  Many bars, restaurants, pubs, hotels and guesthouses were probably going to close up in the next 6 to 12 months.  Indeed, some have, whilst there are many For Sale signs around.  Many are simply not viable anymore and are losing money month after month, in many cases, through no fault of their own.

 

It will now be convenient to blame the virus, but pre virus, it was the quietest high season for western tourists in years.  

 

Now, westerners aside, if Thailand really wanted to get serious about making HUGE money from the Chinese, and completely forgetting about westerners, then the only way forward is with casinos. 

[Gweiloman]

2 minutes ago, Leaver said:

The people who I think are idiots are way above the senior Thai's speaking out in the media, and are based in Bangkok.

 

Briefly, my basic point is, virus aside, this was never going to be a high season.  Many bars, restaurants, pubs, hotels and guesthouses were probably going to close up in the next 6 to 12 months.  Indeed, some have, whilst there are many For Sale signs around.  Many are simply not viable anymore and are losing money month after month, in many cases, through no fault of their own.

 

It will now be convenient to blame the virus, but pre virus, it was the quietest high season for western tourists in years.  

 

Now, westerners aside, if Thailand really wanted to get serious about making HUGE money from the Chinese, and completely forgetting about westerners, then the only way forward is with casinos. 

I cannot comment on whether there would have been a high season in Pattaya or not as I do not track the activities there. What I disputed was your contention that Chinese tourists do not spend any money. 

Unlike westerners, the Chinese do not generally frequent western style bars and restaurants nor the typical 20 room guesthouses that are all over Pattaya. So bars and pubs losing money or closing is no indication of whether there are Chinese tourists or how much money they spend. 

[Leaver]

56 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

I cannot comment on whether there would have been a high season in Pattaya or not as I do not track the activities there. What I disputed was your contention that Chinese tourists do not spend any money. 

Unlike westerners, the Chinese do not generally frequent western style bars and restaurants nor the typical 20 room guesthouses that are all over Pattaya. So bars and pubs losing money or closing is no indication of whether there are Chinese tourists or how much money they spend. 

So, you effectively dispute the whole "zero baht tourist" issue.  Is that correct? 

 

So, a package holiday to Thailand is purchased in China.  The group stays at a hotel that has a Chinese owned.  They eat in Chinese owned restaurants.  They are transported on Chinese owned buses.  They are shipped on Chinese owned boats.  They are taken to Chinese owned latex etc shops.  They were even taken to fake Buddhist Temple here.

 

I posted this link in another thread.

 

https://www.thephuketnews.com/chinese-nominee-tour-company-blitz-in-phuket-nets-53-tour-buses-29-speedboats-58144.php#5uzcj7PvuzSvzDmR.97

 

Quote: "Gen Srivara pointed out that so far officials had seized assets including 117 vehicles, 35 boats and three plots of lands, amounting to “several hundreds of millions of baht.”

 

Look at the list of subsidiary companies. 

 

He listed the 17 companies that form the network as:

1. Tranlee Travel Co Ltd
2. Yang Guang Co Ltd
3. Manta Marine Co Ltd
4. Phuket Ping Friend Co Ltd
5. Meili Co Ltd
6. Blue Haven Diving Centre Co Ltd
7. Kenya and Fae International Co Ltd
8. Thailee Import Co Ltd
9. T.L Better Way Co Ltd (land transportation)
10. Insee Marine Co Ltd (marine transportation)
11. Blue Wave Resort Co Ltd
12. Bluebay Resort Co Ltd
13. Natural Bay Resort Co Ltd
14. Venice Sea View Co Ltd
15. Racha Spa Co Ltd
16. Sabunnga Spa Co Ltd
17. Zean Shabu Shabu Co Ltd

 

Large illegal hotels.

 

“Our investigation revealed that Blue Bay Resort Co Ltd, located in Phang Nga, had added more rooms to their accommodation without a permit. Initially the company asked for a permit to build 76 rooms, today the resort has 330 rooms,” he said.

 

 

Anything that is not Chinese owned, they beat the Thai operators down to their lowest price, so their margins are thin. 

 

Just where in the above does Thailand profit from them?  Any extra money made from them whilst they are in Thailand are repatriated back to China, but the whole package is paid for in China.

 

Sure, they create employment for 300 baht a day workers, but that's not exactly the cash injection into the Thai economy that their huge tourist numbers should represent.

 

There's debate about the Chinese FIT's.  I see them as "flashpackers" which is one up from a backpacker.  They are not in Central and T21 buying brand name items. 

 

Is the article in the link wrong?  Is it fake news? 

 

Of interest is, when is the last time you heard about a raid on a "zero baht tourist" company?  They had a crack down a few years ago, but I have read nothing since, so they must be flourishing. It's probably got out of control to the point that if they did shut them down, Pattaya's Chinese tourism would be decimated, the same way the virus has decimated.  So the Chinese now have the Thai tourism industry over a barrel.  

 

The lack of westerners coming here is why the bars and restaurants and hotels are quiet.  Strong baht, new visa laws etc playing their part.  High season starts 1/11.  Up until the week before Christmas, the place was dead for a high season. The peak season seemed comparable, but it thinned out pretty quick by mid January for westerners.  It appears there simply will not be any high season. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 4, 2020 by Leaver

[Gweiloman]

26 minutes ago, Leaver said:

So, you effectively dispute the whole "zero baht tourist" issue.  Is that correct? 

 

So, a package holiday to Thailand is purchased in China.  The group stays at a hotel that has a Chinese owned.  They eat in Chinese owned restaurants.  They are transported on Chinese owned buses.  They are shipped on Chinese owned boats.  They are taken to Chinese owned latex etc shops.  They were even taken to fake Buddhist Temple here.

 

I posted this link in another thread.

 

https://www.thephuketnews.com/chinese-nominee-tour-company-blitz-in-phuket-nets-53-tour-buses-29-speedboats-58144.php#5uzcj7PvuzSvzDmR.97

 

Quote: "Gen Srivara pointed out that so far officials had seized assets including 117 vehicles, 35 boats and three plots of lands, amounting to “several hundreds of millions of baht.”

 

Look at the list of subsidiary companies. 

 

He listed the 17 companies that form the network as:

1. Tranlee Travel Co Ltd
2. Yang Guang Co Ltd
3. Manta Marine Co Ltd
4. Phuket Ping Friend Co Ltd
5. Meili Co Ltd
6. Blue Haven Diving Centre Co Ltd
7. Kenya and Fae International Co Ltd
8. Thailee Import Co Ltd
9. T.L Better Way Co Ltd (land transportation)
10. Insee Marine Co Ltd (marine transportation)
11. Blue Wave Resort Co Ltd
12. Bluebay Resort Co Ltd
13. Natural Bay Resort Co Ltd
14. Venice Sea View Co Ltd
15. Racha Spa Co Ltd
16. Sabunnga Spa Co Ltd
17. Zean Shabu Shabu Co Ltd

 

Large illegal hotels.

 

“Our investigation revealed that Blue Bay Resort Co Ltd, located in Phang Nga, had added more rooms to their accommodation without a permit. Initially the company asked for a permit to build 76 rooms, today the resort has 330 rooms,” he said.

 

 

Anything that is not Chinese owned, they beat the Thai operators down to their lowest price, so their margins are thin. 

 

Just where in the above does Thailand profit from them?  Any extra money made from them whilst they are in Thailand are repatriated back to China, but the whole package is paid for in China.

 

Sure, they create employment for 300 baht a day workers, but that's not exactly the cash injection into the Thai economy that their huge tourist numbers should represent.

 

There's debate about the Chinese FIT's.  I see them as "flashpackers" which is one up from a backpacker.  They are not in Central and T21 buying brand name items. 

 

Is the article in the link wrong?  Is it fake news? 

 

Of interest is, when is the last time you heard about a raid on a "zero baht tourist" company?  They had a crack down a few years ago, but I have read nothing since, so they must be flourishing. It's probably got out of control top the point that if they did shut them down, Pattay's Chinese tourism would be decimated, the same way the virus has decimated.  So the Chinese now have the Thai tourism industry over a barrel.  

 

 

You are conflating zero baht tours with the service suppliers.

A zero baht tour is basically a “free” tour but the client is expected to spend a minimum amount of money at designated shopping outlets. The service suppliers (hotels, restaurants, coach companies, tour guides etc) are still being paid by the tour operator/agency. Whether the service suppliers are Chinese or Thai owned is irrelevant. There are thousands upon thousands of travel agencies in China. They don’t own the hotels or restaurants or coaches.

 

I do not know what percentage of tour groups coming to Thailand are zero baht tours. What I do know is that in BKK, there are many tour groups staying in 4-5 star hotels that are owned by Thais. I also see many Chinese eating at Thai owned restaurants in Chiang Mai. 
 

You keep repeating the mantra that the Chinese tourists don’t benefit the Thai economy, in spite of multiple threads and articles here on TV reporting that local businesses are suffering due to the drop in Chinese tourism. Don’t let your bias obscure the facts. 
 

 

[Stokakrishna]

I feel sorry for the pristine sand 

[Leaver]

7 hours ago, Gweiloman said:

You are conflating zero baht tours with the service suppliers.

A zero baht tour is basically a “free” tour but the client is expected to spend a minimum amount of money at designated shopping outlets. The service suppliers (hotels, restaurants, coach companies, tour guides etc) are still being paid by the tour operator/agency. Whether the service suppliers are Chinese or Thai owned is irrelevant. There are thousands upon thousands of travel agencies in China. They don’t own the hotels or restaurants or coaches.

 

I do not know what percentage of tour groups coming to Thailand are zero baht tours. What I do know is that in BKK, there are many tour groups staying in 4-5 star hotels that are owned by Thais. I also see many Chinese eating at Thai owned restaurants in Chiang Mai. 
 

You keep repeating the mantra that the Chinese tourists don’t benefit the Thai economy, in spite of multiple threads and articles here on TV reporting that local businesses are suffering due to the drop in Chinese tourism. Don’t let your bias obscure the facts. 
 

 

Firstly, I gather you meant to say "confusing" rather than "conflating."

 

I am not confusing zero baht tourists with service suppliers.  I have said there is a trickle down affect, all the way to the agriculture sector.  Due to strict labor laws here, I focus more on goods, rather than services, and this is why I have openly stated that the Chinese tourism market creates a lot of employment for 300 baht a day Thai workers. 

 

A simplistic example is, a Thai pineapple farmer sells more pineapples because they are used as an ingredient in the dishes that the restaurants catering for Chinese tour groups serve.  So, the pineapple grower now has a bigger market, thus sells more, therefore should be more wealthy.  I get that.

 

However, the pineapple farmer is at the bottom of the tree. (no pun intended)  Basically, the pineapple farmer sells all his pineapples to a local pineapple dealer for 10 baht a pineapple. 

 

The local pineapple dealer sells all the pineapples from the local farmers to a provincial dealer for 20 baht a pineapple.  

 

The provincial pineapple dealer sells the pineapples to national supplier for 30 baht a pineapple. 

 

The national suppler sells the pineapples to restaurants at 40 baht a pineapple. 

 

The restaurant puts the pineapple in a dish and charges 150 baht for the dish.  The restaurant / retail is at the top of the tree, and in many cases, for the Chinese tourist market, the restaurant is owned by a Chinese company.    

 

Now, does this benefit the Thai economy, of course it does, but who has made the most money, the Chinese company, and where does that money go, back to China.  So who benefits the most?  

 

You say, "Whether the service suppliers are Chinese or Thai owned is irrelevant."  How can this be irrelevant, in the context of discussing zero baht tourism?  One makes money in Thailand and keeps the money in Thailand.  One makes money in Thailand, and send the money back to China, or, the profits remain in China and do not even enter the Thai economy.

 

In relation to accommodation, I will just cut and paste a previous post, because I was asked about how the Chinese staying in hotels here does not profit Thailand.

 

Below is that post:

 

 

Quote:

 

As you may be aware, it's not unusual for one company to own several chains hotels, but that company is owned by another company, being the parent company.

 

This is just one example, after a quick Google around. 

 

Jin Jiang International Holdings is a huge Chinese company.  They bought the French hotel company Groupe du Louvre, that has several hotel chains.  

 

Here, you will see Groupe du Louvre owns the Golden Tulip Hotels in Pattaya, but remember, a Chinese company owns them.

 

https://www.goldentulip.com/en-us/hotels-pattaya

 

Here, you will see information about the take over.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groupe_du_Louvre

 

I've never stayed at the Tulip Hotels here, but if you were to take the time to research the ownership of the hotels here where the Chinese tourists stay, you will probably find that money makes its way back to China from quite a few of them.  

 

It's not always 100% ownership.  Sometimes, majority shareholder, or even just a stake in the subsidiary company.

 

Jin Jiang also own a 93% stake in Plateno, and we know Plateno is setting up here. 

 

Here's an article about that.

 

As you may be aware, it's not unusual for one company to own several chains hotels, but that company is owned by another company, being the parent company.

 

This is just one example, after a quick Google around. 

 

Jin Jiang International Holdings is a huge Chinese company.  They bought the French hotel company Groupe du Louvre, that has several hotel chains.  

 

Here, you will see Groupe du Louvre owns the Golden Tulip Hotels in Pattaya, but remember, a Chinese company owns them.

 

https://www.goldentulip.com/en-us/hotels-pattaya

 

Here, you will see information about the take over.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groupe_du_Louvre

 

I've never stayed at the Tulip Hotels here, but if you were to take the time to research the ownership of the hotels here where the Chinese tourists stay, you will probably find that money makes its way back to China from quite a few of them.  

 

It's not always 100% ownership.  Sometimes, majority shareholder, or even just a stake in the subsidiary company.

 

Jin Jiang also own a 93% stake in Plateno, and we know Plateno is setting up here. 

 

Here's an article about that.

 

https://www.chinatravelnews.com/article/118066

 

End quote.

 

 

Here's another interesting article on Plateno.

 

https://destinationthailandnews.com/news/business-news/plateno-group-surges-as-most-influential-chinese-hotel-brand-in-thailand-globally.html

 

 

I don't think many are aware of the real extent Chinese tour companies are doing business in Thailand.  In the list of subsidiary companies of the Tranlee Group that I posted previously, have a look, you will see everything from spas to diving companies. 

 

There is a common saying we know in Thailand and that is, "Thailand is for Thai's."  Well, I can assure you, "The Chinese are for China." 

 

If you think the Chinese have their hooks into Thailand now, wait and see when they start importing their own pineapples from China, to use a humorous example.

 

I have already seen Chinese girls on apps working in the sex trade here.  I have no doubt they are servicing Chinese men.  They are working illegally, and in an illegal trade, but I can assure you, just the way Thai girls send their money to Issan, these girls send their money to back to China.

 

Chinese tour group leaders also working illegally here.

 

Interesting times ahead when you open the door to the Chinese, and I do not mean that in a racist way.  The Chinese will support fellow Chinese, and China, no matter what country they are in.

 

What is of interest is the lack of enforcement on these Chinese companies using Thai nominees. I suppose the footprint the Chinese now have in the Thai tourism industry is so big that if they were to enforce the law, it would decimate Thailand's tourism industry, much in the way we are seeing now with the virus.  So, it appears too late for enforcement.  The Chinese practically have majority control of the tourism industry here now. 

 

Casinos aside, I don't think we can compare Pattaya with Sihanoukville just yet, but there are some similarities. 

 

Are the above links facts, or bias? 

 

 

Edited February 4, 2020 by Leaver

[morrobay]

19 hours ago, sharecropper said:

 

One of the highest seasons I've seen in Jomtien in 17 years. Restaurants jam packed, bars less so.

Yes restaurants ,patios in front of cafe's, steps in front of convenience stores packed with these low class cigarette smoking slobs. Don't know if the Pattaya Tai- area around Soi-Bukow or Jomtien have more of these slobs/block. And of course the lowlife locals smoking too. 

[gk10002000]

On 2/2/2020 at 9:36 PM, webfact said:

Hotels that cater to the Chinese were all but empty.

Curious to know what hotels these were.  Anybody know?

[adammike]

11 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

Curious to know what hotels these were.  Anybody know?

I know the Base on soi Diane is full of Chinese they may be independent travellers.

[Peterw42]

20 hours ago, sharecropper said:

 

One of the highest seasons I've seen in Jomtien in 17 years. Restaurants jam packed, bars less so.

I agree, its the busiest I have seen in the 5 years I have lived here. I dont thin corona virus will have any effect as its all russians/europeans

[jacko45k]

47 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

Curious to know what hotels these were.  Anybody know?

Royal Palace Hotel and Royal Twins Palace Hotel? 

[Leaver]

9 hours ago, adammike said:

I know the Base on soi Diane is full of Chinese they may be independent travellers.

It will be interesting to see if the independent Chinese travelers that usually stay at The Base will be allowed out of China in the near future.  

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

I'm just waiting for TAT to announce record numbers of tourist arrivals...

Is the place really full of Euro Trash, Russians and high spending Indians?

????️

Edited February 5, 2020 by George FmplesdaCosteedback

[nauseus]

On 2/4/2020 at 8:40 PM, Traubert said:

Really, as though China doesn't have it's own seaweed and dried fruit, cheaper and better quality

 

But, if you are reverting to personal insults it's conversation over. I prefer a more convivial dialogue.

 

You maintain your illusion and I'll stick with what I know.

As though. Do you know how far Lanzhou is from the sea? 

[NoComment]

"All the golden eggs in one basket"

The second basket was the Indians!?

The last, disrespected and forgotten basket (who made LOS a tourist attraction) is the European tourist.

The powers that be have bought their houses and invested in Europe whilst ensuring the low baht so they "nevermind"

What will happen now nobody knows. 

My thoughts and prayers are with the normal, everyday, hardworking Thai people who rely on tourism for their families and themselves.

Let's hope this is resolved sooner rather than later.

[Vascoda]

The last months they were complaing Chinese only spend money in their own group and eat noodles in 7/11. So why bother? 7/11 is not not complaining. 

[Gweiloman]

On 2/5/2020 at 6:32 AM, Leaver said:

Firstly, I gather you meant to say "confusing" rather than "conflating."

 

<snip>

 

Are the above links facts, or bias? 

 

 

I really have no idea what you are trying to say. 
 

The travel business, like any other business, is extremely competitive. If a Chinese owned restaurant charges Thb 200 per person for a 5 course Chinese meal and a Thai owned restaurant charges Thb 180 for the same meal, the group will be eating at the Thai owned restaurant. Whether it is a zero baht tour or not, the restaurant (whichever one gets the business) still gets paid and in turn, presumably pays taxes on its profits. 
 

Tbh though, I don’t even recall what this whole discussion is about anymore lol
 

 

[Leaver]

18 hours ago, Gweiloman said:

If a Chinese owned restaurant charges Thb 200 per person for a 5 course Chinese meal and a Thai owned restaurant charges Thb 180 for the same meal, the group will be eating at the Thai owned restaurant.

You would think that to be the case, but the Chinese tours go to Chinese owned establishments.  They don't mind charging their own people higher prices than the Thai's.  

 

Remember, the tour was paid for back in China and included flights, accommodation, land and sea transport, most meals, some activities, and some entrance fees.  It's too late for them to go to a different restaurant because it's cheaper, because they have already paid for the restaurant they are going to in their package.  

 

Of course, the profits from the whole trip remain in China.  Thus, zero baht tourism, but I have said, they create a lot of employment, and we are now seeing how important that is.  I have also admitted there's some profit to suppliers, but the lion's share of the profit are at the point of sale, the package holiday itself, which is Chinese owned and operated.   

[lavezzi]

How many millions Expats we have in Thailand and how many of them have more money than the minium required by thai law?

 

[nausea]

I was in Pattaya recently and it's not a ghost town. The Chinese thing was always a blip. Pattaya's bread and butter is sexually frustrated Westerners, and the Issan girls who supply that need. The demand and supply situation seems to be pretty stable as far as I can see.

[Leaver]

15 hours ago, nausea said:

I was in Pattaya recently and it's not a ghost town. The Chinese thing was always a blip. Pattaya's bread and butter is sexually frustrated Westerners, and the Issan girls who supply that need. The demand and supply situation seems to be pretty stable as far as I can see.

When was your last visit here?

[WalkingOrders]

All I know is the longterm and short term USD/THB is looking good! And there isn't any Corona virus on this high of a floor.

[chrisandsu]

If you think the Russians and Chinese are bad , wait until the millions of ghetto and trailer trash Americans finally figure out what a passport Is for ! 

[tomacht8]

On 2/7/2020 at 6:02 PM, Leaver said:

You would think that to be the case, but the Chinese tours go to Chinese owned establishments.  They don't mind charging their own people higher prices than the Thai's.  

 

Remember, the tour was paid for back in China and included flights, accommodation, land and sea transport, most meals, some activities, and some entrance fees.  It's too late for them to go to a different restaurant because it's cheaper, because they have already paid for the restaurant they are going to in their package.  

 

Of course, the profits from the whole trip remain in China.  Thus, zero baht tourism, but I have said, they create a lot of employment, and we are now seeing how important that is.  I have also admitted there's some profit to suppliers, but the lion's share of the profit are at the point of sale, the package holiday itself, which is Chinese owned and operated.   

All right. But there are also a few, very influential Thai shareholders involved.

 

[chrisandsu]

On 2/10/2020 at 5:47 PM, tomacht8 said:

All right. But there are also a few, very influential Thai shareholders involved.

 

Thai shareholders are probably ethnic Chinese too . 

[kinyara]

As others have mentioned its very far from a ghost town in the Jomtien area, if anything it seems busier this year, from what I saw the other night the bars were doing a decent trade. Certainly doesn't seem representative of a noticeable decline in the western market as some would have us believe. Nice that traffic is now moving a bit more freely without the masses of Chinese tourist buses clogging the place up. They were all zero baht tourists apparently so didn't spend any money here anyway - allegedly ????