Schengen Visa - Belgium. Refused

[RedPill]

47 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

And, having a BF or a BF guarantee letter is an automatic denial now.  They do not want to see it.

That was exactly my point.

 

I have met many Thai's who were on holiday in Europe ... a holiday!

 

It's when you start with the BF's thing to get a girl over 'for a holiday' ... you start to walk into that rabbit hole.

 

And the outcome is different for many, and the reasons for deny always very vague. And not fair. Your country let's in a ton of refugees, but not the girl you are in love with and can take care of ????

 

That's that kind of perspective you should have in mind, before you start filling in the papers and invite your holiday fling.

 

Edited February 24, 2020 by RedPill

[RedPill]

15 hours ago, theoldgit said:

You really need to read the whole thread.

This thread is about a Belgian who who is resident in Belgium and wants his Thai girlfriend to join him at his home for a holiday, different rules apply in that scenario, she cannot simply book a holiday in Germany and pop over the border.

I bet you a 1k Baht that LivinLos did read the complete thread.

 

The bigger picture is different.

 

IMO ... the more evidence you provide that you are in a genuine relationship with the girl ... loved up pictures together on an elephant in Koh Chang, together on a Jet Ski in Phuket, in front of the Grand Palace in BKK ... the more evidence you provide that you want to start a relationship with the girl, and since you can't live in Thailand because you still work, the more reason for the girl not to return to Thailand.

 

They know it's a holiday fling, and they don't want that.

 

A Thai however, who wants to see Manneken Pis for a genuine 2 week holiday in Brussels (and i.e. get's an invitation letter from a family/friends/colleagues) will have less issues getting that tourist visa.

 

In that sense, the girl better get's an invitation from someone else, and pops over from i.e. Germany to Belgium, once she has the Schengen visa.

 

Or you go through a mountain of paperwork and hazzles ... with starting point: Boyfriend invites Thai girl he met on Thailand holiday.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[RedPill]

Sorry, don't know what happened, something went wrong with editing my initial post.

 

What I wanted to say is, the more evidence you 'try' to provide to proof your relationship with the girl (pictures etc.).

 

The more evidence you provide that you want her to stay with you in your country, and the more reasons for her to not return to Thailand. 

 

And for a holiday fling ... that brings on all sorts of risks (both ways). And the ECO puts a cap on it.

 

You shoot yourself in your own foot, so to speak.

 

Look for, or try, a different strategy.

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[fceligoj]

I recently sent an email to the help desk of the Visa Service , VPS Netherlands, about taking my Thai wife on a vacation to Europe,visiting 4 countries, main location was to be The Netherlands.  Since they are not related, just a gf, etc., here is their reply to me with a Thai wife:

 

Financial travel documents that show that you can spend throughout your travel period,

such as bank statements or account records showing recent 3 month movements or

in the case of financial statements of family members.

Documents that must show that they are related, such as

And have a written letter from the person who paid

 

The embassy does not set a fixed amount of money.

But the amount of money must be sufficient to sustain life in the Netherlands.

[RedPill]

11 minutes ago, fceligoj said:

about taking my Thai wife on a vacation to Europe

... different to a holiday fling you try to get over for a "holiday"

 

It's not about what documents are on the list for a visa.

 

It's about what's in the mind of the ECO

 

You with your wife can go everywhere ... that's why I said before jokingly ... "or you just marry the girl"

 

You married the girl, you don't have these issues.

 

It doesn't apply to the topic.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[theoldgit]

10 minutes ago, fceligoj said:

I recently sent an email to the help desk of the Visa Service , VPS Netherlands, about taking my Thai wife on a vacation to Europe,visiting 4 countries, main location was to be The Netherlands.  Since they are not related, just a gf, etc., here is their reply to me with a Thai wife:

 

Financial travel documents that show that you can spend throughout your travel period,

such as bank statements or account records showing recent 3 month movements or

in the case of financial statements of family members.

Documents that must show that they are related, such as

And have a written letter from the person who paid

 

The embassy does not set a fixed amount of money.

But the amount of money must be sufficient to sustain life in the Netherlands.

What is your nationality.
Not sure that I understand your first para, you talk about not being related, you also talk about a wife, which is it, a wife or a girlfriend, or are you talking about someone else?
I'm surpised at the quality of the response, "must have a written letter", as opposed to?
I have to say that my interactions with the Dutch Immigration Officials has been to a very high standard.

[RedPill]

1 hour ago, fceligoj said:

Since they are not related, just a gf, etc., here is their reply to me with a Thai wife:

Unless I misunderstood you, and you are living with your Thai wife together in Holland.

 

Then this is the alternative, better approach. 

 

You and your partner, are inviting the girl to Holland for a holiday.

 

Once she is there, she can take the train to Brussels and visits the boyfriend.

 

But not that starting point of Boyfriend in Belgium invites Thai Holiday fling directly to Brussels ... that opens a can of worms.

 

At the end, it's just a month holiday ... you don't move together as of yet (reasons to return to Thailand)

 

Chose the better route for a genuine way to get that tourist visa, for a holiday.

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[RedPill]

13 hours ago, Jip99 said:

My missus has not earned a Penny in 13 years but she is financially secure and has had 14 visas.

To wrap this up for me ????

 

IMO ... what you did with your missus does not really count anymore. It's different for everyone. Also maybe different times, long ago.

 

What matters is that your friend's fling got denied, this week.

 

And how to work around this in better ways ...

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[indieke]

Ok, I give you my five cents. I am Belgian and my experiences are with the Belgian foreign affairs.

 

First, your visa application goes to the Embassy. The most small doubt, gets your application send to Belgium, who decide for your visa.

So that are a lot of cases. My gf is Philippine, so same thing there. Once in Belgium, the demand was answered after.......4 months. refused for same reasons as OP.  

 

Now my gf has Ed visa for Thailand. She can do a demand by the Embassy here.  We met the Ambassador, a very kind man, on a party. They just get instructions, to be very difficult. If the Embassy gives a positive advice, Belgium decides faster.  I can assure you that many advice here, with good intentions is incorrect. Inviting her as a couple is mostly denied, as sponsor, bf, even more hard.  With enough means, a good income, sometimes. If like me, you meet people from Embassy, there is a chance of a positive advice. In my case, she has Ed visa, a travel history, and she has to return to Thailand where she has a leech and has to go to school. 

 

Now, I am not far from Pattaya. There are agencies that have good contact with some Embassies. You pay them a fine, and they get the visa for you (10.000 bht). I know a company where you only pay when success. They use German or Dutch Embassy, not Belgium. After obtaining visa, you better board in country that issued, then you go where you want.

 

About French Embassy. It seems they are more relaxed. I know many people obtaining their visa directly there.

 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by indieke

[sead]

You say Scengen Visa Belgium. I had to apply 1 for sweden and 1 for schengen. Since I work around Scandinavia I applied for her a Schengen visa to. So perhaps only a visa for Belgium at first?

[RedPill]

25 minutes ago, indieke said:

I can assure you that many advice here, with good intentions is incorrect. Inviting her as a couple is mostly denied

Ok, thanks .. I'm open to listen to your experience with this.

 

Does that mean a Thai can never visit their friends (or far/near/close family) in Schengen area for a genuine holiday?

 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[indieke]

5 minutes ago, RedPill said:

Ok, thanks .. I'm open to listen to your experience with this.

 

When I first invited my gf, I was still married, and my wife did not care, as we were divorcing already.  We invited her as a friend with all   proves, we knew her long time.  She had a lot of travel in Asia.  Once the Embassy, then the Manila one, not advised positive, after 4.5 long months, the visa was denied. So this was an invitation visa with support.

 

I been looking for solutions a time now. I can tell you, that a steady job, income, like someone in our country is success, all the other cases, girl-friend, just tourist visa, are mostly denied in Belgium.

 

Like I said, I see success with my French fiends who invite their gf, not with the Belgian one's. So I can give you in PM an adres in Naklua, that has a high rate of success, of inviting by the DUTCH embassy. Money enough on her account, they will make a fake travel itternary (note, every travel plans can change, it has no influence after you obtained the visa), they will make a reservation for the flight. This is NOT a booking, where you loose your money when denied, and is enough. Then you need insurance for Schengen, let's say by Axa, that MUST pay you back if denied.  

[RedPill]

9 minutes ago, indieke said:

When I first invited my gf, I was still married, and my wife did not care, as we were divorcing already.

Sorry, that doesn't count to me as a 'typical couple' inviting a Thai or Philippine girl for a holiday.

 

Unless you want to get her over as au-pair or something ... but not as your girlfriend, with your wife still married in/around your house! ????

 

That's why I say ... it's always different for everybody ... different circumstances.

 

You were still married, man, that opens another can of worms ...

 

And on that topic ... to get a visa for a Philippine girl is a total different thing/rules/culture (OFW's, marriage etc...) than a Thai girl.

 

Too mixed up, doesn't apply to the OP, even if you are Belgium ????

 

 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[LivinLOS]

18 hours ago, theoldgit said:

You really need to read the whole thread.

This thread is about a Belgian who who is resident in Belgium and wants his Thai girlfriend to join him at his home for a holiday, different rules apply in that scenario, she cannot simply book a holiday in Germany and pop over the border.

But she can... 

I have been in the situation of being resident in an EU country but applied to a different one for a tourist visa simply because it was an easier more local consulate. 

Thats what free movement brings. 

[indieke]

3 minutes ago, RedPill said:

Sorry, that doesn't count to me as a 'typical couple' inviting a Thai or Philippine girl for a holiday.

 

Unless you want to get her over as au-pair or something ... but not as your girlfriend, with your wife still married in/around your house! ????

 

That's why I say ... it's always different for everybody ... different circumstances.

 

You were still married, man, that opens another can of worms ...

 

 

 

 And that is where you are wrong.  She was not invited as my gf. But as a friend that helped us, a too long story to develop. It was mentioned above, that  couple could invite a girl as a friend, I say that doesn't work.  YOU inviting her as YOUR gf, not work well in Belgium, especially if she is young, not has a good income, not have enough guaranties to go back home. WIth other words, they not want to take any changes, that she would not go back. A woman with means, just clear to visit Europe, having an own house job, is what they agree.

 

Again, France is more open to invite your gf, if you prove a relation.  And no harm done if you go to an agency, who works with a different Embassy the the Belgium one, to obtain visa.

[indieke]

2 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

But she can... 

I have been in the situation of being resident in an EU country but applied to a different one for a tourist visa simply because it was an easier more local consulate. 

Thats what free movement brings. 

That is what I am saying. Believe me, try to forget to ask for Belgium. Go to that agency, tell your requirements, and they handle it for you. They do a lot to obtain it, as their policy is "no visa, no fee". It is all done legal, but let's say they have good contacts with some embassy to get positive evaluation. 

 

Even if you do all, to make a solid case, by Belgium it is denied too often. Not so by the Embassy itself, but Belgian Foreign affaires...   

[theoldgit]

2 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

But she can... 

I have been in the situation of being resident in an EU country but applied to a different one for a tourist visa simply because it was an easier more local consulate. 

Thats what free movement brings. 

Yes, the but as OP's friend has already applied for a visa for his girlfriend, that will be on SIS.
What do you think will happen when she suddenly decides she wants to travel to Germany?
She will of course then need to supply details of the new trip with most of the accomodation needing to be in Germany snd the flights would need to be to there, affordability, reasons to return etc etc, but this time she probably wouldn't have that benefit of a local sponsor.
Don't you think the team at the new member state would smell a rat?

[RedPill]

7 minutes ago, indieke said:

And that is where you are wrong.  She was not invited as my gf. But as a friend that helped us, a too long story to develop. It was mentioned above, that  couple could invite a girl as a friend, I say that doesn't work

Don't need to tell the long story. To make it short, she is from the Philippines ... not Thai, different rules apply ????

 

OFW's etc.

 

 

 

[LivinLOS]

2 minutes ago, theoldgit said:

Yes, the but as OP's friend has already applied for a visa for his girlfriend, that will be on SIS.
What do you think will happen when she suddenly decides she wants to travel to Germany?
She will of course then need to supply details of the new trip with most of the accomodation needing to be in Germany snd the flights would need to be to there, affordability, reasons to return etc etc, but this time she probably wouldn't have that benefit of a local sponsor.
Don't you think the team at the new member state would smell a rat?

yes true.. Once failed the barrier gets higher (I assume).. 

[indieke]

1 minute ago, theoldgit said:

Yes, the but as OP's friend has already applied for a visa for his girlfriend, that will be on SIS.
What do you think will happen when she suddenly decides she wants to travel to Germany?
She will of course then need to supply details of the new trip with most of the accomodation needing to be in Germany snd the flights would need to be to there, affordability, reasons to return etc etc, but this time she probably wouldn't have that benefit of a local sponsor.
Don't you think the team at the new member state would smell a rat?

Yes, you are right about that.  That is indeed a problem now. And reason, you never should apply by Belgian Embassy, the first time.

 

BUT. I cannot state this enough. USE AN AGENCY.  First they have contacts, and being denied one time only, is not a reason to be denied for ever, if all requirements by the agency, are taken care of. I not give an adres on public forum, be free to pm me. Again it is legal, just you need the right contact. 

[RedPill]

18 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

I have been in the situation of being resident in an EU country but applied to a different one for a tourist visa simply because it was an easier more local consulate.

Strictly, from what I always got ... is that you have to enter Schengen at the country you got the visa from.

 

But in reality ... I often applied in one country, and flew into a different one. No one ever cared about that.

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[indieke]

2 minutes ago, RedPill said:

Don't need to tell the long story. To make it short, she is from the Philippines ... not Thai, different rules apply ????

 

OFW's etc.

 

 

 

You ask how to get your gf in BELGIUM, being denied.  WHy don't you take any good advice then. No. It would be different if you had applied in France, Germany, Polen.......  What happens is the same.  If your request is not convincing enough, like most cases, it is send to the diplomatic case, and goes all to the same office, "Vreemdelingen zaken" in Belgium. They are the most difficult one to have positive reaction of Europe. Even here in Thailand they know that.

 

I have a good case by applying in Thailand now, because :

 

- She has ED visa, menaing she is student, and need autorisation from school to do the trip to Europe, she is expected back.

- By obtaining the Ed visa, she has a bankaccount with substantial money on it to finance her trip. She has a year lease for a house, where she normally would return.

 

These two element are the only different one's. But it does not matter so much. If you not want to listen to my experience, ok. But I can only say, stop trying and wasting your time, by Belgian Embassy. Go to a specialized agency, a good one. Discuss your case, let them apply for your gf, at the embassy they work the best with. Up to you

[RedPill]

3 minutes ago, indieke said:

You ask how to get your gf in BELGIUM, being denied.  WHy don't you take any good advice then. No. It would be different if you had applied in France, Germany, Polen.......  What happens is the same.

Yes, I understand that. 

 

It would be the same in France, Belgium or Germany ... for your Philippine girl, especially since you mentioned 'as a helper' (OFW's rules etc.)

 

That does not mean it's the same for a Thai girl

 

Can you follow me up to this point only? ????

 

[indieke]

2 minutes ago, RedPill said:

Yes, I understand that. 

 

It would be the same in France, Belgium or Germany ... for your Philippine girl, especially since you mentioned 'as a helper' (OFW's rules etc.)

 

That does not mean it's the same for a Thai girl

 

Can you follow me up to this point only? ????

 

I follow you, and understand your remarks. She not has been filed as a helper though. But as a friend of the family. We knew from giving us friendly advice, when travel to the Philippines.  As you know, there are 2 tourist visas. One by invitation, where you have to prove you know the person for one way or another. Second individually. WHere money on account, a job, a house on your name are required to make a chance.

 

So, being Thai or Philippine, is exactly the same procedure. The Thai girl will need the same requirements as the Philippine girl, if no positive advice from Embassy, same section in Belgium that would decide. Belgium refuses mostly, if you are requesting the first option by invitation. When France, seems to have less problem with that. And again, OP should go to an agency, and I am surprised nobody PM me to get more information, where to go.

[RedPill]

2 minutes ago, indieke said:

I am surprised nobody PM me to get more information, where to go.

... maybe ppl are getting fed up with getting a Thai into their country, or the love is gone ????

 

[RedPill]

10 minutes ago, indieke said:

I follow you, and understand your remarks. She not has been filed as a helper though. But as a friend of the family. We knew from giving us friendly advice, when travel to the Philippines.  As you know, there are 2 tourist visas. One by invitation, where you have to prove you know the person for one way or another. Second individually. WHere money on account, a job, a house on your name are required to make a chance.

 

So, being Thai or Philippine, is exactly the same procedure. The Thai girl will need the same requirements as the Philippine girl, if no positive advice from Embassy, same section in Belgium that would decide. Belgium refuses mostly, if you are requesting the first option by invitation. When France, seems to have less problem with that. And again, OP should go to an agency, and I am surprised nobody PM me to get more information, where to go.

Yes, ok, we settle for this.

 

But I don't envy you for the path you went through. Must have been hell, a filipina GF working in thailand, mix of helper, different couple not signed up for the OFW ... while you are still married. But good you sorted this out ????

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[indieke]

15 minutes ago, RedPill said:

Yes, ok, we settle for this.

 

But I don't envy you for the path you went through. Must have been hell, a filipina GF working in thailand, mix of helper, different couple not signed up for the OFW ... while you are still married. But good you sorted this out ????

 

 

It is much easier all, being in Thailand, but it cost me an arm and a leg. Ed visa 35.000, renting a house, soon my retirement visa, flights and travels in and out, a motorbike, so she can go around, when I am not there etc.  If I say procedure is same for Philippine or Thai, the only difference is that Philippine authorities are more difficult to let her go abroad. IF she gets Schengen, here she just takes the plane after authorization of school. In Philippines, she would get cross - examination there. Anyway, I am not married any more, but hell I not apply for long term visa through Belgium.

 

EDIT She not work here. We do all legal, she really goes to school and learns Thai.

Edited February 25, 2020 by indieke

[RedPill]

1 hour ago, indieke said:

If I say procedure is same for Philippine or Thai, the only difference is that Philippine authorities are more difficult to let her go abroad.

That was my only point. It's because of that overall OFW revenue program, that the rules are different for Thai's than a Filipina.

 

If you remember, my reply was only towards your statement: "Inviting her as a couple is mostly denied"

 

But you base this only from your personal experience, with a Filipina (under all your circumstances).

 

Just because you met her in Thailand, doesn't mean same rules apply to a Thai friend/couple inviting a Thai girl to Belgium.

 

For the remaining, I agree with all you said about embassies in different countries etc.

 

Thanks, good morning discussion. Not always easy to keep stuff straight in one go on a forum ????

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by RedPill

[theoldgit]

14 minutes ago, RedPill said:

Thanks, good morning discussion. Not always easy to keep stuff straight in one go on a forum ????

But can I remind members that this is a forum where members seek advice on a specific issue, not a general discussion on all things visa related and our own take on various issues. 

[stouricks]

Sorry to rub salt in the wounds, went to BFS last Thursday for a Spanish Schengen for my GF, not married, she doesn't work, I pay everything. Four previous UK Visas.

Passport will be back tomorrow.

Edited February 25, 2020 by stouricks