UK Passport issues during COVID-19

[Martinpeter]

7 hours ago, cheekysailor said:

If your passport will expire before a solution has been agreed you will need to consider returning to UK to renew your passport.

How? walk back to the UK? aren't the airports closed?

 

surely the Passports offices already know this? are they that dum?

[OJAS]

2 hours ago, cheekysailor said:

he need for a sustainable passport service to be available to British Nationals overseas has been recognised and Her Majesty’s Passport Office are working on a solution to this. If and when a solution has been found and agreed with Ministry Of Foreign Affairs Thailand we will contact all affected persons.

A solution which will no doubt be agreed and announced by 31st December 2563. And I do mean 2563 A.D, rather than 2563 B.E. of course! IMHO it is yet another example of brazen HMPO incompetence and ineptitude which has been much in evidence ever since they inflicted the cumbersome and bureaucratic With-It Tower Passport Renewal Experience on us 6 years ago in place of the much smoother Hong Kong Passport Renewal Process if it has only taken the coronavirus pandemic for the need for such a solution to finally penetrate their thick skulls.

Edited May 21, 2020 by OJAS

[OJAS]

1 hour ago, cheekysailor said:

If your passport will expire before a solution has been agreed you will need to consider returning to UK to renew your passport.

The Ambassador must surely have been aware that this was the case when he delivered his message on 15th May. So why did he choose not to be upfront about this then instead of deliberately and maliciously leading those with imminently expiring passports up the garden path by implying that emailing the Embassy might result in a satisfactory solution to their predicament?

 

[cheekysailor]

The Ambassador must surely have been aware that this was the case when he delivered his message on 15th May.  Exactly!

 

'We cannot be held responsible' Is a shambolic response from the embassy.  The British Embassy 'should'  be liaising with Thai authorities in order to successfully extend the duration of passports until a suitable time and thus updating us on possible solutions. 

      The Aussie and Americans have already established two alternate methods of obtaining passports safeguarding it's citizens.  Why are the British so far behind?

[Martinpeter]

Hi/.

 

Yes it is 7 weeks today, i should have collected my new passport now!

 

Still waiting!

 

and nothing has been done yet? communication is zero? no help provided!

 

paid my money and received nothing! only excuses! from Passport offices!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[prakhonchai nick]

52 minutes ago, Canuck1966 said:

If that is the case why don't they just use their loaf and send them back to either the Embassy or to our Thai private addresses?

PATHETIC 

I wrote to HMPO and suggested those 2 possibilities. I received a rather curt reply......Not possible!

[Canuck1966]

11 minutes ago, Martinpeter said:

Hi/.

 

Yes it is 7 weeks today, i should have collected my new passport now!

 

Still waiting!

 

and nothing has been done yet? communication is zero? no help provided!

 

paid my money and received nothing! only excuses! from Passport offices!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Same here March 12th they took the cash and not a dickie bird

Absolutely disgusting 

[ImageDude]

8 hours ago, cheekysailor said:

If your passport will expire before a solution has been agreed you will need to consider returning to UK to renew your passport.

Kind Regards

British Embassy Bangkok

And thereby incurring more expense. That would make it one hell of an expensive passport! What kind of a response is that? It in no way addresses the issue for those of us with passport renewals already in the system.

[cheekysailor]

I have spoke with the Chonburi  immigration office. who were very helpful and sympathetic to my needs. I fully understand that this is not a immigration issue but on the off chance, I was asking to see if they had heard anything about this situation from the powers that be.  In addition where do I stand in relation to an expired passport in these troublesome times. Their response was almost pleading, stating that need to contact authorities in the UK in order to solve this matter.  Many people had been into Chonburi already with the same problem and it was only going to get far worse.  
As for the rules. An expired passport to them is still an expired passport and the holder must face the consequences accordingly. It is out of there hands until they hear indifferently. 
  This post is more to see has anyone had any or similar response from their Thai Immigration Office.

[Canuck1966]

6 minutes ago, prakhonchai nick said:

I wrote to HMPO and suggested those 2 possibilities. I received a rather curt reply......Not possible!

Yeh I've had the same reply

 

[cheekysailor]

And therefore incurring more expense. That would it one hell of an expensive passport! 

 

As stated before on a worse case scenario and I was to go back to the UK for a prolonged period of time I would lose my job.  Furthermore, as stated I would have to find somewhere to live in the UK. Presently I only have distant cousins who I 'briefly' spoke to at a wedding over ten years ago. So the idea of shacking up with family, which is what I was advised is simply a no go. 
      Looking into matters even further, I will not be entitled to any benefits for the first six months if it was an extended stay as I have left my job.  (That is my understanding on this matter, maybe someone could inform me otherwise). I would not be able to apply for a loan as, A: I have not been living in the UK for six months.  B. I do not live at a permanent address, nor have I been living there for three months,  (this changes from bank to bank, three months is the lowest I have found).  Although, I do have a UK bank account it's technically illegal to apply for a loan as I would providing incorrect housing information. I would not be able to get a job in an already dire climate as I have not had a fixed address for six months, this could change I am going from the PAYE website.  
     Repatriation loans are available from the government an can be given but are looked on a case by case basis.  Once received, funds must be paid back in full before one can apply for a passport
       So effectively, I need to cash in my ISAs at an all time low, alternatively sell property in a saturated and dire market.

   This is before looking at things such as who is going to look after my pride and joy which is my dog and many other issues which will arise very quickly indeed.
 

All because the inept and foolish will not try and solve this matter.

 

Edited May 21, 2020 by blackcab
Font normalised

[pontious]

5 hours ago, ImageDude said:

If your passport will expire before a solution has been agreed you will need to consider returning to UK to renew your passport.

Kind Regards

British Embassy Bangkok

An outrageous reply. For those that will be affected by the above why not wave the 'travel requirement' or allow a fictitious  travel plan be accepted for an ETD - they are valid for 1 year I believe.  In these abnormal times the fact that is not ''normal  procedure'' should not be a consideration.!! If they had started this 8 weeks ago there would be a solution by now. They obviously did nothing until the phone calls/ emails from UK citizens overwhelmed them. Too little - too late. Substitute the first 'Too' for 'nothing'.

[OJAS]

1 hour ago, pontious said:

For those that will be affected by the above why not wave the 'travel requirement'

indeed! This is precisely what the US Embassy are prepared to do as regards issuing ETD's to our American cousins with expiring passports, according to this thread:-

 

 

[OJAS]

6 hours ago, Canuck1966 said:

If that is the case why don't they just use their loaf and send them back to either the Embassy or to our Thai private addresses?

PATHETIC 

I doubt whether there is anyone around in VFS to sign for the receipt of replacement passports from HMPO in the UK in any event at the present time - meaning that DHL will in all probability only hang on to them for a limited period before sending them back from whence they came.

 

A complete and utter shambles.

[cheekysailor]

2 hours ago, pontious said:

An outrageous reply. For those that will be affected by the above why not wave the 'travel requirement' or allow a fictitious  travel plan be accepted for an ETD - they are valid for 1 year I believe.  In these abnormal times the fact that is not ''normal  procedure'' should not be a consideration.!! If they had started this 8 weeks ago there would be a solution by now. They obviously did nothing until the phone calls/ emails from UK citizens overwhelmed them. Too little - too late. Substitute the first 'Too' for 'nothing'.

Unfortunately, the ETD cannot be used as a form of ID and therefore cannot be used to validate the 90 day reporting, VISAs or WPs.

[pontious]

1 hour ago, cheekysailor said:

Unfortunately, the ETD cannot be used as a form of ID and therefore cannot be used to validate the 90 day reporting, VISAs or WPs.

Then ask the MFA, as there no way British citizens can renew there  passports can they allow it.

What happens if a British citizen , residing in Thailand, loses there passport, or has there passport stolen, is the BE embassy advice to fly back to UK - that is absurd.

If I were you I would wait a while and with 7-10 days to run out date, if there is no solution, apply for a ETD with a fictitious travel plan. Six weeks ahead I believe. That at least gives you some more breathing space. To make sure ETD,s are good or not for extensions etc. I would ask Ubonjoe on the other Visa forum. I did some time ago but forget what he said. I think he was more favorable than your first sentence says. He will know.

[pontious]

From UbonJoe on the other visa forum.

 

.

[cheekysailor]

Finally, I have a couple of emails: One for specific person with in the consular in BKK who handles these issues. In addition, I also have a higher tier email address for HMPO.  Due to forum rules I will not be posting them here.  Although, if you would like them please PM me, hopefully they can help your pursuit in this dire situation rather than going around the bazaars and voice mail services several times like I have done.

 

[Saltire]

20 hours ago, cheekysailor said:

I have spoke with the Chonburi  immigration office. who were very helpful and sympathetic to my needs. I fully understand that this is not a immigration issue but on the off chance, I was asking to see if they had heard anything about this situation from the powers that be.  In addition where do I stand in relation to an expired passport in these troublesome times. Their response was almost pleading, stating that need to contact authorities in the UK in order to solve this matter.  Many people had been into Chonburi already with the same problem and it was only going to get far worse.  
As for the rules. An expired passport to them is still an expired passport and the holder must face the consequences accordingly. It is out of there hands until they hear indifferently. 
  This post is more to see has anyone had any or similar response from their Thai Immigration Office.

I called my office (Kanchanaburi) and they told me they will stamp my passport with an extension date to match the passport expiry date which means I will be short 3 months if I can't get a renewal before November when my extension is due. Hopefully this will be long enough to get something moving before I too am in the sh!t.

[OJAS]

14 hours ago, pontious said:

apply for a ETD with a fictitious travel plan.

But won't the Embassy require to see some evidence of this imaginary plan? That said, maybe a cheap throwaway Air Asia ticket to an adjoining country would do the trick (as advised on here so as to avoid potential check-in problems at LHR in the case of those intending to fly to Thailand on a one-way ticket with a 30-day visa exempt stamp upon arrival) - provided, of course that: (1) ETD's are valid for entry into said adjoining country; and (2) Air Asia is currently operating flights to that country.

[cheekysailor]

Further news.
 

Dear  xx,

                   Good afternoon, thank you for your reply regarding my passport which is set to expire on the 26th of July.  Although, I understand your rationale in saying that this is an HMPO problem I do not accept that the Bangkok Embassy are clearly wiping their hands of this situation and thus stating that 'the British Embassy is unable to assist' As a 'partner' of HMPO, should the embassy not be consolidating all the info and be developing case-by-case study in order to develop a pragmatic solution to solve this matter?  
     Furthermore, by making such a sweeping statement and not looking into the personal circumstances of each individual is inept and foolhardy and a clear indication that presently personal responsibilities are not an issue and the British Embassy Thailand.   Preferring its ex-pats to be 'returning home' thus passing the responsibility on to another department in the Home Office.

        Obviously, I understand that you are just passing on information from the powers that be. Hopefully, you will be so kind to do the same and pass this email and the many others that I am sure you receive through the chain of command in order to put mine and thousands of other ex-pats minds at ease.

Yours sincerely,

 

RESPONSE

 

I can assure you that the British Embassy is not “wiping its hands” of the situation. We have been speaking with Her Majesty’s Passport Office for many weeks to escalate the severity of the situation that is being faced by British Nationals in Thailand.

 

The British Embassy currently has no authority to deal with passport renewals unless a decision is made by Her Majesty’s Passport Office which states we can do so.

 

Unfortunately, we are also beholden to Ministry Of Foreign Affairs in Thailand with regard to any solution that is found. Until both Her Majesty’s Passport Office and Ministry Of Foreign Affairs Thailand can agree on a solution for British Nationals to renew their passports in Thailand whilst VFS is closed, this facility will be unavailable.

 

As the renewal of passports is owned by Her Majesty’s Passport Office, you should contact them directly with any complaints you have.

 

You can contact Her Majesty’s Passport Office directly on:

Telephone: 0300 222 0000
From outside the UK: +44 (0)300 222 0000
Textphone: 18001 0300 222 0222

 

You can also use the online enquiry form for general advice or to make a complaint.

 

I am sorry that I cannot be of more assistance.

 

Kind Regards

 

 

 

This email is intended for the addressee(s) only.  All messages se

[Martinpeter]

Hi there/.

 

I hope when they finally issue our new outstanding passports this year?

 

That they are dated from the date finally issued date?

 

NOT the applied for date, otherwise we lose again? I bet they don't care either about this, we lose because the passport office delay not ours!

 

Let's c?

[pontious]

4 hours ago, cheekysailor said:

As the renewal of passports is owned by Her Majesty’s Passport Office, you should contact them directly with any complaints you have.

Many people have done that - they always reply.

1. Get an ETD - cannot if no travel plans.

2. Contact BE for local advice - we do- they keep referring us to HPMO!

One thing is for sure - HMPO will not be pushing to reopen VFS. They cannot cope with the applications they have received. It is a complete shambles.

5 hours ago, cheekysailor said:

Thailand whilst VFS is closed, this facility will be unavailable.

Why is the Passport section closed.?  Visa applications whilst annoying to those who want to apply is not essential. Passport renewal is.!!!!

[OJAS]

16 hours ago, cheekysailor said:

The British Embassy currently has no authority to deal with passport renewals unless a decision is made by Her Majesty’s Passport Office which states we can do so.

Or to translate:-

 

"The British Embassy does not operate outside the limited confines of its ivory tower silo with its blinkers firmly fixed in a forward direction, consistent with overall Government policy which HMPO is also following".

 

So much these days for the concept of "joined-up Government", which was all the rage 20 years ago!

Edited May 23, 2020 by OJAS

[pontious]

What is going to happen to those who applied mid March and have still not been told there passport has been done. It is now two and a half months later and no one  has reported success so far.

Remember once your application has been accepted your passport is no longer valid for travel. Only valid for ID. But only whilst it is valid. After that you are here illegally and subject to overstay. The longer VFS remains shut  more and more people will be dragged into the net. These are not last minute applicants. They applied months ago.!

The BE cannot tell those people to fly back to the UK to sort it out. They do NOT have a valid passport for travel..

And the self quarantine for 14 days starting soon and the FCO advice do NOT travel internationally unless 'essential' does not help..

 

 

Edited May 23, 2020 by pontious

[cheekysailor]

On 5/23/2020 at 3:37 PM, pontious said:

The BE cannot tell those people to fly back to the UK to sort it out. They do NOT have a valid passport for travel.

You know I am in the same boat, so please don't think I'm having a go.  However, I would like to bet in this scenario they will say that you will have to apply for ETD and then go back to the UK to sort it out.

Edited May 25, 2020 by blackcab
Quote fixed

[Upnotover]

2 hours ago, pontious said:

The BE cannot tell those people to fly back to the UK to sort it out. They do NOT have a valid passport for travel..

 

Whilst it is correct that the old passport is cancelled upon receipt of the new application the only people that know about that are the UK authorities.  If the old passport is still not expired it could still be used to return to the UK, obviously as a last resort, although the pubs may open in the not to far future so might not be so bad an idea.

[OJAS]

57 minutes ago, Upnotover said:

the only people that know about that are the UK authorities.

Not so sure about that. Might it not become apparent to an IO at BKK Departures that the passport of someone en route back to the UK had been electronically cancelled after he or she had swiped the photopage through a scanner in accordance with standard practice?

[Upnotover]

1 minute ago, OJAS said:

Not so sure about that. Might it not become apparent to an IO at BKK Departures that the passport of someone en route back to the UK had been electronically cancelled after he or she had swiped the photopage through a scanner in accordance with standard practice?

The subject has been discussed here several times over the years and apparently no, the UK doesnt immediately share information about cancelled passports with other countries, if indeed ever. 

[pontious]

On 5/22/2020 at 3:32 PM, cheekysailor said:

I can assure you that the British Embassy is not “wiping its hands” of the situation. We have been speaking with Her Majesty’s Passport Office for many weeks to escalate the severity of the situation that is being faced by British Nationals in Thailand.

 

The British Embassy currently has no authority to deal with passport renewals unless a decision is made by Her Majesty’s Passport Office which states we can do so.

 

Then get the Ambassador to phone Priti Patel and tell her we need a solution now. Otherwise the consular officers will be busy visiting the IDC. Tell her you want to issue ETD,S valid for one year with no travel plans. Tell her you want to put a sticker in the passport to temporarily extend the passport for 1 year.  Someone has to get off there ass and provide a solution. Not you and me -them.! The USA fixed it in nano seconds. Rules are rules is not applicable in these emergency times. Also ask them why is the Passport section in VFS still closed. Or why it was closed at all for that matter. Rant over. My passport is valid till mid November - any one like to guarantee no problem,? 

Edited May 23, 2020 by pontious