'What planet are they on?' No respite for UK's Johnson and aide

[vogie]

46 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Yougov poll.

 

59% think Cummings should resign. 27% think he should stay.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2020/05/26/3fb8f/2

 

71% say he broke the lockdown rules. 20% say he did not.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2020/05/26/3fb8f/1

 

57% say the media has been fair in its reporting of Cummings. 33% say its been unfair.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/media/survey-results/daily/2020/05/26/e3651/3

 

70% say Cummings has made it harder for the government to explain it lockdown message. 2% think he has made it easier.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2020/05/26/e3651/2

 

It would appear all those defending Cummings are way out of step with public opinion.

Most of those people who took part in the poll didn't know what they were voting for.

 

A lot of those that took part in the poll are probably dead now.

 

Only 0.0032% of the population took part in those polls, so it's not the will of the people.

 

Polls are a stupid way to decide things.

 

 

 

 

 

[cleopatra2]

21 minutes ago, Logosone said:

I thought about this too, I thought it would have made more sense that he was generally unwell and then thought about doing a test drive on account of that. It was very unfortunate that it became drive to test the eye-sight. However this was not the media's fault, this was Cummings himself saying that, he's on record. Here's the excerpt from his full transcript:

 

"On Sunday 12 April, 15 days after I had first displayed symptoms, I decided to return to work. My wife was very worried, particularly given my eyesight seemed to have been affected by the disease. She didn't want to risk a nearly 300-mile drive with our child, given how ill I had been. We agreed that we should go for a short drive to see if I could drive safely. We drove for roughly half an hour and ended up on the outskirts of Barnard Castle town. We did not visit the castle. We did not walk around the town. We parked by a river."

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/dominic-cummings-statement-speech-transcript-durham-full-text-read-lockdown-a9531856.html

 

So it was Cummings who gave eye-sight as a reason for the test drive to Barnard Castle, it was not a media misconstruction.

 

It does make it look as if he was trying to construct a story that was plausible, after all a plausible reason for not being able to drive would be poor eye-sight. Hence he needed to test drive.

 

Excessive detail equals lie?

He had been medically cleared before his trip to Bernard Castle

If he was concerned about vision why not carry out the proscribed test of trying to read a number plate at the required distance. 

His wife did not have covid symptoms when they embarked upon the journey to Durham . The statement about Dom s wife having covid was put out by no.10 statement on Saturday. Dom corrected this in his televised presentation.

[Phulublub]

25 minutes ago, Logosone said:

We drove for roughly half an hour and ended up on the outskirts of Barnard Castle town.

30 miles away....and it took "roughly half an hour".....

 

Maybe Durham police should add speeding to the investigation they have opened.

 

????

 

PH

[cleopatra2]

6 minutes ago, vogie said:

Most of those people who took part in the poll didn't know what they were voting for.

 

A lot of those that took part in the poll are probably dead now.

 

Only 0.0032% of the population took part in those polls, so it's not the will of the people.

 

Polls are a stupid way to decide things.

 

 

 

 

 

I see a Conservative MP has stated that breaking the law is secondary to winning the next GE

[Phulublub]

2 minutes ago, cleopatra2 said:

I see a Conservative MP has stated that breaking the law is secondary to winning the next GE

Really?  You have a source for that?

 

PH

[stevenl]

15 minutes ago, vogie said:

Most of those people who took part in the poll didn't know what they were voting for.

 

A lot of those that took part in the poll are probably dead now.

 

Only 0.0032% of the population took part in those polls, so it's not the will of the people.

 

Polls are a stupid way to decide things.

Your last point is valid, the rest not. The arrogance ("Most of those people who took part in the poll didn't know what they were voting for.") is astounding.

Edited May 27, 2020 by stevenl

[Phulublub]

15 minutes ago, Phulublub said:

30 miles away....and it took "roughly half an hour".....

 

Maybe Durham police should add speeding to the investigation they have opened.

 

????

 

PH

Replying to myself...after a bit of fact checking it would appear that the bench by the river that Cummings says he sat on for a short while is on the FAR side of Barnard Castle from the family home.  

 

So with his dicky eyesight, he drove through a busy town?  Putting your own family first is one thing; being totally unconcerned for the safety of other families' children is quite another. 

 

Ah, might say the supporters, you don't know he drove through town.  True - but if that is the case, it is a considerably further distance than 30 miles to drive in "roughly half an hour".

 

So, M'Lud, did he willfully put others at risk by driving through town?  Or exceed the speed limit?  Or both?  Or is the whole story just a complete fabrication?

 

PH

Edited May 27, 2020 by Phulublub

[OJAS]

On 5/25/2020 at 8:45 PM, BillStrangeOgre said:

I doubt any parent would leave a 4 year old child in full time care with someone who was not immediate family and capable to do so

Most parents would probably be unable to afford the cost in any case. But Cummings clearly could have, but was presumably too tight-fisted to do so. Sure this would almost certainly have meant his son having to be cared for by someone who was not immediate family, but why should the welfare of a 4-year-old take precedence over the welfare of all those who were needlessly exposed to the virus as a result of his reckless "magical mystery tour"? 

 

On 5/25/2020 at 10:53 PM, tribalfusion001 said:

Took a 15 mile journey to see if he could drive safety, smells of fresh turd and bs...

Clearly he was also too tight-fisted to pay for an optician's eye test to determine whether he was up for the return drive to London!

 

Edited May 27, 2020 by OJAS

[cleopatra2]

27 minutes ago, Phulublub said:

Really?  You have a source for that?

 

PH

Danny Kruger

See Nicholas Watt twitter 

Edited May 27, 2020 by cleopatra2

[Logosone]

32 minutes ago, cleopatra2 said:

He had been medically cleared before his trip to Bernard Castle

If he was concerned about vision why not carry out the proscribed test of trying to read a number plate at the required distance. 

His wife did not have covid symptoms when they embarked upon the journey to Durham . The statement about Dom s wife having covid was put out by no.10 statement on Saturday. Dom corrected this in his televised presentation.

That's true, he was medically cleared to go back to work. Of course he could still have had another bout of feeling unwell, that's entirely plausible that could happen after a doctor's visit. I'm just reading the biography of the great Errol Flynn, just before he died he got the all clear from a doctor.

 

But it is indeed problematic that he adduces the eye-sight issue, because it is the case that you generally test your eye-sight whilst not driving. His story would have been more plausible if he'd said he suddenly felt unwell again. But it looks like he was looking for a 'believe me' factor and with bad eye sight you can't drive, that's a believable excuse, I'll go with that. So perhaps a hastily drafted story which was intended to fit the rules and evidence, but does not tell the full truth.

 

Indeed his wife was recovered by then, but it's probably immaterial, it could be she's a very poor driver and she did not want to drive to London.

[cleopatra2]

6 minutes ago, Logosone said:

That's true, he was medically cleared to go back to work. Of course he could still have had another bout of feeling unwell, that's entirely plausible that could happen after a doctor's visit. I'm just reading the biography of the great Errol Flynn, just before he died he got the all clear from a doctor.

 

But it is indeed problematic that he adduces the eye-sight issue, because it is the case that you generally test your eye-sight whilst not driving. His story would have been more plausible if he'd said he suddenly felt unwell again. But it looks like he was looking for a 'believe me' factor and with bad eye sight you can't drive, that's a believable excuse, I'll go with that. So perhaps a hastily drafted story which was intended to fit the rules and evidence, but does not tell the full truth.

 

Indeed his wife was recovered by then, but it's probably immaterial, it could be she's a very poor driver and she did not want to drive to London.

No you misunderstand about the wife.

When leaving London to go to Durham Mary Wakefield had been unwell but not wirh any Covid Symptoms.

 

This is from the transcript

 

She was ill. She might have Covid, though she did not have a cough or a fever. At this point, most of those who I work with most closely, including the prime minister himself and others who sit within 15 feet of me every day, either had had symptoms and had returned to work or were absent with symptoms. I thought there was a distinct probability that I had already caught the disease

 

Edited May 27, 2020 by cleopatra2

[Phulublub]

10 minutes ago, cleopatra2 said:

Danny Kruger

See Nicholas Watt twitter 

Cannot see anything there that states, or gives a link to, Kruger saying winning is more important than the law...closest I can see is he is quoted as saying "maybe Cummings is arguably guilty of a minor infraction".  whih=ch is hardly the same.

 

Facts matter.  On both sides of the argument

 

PH

[cleopatra2]

3 minutes ago, Phulublub said:

Cannot see anything there that states, or gives a link to, Kruger saying winning is more important than the law...closest I can see is he is quoted as saying "maybe Cummings is arguably guilty of a minor infraction".  whih=ch is hardly the same.

 

Facts matter.  On both sides of the argument

 

PH

I will paraphrase

He says without DC and BJ we will not level up get Brexit done , and win the next GE. A arguable minor infraction of the lockdown rules is secondary.

 

 

The lockdown rules are law and there to protect the nation so infraction can hardly be construed as minor.

[Logosone]

19 minutes ago, cleopatra2 said:

No you misunderstand about the wife.

When leaving London to go to Durham Mary Wakefield had been unwell but not wirh any Covid Symptoms.

 

This is from the transcript

 

She was ill. She might have Covid, though she did not have a cough or a fever. At this point, most of those who I work with most closely, including the prime minister himself and others who sit within 15 feet of me every day, either had had symptoms and had returned to work or were absent with symptoms. I thought there was a distinct probability that I had already caught the disease

 

Why does it matter if she was ill with Covid or anything else though? What is the relevance of her illness to establishing Cummings lied?

 

 

Edited May 27, 2020 by Logosone

[evadgib]

2 hours ago, OJAS said:

Most parents would probably be unable to afford the cost in any case. But Cummings clearly could have, but was presumably too tight-fisted to do so. Sure this would almost certainly have meant his son having to be cared for by someone who was not immediate family, but why should the welfare of a 4-year-old take precedence over the welfare of all those who were needlessly exposed to the virus as a result of his reckless "magical mystery tour"? 

 

Clearly he was also too tight-fisted to pay for an optician's eye test to determine whether he was up for the return drive to London!

 

Were any open over Easter during lockdown & if so how do you propose he get there? This eyesight lark is being milked. I took it to mean that his answer was that he wasn't feeling 100% and that he simply flummoxed the reply during a 90 min unprecedented grilling.

 

In the same circumstances who wouldn't?

Edited May 27, 2020 by evadgib

[Phil McCaverty]

8 minutes ago, evadgib said:

I took it to mean that his answer was that he wasn't feeling 100% and that he simply flummoxed the reply at the end of a grilling.

It wasn't at the end of a grilling. He freely offered the information that he had problems with his eyesight so decided to test it by making a 60 mile round trip to Barnard Castle. It formed part of his pre prepared statement.

 

Talk about clutching at straws!

[evadgib]

19 minutes ago, Phil McCaverty said:

It wasn't at the end of a grilling. He freely offered the information that he had problems with his eyesight so decided to test it by making a 60 mile round trip to Barnard Castle. It formed part of his pre prepared statement.

 

Talk about clutching at straws!

Eyesight? nausea? headache? galloping gut rot? Has anyone reading this that has ever been Ill not suffered one or more of these afterwards?

Edited May 27, 2020 by evadgib

[Phil McCaverty]

18 minutes ago, evadgib said:

Eyesight? nausea? headache? galloping gut rot? Has anyone reading this that has ever been Ill not suffered one or more of these afterwards?

Apart from dodgy eyesight did Cummings claim to be suffering from any of those before his afternoon out to Barnard Castle with his family?

 

Hang on tight, those straws are getting shorter.

[Nigel Garvie]

4 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Yougov poll.

 

59% think Cummings should resign. 27% think he should stay.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2020/05/26/3fb8f/2

 

71% say he broke the lockdown rules. 20% say he did not.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2020/05/26/3fb8f/1

 

57% say the media has been fair in its reporting of Cummings. 33% say its been unfair.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/media/survey-results/daily/2020/05/26/e3651/3

 

70% say Cummings has made it harder for the government to explain it lockdown message. 2% think he has made it easier.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2020/05/26/e3651/2

 

It would appear all those defending Cummings are way out of step with public opinion.

 

3 hours ago, vogie said:

Most of those people who took part in the poll didn't know what they were voting for.

 

A lot of those that took part in the poll are probably dead now.

 

Only 0.0032% of the population took part in those polls, so it's not the will of the people.

 

Polls are a stupid way to decide things.

 

 

 

 

 

It has already been pointed out that saying people didn't know what they were voting for is incredibly arrogant, even Brexiteers believed they knew what they were voting for, albeit it was a pack of half truths and outright lies.

 

There was no claim that it was "The will of the people" simply the reporting of poll results.

 

"A lot of those that took part in the poll are probably dead now"..............Please, check the maths. 9.3 deaths per 1000 people in the uk, all causes PER ANNUM. So if this poll was 3 days ago and they polled for example 2000 people, not one would have died, on average.

 

The surprising thing is that even roughly 45% of Tories (It appears that there remains at least some decency in the Tory party) and over 40% of Brexiteers don't believe Dom's story.

 

We don't have travel restrictions in CM to speak of, although there was a time when going out of province was banned. If I had been stopped I would have said "It's OK Officer I',m Doing a Dom"

 

This is where the true HORROR of the whole lying Dom affair is apparent.

"70% say Cummings has made it harder for the government to explain it lockdown message". The result is that 10s probably 100s of thousands of people will be saying "If it is good enough for him then it's OK for me". When they get stopped they will say "I'm just DOING A DOM". The direct result of this will be increased deaths, and Cummings will to all extents and purposes be an accessory to murder. Sounds a bit heavy maybe, but it simply follows the logic. The police have already said it makes maintaining the lockdown near impossible.

[david555]

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-johnson-to-face-senior-mps-over-cummings-and-his-h
Coronavirus: Johnson to face senior MPs over Cummings and his handling of the pandemic 
The opening of schools and kick-starting the economy will also be examined by the Liaison Committee.

 

Coronavirus: Johnson to face senior MPs over Cummings and his handling of the pandemic 
The opening of schools and kick-starting the economy will also be examined by the Liaison Committee.

Boris Johnson is facing more potentially awkward questions about his refusal to sack Dominic Cummings in a 90-minute interrogation by senior MPs.

For the first time since becoming Prime Minister 10 months ago, he is appearing before the Liaison Committee, made up of the MPs who chair all-party select committees.
Mr Johnson's interrogation comes as more than 30 Tory MPs demand Mr Cummings is sacked and opinion polls suggest strong public support for his dismissal.
 

Edited May 27, 2020 by david555

[evadgib]

59 minutes ago, Phil McCaverty said:

Apart from dodgy eyesight did Cummings claim to be suffering from any of those before his afternoon out to Barnard Castle with his family?

 

Hang on tight, those straws are getting shorter.

Which part of #315 could I have further simplified?

[Phil McCaverty]

1 hour ago, evadgib said:

Were any open over Easter during lockdown & if so how do you propose he get there? This eyesight lark is being milked. I took it to mean that his answer was that he wasn't feeling 100% and that he simply flummoxed the reply during a 90 min unprecedented grilling.

 

In the same circumstances who wouldn't?

 

1 hour ago, Phil McCaverty said:

It wasn't at the end of a grilling. He freely offered the information that he had problems with his eyesight so decided to test it by making a 60 mile round trip to Barnard Castle. It formed part of his pre prepared statement.

 

Talk about clutching at straws!

 

1 minute ago, evadgib said:

Which part of #315 could I have further simplified?

QED.

 

The straws have run out!

[evadgib]

2 minutes ago, Phil McCaverty said:

 

 

QED.

 

The straws have run out!

Try quoting #315 instead of the version that hasn't survived the edit window (which is what the window is for!)

 

& what has cunards flagship got to do with it?

 

 

(????)

[Phil McCaverty]

3 minutes ago, evadgib said:

Try quoting #315 instead of the version that hasn't survived the edit window (which is what the window is for!)

 

& what has cunards flagship got to do with it?

 

 

(????)

I quoted the post you pointed to. Not my fault that you subsequently edited it on the strength of my reply.

 

Quod Erat Demonstrandum

[Chomper Higgot]

15 hours ago, evadgib said:

I could not have made it any clearer & having done so will move on.

Chuckles to self.

[david555]

Even The Torygraph ….

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/05/26/tory-revolt-grows-mps-break-ranks-calling-dominic-cummings-resign/

 

Tory MPs revolt as voters turn on Dominic Cummings 
More than 35 Conservative MPs call for Boris Johnson's chief adviser to reg-dominic-cummings-resign/

More than 35 Tory MPs including former Cabinet ministers have called for Dominic Cummings to resign, after claiming they have been contacted by hundreds of angry constituents over his alleged breaches of lockdown.

Edited May 27, 2020 by david555

[evadgib]

8 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Chuckles to self.

I'm bored and in Tescos, waiting for 'er indoors ????

[andyg75]

I haven’t read every page but it looks like the old remainer mob on here must have wet themselves with excitement when they saw the headlines about Cummins and are now trying to get some sort of revenge.what a sad lot.

[Phil McCaverty]

1 minute ago, evadgib said:

I'm bored and in Tescos

You're on a Greek island?

[evadgib]

18 minutes ago, Phil McCaverty said:

I quoted the post you pointed to. Not my fault that you subsequently edited it on the strength of my reply.

 

Quod Erat Demonstrandum

Are you genuinely no good at this banter lark or is it cos I'm on the wrong side?