On death in Thailand - Bank accounts

[Speedo1968]

I am trying to finds ways to make it easier for those concerned to close my bank accounts ( and receive the monies ) in Thailand on my death.

Note I live alone here.

I have 2 accounts, one for retirement visa the other for general expenses.

The maximum daily withdrawal amount is high on both accounts, enough to "clear" the funds quickly should there be an emergency or other issues.

 

Recently I contacted my local branch of KBank and asked them if I could nominate 3 people to have the authority to close my accounts upon my death.

They answered yes providing the following documents are provided:-

1 - Certified copy of my instructions ( English and Thai ) allowing named people to close my bank accounts and receive all monies.

2 - Copy of death certificate in Thai.

3 - Copy of my passport ( when asked if this needed to be a certified copy, the bank replied "No". )

4- Copy of daughters ( 2 ) UK passports ( when asked if this needed to be a certified copy, the bank replied "No". )   I wish to name either daughter due to not knowing which will be free to travel at the time

5 - Copy of Thai persons passport or ID card whom I trust implicitly ( when asked if this needed to be a certified copy, the bank replied "No". )

 

My questions are-

1 - Do I need certified copies of my passport and birth certificate ?

2 - Do I need certified copies of my daughters passports and birth certificates ?

3 - Has anyone else closed bank accounts for similar reasons in a similar manner to above ?

2 - Could anyone advise exactly what is required and does it differ according to the banks.

3 - I have been told that the banks ask for a copy of account holders birth certificate ( even translated to Thai ) and the birth certificate of the person withdrawing funds ( translated to Thai ).    A Thai person mentioned that someone in their family was asked to provide grandparents birth certificate.

 

[Puccini]

Each bank makes its own rules.

[bkk6060]

You have a Thai will?

 

Just my opinion, I think it is very irresponsible to make a family member come here from another country to recover death assets.  I know several here who have bank accounts and also own condos, with no will or plan to resolve the assets and distribute funds.  They actually believe their embassy will handle everything for them.

Naive and careless.

Most have no clue and in these cases, probably best to seek legal counsel.

That´s what I would recommend especially if you have what you believe are significant funds/assets based in a foreign country.

 

We are all going to die, so make the proper arrangements for it.

Edited May 30, 2020 by bkk6060

[Speedo1968]

6 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

You have a Thai will?

 

Just my opinion, I think it is very irresponsible to make a family member come here from another country to recover death assets.  I know several here who have bank accounts and also own condos, with no will or plan to resolve the assets and distribute funds.  They actually believe their embassy will handle everything for them.

Naive and careless.

Most have no clue and in these cases, probably best to seek legal counsel.

That´s what I would recommend especially if you have what you believe are significant funds/assets based in a foreign country.

 

We are all going to die, so make the proper arrangements for it.

Yes, I have a will that indicates bank accounts in England and Thailand, my assets are not large neither do i own a house / condo etc. in Thailand or England.

The money belongs to my daughters and I solely wish to ensure that monies in my Thai accounts go to them and not disappear in to the banks coffers

[KhaoYai]

Possibly a better option for you. I've never done it but my Kasikorn online banking lists 'International Transfers' (only during banking hours).

 

It may be possible for you to give your daughters the log in details for your online banking and instruct them how to make a foreign transfer. Your accounts could then be emptied without hassle.

 

Check with your bank about foreign transfers but obvioulsy don't tell them what you're thinking of. If it is possible to do this, it would probably be better to make several smaller transfers - emptying the account all in one go may trigger a fraud alert.

[Mulambana]

4 minutes ago, Speedo1968 said:

The money belongs to my daughters and I solely wish to ensure that monies in my Thai accounts go to them and not disappear in to the banks coffers

Use two accounts. Give ATM card of one account where bulk of the money sits to your daughter in the UK with PIN. Transfer money from the bulk account to your expense account (another bank account) weekly. THis cn be automated. In case of somehting happens, your daughter has full access to the money from the bulk account and can draw it quickly in the UK. 

[Delight]

 If the surviving  relative removes monies from the bank account(via a ATM) from a now dead relative-then technically that is theft.

The use of  a  joint account eliminates this issue

[Speedo1968]

18 hours ago, Delight said:

 If the surviving  relative removes monies from the bank account(via a ATM) from a now dead relative-then technically that is theft.

The use of  a  joint account eliminates this issue

I thought that if it is a joint account then only half of the monies can be withdrawn.
Please correct me if I am wrong.

[Speedo1968]

19 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

Possibly a better option for you. I've never done it but my Kasikorn online banking lists 'International Transfers' (only during banking hours).

 

It may be possible for you to give your daughters the log in details for your online banking and instruct them how to make a foreign transfer. Your accounts could then be emptied without hassle.

 

Check with your bank about foreign transfers but obvioulsy don't tell them what you're thinking of. If it is possible to do this, it would probably be better to make several smaller transfers - emptying the account all in one go may trigger a fraud alert.

Have never used online banking with my Thai accounts but do occasionally with my UK account.

[hotandsticky]

19 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

Possibly a better option for you. I've never done it but my Kasikorn online banking lists 'International Transfers' (only during banking hours).

 

It may be possible for you to give your daughters the log in details for your online banking and instruct them how to make a foreign transfer. Your accounts could then be emptied without hassle.

 

Check with your bank about foreign transfers but obvioulsy don't tell them what you're thinking of. If it is possible to do this, it would probably be better to make several smaller transfers - emptying the account all in one go may trigger a fraud alert.

 

 

Even though that would be illegal.....

[hotandsticky]

17 minutes ago, Speedo1968 said:

I thought that if it is a joint account then only half of the monies can be withdrawn.
Please correct me if I am wrong.

 

 

Incorrect - the surviving account holder becomes 100% owner.

 

 

Joint account no good for Immigration though

[couchpotato]

14 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

Incorrect - the surviving account holder becomes 100% owner.

 

 

Joint account no good for Immigration though

Correct, the joint account holder can operate the account, but cannot close it.

[dddave]

20 hours ago, Puccini said:

Each bank makes its own rules.

Sometimes even individual branches and employees within branches.  Do not count on ANY verbal statement.  Get any such information in writing, signed by branch manager.  Even then, I would double check it with headquarters branch.

 

A friend of mine had a  western neighbor who knew he was dying.  They went to his banks together, with a Thai lawyer and tried to set everything up so that my friend could distribute this man's cash assets according to his wishes. 

After the man's death, it turned into a nightmare for my friend.  The banks put up roadblocks at every turn and made it as difficult as they possibly could. 

[Puccini]

The correct way to do it is to make a will including the appointment of an executor of the will. With this, a court will institute the executor as such and the banks must give him access to the bank accounts.

[Speedo1968]

18 hours ago, Mulambana said:

Use two accounts. Give ATM card of one account where bulk of the money sits to your daughter in the UK with PIN. Transfer money from the bulk account to your expense account (another bank account) weekly. THis cn be automated. In case of somehting happens, your daughter has full access to the money from the bulk account and can draw it quickly in the UK. 

Thanks Mulambana for your suggestion.

One account is for retirement visa so I don't use it.    

The second account is for monthly expenses which are small as I don't live in Bangkok and, as an emergency coffer for medical emergencies etc.   I keep this topped up once per year.

My funds are split between Thailand and UK.

Unless I can get two cards for each account it doesn't really solve how to remove funds from both accounts, as you are aware the account for retirement visa is 800K.

From what I understand when two cards are issued against one account this becomes a joint account and as such only half of the monies can be removed.

My local branch was unsure as to the regulations so will go to Khon Kaen and ask there, hopefully they will have something in writing.

[Speedo1968]

2 hours ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

Incorrect - the surviving account holder becomes 100% owner.

 

 

Joint account no good for Immigration though

Thanks for clarifying about the surviving account holder.

 

My first account is solely for immigration - I don't touch it.

The second account is for monthly expenses which are small as I don't live in Bangkok and, as an emergency coffer for medical emergencies etc.   I keep this topped up once per year or as required.

It would mean a 3rd account for monthly expenses, this I presume I could move from the second account to a smaller monthly needs account.

So i would need two extra cards, one each for the first and second account that go to the surviving account holder.

Can the account holders come from different countries, I assume they can, will ask when I go to Khon Kaen and see what official documents they need ?

Can one trust the banks to take action or will they delay as long as possible ?

[Speedo1968]

2 hours ago, couchpotato said:

Correct, the joint account holder can operate the account, but cannot close it.

Thanks for clarifying that.

[Grumpy one]

A friend died a couple of years ago, without a will.

Before his wife could get the money from his account she had to go to run around to the UK embassy and wait till it cleared by the local court.

In all it took her about 4 months

[Kerryd]

When my father died (in Thailand), he had a Will naming me as the beneficiary (as well as the Executor). 

After the mandatory 45 day waiting period had passed, I was able to go to court and have the Will probated. Took a couple weeks after that to get the official paperwork.

With that, I was able to go to the bank and close out dad's accounts. I think I had my passport with me for ID and a certified copy of his Death Certificate (and a copy of the court Probate order). 
That was all I needed. No birth certificates of any kind. No photocopies or special letters. I don't think I even had a copy of his Will with me (as the Court Probate Order showed me as the heir and Executor).
I think the bank photocopied my passport (like almost every place in the country does) as proof of who closed the accounts.

No hassles of any kind, even with closing his Fixed Term account (where he kept his "Extension" renewal money).

The other option of course is to just give someone access to your account (ATM card and PIN) and let them drain the account(s) until they are empty then throw the card(s) away and forget about the accounts (which would eventually go dormant and be closed automatically after a period of time once the balance hits zero).

[LukKrueng]

On 5/30/2020 at 5:27 PM, KhaoYai said:

Possibly a better option for you. I've never done it but my Kasikorn online banking lists 'International Transfers' (only during banking hours).

 

It may be possible for you to give your daughters the log in details for your online banking and instruct them how to make a foreign transfer. Your accounts could then be emptied without hassle.

 

Check with your bank about foreign transfers but obvioulsy don't tell them what you're thinking of. If it is possible to do this, it would probably be better to make several smaller transfers - emptying the account all in one go may trigger a fraud alert.

I never tried to complete the process of overseas transfers using the online system, but by what I saw you can just prepare the forms and then have to take it to the bank to actually complete the transfer. If that's the way it works it won't help the op. Another point is that as soon as the bank is notified the account owner is dead they have to freeze the accounts

[macahoom]

5 minutes ago, LukKrueng said:

I never tried to complete the process of overseas transfers using the online system, but by what I saw you can just prepare the forms and then have to take it to the bank to actually complete the transfer. If that's the way it works it won't help the op. Another point is that as soon as the bank is notified the account owner is dead they have to freeze the accounts

Who would notify the bank?

Edited May 31, 2020 by macahoom

[LukKrueng]

On 5/30/2020 at 3:11 PM, Speedo1968 said:

My questions are-

You already contacted the relevant bank and got their answers. Any answers given to you here won't be relevant anyway. 

As the bank's requirements are simpler than what you expected (ie no need for certified copies of anything, no need for birth certificates etc') - if you feel that when the time comes they'll demand much more than they told you, why not just go all the way and prepare for the worst just to be covered? 

[Trillian]

1 minute ago, macahoom said:

Who would notify the bank?

The Embassy would notify the Police who would notify Immigration, chances are the bank details are a matter of record.

[LukKrueng]

1 minute ago, macahoom said:

Who would notify the bank?

Didn't say any particular person will, but it is an option and as there are official ways to go about getting the money and closing the accounts, and seems the official way is not that difficult, why look for workarounds that might not work? 

[1FinickyOne]

19 hours ago, Speedo1968 said:

a joint account then only half of the monies can be withdrawn.

This doesn't make sense... half in one shot - 2 days can reduce to 25% and who does the calculating?

 

Do you have a reliable executor for your Will? Or a lawyer? - 

[murraynz]

On 5/30/2020 at 5:10 PM, bkk6060 said:

You have a Thai will?

 

Just my opinion, I think it is very irresponsible to make a family member come here from another country to recover death assets.  I know several here who have bank accounts and also own condos, with no will or plan to resolve the assets and distribute funds.  They actually believe their embassy will handle everything for them.

Naive and careless.

Most have no clue and in these cases, probably best to seek legal counsel.

That´s what I would recommend especially if you have what you believe are significant funds/assets based in a foreign country.

 

We are all going to die, so make the proper arrangements for it.

You will need to make a will.

As above,do it properly.

It doesnt cost huge money to make a will with a thai lawyer.

[Bender Rodriguez]

On 5/30/2020 at 5:51 PM, Delight said:

 If the surviving  relative removes monies from the bank account(via a ATM) from a now dead relative-then technically that is theft.

The use of  a  joint account eliminates this issue

funny, as upon death, the joint account normally is BLOCKED till taxes are paid, well, in 1st world countries

[lopburi3]

1 hour ago, Trillian said:

The Embassy would notify the Police who would notify Immigration, chances are the bank details are a matter of record.

Believe it is normally the police that officially notify the Embassy.

[Card]

On 5/30/2020 at 5:31 PM, Mulambana said:

Use two accounts. Give ATM card of one account where bulk of the money sits to your daughter in the UK with PIN. Transfer money from the bulk account to your expense account (another bank account) weekly. THis cn be automated. In case of somehting happens, your daughter has full access to the money from the bulk account and can draw it quickly in the UK. 

The problem.is that removing cash from a dead man's account may count as fraud.

[Surasak]

I have bank A/Cs in Thailand and UK. I have a WILL for UK family and a WILL for the Thai family, and never the twain shall meet.

Neither one know details of the other, and neither WILL makes mention of the the other.

The police are usually the first to be notified of your death, who then notify the embassy. The embassy notify the relevant authorities who then notify the next of kin. This can be done very quickly providing you have filled the name of the person you wish notified, in the back of your passport.