Leader of London BLM protests demands meeting with Johnson

FarangULong · June 22, 2020

3 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

This thread is about the UK as were the links I posted regarding the extent of inequality and discrimination based upon ethnicity.

Which is just as much of a lie, as the stuff the BLM USA "mother chapter" is spouting. There are racial employment quotas in the UK for companies of a certain size onwards (ie the company's branch I worked in/for, if we had ONE MORE full time employee, it would have to have been either an Asian - most likely Pakistani or Indian, for the USAians here, not Korean etc. type of Asian - or a Black guy, regardless of their qualifications over any potential White British/White European applicants like me).

When I was there (mid 00s) ie the London Met hired exclusively females (incl. Whites), and almost exclusively non-White males (no matter how well they did during the selection tests). Lyrics of children chants were changed (ie "bah bah black sheep" became "bah bah green sheep") as to not "offend", and other such <deleted>, ridiculous at best, discriminating against Whites (especially White males) at worst.

Police officers had to fill out a little slip of paper (I got a couple myself) if they stopped & searched you. I personally knew some "lady" (English woman), who had 4 mixed children by 4 different "men", the eldest of which in prison, the 2nd oldest had been to a youth prison, and she was COLLECTING her 2nd oldest's stop&search, just so she could complain against officers (KNOWING him and his "buddies" were hanging out by the shops, harassing and sometimes even assaulting people, that he was dealing coke boshed with paracetamol etc.) and even try to sue for "racists harassing her angel".

Just before I left the country, there were a couple of infamous "racist" attacks in Crawley (Bewbush), where some Gambian men were insulted (go back to Gambia, <deleted> off etc.) and then assaulted by the shops, and then a Gambian man was beat down outside his council house, in full view of his young children by the same group, again yelling "<deleted> off back to gambia". It was all over the regional (if not national) news, and was blamed on "racist White scum".

Yet the truth is, the ring leaders were all mixed race + one Moroccan guy, namely the prev. mentioned 2nd oldest, his friends (who sometimes criticized &ridiculed him for having a "White man mentality", when he had some rare moments of clarity and decided he wanted to go to college after all), and his best friend (the Moroccan kid), along with some of the local White chavs, were the real perpetrators. Of course no mention of any of that, in the media.

The backstory to this was, that his mother (again, who I knew personally, and I've been to her house etc. as my then gf was her boss and for some reason befriended her, and I can still name some names of those involved, if that might somehow help confirm all of this; the incident shouldn't be hard to find in media archives, I will do a search later) had been dating&hiding an illegal Gambian in her home, who - as it turned out - had cheated on her and then disappeared practically over night....

But hey, let's blame it on Whitey instead.

Anyway, that's merely anecdotal, and I realize that. Well, except for the fact that there ARE affirmative action-esque quotas in the UK.

However, to claim that there is an actual problem with systemic racism/discrimination in the UK, is extremely laughable. It can/will cost you your job, and potentially ruin your career (but only if you're White), cops lost their jobs over the whole "stop&search" thing, and as a result knife crime, etc. went up.

And let's not pretend that Blacks and mixed race in the UK aren't disproportionately often involved in crime either.

I STILL remember that the London Met had the stats up back then, that over 25% of the violent crimes in London were committed by young Black men. They had to be taken down shortly after, as there was a media <deleted> storm and protests/outrage (by people like you, I'd imagine), about how "racist" these stats were, and how these stats were "inciting racial hatred". And again, this was in the mid 2000s. Surely, it can't be that hard to look up the current stats for the UK, unless they've banned doing crime statistics by racial break downs, as that would be "racist".... So I will look into it.

But please, can you give me anything concrete, on how exactly Blacks (or other minorities) are being harassed, oppressed or whatever in the UK? Like "travellers" for example, when they "camp" on somebody's property, and by the time the courts FINALLY allow the police to remove them, they've already gone and destroyed the place? Can you give me ANYTHING, other than BLM links?

Bluespunk · June 22, 2020

7 minutes ago, FarangULong said:

Which is just as much of a lie, as the stuff the BLM USA "mother chapter" is spouting. There are racial employment quotas in the UK for companies of a certain size onwards (ie the company's branch I worked in/for, if we had ONE MORE full time employee, it would have to have been either an Asian - most likely Pakistani or Indian, for the USAians here, not Korean etc. type of Asian - or a Black guy, regardless of their qualifications over any potential White British/White European applicants like me).

When I was there (mid 00s) ie the London Met hired exclusively females (incl. Whites), and almost exclusively non-White males (no matter how well they did during the selection tests). Lyrics of children chants were changed (ie "bah bah black sheep" became "bah bah green sheep") as to not "offend", and other such <deleted>, ridiculous at best, discriminating against Whites (especially White males) at worst.

Police officers had to fill out a little slip of paper (I got a couple myself) if they stopped & searched you. I personally knew some "lady" (English woman), who had 4 mixed children by 4 different "men", the eldest of which in prison, the 2nd oldest had been to a youth prison, and she was COLLECTING her 2nd oldest's stop&search, just so she could complain against officers (KNOWING him and his "buddies" were hanging out by the shops, harassing and sometimes even assaulting people, that he was dealing coke boshed with paracetamol etc.) and even try to sue for "racists harassing her angel".

Just before I left the country, there were a couple of infamous "racist" attacks in Crawley (Bewbush), where some Gambian men were insulted (go back to Gambia, <deleted> off etc.) and then assaulted by the shops, and then a Gambian man was beat down outside his council house, in full view of his young children by the same group, again yelling "<deleted> off back to gambia". It was all over the regional (if not national) news, and was blamed on "racist White scum".

Yet the truth is, the ring leaders were all mixed race + one Moroccan guy, namely the prev. mentioned 2nd oldest, his friends (who sometimes criticized &ridiculed him for having a "White man mentality", when he had some rare moments of clarity and decided he wanted to go to college after all), and his best friend (the Moroccan kid), along with some of the local White chavs, were the real perpetrators. Of course no mention of any of that, in the media.

The backstory to this was, that his mother (again, who I knew personally, and I've been to her house etc. as my then gf was her boss and for some reason befriended her, and I can still name some names of those involved, if that might somehow help confirm all of this; the incident shouldn't be hard to find in media archives, I will do a search later) had been dating&hiding an illegal Gambian in her home, who - as it turned out - had cheated on her and then disappeared practically over night....

But hey, let's blame it on Whitey instead.

Anyway, that's merely anecdotal, and I realize that. Well, except for the fact that there ARE affirmative action-esque quotas in the UK.

However, to claim that there is an actual problem with systemic racism/discrimination in the UK, is extremely laughable. It can/will cost you your job, and potentially ruin your career (but only if you're White), cops lost their jobs over the whole "stop&search" thing, and as a result knife crime, etc. went up.

And let's not pretend that Blacks and mixed race in the UK aren't disproportionately often involved in crime either.

I STILL remember that the London Met had the stats up back then, that over 25% of the violent crimes in London were committed by young Black men. They had to be taken down shortly after, as there was a media <deleted> storm and protests/outrage (by people like you, I'd imagine), about how "racist" these stats were, and how these stats were "inciting racial hatred". And again, this was in the mid 2000s. Surely, it can't be that hard to look up the current stats for the UK, unless they've banned doing crime statistics by racial break downs, as that would be "racist".... So I will look into it.

But please, can you give me anything concrete, on how exactly Blacks (or other minorities) are being harassed, oppressed or whatever in the UK? Like "travellers" for example, when they "camp" on somebody's property, and by the time the courts FINALLY allow the police to remove them, they've already gone and destroyed the place? Can you give me ANYTHING, other than BLM links?

All you say above what you say happened...links please.

By the way, have you read the links I sent to transam. They support what BLM is protesting on.

Here's one of them for you as actually reading through a thread is so exhausting

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/dec/02/revealed-the-stark-evidence-of-everyday-racial-bias-in-britain

And another

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/racism-uk-inequality-black-lives-matter-wealth-economic-health-a9567461.html

Oh why not, here's another

https://www.ft.com/content/cbe7cb47-6789-4590-9271-9a113bfd54a4

Edited June 22, 2020 by Bluespunk

FarangULong · June 22, 2020

2 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

As I've said several times now, your links just show data. They do not show cause. You assume the cause is racial inequality. That's your opinion. But please don't dress is up as fact.

Most of it is based on assumption, and sometimes outright <deleted>. Ie excusing the crimes, by blaming it on poverty (and of course "lack of opportunity, due to racism").

Yet there are way more Whites on welfare and/or near/below the poverty line, than Blacks, but you don't see them committing so many homicides, robberies, violent home invasions, etc.

Culture, upbringing, etc. is almost always (though not exclusively, of course ie poverty CAN play into it, but is hardly a valid excuse) the root cause. And that has nothing to do with racism. The problem is, that if you point out flaws in the culture etc. of certain ethnic/racial/cultural/religious groups (especially non White), it automatically equates to "racism" in the minds of the ignorant of & abusers within said group, as well as their White enablers.

BLM, & violent riots/lootings associated with it, would NOT be possible, if it were not for the "Gutmenschen" enablers like certain posters here, enablers/liars/propagandists within the media, and politicians of ie the Democratic Party, who NEED victims and victimhood, in order to garner votes, in exchange for short term "help" (free stuff and/or meaningless gestures) policies.

FarangULong · June 22, 2020

1 hour ago, Bluespunk said:

All you say above what you say happened...links please.

By the way, have you read the links I sent to transam. They support what BLM is protesting on.

Here's one of them for you as actually reading through a thread is so exhausting

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/dec/02/revealed-the-stark-evidence-of-everyday-racial-bias-in-britain

And another

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/racism-uk-inequality-black-lives-matter-wealth-economic-health-a9567461.html

Oh why not, here's another

https://www.ft.com/content/cbe7cb47-6789-4590-9271-9a113bfd54a4

The Guardian is a leftist-populist rag. So I won't even dignify that with a response. It is the leftist equivalent of the Daily Mail, albeit more "high brow"/pseudo intellectual, for the tweed wearing etc. crowd...

I will, however, respond to the independent article.

"Stop-and-search rates between 2018 and 2019 show that black people are now nearly 10-times more likely to be stopped and searched by police than white people. This has contributed to far higher arrest rates for black people than for white people."

Oh ok, somehow it is the fault of stop and search, that stuff is found on these guys, and they are therefore arrested. How racist. The article DOES NOT go into details, about WHY the majority of these people were searched. I do not know how stop&search works today, but when I was in Britain you got a copy of that little paper I mentioned earlier (the write through thingy, I don't know the English term), and the officer had to write his reasons for stopping&searching you on there.

Officers usually do not randomly search people. They will search you, however, when they see you do something suspicious (or see you commit an actual crime), if you match the description of a suspect and on top of that act a certain way, once approached, etc. I was stopped and searched multiple times. Maybe, just maybe, it had something to do with the fact that back then I used to dress a certain way, and "act" a certain way.

I also see in these stats, that "White other" was searched far more often than "White British". Oh noes, ze English are racist against non British. Or maybe, just maybe, it has something to do with the fact that a lot of the thieving, burglary, ATM card copying etc. is done by certain people under certain passports (but often they're not that even that actual ethnicity, just the nationality, though not always)....

None of these statistics by themselves prove anything.

This is exactly what I am talking about, when I keep saying (in multiple threads) that the media is no longer doing hteir job (report the facts, ALL the facts, and leave it UP TO THE READER/VIEWER to form their OWN opinion, based on the facts/complete picture). What they're doing now (and BOTH sides are guilty of that), is present PART of the facts, so long as they suit the narrative that is slammed into the article/segment. This used to be called "opinion piece", and was labelled as such. Still is, on occasion, but most articles/TV segments/talking heads etc. today are nothing more bad a mixture of opinion pieces, narrative pushing, and outright propaganda.

As for the articles about the Gambian thing (this is the first time I saw with my very own eyes, how the media lies.. I was getting wary beforehand, but that took the cake, and caused me to start looking into things for myself), I am still looking. I will post it/them, once I find it/them. I have other things to do as well though.

As for racial employment quotas in the UK, you must be joking, right? Are you trying to tell me, that you're not familiar with the "equality act" of 2010, as well as the "equality act" of 2006 preceeding it? And all the other "equality stuff" before THAT?

Or about Police forces (the London Met especially, in order to create a more "diverse" force, no matter who is better qualified) discriminating against White males? Here, just one of many examples (even the British Broadcasting Communists seem to agree there): http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-47335859

Bluespunk · June 22, 2020

24 minutes ago, FarangULong said:

The Guardian is a leftist-populist rag. So I won't even dignify that with a response. It is the leftist equivalent of the Daily Mail, albeit more "high brow"/pseudo intellectual, for the tweed wearing etc. crowd...

I will, however, respond to the independent article.

"Stop-and-search rates between 2018 and 2019 show that black people are now nearly 10-times more likely to be stopped and searched by police than white people. This has contributed to far higher arrest rates for black people than for white people."

Oh ok, somehow it is the fault of stop and search, that stuff is found on these guys, and they are therefore arrested. How racist. The article DOES NOT go into details, about WHY the majority of these people were searched. I do not know how stop&search works today, but when I was in Britain you got a copy of that little paper I mentioned earlier (the write through thingy, I don't know the English term), and the officer had to write his reasons for stopping&searching you on there.

Officers usually do not randomly search people. They will search you, however, when they see you do something suspicious (or see you commit an actual crime), if you match the description of a suspect and on top of that act a certain way, once approached, etc. I was stopped and searched multiple times. Maybe, just maybe, it had something to do with the fact that back then I used to dress a certain way, and "act" a certain way.

I also see in these stats, that "White other" was searched far more often than "White British". Oh noes, ze English are racist against non British. Or maybe, just maybe, it has something to do with the fact that a lot of the thieving, burglary, ATM card copying etc. is done by certain people under certain passports (but often they're not that even that actual ethnicity, just the nationality, though not always)....

None of these statistics by themselves prove anything.

This is exactly what I am talking about, when I keep saying (in multiple threads) that the media is no longer doing hteir job (report the facts, ALL the facts, and leave it UP TO THE READER/VIEWER to form their OWN opinion, based on the facts/complete picture). What they're doing now (and BOTH sides are guilty of that), is present PART of the facts, so long as they suit the narrative that is slammed into the article/segment. This used to be called "opinion piece", and was labelled as such. Still is, on occasion, but most articles/TV segments/talking heads etc. today are nothing more bad a mixture of opinion pieces, narrative pushing, and outright propaganda.

As for the articles about the Gambian thing (this is the first time I saw with my very own eyes, how the media lies.. I was getting wary beforehand, but that took the cake, and caused me to start looking into things for myself), I am still looking. I will post it/them, once I find it/them. I have other things to do as well though.

As for racial employment quotas in the UK, you must be joking, right? Are you trying to tell me, that you're not familiar with the "equality act" of 2010, as well as the "equality act" of 2006 preceeding it? And all the other "equality stuff" before THAT?

Or about Police forces (the London Met especially, in order to create a more "diverse" force, no matter who is better qualified) discriminating against White males? Here, just one of many examples (even the British Broadcasting Communists seem to agree there): http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-47335859

All I can tell you is I’ve backed up my view and you can dislike it all you wish.

Now links to your earlier claims please.

OZinPattaya · June 22, 2020

How about you Brits that said f-all when Yankee statues were being defaced, let alone neighborhoods being burned down, and are now outraged that your own beloved icons are at peril. Quite frankly, I don't have an ounce of sympathy for your fallen heroes. I'm glad that the turmoil in America has come to your British doorstep.

On 6/21/2020 at 1:50 AM, Bluespunk said:

Oh dear, citizens exercising their democratic right to protest and requesting a conversation with the pm are now terrorists.

How much further to the right can the right swing?

On 6/21/2020 at 1:12 AM, lupin said:

Total number of "people of color" killed by police in the UK for all of 2019 = 1 ... and that was the London bridge terrorist. BLM has zero place in the UK

Edited June 22, 2020 by OZinPattaya

lupin · June 22, 2020

1 hour ago, OZinPattaya said:

How about you Brits that said f-all when Yankee statues were being defaced, let alone neighborhoods being burned down, and are now outraged that your own beloved icons are at peril. Quite frankly, I don't have an ounce of sympathy for your fallen heroes. I'm glad that the turmoil in America has come to your British doorstep.

I'm not a Brit or a Yank and wasn't aware it was a prerequisite for posting

OZinPattaya · June 22, 2020

Just now, lupin said:

I'm not a Brit or a Yank and wasn't aware it was a prerequisite for posting

Never said it was a prerequisite for anything. If you're gonna post make it mean something.

torturedsole · June 22, 2020

Breaking: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8448635/Burnley-FC-apologise-White-Lives-Matter-banner-flown-match-against-Manchester-City.html

I shouldn't laugh. ????

OZinPattaya · June 22, 2020

3 minutes ago, torturedsole said:

Breaking: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8448635/Burnley-FC-apologise-White-Lives-Matter-banner-flown-match-against-Manchester-City.html

I shouldn't laugh. ????

Say something, make an argument. Posting a link is not an argument.

torturedsole · June 22, 2020

1 minute ago, OZinPattaya said:

Say something, make an argument. Posting a link is not an argument.

What argument? It's a link, LOL. Very funny, though.

twocatsmac · June 22, 2020

8 minutes ago, torturedsole said:

What argument? It's a link, LOL. Very funny, though.

Beyond me how the words “white lives matter” can be deemed offensive.

Anti-white racism?

Bluespunk · June 23, 2020

6 hours ago, OZinPattaya said:

How about you Brits that said f-all when Yankee statues were being defaced, let alone neighborhoods being burned down, and are now outraged that your own beloved icons are at peril. Quite frankly, I don't have an ounce of sympathy for your fallen heroes. I'm glad that the turmoil in America has come to your British doorstep.

I’m not outraged.

Take them all down.

BobBKK · June 23, 2020

Tell this scum to go procreate

Edited June 23, 2020 by BobBKK

NanLaew · June 23, 2020

19 hours ago, watso63 said:

Tell them where to go Boris and if any statue should be removed then let it be the Karl Marx abomination!

In the future, we'll be talking about Boris 'no statues' Johnson, the failed former PM of the UK.

evadgib · June 23, 2020

On 6/21/2020 at 11:50 AM, evadgib said:

How about repairing and replacing Coulson's statue & getting Soros to foot the bill again first?

Update: Sky report that plod has published photos of 15 of the 18 statue lynchers they intend to prosecute over this affair. If a bloke can get 14 days for p1ssing on a memorial...

FarangULong · June 23, 2020

12 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

All I can tell you is I’ve backed up my view and you can dislike it all you wish.

Now links to your earlier claims please.

You haven't backed up anything. All you did, was give a link to stop & search and arrest quotas associated with it (and a guardian article, which I will not read, as it's too early in the morning for me to get upset already). As I already said, the article does NOT explain why they were searched. People aren't searched for no reason, or merely "he looked suspicious" (that kind of stuff will get a Police officer branded "racist", if the "suspicious looking" person is black or otherwise a minority).

Again, it's merely telling half the story, as per usual. It doesn't prove anything, other than that more Blacks were arrested, and Blacks were more often searched. That does not automatically mean racism or discrimination.

Blacks in the UK are 2-3%, or thereabouts, yes? And about 10% in London, yes? So how come then, that JUST LIKE IN THE US, they also commit 25% of hte violent crimes (at least in places like London)? Considering that, they do it even MORE disproportionally than in the US, as 2% is NOT half of 13%, yet 25% is half of 50%... It's sad, that I even have to point all these simple things out to you. You see what you want to see. It's called "confirmation bias". We all have it, to some degree. Though it is glaringly obvious, that some suffer more, than others...

Edit: I actually looked it up... in London alone, they commit more than 50% of the gun crimes, almost half the knife crime (yet aren't half the population + mixed race are counting seperately), over 30% of sex crimes, more than half the robberies/muggings etc. I'm still looking for the UK total stats, but no worries, I'll find them (just like I'll eventually find the articles about the "white racists harassing the Africans in Crawley", even if it takes me calling up media archives).

Here's the stats for London: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/7856787/Violent-inner-city-crime-the-figures-and-a-question-of-race.html

Sad, that the media that's actually concerned with real issues (rather than make believe ones, so Labour can garner some votes), has to obtain these stats via Freedom of Information Act... they used to be freely available on the London Met website. But people whined about them, "mimimimi facts and statistics incite racial hatred, they're wayciss (racist) mimimimi", so it was all taken down... Any chance you were one of the outraged & "concerned" citizens, back then? (2006ish, this happened, if I remember correctly)

Edited June 23, 2020 by FarangULong
spelling/add on/source

Bluespunk · June 23, 2020

1 minute ago, FarangULong said:

You haven't backed up anything. All you did, was give a link to stop & search and arrest quotas associated with it. As I already said, the article does NOT explain why they were searched. People aren't searched for no reason, or merely "he looked suspicious" (that kind of stuff will get a Police officer branded "racist", if the "suspicious looking" person is black or otherwise a minority).

Again, it's merely telling half the story, as per usual. It doesn't prove anything, other than that more Blacks were arrested, and Blacks were more often searched. That does not automatically mean racism or discrimination.

Blacks in the UK are 2-3%, or thereabouts, yes? And about 10% in London, yes? So how come then, that JUST LIKE IN THE US, they also commit 25% of hte violent crimes (at least in places like London)? Considering that, they do it even MORE disproportionally than in the US, as 2% is NOT half of 13%, yet 25% is half of 50%... It's sad, that I even have to point all these simple things out to you. You see what you want to see. It's called "confirmation bias". We all have it, to some degree. Though it is glaringly obvious, that some suffer more, than others...

Edit: I actually looked it up... in London alone, they commit more than 50% of the gun crimes, almost half the knife crime (yet aren't half the population + mixed race are counting seperately), over 30% of sex crimes, more than half the robberies/muggings etc. I'm still looking for the UK total stats, but no worries, I'll find them (just like I'll eventually find the articles about the "white racists harassing the Africans in Crawley", even if it takes me calling up media archives).

Here's the stats for London: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/7856787/Violent-inner-city-crime-the-figures-and-a-question-of-race.html

Sad, that the media that's actually concerned with real issues (rather than make believe ones, so Labour can garner some votes), has to obtain these stats via Freedom of Information Act... they used to be freely available on the London Met website. But people whined about them, "mimimimi facts and statistics incite racial hatred, they're wayciss (racist) mimimimi", so it was all taken down... Any chance you were one of the outraged & "concerned" citizens, back then? (2006ish, this happened, if I remember correctly)

Back up your earlier claims. Until then I am not going to respond to anything else you post.

FarangULong · June 23, 2020

1 minute ago, Bluespunk said:

Back up your earlier claims. Until then I am not going to respond to anything else you post.

I already back them up partially (ie the claim that Police recruiting policies discriminate against White men & that there are quotas for minorities by telling you what the respective laws are called). It's not my fault, that your reading comprehension starts failing 3 sentences into a block of text, or that perhaps your brain shuts down, as it isn't reading what it wants to read.

I will back the rest up later. And just now, I backed up another thing, namely that it's basically the same issues as in the US, as in Blacks committing disproportionate amounts of crime (esp. violent and deadly crimes) compared to the rest of the population, and thus they also have more police interactions (albeit more weak sauced policing&follow up justice).

FarangULong · June 23, 2020

What's really "sad" (apart from you tagging almost every single one of my post in this thread with your emojis, due to a lack of actual arguments), is your inability to argue the various points one by one.

Instead, you pick out the ones, where I haven't yet posted a source (again: I posted a source - BBC lol, makes it all the "better"/funnier - for an example of Police recruiting discrimination & I pointed out the "Equality Acts" of 2006 & 2010 and their predecessors, regarding the quotas; this should be common knowledge, and I even assume you DO know), and say "I won't respond until you prove/provid a source for EVERYTHING". Basically attacking the way I argue, rather than the individual arguments (which are all seperate issues, but have common/converging points, namely that the only "priviledge" that exists in Western society, is NOT White priviledge, but BLACK [and other minorities, to some degree] priviledge). This is called a "strawman" argument, and is often typical for your side of the political spectrum. It's also a cowardly cop out. And before you say I'm doing the same: Yes, and no. Before I did point it out, I also posted a source or two (or maybe a few more ???? ), that gave a more complete picture to the ones you posted (ie about stop and search, about why Blacks are killed at the rates they are by police, etc.). So it's not the same.

THAT is sad. I have no problem admitting it, when I cannot prove something. Just because it takes me a some time to find certain sources (google makes it harder and harder, on certain topics, by the way they rank search results), doesn't mean they don't exist. Ie I freely admitted being unable to prove something, and that it was merely personal suspicion, in the "foreign groups allowed into Thailand" thread, regarding the Sino-Thai government relationship.

There is nothing wrong that. There is something wrong however, if someone is continually shown that they're wrong and/or that they base their believes and opinions on only part of the truth, as well as only accepting information, arguments and source material, which confirm what someone already believes/think they "know". THAT is confirmation bias, and it's also sad.

And please, for the love of God... when you post links, at least write a one sentence or whatever text, that sums up what the link is about, not just "here#s one, there's another". I'm not clicking all those links and reading them, especially when the title/url says "guardian". The latter (guardian stuff) is also bias & faulty "debate" technique on my part, and I acknowledge that. But that was an exception, on my behalf, not the general rule of how I debate. With you it seems to be a pattern. Just some food for thought.

EDIT: I just went back, and did more reading on the Equality Acts. I made a mistake. There aren't any employment quotas. I made a mistake, and in that case you were right, and I was wrong. And in this case, I am glad I was wrong, as quotas of that sort are nothing but discrimination anyway. There are, however, unofficial quotas with government-esque hiring, such as Police recruiting.

Edited June 23, 2020 by FarangULong
ooops.....

Rimmer · June 23, 2020

Troll and off topic posts also replies have been removed.

FarangULong · June 23, 2020

10 hours ago, OZinPattaya said:

How about you Brits that said f-all when Yankee statues were being defaced, let alone neighborhoods being burned down, and are now outraged that your own beloved icons are at peril. Quite frankly, I don't have an ounce of sympathy for your fallen heroes. I'm glad that the turmoil in America has come to your British doorstep.

It's part of the problem Many people do not agree with all these agendas being pushed, that there's systemic racism, etc. But they're silent. They keep their heads down. They're STILL afraid of being called "racist" (to me, personally, the word has lost almost all meaning), etc.

But imo that makes them guilty all the same. People usually don't speak up, until it personally affects them in some way, shape or form... By then it's usually too late. Not always, but often enough...

FarangULong · June 23, 2020

Here's another one of your "racial injustices in the UK" debunked:

Racial Inequality: Why it’s time to tackle the ethnicity pay gap

https://www.legal500.com/law-journals/2017/12/01/employment-law-journal/racial-inequality-why-its-time-to-tackle-the-ethnicity-pay-gap/

^^ narrative as per BLM, Media, certain people (incl. some on this forum), "supported" by data (but only part of the data).

The WHOLE data, which shows the complete picture:

https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/earningsandworkinghours/articles/ethnicitypaygapsingreatbritain/2018

Quote: "[...] The ethnicity pay gap between White British employees and most other ethnic groups narrows once other characteristics such as education and occupation are taken into account [...]"

Basically, the same story as the "gender pay gap". They (media, feminists, etc.) show only the raw data, which only tells you who/which ethnic/gender (etc.) group makes how much. Instead of showing the OTHER (yet very RELEVANT data) though, which explains WHY there are "gaps", they simply "explain" it with "racism", "sexism", "White patriarchy", etc.

It is beyond me, how people keep falling for the same thing, and simply accept such "explanations" as the literal truth.

I know, that I will most likely not change your mind. I do hope though, that at least this will make you reconsider/rethink some of your positions. It's not easy, to accept that not everything is black&white (figuratively speaking, before this becomes another "race" issue ???? ), and that things one has considered to be 100% true etc. aren't always as they seem. I've had to readjust my own views several times, and I'm still learning on the daily basis. As you've just seen, I was firmly convinced that there affirmative action-esque quotas in the UK, and I was wrong. I couldn't believe it, and kept searching and searching and searching, in order to try and find ANYTHING to reaffirm that belief. It happens. Best one can do, is try and learn from such mistakes, by double checking etc. I realize this might sound patronizing etc., but I am actually trying to help you.

Imo the West is standing at a crossroads, with some of the likely paths about to be taken ending in authoritarianism, and every voice is going to matter. Which is why it is so important (again, in my opinion), that people stop believing stuff, just because articles, TV, etc. says it is true. It's getting easier (but in some aspects harder, also) to do research. And while I do get, that people have other things to worry about in life, than double checking everything the media says & worrying about stuff like this here, it IS important for the future of our countries, for the future of our children/grand children, etc.

People should at the very least make the effort, to do BASIC research/fact checking and trying to look at arguments from all sides, BEFORE deciding their stance. As well as making the effort, to COMBAT such obvious attempts at causing divides, curbing speech, etc.

Bluespunk · June 23, 2020

If you are addressing me I have already made clear what I’d like to see before discussing anything else. You made some claims that you have yet to substantiate.

https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discover/news/extent-of-uks-race-inequality/

Edited June 23, 2020 by Bluespunk

Jai Dee · June 23, 2020

A baiting troll post has been removed.

superal · June 24, 2020

On 6/21/2020 at 2:22 PM, transam said:

If BJ does, I bet he hides his tele.....????

I expect near every single job, or position has been occupied by a non-white in the UK at sometime or another, had music at No.1 in the charts because all UK colours liked it.

Non-white folk are still clambering to enter the UK, and this lot think they are being mistreated...... ????

Just keep them at bay, and deal with the naughty ones.............????

So true and factual .

Racial disharmony can be caused by non indigenous UK residents having no intentions of leading their lives or even attempting to adapt to the British way of living . The UK government does not help when giving generous social security benefits to people of colour and yet is frugal to its own indigenous pensioners .

The destruction of statues and monuments of our heritage by the BLM gangs was terrible to watch and why the police did not intervene is beyond me . Only a few days ago the police were warning people to move on because they were not social distancing but did nothing to stop the damage caused by these masses of arsonists and looters . UK government are too scared and weak to take the steps that the majority of the UK public want . The face of the UK has changed over the last 40 years to the point where now it is not the country that I would live in if I was a young person .

Smigel · June 24, 2020

41 minutes ago, superal said:

So true and factual .

Racial disharmony can be caused by non indigenous UK residents having no intentions of leading their lives or even attempting to adapt to the British way of living . The UK government does not help when giving generous social security benefits to people of colour and yet is frugal to its own indigenous pensioners .

The destruction of statues and monuments of our heritage by the BLM gangs was terrible to watch and why the police did not intervene is beyond me . Only a few days ago the police were warning people to move on because they were not social distancing but did nothing to stop the damage caused by these masses of arsonists and looters . UK government are too scared and weak to take the steps that the majority of the UK public want . The face of the UK has changed over the last 40 years to the point where now it is not the country that I would live in if I was a young person .

The UK police farce did not intervene because they have been utterly politicised. Chock full of common purpose graduates, and promotion of identity politics candidates ( as are all the public sector). With the fake "conservative" bozo in charge of probably the weakest, most inept government in memory. Which is quite a statement when one considers the last incumbent.

It surely can't be long now,until the whole country descends Into a full on socialist state.

FarangULong · June 24, 2020

On 6/23/2020 at 9:52 AM, Bluespunk said:

If you are addressing me I have already made clear what I’d like to see before discussing anything else. You made some claims that you have yet to substantiate.

https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discover/news/extent-of-uks-race-inequality/

Thank you for proving my point @ inability to argue points on an individual basis, as well as your inability to summarize random links, you post.

I'll do it for you:

Ethnic inequalities in health outcomes, experiences of health care and employment in the NHS are substantial and have not changed over time.
• Disparities in educational outcomes show persistent disadvantage for Black Caribbean, Pakistani and Gypsy and Irish traveller groups, including significantly higher levels of permanent exclusion for Black and Gypsy and Irish traveller groups.
• Ethnic minority groups are disproportionately represented in the youth criminal justice system and in prison. Stop and search powers continue to be used disproportionately against ethnic minority groups – with black groups facing the highest rates.
• There is a sustained ethnic penalty in earnings suffered by Bangladeshi, Black and Pakistani groups. Discrimination in the paid labour market has, in part, led to high rates of self-employment for ethnic minority people.
• Recent immigration policies, including the ‘hostile’ or ‘compliant’ environment, have produced acts of discrimination and racism against ethnic minority groups as well as the injustices highlighted by the ‘Windrush scandal’.

And once again, I will point out that all of that is just raw data, and it doesn't even say how the data was compiled. "Study" is a very stretch-able term. It can mean they survey'd (as in asking people), it can mean that ie they actually went and looked through x amounts of patient files, and with the help of doctors and other experts on healthcare, and then determined that in y cases of these x amounts, somehow Blacks and other minorities got "worse" healthcare. Somehow I doubt it's the latter.

They just put numbers there, and then say "it's because of racism". That is not proof of anything. Same <deleted> as "numbers of Blacks being killed = disproportionate = racism", as "ethnicity pay gap = racism"/"gender pay gap = sexism & patriarchy".

Why is the fault of schools, teachers, etc when Blacks, "travellers", etc. fail classes disproportionally? Why is the blame always sought with others, instead of within their own culture? Why is it, that when kids (regardless of colours) come from stable homes, and are taught VALUES at home, etc. that they do better in school, higher education and finally in life?

Why is it racist, when White people say "my life is <deleted> because of Jews/Blacks/whatever", but it's not racist when people say "Blacks/'travellers'/etc. are doing bad at school, whatever because of White racism"? I whole heartedly agree that the first one IS racism, and an over simplification of (to some degree) complicated issues, but SO IS THE LATTER.

Edited June 24, 2020 by FarangULong
123

Bluespunk · June 24, 2020

4 minutes ago, FarangULong said:

Thank you for proving my point @ inability to argue points on an individual basis, as well as your inability to summarize random links, you post.

I'll do it for you:

Ethnic inequalities in health outcomes, experiences of health care and employment in the NHS are substantial and have not changed over time.
• Disparities in educational outcomes show persistent disadvantage for Black Caribbean, Pakistani and Gypsy and Irish traveller groups, including significantly higher levels of permanent exclusion for Black and Gypsy and Irish traveller groups.
• Ethnic minority groups are disproportionately represented in the youth criminal justice system and in prison. Stop and search powers continue to be used disproportionately against ethnic minority groups – with black groups facing the highest rates.
• There is a sustained ethnic penalty in earnings suffered by Bangladeshi, Black and Pakistani groups. Discrimination in the paid labour market has, in part, led to high rates of self-employment for ethnic minority people.
• Recent immigration policies, including the ‘hostile’ or ‘compliant’ environment, have produced acts of discrimination and racism against ethnic minority groups as well as the injustices highlighted by the ‘Windrush scandal’.

And once again, I will point out that all of that is just raw data, and it doesn't even say how the data was compiled. "Study" is a very stretch-able term. It can mean they survey'd (as in asking people), it can mean that ie they actually went and looked through x amounts of patient files, and with the help of doctors and other experts on healthcare, and then determined that in y cases of these x amounts, somehow Blacks and other minorities got "worse" healthcare. Somehow I doubt it's the latter.

They just put numbers there, and then say "it's because of racism". That is not proof of anything. Same <deleted> as "numbers of Blacks being killed = disproportionate = racism", as "ethnicity pay gap = racism"/"gender pay gap = sexism & patriarchy".

Why is the fault of schools, teachers, etc when Blacks, "travellers", etc. fail classes disproportionally? Why is the blame always sought with others, instead of within their own culture? Why is it, that when kids (regardless of colours) come from stable homes, and are taught VALUES at home, etc. that they do better in school, higher education and finally in life?

Why is it racist, when White people say "my life is <deleted> because of Jews/Blacks/whatever", but it's not racist when people say "Blacks/'travellers'/etc. are doing bad at school, whatever because of White racism"? I whole heartedly agree that the first one IS racism, and an over simplification of (to some degree) complicated issues, but SO IS THE LATTER.

Scanned for links to original claims about racist incidents and cannot see. Not reading anything you write until you back up your claims.

Orton Rd · June 24, 2020

10 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

Scanned for links to original claims about racist incidents and cannot see. Not reading anything you write until you back up your claims.

Of course you will, and then come back with quotes form the marxist Gaurdian to 'prove your point' ????

Edited June 24, 2020 by Orton Rd

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