Britain nears abandoning Brexit trade deal hope - The Telegraph

[CorpusChristie]

8 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

 

.

They might not be coming from the EU any more but they will be coming from somewhere.

Trade deal with India? Brace yourselves.

 

Could you elaborate on that ?

Is it a fact ?

Does a trade deal with India include allowing Indian workers to work in the UK ?

Is that fact ?

Is it being discussed between India and the UK or

Did you just make that up to try to get some Brexiteers to regret their choice ?

[Rookiescot]

9 hours ago, CorpusChristie said:

As the UK is no longer a member of the EU , Europeans workers no longer have the right to go and live and work in the UK .

  That is a done deal .

"Coporate UK" will now have to find another source of worker , all those unemployed Brits will need to be trained up to be able to fill those vacancies .

  Why do you think we all voted for Brexit ?  

Yes freedom of movement has ended. But migrant workers will still be coming here to work. They will just have to apply for a visa first.

Do you think for one second unemployed Brits are going to go pick fruit and veg? The hourly rate is so bad its not worth it. So we either hugely increase the wages (unlikely), force people to take the jobs (possible but pointless, they will turn up but not work) or we carry on letting eastern europeans do it.

Which do suspect will happen?

If you voted for Brexit based on the assumption migrant workers would disappear then you have been duped.

[transam]

8 hours ago, Phulublub said:

So a very expensive mistake?  A bit like Brexit then.

 

PH

Seeing the writing on the wall and doing something about it is commendable, at least the French tried.

It is a bit like Brexit, seeing the writing on the wall and doing something about it.

YOU have no idea if Brexit will be a financial disaster, so I would suggest you stop reading lefty rag tripe and put your tool back in the cupboard.....???? 

 

 

 

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, CorpusChristie said:

Could you elaborate on that ?

Is it a fact ?

Does a trade deal with India include allowing Indian workers to work in the UK ?

Is that fact ?

Is it being discussed between India and the UK or

Did you just make that up to try to get some Brexiteers to regret their choice ?

https://www.ft.com/content/56074dda-95bd-11e9-8cfb-30c211dcd229

 

India’s government has made it clear that it will be in no rush to reach a trade deal with the UK without significant concessions on movement of people. 

 

 

[CorpusChristie]

16 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Yes freedom of movement has ended. But migrant workers will still be coming here to work. They will just have to apply for a visa first.

Do you think for one second unemployed Brits are going to go pick fruit and veg? The hourly rate is so bad its not worth it. So we either hugely increase the wages (unlikely), force people to take the jobs (possible but pointless, they will turn up but not work) or we carry on letting eastern europeans do it.

Which do suspect will happen?

If you voted for Brexit based on the assumption migrant workers would disappear then you have been duped.

There are far more important issues than who will dig the potatoes up , thats unskilled part time seasonal work and of little importance 

[Rookiescot]

10 hours ago, CorpusChristie said:

Many people prefer those conditions , allows them to work around personal needs .

Can work when they want and for how long they want without getting sacked for taking time off 

Yes. About 25% of people on zero hours contracts like being on them.

Which means 75% dont.

[Rookiescot]

1 minute ago, CorpusChristie said:

There are far more important issues than who will dig the potatoes up , thats unskilled part time seasonal work and of little importance 

Little importance?

What are we going to eat then? Will British nationalism keep us sustained even though our belly's be empty?

Who is going to dig the potatoes up? 

[CorpusChristie]

18 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

https://www.ft.com/content/56074dda-95bd-11e9-8cfb-30c211dcd229

 

India’s government has made it clear that it will be in no rush to reach a trade deal with the UK without significant concessions on movement of people. 

 

 

Behind a pay wall , so could not read it .

I did a websearch and found a similar article where the suggestion was that the UK should relax its visa rules for Indians , allowing more Students , Tourists and skilled workers into the UK as that would improve trade between the two Countries , there was no mention of allowing masses of unskilled Indian workers into the UK .

 

 

[CorpusChristie]

7 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Little importance?

What are we going to eat then? Will British nationalism keep us sustained even though our belly's be empty?

Who is going to dig the potatoes up? 

Ha ha , no, the potatoes getting dug up is important , whoever digs them up is NOT important .

Potatoes - Important .

Potatoes diggers birth place - Unimportant 

[simple1]

4 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Little importance?

What are we going to eat then? Will British nationalism keep us sustained even though our belly's be empty?

Who is going to dig the potatoes up? 

Many years ago I did seasonal work on farms around the UK. The casual workforce included gypsies, East Enders, students, ex-military and so on. Do UK students and other citizens no longer do seasonal work on farms or has farming sector grown to exceed capacity of UK nationals for employment or is it just plain laziness? If laziness is there not any enforcement mechanism e.g. withdrawing welfare if decline to work?

[Rookiescot]

8 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

Ha ha , no, the potatoes getting dug up is important , whoever digs them up is NOT important .

Potatoes - Important .

Potatoes diggers birth place - Unimportant 

Right so migrants will still be coming to the UK even after Brexit.

[CorpusChristie]

1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

Right so migrants will still be coming to the UK even after Brexit.

That would be an option 

[hotandsticky]

1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

Right so migrants will still be coming to the UK even after Brexit.

 

 

I do hope so.............................. every country needs them.

 

 

 

Just control the numbers in accordance with a sensible immigration policy.

[Rookiescot]

15 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

Behind a pay wall , so could not read it .

I did a websearch and found a similar article where the suggestion was that the UK should relax its visa rules for Indians , allowing more Students , Tourists and skilled workers into the UK as that would improve trade between the two Countries , there was no mention of allowing masses of unskilled Indian workers into the UK .

 

 

I have no idea which groups India has said it wants easier access for. I am not in the negotiating team.

However the very fact that India is insisting on it does not bode well for those who want to take back control of our borders does it?

After all here we have another country dictating what out immigration policy should be or we get no trade deal.

[Rookiescot]

2 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

That would be an option 

What other options are there?

[CorpusChristie]

21 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Little importance?

What are we going to eat then? Will British nationalism keep us sustained even though our belly's be empty?

Who is going to dig the potatoes up? 

I suggest that the long term unemployed should be used for work experience to harvest the  crops .

Provide transport , food and accommodation  and require them to earn their dole money

 

[Rookiescot]

1 minute ago, CorpusChristie said:

I suggest that the long term unemployed should be used for work experience to harvest the  crops .

Provide transport , food and accommodation  and require them to earn their dole money

 

Ah so a form of forced labour. How very North Korean.

How will the UK have to moral high ground to condemn other countries for using such tactics when we are doing it ourselves?

Will the accommodation be surrounded by barbed wire and guard towers? 

[luckyluke]

44 minutes ago, transam said:

have no idea if Brexit will be a financial disaster

No one in Europe, and the U.K., has any idea what Brexit will bring.

We all have opinions and wishes.

They go from the U.K., and/or the E.U., flourishing,

to be a complete economic disaster.

Time will tell.

[CorpusChristie]

3 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Ah so a form of forced labour. How very North Korean.

How will the UK have to moral high ground to condemn other countries for using such tactics when we are doing it ourselves?

Will the accommodation be surrounded by barbed wire and guard towers? 

Such schemes have been in place for the last 20 years or so , once you have been unemployed for over six months , you get assigned "voluntary" work , and if you refuse to participate, you get your benefits stopped .

  Notice how you make it sound sinister by mentioning barbed wire , North Korea and guard towers , whereas the schemes have already been in place for the last 20 years or so .

  Its not "forced labour" either as people are quite free to opt out , they just lose their benefits

[JonnyF]

26 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Ah so a form of forced labour. How very North Korean.

How will the UK have to moral high ground to condemn other countries for using such tactics when we are doing it ourselves?

Will the accommodation be surrounded by barbed wire and guard towers? 

If Sturgeon had any say in it then you might be right.

 

After banning free speech last month, she's now banning music in pubs. What a dreary, depressing, joyless place Scotland must be under her totalitarian leadership. Still, you knew what you were voting for, right?

 

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/people/sneaky-petes-owner-urges-nicola-sturgeon-have-urgent-rethink-music-ban-claiming-scottish-government-have-got-it-wrong-2943783

 

[Rookiescot]

12 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

Such schemes have been in place for the last 20 years or so , once you have been unemployed for over six months , you get assigned "voluntary" work , and if you refuse to participate, you get your benefits stopped .

  Notice how you make it sound sinister by mentioning barbed wire , North Korea and guard towers , whereas the schemes have already been in place for the last 20 years or so .

  Its not "forced labour" either as people are quite free to opt out , they just lose their benefits

No. After 6 months you are removed from the Job Seekers Allowance (JSA) and transferred to Universal Credit benefits. Many in this position register themselves (and are encouraged to do so) as self employed. 

This has the handy benefit for the government that they no longer appear on the unemployment lists.

[transam]

1 hour ago, Rookiescot said:

Little importance?

What are we going to eat then? Will British nationalism keep us sustained even though our belly's be empty?

Who is going to dig the potatoes up? 

Probably a machine.....????

 

 

[CorpusChristie]

6 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

No. After 6 months you are removed from the Job Seekers Allowance (JSA) and transferred to Universal Credit benefits. Many in this position register themselves (and are encouraged to do so) as self employed. 

This has the handy benefit for the government that they no longer appear on the unemployment lists.

Have they stopped the voluntary placement schemes for the long term unemployed ?

Previously , if you had been unemployed for 2 years , you had to attend the job center everyday for six months from 9-5 , sat in a job center for 7 hours a day , five days a week .

   Voluntary work was offered , which would be preferable to sitting in the job center all day long .

Offer the long term unemployed voluntarily work picking the crops 

[nauseus]

7 hours ago, candide said:

Weren't they given a chance already? There must be already training programs offered to them, right? Plus, the pre-Brexit unemployment rate was rather low so it should not have been that hard to get a job (provided people are ready to move to places where jobs are offered).

Some were, depending on where they live. The official employment rate is low but the method of computing that rate has been continually revised (as with several other economic indicators) to hide the true percentage. Many of the lower end service jobs do not require much training and are now done by a surplus of uni graduates and many EU people.

 

The types of apprenticeships that used to exist have declined along with the decline of British industry. This is an opportunity to reset and shift the bias a bit back to more UK manufacturing and start more technical and mechanical training for young British people that those industries will need.   

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, CorpusChristie said:

Have they stopped the voluntary placement schemes for the long term unemployed ?

Previously , if you had been unemployed for 2 years , you had to attend the job center everyday for six months from 9-5 , sat in a job center for 7 hours a day , five days a week .

   Voluntary work was offered , which would be preferable to sitting in the job center all day long .

Offer the long term unemployed voluntarily work picking the crops 

Now that I dont know about. I have never heard of anyone having to attend the job center every day.

Offering them jobs picking fruit and veg is not voluntary if you threaten to stop their money.

Its forced labour. 

[melvinmelvin]

4 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Little importance?

What are we going to eat then? Will British nationalism keep us sustained even though our belly's be empty?

Who is going to dig the potatoes up? 

try eating French spuds,

after digging 'em out the frogs export them willingly

 

[CorpusChristie]

1 hour ago, Rookiescot said:

Now that I dont know about. I have never heard of anyone having to attend the job center every day.

Offering them jobs picking fruit and veg is not voluntary if you threaten to stop their money.

Its forced labour. 

Well , its not the actual job center , they're located in buildings close by and you are required to apply for at least ten jobs per week and attend any interviews for those jobs .

   You are seeking a job and receive job seekers allowance , if you refuse any jobs, they stop your JSA .

They also offer voluntary work , and if you refuse that work, they can also stop your JSA , its your choice as to what you do 

[JonnyF]

1 hour ago, Rookiescot said:

Now that I dont know about. I have never heard of anyone having to attend the job center every day.

Offering them jobs picking fruit and veg is not voluntary if you threaten to stop their money.

Its forced labour. 

Forced labour? ????

 

Nobody is forcing them to work. It's just that they cannot afford to eat if they don't. Welcome to the real world.

[Rookiescot]

37 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Forced labour? ????

 

Nobody is forcing them to work. It's just that they cannot afford to eat if they don't. Welcome to the real world.

So they either work or are made destitute?

 

Here's the definition of forced labour.

 

Unfree labour (or forced labour) is any work relation, especially in modern or early modern history, in which people are employed against their will with the threat of destitution, detention, violence (including death), compulsion,[1] or other forms of extreme hardship to themselves or members of their families.

 

You will note the part about destitution. 

It would appear not only do you Brexiteers casually rewrite history and facts but are now capable of rewriting the definition of words.

[Nigel Garvie]

5 hours ago, JonnyF said:

If Sturgeon had any say in it then you might be right.

 

After banning free speech last month, she's now banning music in pubs. What a dreary, depressing, joyless place Scotland must be under her totalitarian leadership. Still, you knew what you were voting for, right?

 

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/people/sneaky-petes-owner-urges-nicola-sturgeon-have-urgent-rethink-music-ban-claiming-scottish-government-have-got-it-wrong-2943783

 

That is a rather simplistic picture of the article, which is about banning background music in pubs BECAUSE of the danger of people shouting above the music being more likely to spread Covid germs - so just a temporary measure. The pub organisation is talking to the government to try and refine the measure to take into account decibel levels.

 

Please direct me to a source for the information that NS banned free speech last month. That would be such a huge news item I am surprised that I haven't read it elsewhere, or are you over egging the pudding again by any chance?