Foreigners CAN own land - Putting an argument to rest.

[worgeordie]

I have a 2.5 x1.5 ? meter plot in the Foreigners Graveyard in Chiang Mai,

not big enough to build a house on ????, and not sure I actually own it,

maybe they will dig me up and put me somewhere else,then sell it again,

I believe it was given by HM King  Rama V,seems to be some old British

Teak managers and Missionaries buried there,so hopeful i won't be moved.

and hopefully i won't need it for a few years yet????

regards worgeordie

 

 

 

 

 

[Pottinger]

15 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

Seems a bit of a mute point if you cannot get in and out of the country to stay in it ! 

If it's a 'mute' point, I'm saying nothing.

[thelovedone]

Crikey......after reading all that OP rambling on Section 86, i still feel pretty comfortable  saying foreigners cannot own land in Thailand.

[geisha]

If anyone wants to spend 1 to 3 million euros , we have some gorgeous villas on the Côte d’Azur , Spain, Italy, etc. They are worth your money, you can re sell them easily and make a profit, you can come and go as you please, and take advantage of good infrastructure, healthcare, pristine scenery and towns ,cities and villages with all the best food in the world. 
( there are also 50 and 100 million houses for sale!) 

[ross163103]

Sure hope you're right about putting it to rest but based on past subjects I've read on here....probably not. Too many keyboard warriors out there with too much time on their hands.

[blackcab]

2 hours ago, paahlman said:

Do I remember wrongly or doesnt the amount needed used to be 10 mill Baht?

 

It's 10 million if you want to apply for a 1 year extension of stay based on investment. As far as I know there has been no change to this.

 

You could, in theory, use the 40 million investment to also apply for an extension of stay based on investment, although I am not learned in the exact immigration requirements for this.

[blackcab]

A troll post has been removed.

[Heppinger]

17 hours ago, blackcab said:

You are entirely correct, and what you have mentioned is not new knowledge. Personally, I have not known anyone to actually achieve a Section 86 purchase.

 

This is mainly because the applicant needs to import the equivalent of 40 million baht of foreign currency into Thailand, and invest it in the specified manner. Only when this is done can the investor petition for specific written authorisation from the Minister of the Interior. Such permission is not a right, and is at the whim of the Minister. I have never known such permission to be granted, although it certainly could have happened.

 

The other main stumbling block is that Section 86 land cannot be disposed of to a non-Thai person. This means if a non-Thai citizen purchased such land, and then they died, there is no way of transferring the ownership to their non-Thai children (unless the children themselves imported the equivalent of 40 million baht and gained their own permission from the Minister of the Interior).

 

If you happen to be well connected and can count the Minister of the Interior as a personal friend, however, it's possible.

So what your saying is you would be crazy to purchase land under this agreement?  

[phantomfiddler]

Sounds like another one who has been here for a year and knows it all ???? pedantic nonsense comes to mind.

[rvaviator]

16 minutes ago, thelovedone said:

Crikey......after reading all that OP rambling on Section 86, i still feel pretty comfortable  saying foreigners cannot own land in Thailand.

Yes ..... your conclusion sounds spot on to me ????99.9% of foreigners can not own land .. however if Bill Gates or some other mega rich guy came along and said ..

 

I like to buy a few Rai in Pattaya ...  Here are 200Mil THB to the local temple restoration fund .. and please let me pay for a new children's hospital ..... and please accept a small contribution to the Immigration retirement fund ...  Only thing I ask in return is to have my name on the Charnot  ....  

 

I am sure the reply would be ... yes sir .. thank you sir we will have that sorted out in no time ... 

[Mazzza33]

40,000,000.oo why would anyone consider moving/living/settling  to Thailand ,with this lot ,

in your kitty 

Thailand is only tractive for the affordable life style after retirement ,to live it ,

a foreigners ambition and business sense get squashed here very quick 

[blackcab]

1 hour ago, rvaviator said:

I am sure the reply would be ... yes sir .. thank you sir we will have that sorted out in no time ... 

 

Section 86 purchases are limited to a maximum of 1 rai per person.

 

Even Bill Gates cannot legally own, "a few rai" in his own name.

[JeffersLos]

2 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Only' if I had so much money......I certainly wouldn't be investing 40,000,000 baht in Thailand for the privilege of being able to purchase land in Thailand.

I don't know, if I suddenly won $150,000,000 on the US lottery, buying a rai downtown, putting up massive posters of myself with 'I own this land 100%' along the border, then filling it up with massive boom boxes that go off at 3am, does sound kind of appealing. 

[RocketDog]

17 hours ago, timendres said:

I am sick and tired of foreigners who obsess over owning land in this country.

 

I totally agree. I recently bought a nice house with a 90 year land lease which I will leave to my Thai lady in my will. 

Why would I care about owning the land under it it? So she can leave it to her great grandchildren? 

[bwpage3]

You interpret what you read, which is not 100% correct.

 

This is for someone that is investing 40,000,000 baht to own 1 rai.

 

This is not for you to get married and buy land for the going price.

[bwpage3]

2 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

Sounds like another one who has been here for a year and knows it all ???? pedantic nonsense comes to mind.

Hit the nail on the head!

[pacovl46]

Good to know. Thanks for sharing! ????

[Mac98]

19 hours ago, impulse said:

It's extremely dangerous for a layman to interpret Thai laws without a full understanding of the complex eco-structure and history surrounding those laws.  Just because it's technically legal, doesn't mean it's ever been done.  And even if someone else did it, doesn't mean you can do it under your circumstances, down at your local land office. 

 

My guess is that Bill Gates or Elon Musk or Jack Ma could own land in Thailand.  But that doesn't mean I could...  I don't have pockets that deep, a staff big enough to chase the paper, or hundreds of millions of $$$ in potential investment money I could use for leverage.

 

And who with that much money would want a parcel that small? Most of those people have kitchens bigger than that.

[digger70]

20 hours ago, Jenkins9039 said:

I'm so sick and tired of hearing foreigners state, you can't own etc.

Yea No probs ,don't be sick & tired . 

Just get ya 40 mill out of ya purse and Go for it . 

You got my blessing to do so. 

How many Expats you think Can/will do that?  Zero . Why? 

No 40 Mill and the other hoops to jump thru.  ????????

[impulse]

7 minutes ago, Mac98 said:

And who with that much money would want a parcel that small? Most of those people have kitchens bigger than that.

 

0.4 acres in the middle of BKK could easily go into the millions of $$$.  Maybe tens of millions of $$$.

 

It's not so much the limited size.  It's the restriction that it can only be used to build a family residence for the owner.

 

[Kurtf]

So that lays it to rest. A foreigner can own land as long as he is very very wealthy and can put 40 million baht into Thai gov't bonds. But on a realistic side, damn few foreigners have an extra 40 million baht laying around. So the ACTUAL answer is NO a foreigner can not own land in Thailand.

[khunPer]

21 hours ago, Jenkins9039 said:

I'm so sick and tired of hearing foreigners state, you can't own etc.

It's nothing new, it's been part of the so-called "investor visa" for long time.

 

But most of the foreigners in Thaivisa forum are not investing 40 million baht in Thailand for investment only to buy a two to five million baht private property, including both house and land, for example up Isaan or in Pattaya...????

[jvs]

20 hours ago, timendres said:

I am sick and tired of foreigners who obsess over owning land in this country.

 

 

can you truly own land in your country?

 

[elliss]

20 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

Seems a bit of a mute point if you cannot get in and out of the country to stay in it ! 

     Do not despair , your lady can send you photos of the land you purchased ??.

     Only another few years , before foreigner/ farangs , allowed to enter the Kingdom..

     Well worth waiting for . Imo..

 

 

[jimmya123]

If a foreigner wants to live in Thailand(except Bangkok,Pattaya,..) and plans to build small home , it will be best solution for him to lease 1 rai land which is renewable (costs 100K-150K Baht) for 30 years in rural area and construct a home(750K-1M) and you can register the property by your name. If an agreement is done between two parties and he foreigner adds his inheritors names on that agreement , the leasing will be renewed for the new 30 years after first cut. actually , instead of investing 40 million baht actually nobody knows whether he is alive or .. after 30 years???? 

[The Deerhunter]

On 7/30/2020 at 9:12 PM, Seeall said:

And the reply is the truth and nothing but the truth......

Maybe a courageous TV member with lots of time on hand enquires at the land office ? 

 

Preferably at the local land office of the O.P.  All such decisions are subject to the whim and/or financial fortunes of the local office in virtually all Thai government department decisions.  Remember the TM30 debacle and also whether can you carry a copy of your passport instead of the real thing.   Just like a local raffle back home.  "The judge's decision is final and no correspondence will be entered into."

[khunPer]

15 hours ago, jimmya123 said:

If a foreigner wants to live in Thailand(except Bangkok,Pattaya,..) and plans to build small home , it will be best solution for him to lease 1 rai land which is renewable (costs 100K-150K Baht) for 30 years in rural area and construct a home(750K-1M) and you can register the property by your name. If an agreement is done between two parties and he foreigner adds his inheritors names on that agreement , the leasing will be renewed for the new 30 years after first cut. actually , instead of investing 40 million baht actually nobody knows whether he is alive or .. after 30 years???? 

Renewal of lease is up to negotiation with the at any time owner after the first lease period expires. A renewal option cannot legally be mentioned in a lease contract. Any external document with a renewal promise would not have much legal value, as it's in principle illegal.

Quote

Can the lessee and lessor execute 2 consecutive 30 year lease agreements?

When the leaseholder (lessee) and freeholder (lessor) have executed 2 consecutive 30-year lease agreements (whether registered with the land office or not) it shall by law and supreme court rulings be deemed as one lease. The second lease contract shall be deemed void (section 150 civil code) or if considered as one lease reduced to a 30 year term (section 544 civil code).

Source: Samui for Sale "Thai Real Estate Lease Leasehold and Rent laws".

 

But you shall look into what long term rent of a similar house would costs you. In general rent is based of 8 percent to 12 percent of the value, might however sometimes be less, for example around 6 percent. Often you will find that you have paid the full value after between 15 to 20 years, so one 30-year lease of land, and building a house, could still make sense, compared to renting.

[kingofthemountain]

3 hours ago, khunPer said:

Often you will find that you have paid the full value after between 15 to 20 years, so one 30-year lease of land, and building a house, could still make sense, compared to renting.

I wonder if someone, even with a nice crystal ball, can says if he will be able to stay

30 years at the same place, particularly nowadays and particularly in Thailand.

 

I agree with you renting a house or a condo is more expensive on the very long term, but it gives you a priceless freedom in your choices and moves, and the capacity to adapt easily and in a cheap way to a very unstable environment if it becomes necessary,

 

If you build, you are stick in your brick and mortar for the best but also often for the worst

unfortunately most of the time the only option is to take your losses if for some reasons you want or you have to move quickly

[khunPer]

21 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said:

I wonder if someone, even with a nice crystal ball, can says if he will be able to stay

30 years at the same place, particularly nowadays and particularly in Thailand.

 

I agree with you renting a house or a condo is more expensive on the very long term, but it gives you a priceless freedom in your choices and moves, and the capacity to adapt easily and in a cheap way to a very unstable environment if it becomes necessary,

 

If you build, you are stick in your brick and mortar for the best but also often for the worst

unfortunately most of the time the only option is to take your losses if for some reasons you want or you have to move quickly

Yes, looking in crystal balls and fortune telling are difficult arts. However, in the always crystal clear light of hindsight lots of people have stayed many years in Thailand inside the same brick and mortar construction.

I've also, so far 10-years in mine, and with no intentions of moving. Renting some like what I have, would have paid both my house and the land underneath it in 10 years, so just looking at numbers I'm already safe. However, I would probably have rented something cheaper, if I had rented instead.

 

But it's the same situation in many places around the World, you might buy, or build, a house in an area, where you some years later find out that it's very difficult to sell for numerous reasons, even with a loss. You can be stuck to your bricks and mortar many places.