France recalls envoy after Turkey scolds Macron over Muslims

[rooster59]

France recalls envoy after Turkey scolds Macron over Muslims

By Daren Butler and Geert De Clercq

 

FILE PHOTO: French President Emmanuel Macron and his wife Brigitte Macron welcome Turkey's President Tayyip Erdogan with his wife Emine Erdogan at the Elysee Palace as part of the commemoration ceremony for Armistice Day, 100 years after the end of the First World War, in Paris, France, November 11, 2018. REUTERS/Philippe Wojaze

 

ISTANBUL/PARIS (Reuters) - France recalled its ambassador on Saturday after Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan said his counterpart Emmanuel Macron needed mental help over his attitude towards Muslims.

 

"Outrage and insult are not a method," Macron's office said.

 

The French leader this month declared war on "Islamist separatism", which he believes is taking over some Muslim communities in France.

 

France has since been shaken by the beheading of a teacher by an Islamist radical, avenging the use of cartoons of the Prophet Mohammad in a class on freedom of expression.

 

"What is the problem of this person called Macron with Muslims and Islam? Macron needs treatment on a mental level," Erdogan said in a speech in the central Turkish city of Kayseri.

 

"What else can be said to a head of state who does not understand freedom of belief and who behaves in this way to millions of people living in his country who are members of a different faith?" Erdogan added.

 

Turkey and France are both members of the NATO military alliance, but have been at odds over issues including Syria and Libya, maritime jurisdiction in the eastern Mediterranean, and the conflict in Nagorno-Karabakh.

 

"France has gathered its European partners, who share France's demand that Turkey puts a stop to its dangerous adventures in the Mediterranean and in the region," the statement from Macron's office said.

 

Erdogan has two months to respond or face measures, it added, noting the absence of a condolence message from Turkey's leader after the history teacher's death last week.

 

Erdogan is a pious Muslim and since his Islamist-rooted AK Party first came to power in 2002, he has sought to shift Islam into the mainstream of politics in Turkey, an overwhelmingly Muslim but constitutionally secular country.

 

The Turkish president had also said on Oct. 6 that Macron's comments on Islamist threats were "a clear provocation" and showed "impertinence".

 

(Reporting by Daren Butler and Geert De Clercq; Editing by Frances Kerry and Andrew Cawthorne)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2020-10-25

 

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[gunderhill]

12 minutes ago, rooster59 said:

"What else can be said to a head of state who does not understand freedom of belief

Anything that involves the word "belief"  should not be taken seriously. Then to  kill someone based on a "belief" is even more disgusting.

[biggles45]

1 hour ago, rooster59 said:

 

"What else can be said to a head of state who does not understand freedom of belief and who behaves in this way to millions of people living in his country

Unfortunately the millions of people living in France with different beliefs do NOT accept other people's rights to their own beliefs, and thats the problem there and all around the world

[SomchaiCNX]

Good start, now start to send back all those Turkish people with dual nationality, and I mean not only from France but from the whole of Europe. This guy is the cancer that eventually will be the end of Europe. They vote left in Europe while supporting extreme right in their own country, the weak laws in Europe allows them to do it legally. Please Macron and the rest of Europe don't stop and start to mention and ask questions about the Armenian genocide. Hopefully he get so angry that he will get a heart attack. It is partly the problem because of the US who want to keep them in NATO. The rest of normal people in Europe had enough of this guy.

[animalmagic]

1 hour ago, rooster59 said:

"What else can be said to a head of state who does not understand freedom of belief and who behaves in this way to millions of people living in his country who are members of a different faith?" Erdogan added.

Would that be like the suppression of Orthodox Christianity in Turkey?

For the record I am in favour of neither side as I am an atheist.

 

[NanLaew]

If they revoke their ban on the hijab and the burka, France can set itself free.

[LomSak27]

1 hour ago, rooster59 said:

"What else can be said to a head of state who does not understand freedom of belief and who behaves in this way to millions of people living in his country who are members of a different faith?" Erdogan added.

 

Yes Mr Erdogan and how did Turkey deal with people of a different faith? Genocide, Massacre, & forced ethnic expulsion of the Greek, Armenian and Syriac Christian minorities. Thankfully France does not copy the Turkish example.

 

 

Edited October 25, 2020 by LomSak27

[donnacha]

4 minutes ago, LomSak27 said:

Thankfully France does not copy the Turkish example.

Yet.

 

[JusticeGB]

18 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

If they revoke their ban on the hijab and the burka, France can set itself free.

Queen Elizabeth the first would have cut off their heads as we were at war with them then. 

[Rimmer]

A post has been removed.

Please do not alter a politicians name to suit your own agenda thank you

[Surelynot]

France is secular and long may it be so.....a beacon for the rest of the world......no religion is a good religion...all are hijacked by the moronic males of the species for their own ends....the power and the glory.

[Opl]

 

1 hour ago, NanLaew said:

If they revoke their ban on the hijab and the burka, France can set itself free.

downgrading the various benefits that encourage immigration is a possibility to set France free

[Morch]

2 hours ago, gunderhill said:

Anything that involves the word "belief"  should not be taken seriously. Then to  kill someone based on a "belief" is even more disgusting.

 

Following that, neither AQ, nor IS should have been taken seriously. On the whole, maybe safer to take them a wee bit more seriously than advised above.

[Morch]

1 hour ago, SomchaiCNX said:

Good start, now start to send back all those Turkish people with dual nationality, and I mean not only from France but from the whole of Europe. This guy is the cancer that eventually will be the end of Europe. They vote left in Europe while supporting extreme right in their own country, the weak laws in Europe allows them to do it legally. Please Macron and the rest of Europe don't stop and start to mention and ask questions about the Armenian genocide. Hopefully he get so angry that he will get a heart attack. It is partly the problem because of the US who want to keep them in NATO. The rest of normal people in Europe had enough of this guy.

 

 

Disregarding the OTT nonsense, was wondering about this bit

 

Quote

It is partly the problem because of the US who want to keep them in NATO.

 

Are other members of NATO openly against Turkey's membership? Also, are you aware that there is no actual mechanism of expelling members from NATO (or for that matter, keeping them in)?

[Harveyboy]

1 hour ago, NanLaew said:

If they revoke their ban on the hijab and the burka, France can set itself free.

would be stepping  down .. burka should be banned no hiding... you go walk into a bank with a ski mask on ...all about security and these Evil B.....ds creating havoc worldwide  not racist just realist

[stevenl]

48 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Following that, neither AQ, nor IS should have been taken seriously. On the whole, maybe safer to take them a wee bit more seriously than advised above.

Why are you intentionally misinterpreting the post you replied to?

[stevenl]

7 minutes ago, Harveyboy said:

would be stepping  down .. burka should be banned no hiding... you go walk into a bank with a ski mask on ...all about security and these Evil B.....ds creating havoc worldwide  not racist just realist

Banks are private places, burka ban is in public space only.

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Why are you intentionally misinterpreting the post you replied to?

 

Why are you intentionally misrepresenting my post?

[NeoDinosaw]

4 hours ago, JusticeGB said:

Queen Elizabeth the first would have cut off their heads as we were at war with them then. 

Do you mean that we were at war with Turkey or at war with France.  We have been at war with so many countries it's hard to remember 

[SomchaiCNX]

3 hours ago, Morch said:

 

 

Disregarding the OTT nonsense, was wondering about this bit

 

 

Are other members of NATO openly against Turkey's membership? Also, are you aware that there is no actual mechanism of expelling members from NATO (or for that matter, keeping them in)?

I added this to annoy people like you ???? The US had / has problems with the Turkish but at the end they need them because they are part of the NATO so they can use their air force bases in case. So what is so difficult to understand?

[Mayhem11]

Islamophobia running rampant again.

[SomchaiCNX]

52 minutes ago, Mayhem11 said:

Islamophobia running rampant again.

B.S when you have no real argument.

A person once said. The extreme islamist is cutting of the head while the moderate one is holding the feet.  

Edited October 25, 2020 by SomchaiCNX

[Opl]

1 hour ago, Mayhem11 said:

Islamophobia running rampant again.

what reprisals are being considered against China which, objectively, imprisons and mistreats (euphemism) the Uighurs ... any reaction from Erdogan?

 

[Opl]

Still accurate: In 1997, as mayor of Istanbul, Erdogan loosely referenced a poem by the Turkish nationalist Ziya Gokalp:

The mosques are our barracks,

the domes our helmets,

the minarets our bayonets,

and the believers our soldiers.

"Erdogan had included these lines in past speeches. But this time they provoked Turkey’s secular military leaders and civilian elite, who had just forced the country’s first Islamist prime minister from power and who viewed Istanbul’s popular, Islamist-leaning mayor as a threat."

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2016/04/turkey-germany-erdogan-bohmermann/479814/

Edited October 26, 2020 by Opl

[simple1]

Erdogan making contentious comments appealing to his base, politicians of a more extreme political posture do so, including some Western politicians. Erdogan has a tendency to wind back his comments under pressure. would expect him to do so with this matter in the course of time i.e. prior to the date of threatened retaliation (sanctions against ruling party individuals?) by France.

[Morch]

17 hours ago, SomchaiCNX said:

I added this to annoy people like you ???? The US had / has problems with the Turkish but at the end they need them because they are part of the NATO so they can use their air force bases in case. So what is so difficult to understand?

 

Sure, 'people like me' how?

You apparently wish to deny NATO includes other nations than the USA, or that some of these other nations were making use of Turkish bases as well. What's difficult to understand is where did you come upon the notion that NATO members are for expelling Turkey, but the USA position is otherwise. Same goes for your apparent uninformed notion that members can be expelled from NATO - this is not the case, there's no such provision in place.

[Morch]

 

On the local level, its yet another attempt to distract from deepening economic crisis, and initial poor response to the Corona virus situation. Playing the Defender of Islam and Muslims bit works for his home crowd, and if it seems out of sync with 'the issues', well....he doesn't have that many relevant cards to play so makes do with what's available.

 

Regionally, there are at several unrelated fronts. One picks up the previously mentioned Defender of Islam and Muslim theme, which is central to Erdogan's long term goal of Making Turkey Great Again. Diplomatically, this is exhibited by competing with Saudi Arabia for the Arab/Muslim world title championship - often by trying to make KSA look soft or divisive (in this case, KSA comments weren't all that fiery and with the backdrop issue of their quiet acceptance of other countries normalizing relations with Israel, a good opportunity to score some Tough Guy points).

 

Apart from this, Turkey is embroiled in an almost open conflict with several Mediterranean neighbors on the issue of maritime gas exploration and production. I'm not sure how much this directly got to do with France (via French firms), but huffing and puffing in order to improve negotiation position or secure concessions is pretty much what Erdogan does, on a regular basis.

 

Also, Erdogan's dreams about expanding Turkey's regional influence imply an unfavorable position on others taking the limelight as movers and shakers. He often gets antagonistic to any mediation, intervention or other forms of diplomacy seen as cutting on his turf. I guess Macron is a prime candidate for his ire, seeing as he's pretty active hopping about the ME trying to sort things out (recently, in Lebanon).

 

Doubt he actually cares much regarding the rights of Muslims in France, but it's a good opportunity as any to further his agenda, so why not.

[Harveyboy]

On 10/25/2020 at 1:44 PM, stevenl said:

Banks are private places, burka ban is in public space only.

i don't think you understand what im saying here is no garment covering anyone's face in public should be allowed not talking race or religion im talking security  that's all  

[stevenl]

13 minutes ago, Harveyboy said:

i don't think you understand what im saying here is no garment covering anyone's face in public should be allowed not talking race or religion im talking security  that's all  

I understand exactly what you're saying.

[briansbiology]

I am no fan of Macron. But in this case Erdogan is an absolute mule. The whole world needs to start drawing pictures of Mohammed in various states until they become so flooded by it  that it no longer enrages both  brain cells of the radicals

 

not being able to question the prophet is as backwards and stupid as not being able to questions any person in power. ????

Edited October 27, 2020 by briansbiology