With election looming, U.S. faces record surge of coronavirus cases

[placeholder]

17 minutes ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

As someone who has experienced the virus and its effects first-hand, I think the president is in a position to express his opinions on it and various suppression and mitigation strategies (of course in consultation with appropriate medical, policy, and legal experts). Again agree or disagree as you wish. I think the president has people's safety in mind and the country's safety...the leader of any country has many factors to consider and weigh in making policy. Of course anyone is free to disagree (and in the US system even "vote the bum out.")

And if someone gets cancer I guess that makes them qualified to give advice on what courses of treatment others should follow. And it's perfectly sane to make your chief advisor someone who didn't train as a virologist or epidemiologist but did offer pleasing opinions via Fox News. And it's entirely reasonable advise one's supporters to engage in risky behavior because one has their welfare in mind. And it not at all deranged to denigrate those who do follow the advice of virologists and epidemiologists and discourage a huge segment of the population from wearing masks. And  anyone is free to disagree because everybody's opinion is equally valuable and there's really no such thing as expertise. Yup. Definitely not crazy. Utterly rational.

[placeholder]

Coronavirus deaths are rising again in the US, as feared

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-virus-outbreak-ap-top-news-michael-pence-idaho-52978c2d2646bc190bd577cb132662b3

 

COVID-19 deaths on the rise in the U.S., as hospitals fill up at alarming rate.

https://www.cbsnews.com/live-updates/covid-19-latest-news-2020-10-27/

Edited October 31, 2020 by onthedarkside
quote of removed post deleted

[placeholder]

15 minutes ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

I think everyone knows any world leader gets extraordinary care when they are ill...so what your saying is hardly a revelation. Try to spin it any way you like but the fact of the matter is a 74 year old fat man, whose favorite meal is a Big Mac Combo Set, recovered from the virus in days and has been out on the road campaigning ever since. That's not to say everyone will have the same clinical course...Boris Johnson, a much younger man with access to similar medical resources ended up in ICU. Maybe Trump just has the best genes...and that's why you hate him so.

And let's just say for the sake of argument that Trump does enjoy unusually robust health. Does that make it okay to advocate risky behavior for the general populace?

[Tug]

Guess 1,000 dead Americans a day isent enough dead to impress or let’s put it this way 2 fulley loaded packed to the gills jumbo jets a day crashing killing all aboard day after day ehhh and it’s going to get worse much worse.meanwhile trump says doctors get more money If  they declare death for other reasons covid deaths as he holds his super spreader (rallies) to me it beggars belief that the one charged with protecting Americans is actively spreading this deadly virus and he straight up knows he’s doing it.

Edited October 31, 2020 by onthedarkside
quote of removed post deleted

[ChouDoufu]

2 minutes ago, Tug said:

Guess 1,000 dead Americans a day isent enough dead to impress or let’s put it this way 2 fulley loaded packed to the gills jumbo jets a day crashing killing all aboard day after day ehhh and it’s going to get worse much worse.meanwhile trump says doctors get more money If  they declare death for other reasons covid deaths as he holds his super spreader (rallies) to me it beggars belief that the one charged with protecting Americans is actively spreading this deadly virus and he straight up knows he’s doing it.

 

more like two 9/11's per week, soon to be three per week, continuing into the foreseeable future.

 

jinkies!  that's some legacy!

[onthedarkside]

A post falsely claiming that coronavirus deaths in the U.S. have not been rising lately has been removed. Along with another post claiming a false survival rate for U.S. CV cases.

 

And unfortunately, by necessity, a goodly number of regular posts replying to and quoting the false info ones that were removed.

 

 

https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus-data-explorer?zoomToSelection=true&time=2020-07-07..latest&country=~USA&region=World&deathsMetric=true&interval=smoothed&hideControls=true&smoothing=7&pickerMetric=location&pickerSort=asc

 

 

The current U.S. case fatality rate among confirmed CV case is 2.5%.

 

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality

 

 

[scammed]

1 hour ago, onthedarkside said:

A post falsely claiming that coronavirus deaths in the U.S. have not been rising lately has been removed. Along with another post claiming a false survival rate for U.S. CV cases.

 

And unfortunately, by necessity, a goodly number of regular posts replying to and quoting the false info ones that were removed.

 

 

https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus-data-explorer?zoomToSelection=true&time=2020-07-07..latest&country=~USA&region=World&deathsMetric=true&interval=smoothed&hideControls=true&smoothing=7&pickerMetric=location&pickerSort=asc

 

 

The current U.S. case fatality rate among confirmed CV case is 2.5%.

 

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality

 

 

please elaborate what you mean with 'lately',

because you will need to hard core cherry picking

start date to make out a rising trend

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

[onthedarkside]

40 minutes ago, scammed said:

please elaborate what you mean with 'lately',

because you will need to hard core cherry picking

start date to make out a rising trend

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

 

The daily deaths data, seen from afar, doesn't show the actual trend lately, because of the data reporting variations involving weekends and such where counts aren't timely reported. The prior 7 days average of daily data chart I posted above evens out those daily reporting anomalies, and clearly shows an upward trend lately.

 

And the recent trend is not at all hard to see:

 

 

[onthedarkside]

And there also is this Oct. 27 report from Associated Press, if charts aren't your thing -- average deaths per day across the country are up 10% over the past two weeks, from 721 to nearly 794 as of last Sunday.

 

Quote

 

BOISE, Idaho (AP) — Deaths per day from the coronavirus in the U.S. are on the rise again, just as health experts had feared, and cases are climbing in practically every state, despite assurances from President Donald Trump over the weekend that “we’re rounding the turn, we’re doing great.”

With Election Day just over a week away, average deaths per day across the country are up 10% over the past two weeks, from 721 to nearly 794 as of Sunday, according to data from Johns Hopkins University. Newly confirmed infections per day are rising in 47 states, and deaths are up in 34.

 

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-virus-outbreak-ap-top-news-michael-pence-idaho-52978c2d2646bc190bd577cb132662b3

[onthedarkside]

A reminder note to posters.... Public commenting on moderation is against forum rules. Any questions or issues should be addressed to the moderating team by PM.

 

Also:
 

Quote

 

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[RoadWarrior371]

17 hours ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

The European lockdowns are only partial, with many exceptions; that's why they failed the first time and will likely again. Not sure what Trump's bank balance has to do with Covid...I'll just put it down to a typical anti-Trump non-sequiter. 

Pretty much spot-on.  You will notice the deaths per millions in the last 7 days is ~ 20 for UK and France, and 14 for the USA.  Meanwhile the US economy has suffered the least.  Things that make you go Hmm. 

[Lacessit]

3 hours ago, RoadWarrior371 said:

Pretty much spot-on.  You will notice the deaths per millions in the last 7 days is ~ 20 for UK and France, and 14 for the USA.  Meanwhile the US economy has suffered the least.  Things that make you go Hmm. 

The number of active cases in the US is now 3.1 million, hospitals are overwhelmed in places such as Utah, and you say the US economy has suffered the least.

I guess the economy is more important to you than lives and long-term impairment, which does say a lot about you.

[Jeffr2]

3 hours ago, RoadWarrior371 said:

Pretty much spot-on.  You will notice the deaths per millions in the last 7 days is ~ 20 for UK and France, and 14 for the USA.  Meanwhile the US economy has suffered the least.  Things that make you go Hmm. 

It's not just about lockdowns.  It's also about how the population feels about being able to go out safely.  Worth a read:

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/business/economy/economy-coronavirus-lockdown-iowa.html

 

Iowa Never Locked Down. Its Economy Is Struggling Anyway.

President Trump has blamed Democratic officials’ rules for impeding the recovery. But even where restrictions are few, business is far from normal.

[RPCVguy]

21 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

The deaths lag the infections by between 2 & 8 weeks so look back that far to see why the deaths are not going up.

this is the infection rate

 

infections have jumped from 60,000 per day to over 100,000 per day in the last 6 days.

 

and here is the difference between a second world country that is doing a reasonable job and the USA who is ridiculously bad.

Excellent graphics! To those who want to point fingers, I recommend considering the cultural divide of the USA politically and ideologically as evidenced in these two additional graphics.

 

The above shows TOTAL CASES since June
This next one shows both Cases and DEATHS,  but on a per capita basis (per 100,000 people in the state.)
The link to the interactive website for this 2nd graph is https://91-divoc.com/pages/covid-visualization/?chart=countries-normalized

[spidermike007]

Largely due to America's non leader, his terrible example, and fools like Pence, who flout the protocols all the time. He has succeeded on a few levels. He has made the US the laughing stock of the world. He has allowed the US to become the most radioactive nation on earth, with over 8 million Covid cases, many of which are directly attributed to his polices, his ignorance, his willingness to ignore multiple warmings by experts, and his hubris. Granted, the rest can be linked to the world's highest levels of heart disease, diabetes, and morbid obesity, combined with a horrific American diet. 

 

Talk about egg in the face. After all the dismissal of it being a little flu, nothing to worry about, etc. Let us see how the cheeseburger Deleted is able to fight this one off. How many in the White House already have it? At a minimum, it derails his campaign, and makes him look incredibly dumb. He is not a healthy man. Just in the past year his steadiness and stamina seems to have declined remarkably. Notice how he is nearly always holding onto something, to keep himself propped up? Notice him becoming even less coherent than usual? I have. 

 

"I feel so powerful, I'll walk into that audience. I'll walk in there, I'll kiss everyone in that audience," Trump said in Sanford, Florida, showing his illness did not teach him to respect his own government's pandemic guidelines. "I'll kiss the guys and the beautiful women and the -- everybody. I'll just give everybody a big, fat kiss." Hold those kisses big boy. You are the last person on earth we want a kiss from. Even Melanie says NO WAY!!!!

 

With "Mr. I cannot make a deal to save my life" 7-11 points behind in the latest polls, republican senators and congressmen are starting to distance themselves from the train wreck they see coming. And there is nothing Trump can do at this stage, to arrest his stunning decline. Nothing. His rallies only make his supporters happy. And those 36% or so, of the electorate, are not going to win him an election. If he were smart, (which he demonstrates time and again, he is not) he would figure out a way to appeal to the suburban women. But, he cannot. He has no appeal to them anymore. So, he drones on and on during his rallies, and if anything he alienates more and more of the undecided voters.

There is an important thing to understand about the dynamics at play here. Every time the polls drop, those are HIS SUPPORTERS, who are defecting. That is all he has now. So many of his former supporters are put off by how unhinged, unstable, angry, incoherent, inarticulate, hateful, incompetent, and irrational he is. And his health appears to have been in decline, long before he caught Covid, and became a super spreader.

 

I predict a Biden win by 11 million votes, and 340 delegates. And a complete dismissal of Trump. You are out of here. Go into hiding, and a lifetime full of obscurity, irrelevance, and obscurity. See ya! 

 

[placeholder]

27 minutes ago, RPCVguy said:

Excellent graphics! To those who want to point fingers, I recommend considering the cultural divide of the USA politically and ideologically as evidenced in these two additional graphics.

 

The above shows TOTAL CASES since June
This next one shows both Cases and DEATHS,  but on a per capita basis (per 100,000 people in the state.)
The link to the interactive website for this 2nd graph is https://91-divoc.com/pages/covid-visualization/?chart=countries-normalized

As folks at the CDC have repeatedly and clearly explained, it can take several weeks before reports of all the deaths recorded at the state and lower levels make their way to the CDC.

With the result being that if you take an uninformed look at their data, it will always look like deaths are in decline.

Edited November 1, 2020 by placeholder

[Phoenix Rising]

2 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

 

I sincerely hope he gets voted out, prosecuted for his multiple crimes and spends his final miserable years in a jail cell. Anything else would be a travesty of justice.

[Phoenix Rising]

I wish there was a vaccine against stupid because that's surely needed.

 

US election poll: One in five believe Covid-19 is a ‘depopulation plan orchestrated by UN’ amid disturbing rise in conspiracy theories

[polpott]

4 minutes ago, Phoenix Rising said:

I wish there was a vaccine against stupid because that's surely needed.

 

US election poll: One in five believe Covid-19 is a ‘depopulation plan orchestrated by UN’ amid disturbing rise in conspiracy theories

90% of all conspiracy theories originated in the USA. What does that say about Americans?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

12 minutes ago, Phoenix Rising said:

I wish there was a vaccine against stupid because that's surely needed.

 

US election poll: One in five believe Covid-19 is a ‘depopulation plan orchestrated by UN’ amid disturbing rise in conspiracy theories

 

I believe that share is in the same neighborhood as the share that believe in QAnon conspiracy theory rubbish, most of them Trump Republicans.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tommybeer/2020/09/02/majority-of-republicans-believe-the-qanon-conspiracy-theory-is-partly-or-mostly-true-survey-finds/#6800a46d5231

 

Quote

Majority Of Republicans Believe The QAnon Conspiracy Theory Is Partly Or Mostly True, Survey Finds

 

Republicans being a minority (less than majority) party by registration in the U.S., and then just over half of them (56%) supposedly believe in QAnon... Gets you to a similar share of the overall population.

 

Quote

Only 4% of Democrats think the theory is even partly true, according to the Daily Kos/Civiqs poll, with 72% of Dems responding that the QAnon conspiracy is “not true at all.”

 

Edited November 1, 2020 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[stevenl]

19 minutes ago, Phoenix Rising said:

I wish there was a vaccine against stupid because that's surely needed.

 

US election poll: One in five believe Covid-19 is a ‘depopulation plan orchestrated by UN’ amid disturbing rise in conspiracy theories

Thanks for the link. The stupidity is incredible, tremendous.

[Emdog]

I don't have the numbers, but to paint Trump supporters as all uneducated yokels is just not true. Sorry well educated sort who might believe that sort of tribal nonsense.

I'm a liberal, detest Trump and do have a certain affection for facts.

I still have friends who are Trump supporters. One has Phd, others are uni grads.

Many reasons someone might have wanted Trump in 2016. How they can still want him is difficult to fathom, given his track record.

Fairly universal that Trump backers refuse to accept proven facts. Many won't listen to his speeches and rallies. Might give them too much cognitive dissonance.

Oh, and there are different kinds of intelligence. You could be expert on Punic wars but be clueless on how to do simple household repairs

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

30 minutes ago, Emdog said:

I don't have the numbers, but to paint Trump supporters as all uneducated yokels is just not true. Sorry well educated sort who might believe that sort of tribal nonsense.

 

I'm not addressing the specifics of your first sentence above. But research shows there definitely is an education level bias in Trump supporters vs Democrat supporters, at least in the 2016 presidential election.

 

Quote

Among Clinton voters, 43% were college graduates, compared with 29% of Trump voters. And while non-college whites made up a majority of Trump’s voters (63%), they constituted only about a quarter of Clinton’s (26%).

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2018/08/09/an-examination-of-the-2016-electorate-based-on-validated-voters/

 

 

[ChouDoufu]

7 hours ago, RoadWarrior371 said:

Pretty much spot-on.  You will notice the deaths per millions in the last 7 days is ~ 20 for UK and France, and 14 for the USA.  Meanwhile the US economy has suffered the least.  Things that make you go Hmm. 

 

but why should we settle for the least worst option?  you don't think we can do better than that?  why compare our death rates to other countries with high mortality rates?  yay!  among the losers, we're the winner!

 

why aren't we comparing ourselves to countries with the best stats - korea, japan, taiwan?  are our standards so low now?  is our new national slogan "america -- we're not the worst!"?  that doesn't sound the least bit maga to me.

 

why don't we look at, ummm, china where the virus is nearly non-existent?  sure, it's still there, but the spread has been stopped, and there are few fatalities.  they have testing and tracing, and immediate response to any outbreak.  you'll be happy to know the mask mandate has been dropped, citizens can travel freely, domestic tourism is booming, the factories are running, and the national gdp will be positive for the year.  so something works to control the virus.  what was it, and can we do it, too?

 

yes, i know they are evil communists, and their methods in their entirety won't work in a representative democracy.  still.....we could look at what is effective, and shirley find some aspects that could be added to our meager response. 

 

at this point the experts are just asking you to wear a mask, keep your distance especially indoors, wash your hands often, maybe conduct online schooling until the spread stops.  does the "freedom" to say no to that outweigh the deaths of half a million fellow citizens?

 

or heck, we could just give up, cause "it is what it is."

 

things that make you go hmmm.

[Jeffr2]

3 hours ago, placeholder said:

As folks at the CDC have repeatedly and clearly explained, it can take several weeks before reports of all the deaths recorded at the state and lower levels make their way to the CDC.

With the result being that if you take an uninformed look at their data, it will always look like deaths are in decline.

 

I think I've read that due to better care and more knowledge of the virus, there are less deaths.  Oh, and those getting sick now are younger.

 

3 hours ago, Phoenix Rising said:

I wish there was a vaccine against stupid because that's surely needed.

 

US election poll: One in five believe Covid-19 is a ‘depopulation plan orchestrated by UN’ amid disturbing rise in conspiracy theories

 

You should look at the YouTube videos of Trump supporters.  Incredible how stupid they are.  And most admit they only get news from OANN and Fox.  Jordan Klepper has some that will blow your mind.  Truly stupid people.

[sometimewoodworker]

14 hours ago, scammed said:

please elaborate what you mean with 'lately',

because you will need to hard core cherry picking

start date to make out a rising trend

It’s not difficult to claim a sharply falling trend if you go back to April 

a slightly falling trend from September 1st

a definitely rising trend from October 1st

 

 

all these data are the same it’s just the period that has changed

 

It is a virtual certainty that November will continue the sad increase.

The strait line is the trend line.

Edited November 1, 2020 by sometimewoodworker

[Fat is a type of crazy]

 

I think if you look at subsets of Trump supporters, and get down to those who attend the rallies, I am guessing the percentage of those that believe in conspiracy theories such as QANON, skyrockets.

That is why it is so irresponsible for Trump to bring the most easily influenced together and risk their lives in this way.

I am not saying all attendees are dumb*sses - just that a higher percentage than the general population are vulnerable to powerful, dominating, almost cult like influences of a Trump type person.

 

 

Edited November 1, 2020 by Fat is a type of crazy

[Dumbastheycome]

It appears the desperation level for Trump's supporters has started to result in red neck intimidation encouraged by Don Junior !

The ultimate disgrace the USA might yet suffer is a resumption of  Civil War in the midst of a pandemic !

That in itself means  keeping an eye on players who  might take advantage of the distraction . Not a lot of  winning  in the wind !

[Neeranam]

4 hours ago, Emdog said:

I don't have the numbers, but to paint Trump supporters as all uneducated yokels is just not true.

Arrogant and condescending, I'd say. 

[ChouDoufu]

1 hour ago, scammed said:

to count only the last week and state a trend from that

is the most preposterous of all

 

to cherry-pick a starting point to prove "it's just the flu, bruh" is the mostest preposteroustestest of all!

 

let's take the economy.  last quarter saw a 33% rise!  egads!  we're winning!  trump was right!  trade wars ARE fun and easy!  looks super awesome until you compare it to the 37% drop the previous quarter.  and of course percentages don't cancel each other out.  we'd need close to 50% increase to get us back to where we were.

 

we don't look as far back with virus statistics, because we're comparing apples to non-fruit things.  to look good, to claim "we've turned the corner," we'd have to go back to when the deaths were decreasing, at the end of the first wave.  start from the peak of the first wave, and gosh, we're doing just fine.  but we've entered a new cycle.

 

you want to compare time periods?  look at the increase in deaths near the beginning of the first wave, around mid-july.  with the increase in positives recently, expect to see that exponential rise in 7-10 days.

 

you think this is over?  oh, it's just getting started.