Non Imm O-A Visa application in home-country - Easy to meet health-insurance requirement

[CANSIAM]

3 hours ago, Flyfish said:

I am currently stuck in U.K. I have a valid non O visa with a re entry until 6dec 2021.

what are the options please for a return to Thailand?

thank you in advance for your assistance.  

I would suggest the O-A Visa application from your Embassy or the Elite Visa if money is not an issue..... 

[SunsetT]

39 minutes ago, CANSIAM said:

I would suggest the O-A Visa application from your Embassy or the Elite Visa if money is not an issue..... 

Unfortunately embassies do not deal with visa applications anymore. they must be made on an atrocious Thai website, thaievisa.go.th which provides no help or feedback if you get something wrong.

[TimBKK]

9 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

You incorrectly wrote TravelWing > correct name = SafetyWing - attached link to their website

> https://safetywing.com/nomad-insurance/?utm_expid=.O9f92zU7S9CnL_sdRe02ow.1&utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2F

Their travel-insurance package includes health-insurance coverage (accidents and illnesses) including covid-19 treatment.

You can subscribe to their policy for any period of your liking (1 year possible).  You pay per 4-weeks and can cancel the policy anytime.

Applicants subscribing to that policy have been approved for the CoE, as the policy fully meets the requirements.

For me, this is a really important point that I was unaware of.  A full year of Covid coverage (to cover the initial non O-A period of entry) - be it through the official Thai website or through inclusion in travel insurance - is expensive for an American who is at least 50.  If a Safety Wings policy is in fact sufficient for COE purposes it is definitely the cheapest way to go when combined with the LMG throwaway policy.

 

The decision then becomes a) throwaway policies strictly for visa processing purposes and self insurance for any legit medical issues that may arise or b) a more conventional policy that both meets visa needs and offers more coverage for medical issues - like the Pacific Cross policy linked above.  With a reasonable deductible this would be roughly $1200 USD per year (in my case).

[Jacques MERIDEUR]

Dear Peter Denis,

I am interested in applying for a Non Imm O-A Visa in my home-country, and very interested to receive a comprehensive  Guideline document with the options on how to meet the health-insurance requirement for such application.   

I am a French citizen, 72 years old, since the last 10 years I always had my retirement visa NON-O extented without any problem. The current extension is valid until the 18 of january 2021 and I have a multi entree until that date but I am blocked in France because holders of such visa are not allowed to re enter Thailand.

Can you, please, help me with a guideline and informations to get a NON – OA Retirement visa and of course a CoE from the Thai Embassy in Paris  

I sincerely thank you very much in advance for your kind assistance

Best regards,

Jacques Merideur

[farang51]

11 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

@JomtienExile > Yes, that policy indeed covers both the Non Imm O-A compliant requirement and the 100.000 US $ medical treatment in Thailand (including covid-19).

There are however two caveats:

1 - Cost is (much) higher than subscribing separately to the two suggested policies

2 - The covid-19 coverage would only start when you are already 15 days in Thailand

 

1 - You can get a policy that renews every six months; thus, making it possible to cancel it after six months; that way cutting the cost in half if only staying for six months.

 

2 - There is a waiting period from when you get the insurance which covers the world and not only Thailand. If you get the insurance 15 days before going to Thailand, it covers from when you land in Thailand.

 

One thing to know: If choosing an insurance with deductions, those deductions are for both the usual insurance and for the covid insurance. Thus, if choosing 300.000 baht deduction to make the insurance cheaper, it can be very expensive to get a fever while in quarantine.

Edited November 2, 2020 by farang51

[farang51]

13 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

2 - There exists also a 1-year MultipleEntry Non Imm O Visa, which is - despite its 1-year validity - also 'short-stay'.

You apply for the 1-year MultipleEntry Non Imm O Visa in your home-country (only available in some countries, and only for reason of Marriage)

In Denmark, you can get the Multientry Non Imm O based on retirement alone.

(http://thaiembassy.dk/retirement-visa-o-basic/)

Edited November 2, 2020 by farang51
Link added

[TimBKK]

2 hours ago, TimBKK said:

For me, this is a really important point that I was unaware of.  A full year of Covid coverage (to cover the initial non O-A period of entry) - be it through the official Thai website or through inclusion in travel insurance - is expensive for an American who is at least 50.  If a Safety Wings policy is in fact sufficient for COE purposes it is definitely the cheapest way to go when combined with the LMG throwaway policy.

 

The decision then becomes a) throwaway policies strictly for visa processing purposes and self insurance for any legit medical issues that may arise or b) a more conventional policy that both meets visa needs and offers more coverage for medical issues - like the Pacific Cross policy linked above.  With a reasonable deductible this would be roughly $1200 USD per year (in my case).

Per Safety Wings, if paying month by month the proof of coverage certificate will show a termination date (logically) at the end of that month.  How could that be sufficient for COE issuance?  You would have to pay upfront and in full if coverage for 6 months or one year is needed.

[CANSIAM]

8 hours ago, SunsetT said:

Unfortunately embassies do not deal with visa applications anymore. they must be made on an atrocious Thai website, thaievisa.go.th which provides no help or feedback if you get something wrong.

Thats very unfortunate, why ?  I just got a O-A visa from an Embassy in Canada 4 days ago, along with an already valid re-entry permit on a Non O retirement extension in PP. 

[a977]

On 11/1/2020 at 9:23 AM, DrJack54 said:

Another thing to add regarding non O (based on retirement) is that this option is not available in some countries. Two that come to mind are USA and AU.

 

If AU is meant to be Australia, then I'm sorry you are wrong. I got a Non O in 2015 in Perth Australia

[ubonjoe]

29 minutes ago, a977 said:

I got a Non O in 2015 in Perth Australia

That is not now. Changed in 2016 or so.

[DrJack54]

1 hour ago, a977 said:

If AU is meant to be Australia, then I'm sorry you are wrong. I got a Non O in 2015 in Perth Australia

Yes changed some years ago.

BTW ......There are two common abbreviations of Australia: Au. and AU. Since Australia is a singular, proper noun, it cannot be pluralized

[Peter Denis]

6 hours ago, farang51 said:

In Denmark, you can get the Multientry Non Imm O based on retirement alone.

(http://thaiembassy.dk/retirement-visa-o-basic/)

Thanks for the info!

Denmark is then one of the very few countries I know of where you can still apply at the Thai Embassy for the 1-year MultipleEntry Non Imm O Visa for reason of retirement.

You can also still apply for that rare Visa at the Savannakhet Consulate.

NOTE: With the current Thai entry-restrictions you would need to be married to a Thai national or have Thai dependent children (which makes you eligible for the CoE) in order to be able to enter Thailand with such Non Imm O Visa.

Edited November 3, 2020 by Peter Denis

[Peter Denis]

5 hours ago, TimBKK said:

Per Safety Wings, if paying month by month the proof of coverage certificate will show a termination date (logically) at the end of that month.  How could that be sufficient for COE issuance?  You would have to pay upfront and in full if coverage for 6 months or one year is needed.

Yes, I initially also wondered about that.  But you can subscribe to their covid-19 inclusive travel-insurance package for the period of your choice (up to 1 year).  But you will get billed 4-weekly (kind of like a subscription service), and this also allows you to simply cancel the policy.  

That's a very advantageous feature, because after 4-weeks in covid-free Thailand, there is as good as no need for that specific coverage anymore.  But obviously you can continue paying the 4-weekly premiums if you wish to do so, as their accident/insurance coverage is quite generous and hence worthwhile if you are not already covered for that with your regular insurance (that does not cover covid-19). 

[Peter Denis]

6 hours ago, farang51 said:

 

1 - You can get a policy that renews every six months; thus, making it possible to cancel it after six months; that way cutting the cost in half if only staying for six months.

 

2 - There is a waiting period from when you get the insurance which covers the world and not only Thailand. If you get the insurance 15 days before going to Thailand, it covers from when you land in Thailand.

 

One thing to know: If choosing an insurance with deductions, those deductions are for both the usual insurance and for the covid insurance. Thus, if choosing 300.000 baht deduction to make the insurance cheaper, it can be very expensive to get a fever while in quarantine.

Thanks for your message.

However, I am not 100% sure whether #2 is fully correct, as the remarks in 'fine print' on the PacificCross VisaFriendly web-page are somewhat ambiguous...

5 - Period of insurance is effective when the insured arrive Thailand and pass the immigration process for “entry” or on the effective date as stated in the policy, whenever it happens “after”.

6 - Waiting period 15 days for Covid-19, 30 days for illness, and 120 days for tumor, cysts, cancer, hemorrhoids, hernia, cataracts or pteygium, tonsillectomy or adenoidectomy, calcification, variose veins, endometriosis

[Peter Denis]

17 hours ago, Flyfish said:

I am currently stuck in U.K. I have a valid non O visa with a re entry until 6dec 2021.

what are the options please for a return to Thailand?

thank you in advance for your assistance.  

The valid permission to stay (protected by a Re-Entry Permit) based on your Non Imm O Visa, would ONLY be accepted when you are married to a Thai national or have Thai dependent children (as those conditions would make you eligible for the CoE). 

If not married, your only feasible option is to apply for the Non Imm O-A Visa.  To apply for that Visa you need to be +50 years of age and provide evidence of sufficient funds on a foreign and/or Thai bank-account (as well as some other requirements of a more admin nature like a police clearance).

Once you have the Non Imm O-A Visa you can then apply for the CoE, which requires a.o. a 100.000 US $ coverage policy for medical treatment in Thailand (including covid-19 treatment).  

>> I did PM you a guideline document on how to meet the IO-approved health-insurance requirement when applying for the Non Imm O-A Visa.

To access your PM-messages just click the letter-icon next to your Profile when logged in to the Forum.

Edited November 3, 2020 by Peter Denis

[Peter Denis]

8 hours ago, Jacques MERIDEUR said:

...

I am interested in applying for a Non Imm O-A Visa in my home-country, and very interested to receive a comprehensive  Guideline document with the options on how to meet the health-insurance requirement for such application.   

I am a French citizen, 72 years old, since the last 10 years I always had my retirement visa NON-O extented without any problem. The current extension is valid until the 18 of january 2021 and I have a multi entree until that date but I am blocked in France because holders of such visa are not allowed to re enter Thailand.

Can you, please, help me with a guideline and informations to get a NON – OA Retirement visa and of course a CoE from the Thai Embassy in Paris  

...

Hi Jacques,

I did PM you the requested Guideline document on how to meet the mandatory IO-approved health-insurance requirement when applying for the Non Imm O-A Visa in your home-country.

When you are not married to a Thai national (or have Thai dependent children) your still valid permission to stay (protected by a Re-Entry Permit) based on your Non Imm O Visa, will currently NOT be eligible for re-entering Thailand.

But you will be able to re-enter Thailand on a Non Imm O-A Visa.

 

To meet the CoE criteria you would also need a 100.000 US $ coverage of medical treatment in TH health-insurance policy including covid-19 treatment.  At your age (72) you would not be eligible for the SafetyWing travel-insurance that provides such coverage at very affordable premiums.  So I would recommend you look for other travel- or health-insurance that would meet that requirement.  In case you do not find fitting insurance for those specific requirements you could subscribe to a TGIA covid-19 only insurance, which has no age limitation to subscribe to it > https://covid19.tgia.org/

Note that although it does not meet the 100.000 US $ medical treatment in Thailand requirement as mentioned on the Thai Embassy websites, according to UbonJoe that covid-19 only insurance is accepted by the Thai Embassies for a CoE application.

 

[farang51]

1 hour ago, Peter Denis said:

Denmark is then one of the very few countries I know of where you can still apply at the Thai Embassy for the 1-year MultipleEntry Non Imm O Visa for reason of retirement.

 

NOTE: With the current Thai entry-restrictions you would need to be married to a Thai national or have Thai dependent children (which makes you eligible for the CoE) in order to be able to enter Thailand with such Non Imm O Visa.

Correct, they do not issue it at the moment. I had the choice between the Tourist Visa (60+30 days) or the new STV, I went for the STV because I want to stay 6 months.

[farang51]

1 hour ago, Peter Denis said:

Thanks for your message.

However, I am not 100% sure whether #2 is fully correct, as the remarks in 'fine print' on the PacificCross VisaFriendly web-page are somewhat ambiguous...

5 - Period of insurance is effective when the insured arrive Thailand and pass the immigration process for “entry” or on the effective date as stated in the policy, whenever it happens “after”.

6 - Waiting period 15 days for Covid-19, 30 days for illness, and 120 days for tumor, cysts, cancer, hemorrhoids, hernia, cataracts or pteygium, tonsillectomy or adenoidectomy, calcification, variose veins, endometriosis

I asked Pacific Cross:
 

Quote

 

The waiting period for the covid insurance is 15 days, does that mean that if one takes out the insurance 15 days before travelling, it covers from day 1 in Thailand?

 

Are the deductions for both the healthcare part and for the covid insurance or only for the healthcare part?

 

and got this answer:

Quote

In answer to your questions, COVID coverage starts once you arrive in Thailand. The deductible will work on all parts of the plan.

LMG was a bit slow; thus I chose Pacific Cross. I ended up paying around 18.000 baht which is for 6 months and with a 300.000 baht deductible. Thus, clearly more expensive than LMG; however, they cover they world (not that I need it) and not only Thailand.

 

Added: I recommend the TIP Insurance for covid instead of coverage with deductibles. A false positive test or a fever while in quarantine can be very expensive with deductibles.

Edited November 3, 2020 by farang51

[Bogbrush]

If you have an OA and are in Thailand and due for extension in a few weeks, is the Covid-19 insurance necessary in addition to the 400 000/40 000 cover or is it only applicable to those entering now?

[jacko45k]

16 minutes ago, Bogbrush said:

If you have an OA and are in Thailand and due for extension in a few weeks, is the Covid-19 insurance necessary in addition to the 400 000/40 000 cover or is it only applicable to those entering now?

Only required to travel here.

[Peter Denis]

12 minutes ago, Bogbrush said:

If you have an OA and are in Thailand and due for extension in a few weeks, is the Covid-19 insurance necessary in addition to the 400 000/40 000 cover or is it only applicable to those entering now?

The mandatory insurance with 100.000 US $ coverage of medical treatment in Thailand (including covid-19) is ONLY applicable for those currently abroad and applying for a CoE (certificate of entry), which is now required from everybody wanting to re-enter Thailand.

So not required when already in Thailand.

The only mandatory insurance when already in Thailand is the Thai IO-approved health-insurance provided by a TGIA-associated insurer, when applying for the 1-year extension of stay based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

[federicoP]

3 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

Hi Jacques,

I did PM you the requested Guideline document on how to meet the mandatory IO-approved health-insurance requirement when applying for the Non Imm O-A Visa in your home-country.....

 

I am in the exact same situation fo Jacqes (age, O visa for retiremt expiring...) he only difference is that I am from Italy.
 

Regarding health insurance I aready have a good coverage from a mutual organization (Italian Industry Manager), so will choose for shure the LMG.

 

Regarding the 100.000 dollar covid coverage, the TGIA is asking me, because I am from Italy, but from France or USA is the same) 43.200 baht per year.

For the moment I found LUMA that, until the age of 74, asks 34.000 baht per year or 20.000 baht for six months.

 

Of course, if Peter would be so kind to send also to me his Guideline document for tha O-A visa I will be grateful, and more than happy !!!!

By the way, I see than to issue the O-A visa the Thai Embassy in Rome asks also a medica certificat confirming that I am not affected by leprosy, elephantiasis and third step of syphilis. I wonder if it is the same all over the world or it is only the Embassy in Italy that is so cautious..... ????

[Sheryl]

1 minute ago, federicoP said:

I am in the exact same situation fo Jacqes (age, O visa for retiremt expiring...) he only difference is that I am from Italy.
 

Regarding health insurance I aready have a good coverage from a mutual organization (Italian Industry Manager), so will choose for shure the LMG.

 

Regarding the 100.000 dollar covid coverage, the TGIA is asking me, because I am from Italy, but from France or USA is the same) 43.200 baht per year.

For the moment I found LUMA that, until the age of 74, asks 34.000 baht per year or 20.000 baht for six months.

 

Of course, if Peter would be so kind to send also to me his Guideline document for tha O-A visa I will be grateful, and more than happy !!!!

By the way, I see than to issue the O-A visa the Thai Embassy in Rome asks also a medica certificat confirming that I am not affected by leprosy, elephantiasis and third step of syphilis. I wonder if it is the same all over the world or it is only the Embassy in Italy that is so cautious..... ????

It is everywhere, this is standard Thai govt health certificate (as bizarre as it is).

 

Re COVID insurance if you can get written confirmation from your Italian insurance that it will cover you in Thailand for COVID you should  not need a separate COVID policy.

 

For that matter, if your Italian insurance will sign the "overseas insurance certificate" you ca use it to meet the O-A requirement as well - but only for issuance of the initial visa, nto for incountry extension.

[Peter Denis]

5 minutes ago, federicoP said:

I am in the exact same situation as Jacques (age, O visa for retirement expiring...) the only difference is that I am from Italy.

...

Of course, if Peter would be so kind to send also to me his Guideline document for tha O-A visa I will be grateful, and more than happy !!!!

...

> Hi Federico, I did PM you the requested Guideline document (as well as some other info of relevance).

To access your PM-messages just click the letter-icon next to your profile when logged in to the Forum.

[federicoP]

34 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Re COVID insurance if you can get written confirmation from your Italian insurance that it will cover you in Thailand for COVID you should  not need a separate COVID policy.

 

For that matter, if your Italian insurance will sign the "overseas insurance certificate" you ca use it to meet the O-A requirement as well - but only for issuance of the initial visa, nto for incountry extension.

Thanks Sheryl, unfortunately it is not an Insurance Company, but a mutual organization between the managers and ex-managers of the italian industries. It gives a good coverage, also if not 100%, has no upper limit for the expenses and will escort me for my entire life, but it is not an insurance and almost will not sign the infamous thai papers.
But, anyway, I'll try  !!!

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, federicoP said:

Thanks Sheryl, unfortunately it is not an Insurance Company, but a mutual organization between the managers and ex-managers of the italian industries. It gives a good coverage, also if not 100%, has no upper limit for the expenses and will escort me for my entire life, but it is not an insurance and almost will not sign the infamous thai papers.
But, anyway, I'll try  !!!

Doesn't matter that not a private insurance company.

 

But you would need the certificate to use it for O-A. And you'll need the letter re COVID to use it for that.

[EVENKEEL]

4 hours ago, federicoP said:

I am in the exact same situation fo Jacqes (age, O visa for retiremt expiring...) he only difference is that I am from Italy.
 

Regarding health insurance I aready have a good coverage from a mutual organization (Italian Industry Manager), so will choose for shure the LMG.

 

Regarding the 100.000 dollar covid coverage, the TGIA is asking me, because I am from Italy, but from France or USA is the same) 43.200 baht per year.

For the moment I found LUMA that, until the age of 74, asks 34.000 baht per year or 20.000 baht for six months.

 

Of course, if Peter would be so kind to send also to me his Guideline document for tha O-A visa I will be grateful, and more than happy !!!!

By the way, I see than to issue the O-A visa the Thai Embassy in Rome asks also a medica certificat confirming that I am not affected by leprosy, elephantiasis and third step of syphilis. I wonder if it is the same all over the world or it is only the Embassy in Italy that is so cautious..... ????

Same in the USA, my Doc thought that was a bit funny.

[Piscis]

Today i received the insurance confirmation from LMG for the mandatory Non O A required health insurance. 

The process took about 4-5 working days. I applied last week tuesday evening european time. Very fast response from Miss Kannika within hours. 

Then a few days waiting for final approval.

 

Thanks again Peter for your help!

 

John 

 

[TimBKK]

10 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

Yes, I initially also wondered about that.  But you can subscribe to their covid-19 inclusive travel-insurance package for the period of your choice (up to 1 year).  But you will get billed 4-weekly (kind of like a subscription service), and this also allows you to simply cancel the policy.  

That's a very advantageous feature, because after 4-weeks in covid-free Thailand, there is as good as no need for that specific coverage anymore.  But obviously you can continue paying the 4-weekly premiums if you wish to do so, as their accident/insurance coverage is quite generous and hence worthwhile if you are not already covered for that with your regular insurance (that does not cover covid-19). 

I presume the Thai embassy that will issue a COE will require Covid insurance for the duration of the visa, lets say 1 year for a Non O-A (please correct me if I am wrong, though).
 

A Safety Wings fixed term policy for 1 year requires full payment up front for the entire year, at least from what they tell me by email.

 

If you choose the subscription-style plan (month by month payment) the certificate of coverage will only indicate the period for which you've paid - one month.

 

Not sure this will work as an option for the cheapest Covid coverage for long stay visa purposes, unless I am missing something.

[Andrew Dwyer]

As is usual from Peter Denis this thread gives the reader the exact details and information required for anyone interested in changing to an OA or stuck outside with their O visa and unable to travel back to Thailand .

 

I, myself, have an OA extension based on retirement and was very close to killing that , due to the mandatory health insurance ruling, and getting myself a SE non imm O visa at a Thai consulate in the U.K. back in March ...... well, no prizes for guessing why that didn’t happen ????

 

So, September this year I was in need of the insurance to renew my extension and with the help of Peter’s guidelines, and 6000 baht lighter  , I obtained the LMG “ El Cheapo “ insurance and gained the tranquility of another 12 months stay in LOS.

 

Ironically 12 months ago the O visa extension holders ( some ) were gloating that they were exempt from the insurance scam and claiming the upper hand , now, those stuck outside of Thailand with an O visa extension are being held to ransom while the OA visa is a passport back to LOS ???? 

 

My dear old gran used to say “ god works in mysterious ways “  ... if she was alive today she would probably add “ but not as mysterious as Thai immigration “ !!!