UK had 'one or two' Brexit teething issues on fishing, minister says

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20 minutes ago, Nout said:

No politicians tell the truth all the time. The alternative to BJ was that woke, marxist Jeremy Corbin. 

Very few with such abandon as Johnson. The one elected politician who could top him has been voted out of office.

[elliss]

On 2/9/2021 at 5:51 PM, paddypower said:

one or two teething problems? exports to the EU are down 68% for January. send in the clowns.....oh no!! they're here.

 

 

   Teething problems ..

   Uk .will be toothless , sooner than expected ..

[CG1 Blue]

5 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

Yet again you have made a fool of yourself by not reading the report in a link in it's entirety before commenting. Had you done so you would have seen that it referred, and linked, to two separate reports produced by Rand themselves.

 

Even though you obviously could not be bothered to read the actual Rand report (too much like hard work for you?), the opening phrase of my quote of the final paragraph should have been enough to show you that the report from the Centre for European Reform was in addition to their own analysis!

 

I'll repeat it "Our analysis—and that of others"

 

Yet again you are disputing these various estimates; so where are your alternative figures?

Ok, I looked at the Rand report. That's also full of speculation and guesswork. The only useful thing they point out is that the prolonged negotiations caused uncertainty, which naturally  hampered investment. And we can thank the remainers in Parliament for that - for dragging it out for as long as possible in the desperate hope they could overturn the referendum result. 

 

[7by7]

2 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

Ok, I looked at the Rand report

Better late than never!

 

Maybe in future you'll read reports and articles before commenting on them?

 

2 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

That's also full of speculation and guesswork

Estimates based upon analysis and expertise in the subject.

 

Yet again you dismiss evidence which you don't care for without producing any evidence to support your view.

 

Why is that? Could it be because such evidence does not exist?

 

2 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

The only useful thing they point out is that the prolonged negotiations caused uncertainty, which naturally  hampered investment. And we can thank the remainers in Parliament for that - for dragging it out for as long as possible in the desperate hope they could overturn the referendum result. 

The tired, old Brexiteer fall back when losing an argument of blaming all our woes on the previous Parliament!

 

Brexiteers say that May was a Remainer and that her proposed withdrawal agreement was BRINO (Brexit in name only) which would have effectively kept us tied to the EU as if still a member.

 

Brexiteers also say that the Parliament which voted down that agreement three times was a Remainer Parliament which wanted to keep us tied to the EU as if still a member.

 

So, according to Brexiteers, a Remainer Parliament voted down a Remainer agreement!

[CG1 Blue]

3 hours ago, 7by7 said:

Better late than never!

 

Maybe in future you'll read reports and articles before commenting on them?

 

Estimates based upon analysis and expertise in the subject.

 

Yet again you dismiss evidence which you don't care for without producing any evidence to support your view.

 

Why is that? Could it be because such evidence does not exist?

 

The tired, old Brexiteer fall back when losing an argument of blaming all our woes on the previous Parliament!

 

Brexiteers say that May was a Remainer and that her proposed withdrawal agreement was BRINO (Brexit in name only) which would have effectively kept us tied to the EU as if still a member.

 

Brexiteers also say that the Parliament which voted down that agreement three times was a Remainer Parliament which wanted to keep us tied to the EU as if still a member.

 

So, according to Brexiteers, a Remainer Parliament voted down a Remainer agreement!

It's nice to see you rattled again. 

I'm not the one posting reports without any hard evidence claiming Brexit has caused catastrophic damage to our GDP. I don't need to provide evidence. If I'd have claimed Brexit has taken our economy from strength to strength, then you could ask me to prove it. But most intelligent people know the real effect of Brexit will be seen over the coming years. 

[Hi from France]

2 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

I'm not the one posting reports without any hard evidence claiming Brexit has caused catastrophic damage to our GDP. 

"catastrophic" is subjectives (at best) 

 

So

 

instead of "catastrophic", source what precisely is the % of GDP "damage" and the value you recognize? 

 

AFAIK there are very serious studies about 2016-2019, comparing the evolution of UK's GdP with neighbors, as well as projections for the future.

 

.

 

 

Edited February 21, 2021 by Hi from France

[katana]

...

Edited February 21, 2021 by katana

[Tofer]

17 hours ago, 7by7 said:

Only when you provide evidence to back up your assumption.

 

Standard response we can expect from you, when you've lost an argument.

 

Have you not heard of the EU's Covid recovery fund, a shared loan in contradiction of the EU rules by the way, which all EU states will be paying into for the next how many years, whether they like it or not!

Edited February 22, 2021 by Tofer

[Sujo]

2 minutes ago, Tofer said:

 

Standard response we can expect from you, when you've lost an argument.

He provided evidence to back up his claim. 

[Tofer]

17 hours ago, candide said:

So, what is exactly the imaginary contradiction you are seeing between these two assertions?

(1) decisions (not to join the vaccine program, to grant emergency authorisation for a vaccine) have been made and implemented in accordance with EU law

Meaning: there was no EU law preventing UK to do so (in case you did not understand)

And (2) the joint program is not a law

Meaning: there was no legal obligation to join the vaccine program, as it is not a law. The choice was made in accordance with EU law, which did not forbid UK to do so.

 

If you say so...

 

Quite frankly I'm getting bored with all this crowing and negativity. As one of your supporters said - we've left, it's over, done with, finished. Don't you think it's time to quit your churlish mithering and get on with life. 

 

What exactly do you hope to achieve by cheering the temporary set backs, besides perpetuating your own misery... In fact I find the original post little better than trolling click bait.

[Sujo]

3 minutes ago, Tofer said:

 

If you say so...

 

Quite frankly I'm getting bored with all this crowing and negativity. As one of your supporters said - we've left, it's over, done with, finished. Don't you think it's time to quit your churlish mithering and get on with life. 

 

What exactly do you hope to achieve by cheering the temporary set backs, besides perpetuating your own misery... In fact I find the original post little better than trolling click bait.

Facts matter.

[Tofer]

17 hours ago, 7by7 said:

All working for and to support the NHS!

 

Utter rubbish!

 

The Army and the private care workers do not work for the health service. Yes they are currently supporting the effort, but that is completely different to ""working for""....

 

17 hours ago, 7by7 said:

So a minister in the Health Department is in charge, with the Health Secretary, along with the Prime Minister, having overall responsibility.

 

As your quotation noted ""working with"", ergo not the same department.

 

17 hours ago, 7by7 said:

The reasons for the EU members deciding on a unified approach rather than following the UK's lead are complex

 

Nice dodge.... ????

 

17 hours ago, 7by7 said:

But at the end of the day whilst the UK's programme started on the 8th December, that in most EU (and EEA) member's started on the 26th December.

 

Resulting in serious delays to procurement, with a delay in orders of 3 months, plus the consequential delay in supply, since they are not at the front of the queue...

 

17 hours ago, 7by7 said:

How many extra deaths that resulted in is impossible to calculate, but you seem to have forgotten, if you ever knew, that the UK's death rate is the third highest in the world. (Source) I am, of course, aware that the two countries above us are EU members; but that means the other 25 members have fared better than us.

 

Yes, impossible to calculate. But you cannot deny they will be suffering the consequences of the above noted delays longer than the UK.

 

As I've just said in my previous post, it's high time you got over it and got behind your country, show a bit of British spirit, grow a backbone, instead of constantly crying / crowing over a situation that you cannot change. What exactly do you hope to achieve with all your pessimism and negativity, besides an an adolescent dig of 'I told you so'? Rubbing your hands together and cheering temporary, short term disruptions is, at best, rather disingenuous and very short sighted. Wars are not won in a day, but then, being a conscientious objector, you wouldn't know....

[Tofer]

17 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Oh did you not get to go to the pub?

 

There aren't any "pubs" in Nong Khai!! Unless you count those grubby little 'bars' with ageing hookers down a tiny soi in town.....????. There was more life there 35 years ago, than there is now....

 

17 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Shame really. I had a ball.

 

Whatever floats your boat......

 

[bannork]

2 hours ago, Tofer said:

 

Utter rubbish!

 

The Army and the private care workers do not work for the health service. Yes they are currently supporting the effort, but that is completely different to ""working for""....

 

 

As your quotation noted ""working with"", ergo not the same department.

 

 

Nice dodge.... ????

 

 

Resulting in serious delays to procurement, with a delay in orders of 3 months, plus the consequential delay in supply, since they are not at the front of the queue...

 

 

Yes, impossible to calculate. But you cannot deny they will be suffering the consequences of the above noted delays longer than the UK.

 

As I've just said in my previous post, it's high time you got over it and got behind your country, show a bit of British spirit, grow a backbone, instead of constantly crying / crowing over a situation that you cannot change. What exactly do you hope to achieve with all your pessimism and negativity, besides an an adolescent dig of 'I told you so'? Rubbing your hands together and cheering temporary, short term disruptions is, at best, rather disingenuous and very short sighted. Wars are not won in a day, but then, being a conscientious objector, you wouldn't know....

Posters have said before, don't mention the war. You Brexiteers had better get used to hearing bad economic  news due to Brexit because it's only just begun.

And it's not over, we'll be back in the Customs Union and Single Market by popular demand before too long.

Johnson will try to diverge from EU standards but the more he does that, the more tariffs will be imposed on UK exports to the EU. 

Are you in Nong Khai Tofer? If you want to meet a fellow Brexiteer, I suggest you visit the recently opened restaurant by Brian and his Thai wife just along from the Vietnamese restaurant on the promenade. 

[Tofer]

23 minutes ago, bannork said:

Posters have said before, don't mention the war. You

 

Which war was that? My reference was in the plural, i.e. none specific - "wars".

 

26 minutes ago, bannork said:

And it's not over, we'll be back in the Customs Union and Single Market by popular demand before too long.

 

????????????

 

Are you forgetting, it was popular demand that got us out in the first place.... Or do those people not fit into your equation?

 

27 minutes ago, bannork said:

Are you in Nong Khai Tofer? If you want to meet a fellow Brexiteer, I suggest you visit the recently opened restaurant by Brian and his Thai wife just along from the Vietnamese restaurant on the promenade. 

 

No, although I appreciate the directions to meet someone with some bottle, when I do find myself in that area again.

 

 

[Tofer]

16 hours ago, elliss said:

Uk .will be toothless , sooner than expected ..

 

At least they still have a backbone....

[candide]

3 hours ago, Tofer said:

 

If you say so...

 

Quite frankly I'm getting bored with all this crowing and negativity. As one of your supporters said - we've left, it's over, done with, finished. Don't you think it's time to quit your churlish mithering and get on with life. 

 

What exactly do you hope to achieve by cheering the temporary set backs, besides perpetuating your own misery... In fact I find the original post little better than trolling click bait.

Lame attempt at deflection.

You made a precise claim, I have shown it is contradicted by facts.

 

Start by making accurate claims, and you will not be bored any more by the "negativity" of the replies you get.

[CG1 Blue]

9 hours ago, Hi from France said:

"catastrophic" is subjectives (at best) 

 

So

 

instead of "catastrophic", source what precisely is the % of GDP "damage" and the value you recognize? 

 

AFAIK there are very serious studies about 2016-2019, comparing the evolution of UK's GdP with neighbors, as well as projections for the future.

 

.

 

 

How is the GBP doing since we ended the transition period and properly left the EU? It's up at 1.40 to the USD and 1.15 to the EUR now. So the currency markets disagree with all your negativity

 

 

 

Edited February 22, 2021 by CG1 Blue

[Rookiescot]

20 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

How is the GBP doing since we ended the transition period and properly left the EU? It's up at 1.40 to the USD and 1.15 to the EUR now. So the currency markets disagree with all your negativity

 

 

 

 

Did you agree with the money markets when the pound lost 15% of its value immediately after the referendum result was known?

[Tofer]

1 hour ago, candide said:

Start by making accurate claims, and you will not be bored any more by the "negativity" of the replies you get.

 

It's not the replies to my posts I'm bored with, it's the general attitude of the remainers.

 

It's time they all got used to the idea, and stop pining for the past. there's no mileage in the blame / point scoring game, and neither is it clever... 

[Tofer]

3 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Did you agree with the money markets when the pound lost 15% of its value immediately after the referendum result was known?

 

As has been proven, by the current resurgence of the pound, that had nothing to do with your negative perceptions of Brexit. Money markets don't like uncertainty... 

[Rookiescot]

22 minutes ago, Tofer said:

 

As has been proven, by the current resurgence of the pound, that had nothing to do with your negative perceptions of Brexit. Money markets don't like uncertainty... 

 

So it has immediately risen to Brexit levels has it?

You guys are glorifying a slight rise and ignoring the fact it is still at least 10% down on its value the day before the referendum.

Suddenly the experts in the money markets are to be believed again when you guys have spent the last 5 years telling us "What do experts know?" and "Its just speculators".

 

 

[candide]

1 hour ago, CG1 Blue said:

How is the GBP doing since we ended the transition period and properly left the EU? It's up at 1.40 to the USD and 1.15 to the EUR now. So the currency markets disagree with all your negativity

 

 

 

It may be the start of a big rise, but it's not likely. It seems to be one of the usual limited scale variations since the big decrease after Brexit vote.

[bannork]

4 hours ago, Tofer said:

 

Which war was that? My reference was in the plural, i.e. none specific - "wars".

 

 

????????????

 

Are you forgetting, it was popular demand that got us out in the first place.... Or do those people not fit into your equation?

 

 

No, although I appreciate the directions to meet someone with some bottle, when I do find myself in that area again.

 

 

Brian is what you call dense.

[7by7]

14 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

It's nice to see you rattled again. 

I'm not the one posting reports without any hard evidence claiming Brexit has caused catastrophic damage to our GDP. I don't need to provide evidence. If I'd have claimed Brexit has taken our economy from strength to strength, then you could ask me to prove it. But most intelligent people know the real effect of Brexit will be seen over the coming years. 

 

The evidence provided by myself and others comes from Bloomberg, Rand, etc. who have produced their reports based upon the available historical evidence and made projections based upon that evidence and their professional, educated assumptions of what may happen.

 

I asked you for alternative figures to support your view. Your previous ignoring of that request and now your response quoted above only serve to prove that you have either not bothered to try and find any or, more likely in my opinion, desperately searched for some but failed to come up with anything.

 

You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but simply saying that you don't like the figures therefore they are wrong proves nothing except your blind faith in Boris Johnson's Brexit.

[7by7]

8 hours ago, Tofer said:

 

Standard response we can expect from you, when you've lost an argument.

 

Have you not heard of the EU's Covid recovery fund, a shared loan in contradiction of the EU rules by the way, which all EU states will be paying into for the next how many years, whether they like it or not!

Your actual assumption was 

On 2/21/2021 at 1:47 AM, Tofer said:

I doubt any EU state that decided to go it's own way would have received any support for the funding of the vaccines, hence they all fell in line with the UvdL's commissions directive, since they will be paying for the Covid fund for many years to come either way.

 

The assumption being "I doubt any EU state that decided to go it's own way would have received any support for the funding of the vaccines."

 

You have provided no evidence in support of that assumption. Repeating the line about the recovery fund is not such evidence.

 

Can you point me to the part of the EU rules which support your statement that the Covid recovery fund is "in contradiction of the EU rules" please. I can't find it.

 

Poland and Hungary both challenged a clause in the entire budget, not just the Covid recovery fund, which tied funding with adherence to the rule of law. A compromise was reached, which both countries agreed to. However, they, or any other member, could still challenge it in the European Court. 

 

The latest I can find on this comes from the 11th December.

 

EU breaks deadlock over €1.8tn budget and Covid-recovery fund

Quote

However, the legality of the compromise deal can now be challenged by a member state in the European Court of Justice.

"We of course will do this... we are convinced this needs to be checked," Polish Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki told Poland's TVP television.

 

EU leaders unblock budget in deal with Hungary and Poland

Quote

The use of the new tool will likely be delayed as leaders also agreed that any sanctions process could only be triggered by the EU Commission once the European Court of Justice (ECJ) rules on the new mechanism.

And the ECJ ruling is likely to come into play, when the new model is challenged in court by Hungary and Poland.

 

I can find nothing to say that anyone has yet challenged this deal in court.

[7by7]

8 hours ago, Tofer said:

<snip>

In fact I find the original post little better than trolling click bait.

 

Why have you, according to the "TOP POSTERS IN THIS TOPIC" side panel, so far made 45 posts in response to "Trolling click bait? More than double any one else! 

 

If you consider the OP to be "trolling click bait" shouldn't you report this to the mods for them to rule?

[elliss]

5 hours ago, Tofer said:

 

At least they still have a backbone....

 

Wow .  You have a good memory ..

  Would that be , World War one , World war Two ?...

[elliss]

2 minutes ago, elliss said:

 

Wow .  You have a good memory ..

  Would that be , World War one , World war Two ?...

 

Opps . 

 Sorry I fell for his trolling bait ...555

[elliss]

3 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

 

 

Did you agree with the money markets when the pound lost 15% of its value immediately after the referendum result was known?

 

     Would be interesting to how  the money markets , 

     react to Bitcoin / cyber currency ..

    Probably out of their IQ . parameters ..

    Stay safe . Nationwide offer . sweet nothing , on long term investors..