Dr Seuss rockets up US charts after books pulled over racist portrayals

[Sujo]

6 hours ago, skorp13 said:

His books never hurt anyone of made anyone a racist. I used to read them as a kid and i read them to my kid. Just over sensitive left nonsense. i believe they have much bigger things to worry about than Dr. Seuss books.  Just another ploy in their cancel culture society

who is they? It was a decision by the company alone. So 'they' have no bigger things to worry about.

[Sujo]

6 hours ago, BobBKK said:

Cancel Culture make me PUKE - how about banning Snow White? (wrong colour) or Prince Charming (wrong gender) or Puss-In-Boots (hurtful to dogs)

 

its PATHETIC and I'm waiting for the world to wake up from this woke, boring BS by a very small minority who seek to control us all

So you have issues with the company that decided what it wanted for itself.

[tifino]

at least Asterix & Obelix hasn't been reproached... 

[Airalee]

12 minutes ago, Sujo said:

So you have issues with the company that decided what it wanted for itself.

 

 

14 minutes ago, Sujo said:

who is they? It was a decision by the company alone. So 'they' have no bigger things to worry about.

From the NYTimes...

 

“Mr. Geisel’s stories are loved by fans for their rhymes and fantastical characters but also for their positive values, like taking responsibility for the planet. But in recent years, critics have said some of his work was racist and presented harmful depictions of certain groups.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/02/books/dr-seuss-mulberry-street.html

 

 

Sounds like pressure from the outside to me.

 

[J Town]

39 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

2 hours ago, Benmart said:

The test of time is written and rewritten until those who wrote it are written out of it as being out of step with the latest test, rewrite.

Not true. Not even close to being true. 

Tom Sawyer & Huckleberry Finn have taken hits for decades and are still standing in their original format.

[jesimps]

20 hours ago, Solinvictus said:

As a progressive, I'm disgusted with these liberals and their petty gender issues. Overall, I consider it an infringement on personal liberties. They cancel Mr. Potato head and trying to pass legislature in Cali to have stores be particular how they stock toys.

 

But lastly, I do also think it's done by both parties to keep the country divided.

There's only one party supports rubbish like this, the raving loony Democrats.

[chilli42]

One survey after another demonstrates that the majority of US citizens, be they from the left or right, are “uncomfortable” with the cancel culture and the extreme right progressives.  They are sitting back and watching this happen as they don’t know what to do about it.  This is the kind of thing that pushes voters out of the center into more extreme left or right positions (a la Trump). It’s only a matter of time before this silent majority have had enough of this nonsense and get behind a smart politician who will see beating down this cancel culture/progressive movement as a vote winning strategy (which it is). Then watch out.

[Dart12]

6 hours ago, Kerryd said:

Personally, I find it funny that the "left" and the media are so bent out of shape that they are consumed by gender pronouns and attempting to erase/destroy any history they disagree with, while the rest of the world are trying to cope with the covid crisis and economic issues.

 

 

 

The issue is NOT with the bird but with the depiction of African Pygmies. 

Apparently, depicting an Arab riding on a camel is also "racist" because, as we know, Arabs don't ride camels. Right ? (But of course Aladdin is OK because all Arabs ride carpets I guess.)

Note that it is the company that legally owns the books that decided to no longer publish those 6 books. You know, instead of say, having the offending pics redone. (So that they more accurately depict things like Arabs on Camels or Asian men eating with chopsticks, without anything to suggest race, religion, gender or sexual identity of course.)

It would be fair to say though that the company that owns the rights to those books decided to stop publishing them (after profiting from them for over 8 decades apparently) as they were probably worried that the "cancel culture" might turn their sights on them and the fallout could affect all the other Dr Suess titles.

Personally, I think all they needed to do was remove the images that a tiny group of people have an issue with and replace them with something that the snowflakes couldn't object to.

Like a picture of a table with a bowl of rice and set of chop sticks and a rectangular blank spot seated on a chair with the caption "A gender-neutral, self-identified person of undetermined race, religion, sexual preference or nationality about to eat a meal."

Then a cartoon of a camel, with the same blank spot and generic description, changing "about to eat a meal" to "riding on an enslaved animal".

But you can be sure that no matter how "generic" you make something, some snowflake will take issue with it and in today's society, if one person finds offense with something, it becomes a national (or international) crisis.

You pretty much said everything needed to be said.  

I can't figure it out.  

1.  Dr Seuss, as I remember, everything was a caricature. 

In the pic I shared,  I didn't see Africans, I saw Seuss imagination typical of all his characters.

Without internet and 24/7 see everything TV, Dr. Seuss was opening the world to children to see that where they lived, was not the only place nor the only culture.

So, let's say for arguments sake they were supposed to be African men from the island Of Yerka.
Here's real pics of real African men from a small village in Yerka.

And let's also say that the canary was supposed to be women from there.  If every character has to have a corresponding human to it.
Here's what Seuss was sharing to children in a light and playful way, that in no way pushed any view of looking down at any culture, but more of wonder and amazement:

This is an attack on history, reality, literature, books, art, media.

they have also gone after Dumbo, Peter Pan, The Aristocats, the Muppets, Grease.  NOw, this is just entertainment...but it's not stopping there.

There is in play that they are now teaching new math that  2+2 does not equal 4.  That there are many answers, and 4 is the oppressive "white" answer.  
You can't make this bleep up.

And worst of all, going after genders completely to have that removed.  Literally on forms now they have questions of what you "Identify" as instead of what you were born with.   Poor mom to be's are getting attacked as oppressive for having gender reveal parties...sayiing it's too soon to say what they are despite having a penis or vagina.

Give an inch, they'll take a mile.  
I think going after these little things are more the distraction to the big things that are being shifted culturally and monetarily.
Magic.  Watch this hand while the other does all the serious dirty work.

When I say it's the left, it's obviously far left doing this.  There are 85% of the population with same opinion as wth? is going on.  But these people are normal people who basically live by "live and let live" policy in life.  

What it will take before that 85% cracks?  Idk.  But I'm sure something has got to give at some point.



 

[billd766]

10 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

 

Not the silliest comment ever, but I would award you a "participation medal".

 

You do realize that "they" are not burning the books, or banning them? Still in your public library, assuming the local militia hasn't stormed that yet.

 

I do find it funny that the right wing media seems consumed with Dr. Seuss and Mr. Potato Head, while much of the country deals with a pandemic and econimic downturn. #importantstuff

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

https://www.seussville.com/statement-from-dr-seuss-enterprises/

 

 

 

If anything, this action draws more attention, good and bad, to the books, and fosters a discussion which is long overdue. We've never really come to terms with our history of racial injustice, perferring to pretend it never happend, that is wan't a big deal, that some of my best friends are..., and we should all move on. Until we acknowledge what we did, we'll never really make any headway.

 

Regarding these books, which I grew up with, and if it were up to me, I would re-contextualize the specific six books, and with a lot of input, annotate them to explain (for those few clueless people) what is wrong with them. I mean in the 1950's most Americans were a tad racist; we did support a "separate. but equal" policy, which in hindisght is nearly as embarassing as the bondage/property scheme which preceeded it.

 

 

quote "You do realize that "they" are not burning the books, or banning them? Still in your public library, assuming the local militia hasn't stormed that yet."

 

I don't expect that they are burning books but they are doing much worse. They are demanding that the books be withdrawn from sale, then re-written (to their way of thinking), before the books are allowed to be published for public consumption.

 

It matters not to them that generations of children read the books (or had them read by their parents). They fervently believe that only THEY know best and what is best in their eyes for everybody else.

 

quote "Still in your public library, assuming the local militia hasn't stormed that yet." 

 

I have no idea where my nearest public library is as I live in rural Kamphaeng Phet. At a guess It would be in Bangkok. It could be in the UK or NZ and any points between,

 

It doesn't matter to me as I have my own Ebook library on my PC, and yes it contains some of Dr Seuss books untouched by wokes and snowflakes in the UK/US and it will stay that way. I have no idea what his books are like and I will probably never read them.

 

To all the whiners complaining about his books I have 2 things to say:

 

1   If you can write and publish books as good as or better than the ones you are whining about, then do so.

 

2   If you cannot then leave the authors and their books  alone. Not so many children or people in general read real books any more as they are too busy on their mobiles playing games and talking about banning books that they don't like and probably have never read.

 

As for me, I had a children's library card by the time I was 10 and every country I have been to since then apart from Angola I have bought, sold and swapped books for the past 66 years.

 

Now I use an Ebook reader as I can store perhaps one years worth of reading in less space than one hard cover book. I also have 2 book cases here at home which are overflowing with books I no longer read, but my mate does read them so I take them to him every so often.

 

 

[polpott]

4 hours ago, Dart12 said:

And this group attacked the business that handles Dr Seuss publications . That's why they were bending to that bad press and canceling them.

A complete fiction. Links or it ain't true. (No Fox News links as they're also blaming Biden and the Democrats for it.)

[Airalee]

52 minutes ago, polpott said:

A complete fiction. Links or it ain't true. (No Fox News links as they're also blaming Biden and the Democrats for it.)

Already linked The NY Times article stating as such

[polpott]

6 hours ago, Airalee said:

“Mr. Geisel’s stories are loved by fans for their rhymes and fantastical characters but also for their positive values, like taking responsibility for the planet. But in recent years, critics have said some of his work was racist and presented harmful depictions of certain groups.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/02/books/dr-seuss-mulberry-street.html

 

 

Sounds like pressure from the outside to me.

 

Not to me.

[Airalee]

9 minutes ago, polpott said:

Not to me.

Because it is hard for you to be honest.  It’s ok.  I understand.

[JRinPDX]

On 3/5/2021 at 3:41 AM, billd766 said:

Snowflakes of today are using their own context rather than the time context that the books were written. IMHO it is they who are wrong.

 

You can overwrite history which is what they are trying to do, to sanitise history to their way of thinking, because they KNOW better than the people who lived the history at the time.

 

What they cannot do and t really annoys them is to eradicate the parts of history that they don't like and replace it with the history that THEY like.

They would not be who they are today, 'knowing' what they know without the past that got them there. 

[AlexRich]

What I find annoying is the race issues that are creeping into tv shows and movies ... an English black lady playing an English queen or an English Indian actor playing a Charles Dicken’s character. I don’t care about a persons race but prefer portrayals to be realistic and reflect the accuracy of the book or historical character. Shaft can only be played by a black actor ... and don’t start me on James Bond played by a female!

 

 

 

[Tom89]

On 3/5/2021 at 8:15 PM, Solinvictus said:

As a progressive, I'm disgusted with these liberals and their petty gender issues. Overall, I consider it an infringement on personal liberties. They cancel Mr. Potato head and trying to pass legislature in Cali to have stores be particular how they stock toys.

 

But lastly, I do also think it's done by both parties to keep the country divided.

They canceled Mr. Potato Head? When did that happen?

[VocalNeal]

On 3/6/2021 at 8:29 AM, mtls2005 said:

 

"This" century isn't really an issue. It's the previous one, two, three and four that are "thorny"?

 

 

 

..and yet African-American children living in single parent families is a new thing unrelated to history. 

It is people wanting their version of history to be on top that is the problem. 

 

On 3/5/2021 at 6:32 PM, snoop1130 said:

Seuss’s first book, And to Think That I Saw It on Mulberry Street, contains an illustration of a Chinese man that caused controversy two years ago when it was included in a mural. 

 

A Chinaman who eats with sticks? Well Chinese do eat with sticks do they not? As do japanese and others.  Chinese used to wear wooden shoes. Some Japanese Geisha still do. Conical straw hats? My wife won't wear one. Too Communist. The picture is simply a caricature. I see no big deal.  

[mtls2005]

Back in the day Dr. Seuss was a bit more political...

 

The Complicated Relevance of Dr. Seuss's Political Cartoons

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2017/01/dr-seuss-protest-icon/515031/

 

 

 

14 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

A Chinaman who eats with sticks? Well Chinese do eat with sticks do they not?

 

Not the issue. It's the use "helpers who all wear their eyes with a slant", I think.

[polpott]

33 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

The picture is simply a caricature. I see no big deal.  

That's because you are not of Chinese descent. You just don't get it. Try walking a mile in their shoes.

 

The biggest issue regarding race relations in America today is that white supremacists (40% of the nation) see no reason to recognise other people's sensitivities. You're a white male, why should you be concerned about insulting women and people of other races? Call me "woke" if you wish, rather that than a racist and misogynist.

 

 

Edited March 7, 2021 by polpott

[mtls2005]

16 hours ago, chilli42 said:

One survey after another demonstrates that the majority of US citizens, be they from the left or right, are “uncomfortable” with the cancel culture

 

Calling BS on this claim.

 

 

[johnnybangkok]

1 hour ago, polpott said:

That's because you are not of Chinese descent. You just don't get it. Try walking a mile in their shoes.

 

The biggest issue regarding race relations in America today is that white supremacists (40% of the nation) see no reason to recognise other people's sensitivities. You're a white male, why should you be concerned about insulting women and people of other races? Call me "woke" if you wish, rather that than a racist and misogynist.

 

 

I agree entirely. 

There's so much faux indignation going on in this thread from white, middle aged men commenting on what is/isn't offensive to black people, Chinese people etc. The images of black people with long necks, big lips and grass skirts is so out of date it's not even funny; you might as well go the whole hog and just have a bunch of 'little black sambos'. And when was the last time you saw a 'Chinaman' in geta cloggs (apart fromt he fact they are Japanese), complete with pointy hat and a bowl of rice? 

Steroetypical imagary is a 'thing' and these steroetypes, although originated some 70 years ago have not aged well and are obviously not acceptable now. The publishers have recognised this and are doing their little bit to advance the point. Did we all agree that having golliwogs advertise jam (Robertsons for those not in the know) was unneccessary? Did we think that Aunt Jemima was completely unneccessary to flog some syrup? I did and thankfully they are now no longer.

What does grab me though is the often right wing cry of 'it's all cancel culture' and 'pc liberals running amok' when all it really is is the opportunity to correct imagary that has not aged well. It's as simple as that. No one is cancelling these books and there's no street protests going on so keep your idignation for something more important because this is going to (rightfully) continue until EVERYONE understands the importance of not stereotyping whole nationalities like a bad 1950's cartoon.  

[Blue Muton]

On 3/5/2021 at 6:41 PM, billd766 said:

Snowflakes of today are using their own context rather than the time context that the books were written. IMHO it is they who are wrong.

 

You can overwrite history which is what they are trying to do, to sanitise history to their way of thinking, because they KNOW better than the people who lived the history at the time.

 

What they cannot do and t really annoys them is to eradicate the parts of history that they don't like and replace it with the history that THEY like.

 

I think you've missed the point, which is that time has moved on, regardless of whether or not you like it what went before is not always what is right for today or tomorrow. That's not 'sanitising history' as you put it rather it's looking forward to something better in the future. 

[Blue Muton]

18 hours ago, chilli42 said:

One survey after another demonstrates that the majority of US citizens, be they from the left or right, are “uncomfortable” with the cancel culture and the extreme right progressives.  They are sitting back and watching this happen as they don’t know what to do about it.  This is the kind of thing that pushes voters out of the center into more extreme left or right positions (a la Trump). It’s only a matter of time before this silent majority have had enough of this nonsense and get behind a smart politician who will see beating down this cancel culture/progressive movement as a vote winning strategy (which it is). Then watch out.

Look at the demographics.

 

People who were around in the middle part of the last century are dying out and fortunately taking their viewpoints forged by growing up in a country where apartheid (aka segregation) still existed with them. Some demographic projections show white people of European descent will be in a minority in just twenty-five years, here's a link to one report.

 

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/the-avenue/2018/03/14/the-us-will-become-minority-white-in-2045-census-projects/

 

Now, can you give a credible link to substantiate your claim that "One survey after another demonstrates that the majority of US citizens, be they from the left or right, are “uncomfortable” with the cancel culture"?

[Surelynot]

It would be interesting to hear the response of white people if there were children's books in Thailand that poked fun at or had racist overtones aimed at farangs/expats..... would these bastions of freedom be demanding the books stay in circulation for the Thai children to read?

[Solinvictus]

This entire topic is yet another ploy to divide. Whatever happened to personal choice? It gets to a point where people are simply too sensitive.

 

If someone doesn't like Dr. Seuss or Mr. Potato Head then simply don't buy it. Yes, there are many 'white nationalist' types that IMO aren't very American with regards towards values and education. But imposing changes to 'art' or products that some people wish to continue to buy is just getting to petty.

 

If people are this concerned about the topic why hasn't porno been stopped?

Edited March 7, 2021 by Solinvictus

[polpott]

3 minutes ago, Solinvictus said:

This entire topic is yet another ploy to divide.

Divide what? Racists from non racists? The only way the US will be united is to stamp out racism. This is a small step in that direction.

[tifino]

yes the racism against whites is getting beyond a joke... 

 

 - it is becoming like another modern day South Africa with the tables totally turning...

[blazes]

2 hours ago, johnnybangkok said:

 Did we think that Aunt Jemima was completely unneccessary to flog some syrup? I did and thankfully they are now no longer.

 

I bought some Aunt Jemima just the other day.  Now she beams sweetly down at me whenever I open the cupboard in my kitchen.  Partly I bought the pancake mix (which I rarely use) simply BECAUSE I was so pleased that she had escaped (so far) the cancel culture so breathlessly exposed in your long rant.

[Surelynot]

10 minutes ago, tifino said:

yes the racism against whites is getting beyond a joke... 

 

 - it is becoming like another modern day South Africa with the tables totally turning...

I have read some ludicrous comments in my time......but this is almost breath-taking in its stupidity.

[blazes]

1 hour ago, Surelynot said:

It would be interesting to hear the response of white people if there were children's books in Thailand that poked fun at or had racist overtones aimed at farangs/expats..... would these bastions of freedom be demanding the books stay in circulation for the Thai children to read?

 

Why bother with these putative "books" when the whole racist policy of many Thai governments  over many years is to treat "farang/expats" as inferior human beings, who are tolerated only because their wallets are still worth infiltrating?