Pollution

[Misab]

Thailand, please stop the burning of fields etc. So many months of the years the burning not only kill Thai people it also pollutes our planet. In a time where most modern countries fight pollution, we see Thailand do very little. If we take the size of the country in to consideration Thailand is among the big polluters in the world due to the burning and burning is something Thailand could end, if they wanted to.

I believe, the new young tourist generation from Europe is very aware of pollution and they will punish Thailand for doing nothing where Thailand could make a big difference, if they wanted too.

[Surelynot]

7 minutes ago, Misab said:

please stop the burning of fields

My thoughts exactly until you see it from a farmer's perspective.......back-breaking, fruitless, profitless work to get rid of the waste material.........they will only stop burning when they can make a profit from bailing it and have someone collect it.

[Kwasaki]

20 minutes ago, Misab said:

Thailand, please stop the burning of fields etc

Why don't you go tell the farmers.  I think you would get little reply with just a few words sounding like chips and eyes.

There's many for's & against, basically is down to saving money and time.

Agricultural burning helps farmers remove crop residues left in the field after harvesting grains, such as hay and rice. 

Farmers also use agricultural burning for removal of orchard and vineyard pruning's and trees. Burning also helps remove weeds, prevent disease and control pests.

[Moonlover]

15 minutes ago, Surelynot said:

17 minutes ago, Misab said:

please stop the burning of fields

 

15 minutes ago, Surelynot said:

My thoughts exactly until you see it from a farmer's perspective.......back-breaking, fruitless, profitless work to get rid of the waste material.........they will only stop burning when they can make a profit from bailing it and have someone collect it.

In our area, east of Sakon Nakhon, burning has been much reduced in recent years. More farmers have, or have access to a tractor now and plowing in is becoming the preferred option.

I walk the countryside almost daily and I rarely see a field being burnt off. 

[KannikaP]

I show my Mrs and her family my app with AQI almost daily..............with no reaction whatsoever. Head/brick wall!

[Surelynot]

5 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

More farmers have, or have access to a tractor now and plowing in is becoming the preferred option.

Yes...there was a thread recently where someone in power was said to be pushing for farmers to given loans or grants to purchase tractors specifically to accelerant the move toward ploughing waste back into the ground.

[Lacessit]

Burning is the cheapest option for many rural Thais. Ploughing trash back into the soil needs fuel, and that costs money.

Thailand's commitment to reducing pollution can be measured by comparing Bangkok to Kuala Lumpur. Here, vehicles of all sizes blowing black smoke is as common as dog poo in a soi. Go to KL, one won't see a single vehicle with exhaust smoke.

 

[Olmate]

7 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Burning is the cheapest option for many rural Thais. Ploughing trash back into the soil needs fuel, and that costs money.

Thailand's commitment to reducing pollution can be measured by comparing Bangkok to Kuala Lumpur. Here, vehicles of all sizes blowing black smoke is as common as dog poo in a soi. Go to KL, one won't see a single vehicle with exhaust smoke.

 

8 million extra smokers maybe! 

[Moonlover]

36 minutes ago, Surelynot said:

43 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

More farmers have, or have access to a tractor now and plowing in is becoming the preferred option.

 

40 minutes ago, Surelynot said:

Yes...there was a thread recently where someone in power was said to be pushing for farmers to given loans or grants to purchase tractors specifically to accelerant the move toward ploughing waste back into the ground.

Actually it's becoming an act of economic necessity. Thais are have much smaller families now and many of their offspring prefer to head for the 'bright lights' anyway. So without new labour coming into the industry it's mechanize or die.

It's actually a copy of the industrial revolution in miniature.

[TheFishman1]

The air in Chiang Mai Just terrible TIT

[canopy]

18 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

There's many for's & against, basically is down to saving money and time.

Farmers do not burn to save money or time. If you don't believe this, just ask a few about their reasoning and watch the fireworks. Burning fields hurts their profits by depleting the soil and promoting erosion. They don't care, they just use more chemicals. Burning is not as easy. People need to be there to work it where they want it to go, often by splashing gas as they go along, and make sure it doesn't get out of control, which it sometimes does anyway. There are many profitable ways to deal with the waste, but they don't want it. Burning is simply a habit like smoking. You need to think of it in those terms to understand why it happens. People love smoking and nothing you say will change that. Same with burning fields.

 

18 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Agricultural burning helps farmers remove crop residues left in the field after harvesting grains, such as hay and rice. 

They could make money from this "waste" by baling, sileage, or plenty of other sensible choices. They don't want this because they love burning.

 

18 hours ago, Moonlover said:

 

More farmers have, or have access to a tractor now and plowing in is becoming the preferred option.

Becoming eh? As if farmers haven't been using tractors to plow all over thailand since before most here were born.

 

18 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Farmers also use agricultural burning for removal of orchard and vineyard pruning's and trees.

Yes, absolutely everything that can be burnt is burnt. Even at households every twig, leaf, and piece of plastic is heaped and burned.

 

19 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Burning also helps remove weeds, prevent disease and control pests.

Farmers don't care about this. They use dangerous farm poisons liberally in our food chain and will fight anyone who tries to take them away. Meanwhile there are more profitable approaches like this:

 

[rwill]

Check back in 30 years...

[toolpush]

1 hour ago, canopy said:

Farmers do not burn to save money or time. If you don't believe this, just ask a few about their reasoning and watch the fireworks. Burning fields hurts their profits by depleting the soil and promoting erosion. They don't care, they just use more chemicals. Burning is not as easy. People need to be there to work it where they want it to go, often by splashing gas as they go along, and make sure it doesn't get out of control, which it sometimes does anyway. There are many profitable ways to deal with the waste, but they don't want it. Burning is simply a habit like smoking. You need to think of it in those terms to understand why it happens. People love smoking and nothing you say will change that. Same with burning fields.

 

They could make money from this "waste" by baling, sileage, or plenty of other sensible choices. They don't want this because they love burning.

 

Becoming eh? As if farmers haven't been using tractors to plow all over thailand since before most here were born.

 

Yes, absolutely everything that can be burnt is burnt. Even at households every twig, leaf, and piece of plastic is heaped and burned.

 

Farmers don't care about this. They use dangerous farm poisons liberally in our food chain and will fight anyone who tries to take them away. Meanwhile there are more profitable approaches like this:

 

Agree. Thais just gotta burn. It is in their DNA. See it in residential areas in Pattaya all the time. Especially in dry season?

[connda]

23 hours ago, Misab said:

I believe, the new young tourist generation from Europe is very aware of pollution and they will punish Thailand for doing nothing where Thailand could make a big difference, if they wanted too.

Greta and her friends probably couldn't find Thailand on a map of the world.  And one doesn't gain global notoriety by chastising the Thai government for creating the air pollution and CO2 that will melt the ice caps and flood the world.  On gains notoriety by chastising large first world governments.
Nope.  The villagers will continue to burn their national forests, their fields, their mountains, and their trash as the government mumbles platitudes and Greta and her Eco-activists march around in nice clean First World cities demanding that the First World change.

[Tarteso]

On 3/15/2021 at 11:44 AM, Misab said:

Thailand, please stop the burning of fields

Your words will goes with the polluted wind..

[Surelynot]

On 3/15/2021 at 4:44 AM, Misab said:

I believe, the new young tourist generation from Europe is very aware of pollution

I would love to agree with you.....but I really don't think they are that  aware....or if they are, they write it off in their minds and think ............well I'm desperate to experience Thailand and will still travel.

Edited March 16, 2021 by Surelynot

[Kwasaki]

4 hours ago, canopy said:

Farmers do not burn to save money or time. If you don't believe this, just ask a few about their reasoning and watch the fireworks. Burning fields hurts their profits by depleting the soil and promoting erosion. They don't care, they just use more chemicals. Burning is not as easy. People need to be there to work it where they want it to go, often by splashing gas as they go along, and make sure it doesn't get out of control, which it sometimes does anyway. There are many profitable ways to deal with the waste, but they don't want it. Burning is simply a habit like smoking. You need to think of it in those terms to understand why it happens. People love smoking and nothing you say will change that. Same with burning fields.

 

They could make money from this "waste" by baling, sileage, or plenty of other sensible choices. They don't want this because they love burning.

 

Becoming eh? As if farmers haven't been using tractors to plow all over thailand since before most here were born.

 

Yes, absolutely everything that can be burnt is burnt. Even at households every twig, leaf, and piece of plastic is heaped and burned.

 

Farmers don't care about this. They use dangerous farm poisons liberally in our food chain and will fight anyone who tries to take them away. Meanwhile there are more profitable approaches like this:

I would agree with you but I am not in position or want to get involved. 

The only duck l've see up here in the North is on a plate. 

[Moonlover]

6 hours ago, canopy said:

On 3/15/2021 at 12:17 PM, Moonlover said:

 

More farmers have, or have access to a tractor now and plowing in is becoming the preferred option.

 

6 hours ago, canopy said:

Becoming eh? As if farmers haven't been using tractors to plow all over thailand since before most here were born.

The first tractor arrived in our village 3 years ago. (I saw it still in its delivery wrapping!) Prior to that, those that did  prefer to plough in used the two wheeled 'walking tractor'. There are now 'combines' available now as well, which I never saw when I first came here 4 years ago.

So yes, mechanization an evolving phenomenon. And yes, there is less burning than there was back then.

[chilly07]

To the average Thai the environment doesn't feature high on their priorities. Burning to them is just easier. Government needs to finance cooperatives financing the equipment and Thai farmers need a significant financial inducement to use it. Stopping migrant labor would be a start

[MadMuhammad]

You’d better whip over the border and have a chat to the Cambodians and Burmese while you’re at it 

https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/environment/thailand-on-fire-nasa-satellite-website-tracks-the-countrys-farm-fires

[Captor]

On 3/15/2021 at 6:13 AM, Kwasaki said:

Why don't you go tell the farmers.  I think you would get little reply with just a few words sounding like chips and eyes.

There's many for's & against, basically is down to saving money and time.

Agricultural burning helps farmers remove crop residues left in the field after harvesting grains, such as hay and rice. 

Farmers also use agricultural burning for removal of orchard and vineyard pruning's and trees. Burning also helps remove weeds, prevent disease and control pests.

And they are slowly dying at the same time... gives that a perspective?

[Kwasaki]

9 hours ago, Captor said:

And they are slowly dying at the same time... gives that a perspective?

Way of life would be my point view, two guys in my soi are farmers but they don't work their farms anymore their siblings do.

One is 92 the other 88 so there's their perspective.

[canopy]

On 3/16/2021 at 2:12 PM, Moonlover said:

The first tractor arrived in our village 3 years ago. (I saw it still in its delivery wrapping!) Prior to that, those that did  prefer to plough in used the two wheeled 'walking tractor'. There are now 'combines' available now as well, which I never saw when I first came here 4 years ago.

So yes, mechanization an evolving phenomenon. And yes, there is less burning than there was back then.

The walking tractors are still sometimes favored even when tractors are available for hire, but this is also a form of mechanization. I have not seen anything to indicate there is less burning when a tractor, walking tractor, or a combine is used. Right before they plow or right after they harvest with machinery, burning is common. I would expect burning in Thailand to increase because the population is growing (more is consumed and burned), more land is being farmed, and ever more land is being encroached from the forests. I don't see mechanization as any sort of answer to the problem and I don't notice things getting better.

 

On 3/17/2021 at 9:46 AM, Kwasaki said:

One is 92 the other 88 so there's their perspective.

You are talking anomalies right? You don't find villages full of people that reach the ripe old age of 90. On the contrary you get a lot of funerals in the villages for people in their 40's and 50's. People in the countryside have a much shorter lifespan than those in bangkok. The reasons may not be fully understood, but part of this is surely the air that has already sent a quarter million people to hospitals in just the first two months of the year and this is the time before it gets really bad.

 

[Mark1066]

On 3/15/2021 at 12:17 PM, Moonlover said:

 

In our area, east of Sakon Nakhon, burning has been much reduced in recent years. More farmers have, or have access to a tractor now and plowing in is becoming the preferred option.

I walk the countryside almost daily and I rarely see a field being burnt off. 

A certain large food and retail organisation pays farmers around Chiang Mai to grow corn on fields in the mountains: fields with gradients that make it impossible for them to use a tractor in them. The company and its actions are well known but nobody is going to do anything about it.

[canopy]

16 hours ago, Mark1066 said:

A certain large food and retail organisation pays farmers around Chiang Mai to grow corn on fields in the mountains: fields with gradients that make it impossible for them to use a tractor in them. The company and its actions are well known but nobody is going to do anything about it.

What an amazing factoid to learn that farmers actually get paid for growing a crop. Choosing what to grow is up to the farmer.  Choosing to burn is up to the farmer. No one is forcing them to do any of this.  One of the most foolish places to burn is on a steep gradient because when it rains, the valuable top soil goes running down the hill. It's economically foolish for a farmer to burn yet they don't care. So I fail to see how pollution has anything to do with a certain company. Let's blame the people who deserve it. Whatever a farmer grows, he burns. However flat or steep the land is, he burns. No matter if he uses a tractor or not he burns. Do you see the pattern? The farmers are to blame. Some of you folks need to get out and ask farmers why they burn instead of making up conspiracy theories. It will be very enlightening to you. I have.

 

[Misab]

On 3/16/2021 at 11:30 AM, connda said:

Greta and her friends probably couldn't find Thailand on a map of the world.  And one doesn't gain global notoriety by chastising the Thai government for creating the air pollution and CO2 that will melt the ice caps and flood the world.  On gains notoriety by chastising large first world governments.
Nope.  The villagers will continue to burn their national forests, their fields, their mountains, and their trash as the government mumbles platitudes and Greta and her Eco-activists march around in nice clean First World cities demanding that the First World change.

Greta is not American

[Mark1066]

On 3/20/2021 at 6:45 AM, canopy said:

What an amazing factoid to learn that farmers actually get paid for growing a crop. Choosing what to grow is up to the farmer.  Choosing to burn is up to the farmer. No one is forcing them to do any of this.  One of the most foolish places to burn is on a steep gradient because when it rains, the valuable top soil goes running down the hill. It's economically foolish for a farmer to burn yet they don't care. So I fail to see how pollution has anything to do with a certain company. Let's blame the people who deserve it. Whatever a farmer grows, he burns. However flat or steep the land is, he burns. No matter if he uses a tractor or not he burns. Do you see the pattern? The farmers are to blame. Some of you folks need to get out and ask farmers why they burn instead of making up conspiracy theories. It will be very enlightening to you. I have.

 

I hope you feel better now you’ve had your patronising little rant. My point was that a large national concern is encouraging farmers to grow crops on fields where using a tractor is simply not possible. They know that more pollution will be the result but that doesn’t matter to them. It should. That’s a fact,  not a conspiracy theory ( from one of the executives of the nameless company, not some overbearing foreigner who thinks he has all the answers).

 

Of course the farmers have free will but as in any country, it behoves those who posses the capital and power to set a good example.

 

Some of you folks need to remove your head from where it’s buried and use it for its intended purpose: thinking.

Edited March 21, 2021 by Mark1066

[canopy]

15 hours ago, Mark1066 said:

My point was that a large national concern is encouraging farmers to grow crops on fields where using a tractor is simply not possible.

By "encouraging" I guess you mean they pay better than growing other things. Many other types of crops are grown on steep slopes without machinery besides corn. In my area hilltribes plant their traditional sticky rice on steep slopes. I have also seen corn, hydroponics, and various other crops grown on steep slopes. All are subject to burning.  Remember that traditional Thai farming involved no machinery and no burning. Everything was all organic until about our generation. Burning arrived not because of steep slopes or mechanization, but because of chemical fertilizers. The field residue became a waste product rather than an asset for the soil.

 

[Don Chance]

Just tell the world to stop eating sugar and they will have to stop growing sugar cane.

[canopy]

1 hour ago, Don Chance said:

Just tell the world to stop eating sugar and they will have to stop growing sugar cane.

 

Won't help one bit. The fire bugs manage to ruin everyone's air not just during sugar cane harvest, but continuously. Whatever a thai farmer grows, he burns, even when growing hydroponics and trees they have managed to introduce god awful burning. And they also burn their plastic garbage, the forests, and just everything they can get their hands on is all burnt to a crisp. This is what they enjoy doing and nobody will dare tell them to stop so get used to it.