Been offered Pfizer and Astra Zeneca?

[Kiujunn]

9 minutes ago, placeholder said:

???

Herd immunity means,  so many people are immune (by vaccination or infection) that the virus cannot find enough new hosts and it will die out.

 

US and Europe will never reach this stage: too open (a steady supply of vulnerable hosts from outside), too many anti-vaxxers, right now too many people you cannot vaccinate (children).

Whoever decides not to get vaccinated has decided to be naturally infected, sooner or later.

[jesimps]

2 hours ago, mrfill said:

If you're in the UK you don't get a choice. You get what they have. Both AZ and Pfizer are ok - as are the other vaccines.

 

The differences - well, if you're an epidemiologist, you should already know and if you are not then I wouldn't believe the guff from most of the pseudo doctors.

The fact is - as you will be aware  - the UK is doing well in getting this thing under control and that's because of extensive vaccination by both AZ and Pfizer. The scare stories (probably put out by greedy US profiteers) of 'you get blood clots from AZ' are idiotic as the instances of these clots in vaccinated people is the same or lower than in unvaccinated people. As for side effects, some people have a headache, some get a sore arm, some experience no effect at all (I had my first AZ on 4th March and no side effect at all). I would prefer a sore arm to a week gasping for oxygen, as my sister found out. I'm off to get my second jab tomorrow...

Ask your local friends (who I guess will all have had one jab at least) what their experience was. You'll get the usual stories of aches and pains and grumbles, so then ask someone who spent any time in ICU.

 

It's really sad to see so many people putting so many scare stories around as it will only prolong the spread and deaths. We'll probably never get rid entirely of this virus but if between the body's immune system and jabs we can reduce the effects to the level of influenza, we can get back to some level of normality. 

 

Now - back to the scare stories and the sinophobia......

The scare stories concerning AZ and blood clots were put about by the EU because they wanted revenge on the UK over Brexit. There's no evidence that you're more likely to suffer a blood clot after taking AZ than if you don't have a jab at all. Who knows how many lives this has cost? There's certainly blood on someone's hands in the EC.

Edited May 20, 2021 by jesimps

[placeholder]

21 minutes ago, Kiujunn said:

Herd immunity means,  so many people are immune (by vaccination or infection) that the virus cannot find enough new hosts and it will die out.

 

US and Europe will never reach this stage: too open (a steady supply of vulnerable hosts from outside), too many anti-vaxxers, right now too many people you cannot vaccinate (children).

Whoever decides not to get vaccinated has decided to be naturally infected, sooner or later.

But somewhere before that 100% is reached, they will reach herd immunity, if it's reachable. Of course, if it turns out to be like the flu, then perhaps herd immunity won't be possible for anyone. 

[Nanaplaza666]

8 hours ago, AnnieSeek said:

Yeah it is new technology, lol - i keep hearing that. Where do i find out what this technology is? 

 

My biggest concern is that next year they say we all need to take it again. 

You can count on that . This will be a yearly thing as long as it takes maybe the vaccines will be advanced and altered but you can bet on it that we need to take it every year from now . Welcome to the new normal where they will not allow you to go anywhere but home if not vaccinated . It's the new flu shot and will not be for only elderly and voulnerable . 

[Lokie]

3 hours ago, mrfill said:

If you're in the UK you don't get a choice. You get what they have. Both AZ and Pfizer are ok - as are the other vaccines.

 

The differences - well, if you're an epidemiologist, you should already know and if you are not then I wouldn't believe the guff from most of the pseudo doctors.

The fact is - as you will be aware  - the UK is doing well in getting this thing under control and that's because of extensive vaccination by both AZ and Pfizer. The scare stories (probably put out by greedy US profiteers) of 'you get blood clots from AZ' are idiotic as the instances of these clots in vaccinated people is the same or lower than in unvaccinated people. As for side effects, some people have a headache, some get a sore arm, some experience no effect at all (I had my first AZ on 4th March and no side effect at all). I would prefer a sore arm to a week gasping for oxygen, as my sister found out. I'm off to get my second jab tomorrow...

Ask your local friends (who I guess will all have had one jab at least) what their experience was. You'll get the usual stories of aches and pains and grumbles, so then ask someone who spent any time in ICU.

 

It's really sad to see so many people putting so many scare stories around as it will only prolong the spread and deaths. We'll probably never get rid entirely of this virus but if between the body's immune system and jabs we can reduce the effects to the level of influenza, we can get back to some level of normality. 

 

Now - back to the scare stories and the sinophobia......

Not exactly true;

Im in UK and requested AZ shot, was assured I was booked for AZ, turned up at alloted time/place they only had Pfizer that day, I declined... a week later was assured again report for AZ, turned up and again was only Pfizer available (this was back in Febuary BTW) personally I did not want the Pfizer shot as not tried & tested method IMO (I wanted a shot based on traditional methods) I then went on the NHS site myself and booked within three minutes for the AZ at a mass Vaccination site - namely The Etihad Stadium in Manchester (Man City FC ground) 30 minutes later I went and got AZ shot no problems... Was given second shot date there and then and had that few weeks back (12 weeks apart) so Im well happy.

 

So You can request which ever shot you want, I done exactly that as I feel happier with the AZ shot, most people I know have had AZ, I know only one woman who had Pfizer and felt ill after the first shot few days very groggy flu like and with sore arm... not seen her since so dont know how she got on after that - My daughter is NHS frontline staff age 27 and they got AZ shots in NHS also (just as a side)

 

I agree with rest of this post however...

[Skeptic7]

Pfizer. No contest. 

[shdmn]

1 hour ago, jesimps said:

The scare stories concerning AZ and blood clots were put about by the EU because they wanted revenge on the UK over Brexit. There's no evidence that you're more likely to suffer a blood clot after taking AZ than if you don't have a jab at all. Who knows how many lives this has cost? There's certainly blood on someone's hands in the EC.

It is being reported by non-EU countries as well.   It's quite rare so the benefits greatly outweigh the risks.  Pfizer/Moderna have about the same percentage of heart inflammation in mostly younger people mostly men mostly 2nd dose.  A potentially fatal side effect.  So pick your poison.  

Edited May 20, 2021 by shdmn

[Sheryl]

13 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

Pfizer is for sure the better jab.  As for mixing, I'd leave that up to your doctor.  Quite a few reports out there saying it may not be the best thing to do.  Seems the reason they are even doing this is due to lack of supply of the jabs.

 

Main reason it is being done is that some countries have shifted away from Astra Zeneca for people under certain ages (anywhere from 30 to 60 depending in country) and had the issue of people now in the age group for Pfizer or Moderna having already had 1 AZ dose. 

 

I haven't heard of anyplace mixing doses except where first was AZ.

 

OP: both vaccines are likely to last as long (though the length of time any lasts is still being determined). Both are highly effective. Astra Zeneca has been linked to a very, very small increase in a rare blood clotting disorder (about .001%) and this is mainly in young women. For this reason UK now uses it only on people aged 40 and up if there is alternative available.  At 40, you are right on the cusp which is probably why yo uhave the choice.

 

Get Pfizer if available but if for any reason it is not, don't worry about accepting AZ.

[friendofthai]

AstraZeneca is preferable choice for those who want to travel a lot. Because it is used widely everywhere. For example, it will help you if you are planing to stay in Thailand for a long time and to make visa runs to Laos. AZ is approved in Laos already.

Edited May 20, 2021 by friendofthai

[Negita43]

As far as I am aware the Astrazeneca jab is based on a similar process to the annual flue jab which always give me problems with persistent cold like symtoms. So much so that I have declined the flu jab for many years (apart from this season but again cold like issues)

 

I'm in the UK and fortunately I have had two Pfizer Jabs with absolutely no issues (apart from sore arm at injection site) so I would, based on my experience, choose the Pfizer vaccine.

 

One other point if you are paying, then I think the base cost of the Pfizer jab is somewhat higher than the Astrazeneca

[Phillip9]

37 minutes ago, friendofthai said:

AstraZeneca is preferable choice for those who want to travel a lot. Because it is used widely everywhere. For example, it will help you if you are planing to stay in Thailand for a long time and to make visa runs to Laos. AZ is approved in Laos already.

This guy is a russian or chinese troll and all his posts should be ignored.  

 

Admins can you do anything about someone constantly spreading misinformation?

[friendofthai]

4 minutes ago, Phillip9 said:

This guy is a russian or chinese troll and all his posts should be ignored.  

 

Admins can you do anything about someone constantly spreading misinformation?

AZ is the most widespread vaccine in the world. Its not disinformation. It is a fact. So the AZ jab will give you the best vaccination passport which is good for travellers.

[Thomas J]

21 hours ago, AnnieSeek said:

Hello i have an appointment next week for either Pfizer or Astra Zeneca. Can anyone tell me the difference between the two and what the general consensus is as the 'better vaccine'? 

https://theconversation.com/from-adenoviruses-to-rna-the-pros-and-cons-of-different-covid-vaccine-technologies-145454

[cdemundo]

11 hours ago, AnnieSeek said:

Yeah it is new technology, lol - i keep hearing that. Where do i find out what this technology is? 

 

My biggest concern is that next year they say we all need to take it again. 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/health/pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine.html

How the Pfizer-BioNTech Vaccine Works

 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/health/pfizer-coronavirus-vaccine.html

How Pfizer Makes Its Covid-19 Vaccine

 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/health/oxford-astrazeneca-covid-19-vaccine.html

How the Oxford-AstraZeneca Vaccine Works

 

"My biggest concern is that next year they say we all need to take it again."

 

You might consider other things to be concerned about, for example:

People die from COVID, among those who survive there are those who need supplemental O2, kidney dialysis, and have other long lasting effects.  Since you mention Google, you might also Google "COVID long haulers".

 

I don't understand why needing a booster would be a big concern.

 

 

 

[friendofthai]

Too many words has been said here about TECHNOLOGIES. But such things are important for advertising purposes only.
if you want to buy a car or a motorbike, the technologies are out of interest. A car could be constructed 100% manually or it could be constructed by robots or anything else. It does not matter actually. The only thing that matters is WHAT FINALLY WE GET, the set of features of the final product and its quality.

And if we compare features of the final products we will see that
1. AZ will give you a better VAX passport because it the most widespread vaccine in the world. 
2. AZ and Pfizer - both of them will give you a very good protection against severe COVID symptoms.

3. It is very hard to compare side effects of the products. Too many different opinions.
 

[AnnieSeek]

5 hours ago, danferguson said:

 

My thoughts exactly - obviously a troll post, or a complete idiot

 

An idiot for asking questions? Most people don't have access to the scientific community, so most local discussions will be with close friends to get some feedback. Naturally i am not going to take what anyone says to heart, but nothing wrong with some feedback. 

[AnnieSeek]

7 hours ago, mrfill said:

If you're in the UK you don't get a choice. You get what they have. Both AZ and Pfizer are ok - as are the other vaccines.

 

Wrong. Under 40's will be offered alternative vaccines to Astra Zeneca. However, i can still take it if i chose. 

[placeholder]

6 minutes ago, friendofthai said:

Too many words has been said here about TECHNOLOGIES. But such things are important for advertising purposes only.
if you want to buy a car or a motorbike, the technologies are out of interest. A car could be constructed 100% manually or it could be constructed by robots or anything else. It does not matter actually. The only thing that matters is WHAT FINALLY WE GET, the set of features of the final product and its quality.

And if we compare features of the final products we will see that
1. AZ will give you a better VAX passport because it the most widespread vaccine in the world. 
2. AZ and Pfizer - both of them will give you a very good protection against severe COVID symptoms.

3. It is very hard to compare side effects of the products. Too many different opinions.
 

 

58 minutes ago, friendofthai said:

AZ is the most widespread vaccine in the world. Its not disinformation. It is a fact. So the AZ jab will give you the best vaccination passport which is good for travellers.

By this criterion Sinovac is one of the worst.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/world/covid-vaccinations-tracker.html

 

[placeholder]

59 minutes ago, friendofthai said:

AZ is the most widespread vaccine in the world. Its not disinformation. It is a fact. So the AZ jab will give you the best vaccination passport which is good for travellers.

These maps are about where the vaccines are being used. No necessary connection between that and vaccination passports which are not really a thing yet. Given that Moderna and Pfizer have performed the best, it's dubious that any nation, except those ruled by repressive hypernationalistic governments who feel their prestige is strongly bound to locally created vaccines, would reject people who have been inoculated the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines.

[friendofthai]

Just now, placeholder said:

 

By this criterion Sinovac is one of the worst.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/world/covid-vaccinations-tracker.html

 

Most people here are expats wanting to get their pre-COVID visa-run life back. Expats usually prefer visa-runs to the neighbouring countries. And we see that most neighbouring countries are using Sinovac(Malaysia, Cambodia, Indonesia, China, Phillipines etc). So it is a good choice for expats in Thailand.

[friendofthai]

10 minutes ago, placeholder said:

These maps are about where the vaccines are being used. No necessary connection between that and vaccination passports which are not really a thing yet. Given that Moderna and Pfizer have performed the best, it's dubious that any nation, except those ruled by repressive hypernationalistic governments who feel their prestige is strongly bound to locally created vaccines, would reject people who have been inoculated the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines.

Travellers of the COVID era prefer to use only bulletproof information. Because all those "most probably" and "it's dubious that they reject" usually end with people stuck in transit areas of airports.
Only the fact that a vaccine is being used in a country will give such a bulletproof guarantee that this vaccine is approved and this country will not change its decision to accept travellers vaccinated with it.

[cdnvic]

I strongly suggest getting medical advice from a professional rather than random people on the internet. Few if any answers you get will be from someone qualified to give that advice, and there are many who pretend to be qualified. 

 

When reading articles, look for ones that include citations from sources generally accepted as being reliable such as research universities, national health authorities, and respected medical institutions such as The Mayo Clinic or Johns Hopkins.

 

Here's one that may help you. Note the plentiful citations.

 

https://www.prevention.com/health/a35118263/astrazeneca-vs-pfizer-vs-moderna-covid-19-vaccine/#

 

[AnnieSeek]

2 hours ago, cdnvic said:

I strongly suggest getting medical advice from a professional rather than random people on the internet. Few if any answers you get will be from someone qualified to give that advice, and there are many who pretend to be qualified. 

 

When reading articles, look for ones that include citations from sources generally accepted as being reliable such as research universities, national health authorities, and respected medical institutions such as The Mayo Clinic or Johns Hopkins.

 

Here's one that may help you. Note the plentiful citations.

 

https://www.prevention.com/health/a35118263/astrazeneca-vs-pfizer-vs-moderna-covid-19-vaccine/#

 

 

Thanks for the link - good reading. That's one reason i posted, so i could get guided to some useful information, and some fellow posters feedback. Thanks

[covidiot]

9 hours ago, jesimps said:

The scare stories concerning AZ and blood clots were put about by the EU because they wanted revenge on the UK over Brexit.

first time i hear that.

this should get the conspiracy of the week award.

 

annie, you can trust me. i'm a virologist. ha ha. just kidding.

Edited May 20, 2021 by covidiot

[gargamon]

9 hours ago, placeholder said:

Of course, if it turns out to be like the flu, then perhaps herd immunity won't be possible for anyone. 

You should clarify this statement as you may confuse some. There is no herd immunity for the common flu because the strain changes every year. There may be herd immunity for particular strains, but not the common flu in general. For Covid-19, herd immunity is possible for the current strains (mutations), but this immunity may or may not apply to future mutations. Any new covid booster shots will be to address new mutations, not the ones currently out there.

[sezze]

I had a 1st shot of Pfizer yesterday . Arm sore like tetanus vaccination , and its almost over now . Others i know with Pfizer , all same , sore arm or no effect . My mother actually took a painkiller as her arm did hurt too much after 1st shot ( no more after 2nd ) .

I do know a few who did get AZ , and from them i get stories like:  no effect , sore arm , sick for 1 day .

The real unwanted effects of AZ are extremely rare , about 10 times less then with the female pill , but all focus is on it now .

So far i the new technique aka Pfizer or Moderna look a lot more promising and better in protecting then the old AZ technique .

For all vaccines , i'd say a 3st shot will be there in a while , to keep upto date with new mutations and give a further boost until we are further in this pandemic . Do realise that many people have no sight in any vaccination yet , and anti vaxxers will also keep the virus going around . So this is not going away soon , so as long as this will go around and mutate , expect to have 1 vaccination per year ( although it isnt sure yet ) .

[Jeffr2]

8 hours ago, friendofthai said:

AZ is the most widespread vaccine in the world. Its not disinformation. It is a fact. So the AZ jab will give you the best vaccination passport which is good for travellers.

Just because it's the most widespread vaccine doesn't mean it's the best.  They stopped using it in South Africa as it doesn't cover that variant.  Pfizer does.  If you want to travel to Africa, Pfizer is the jab to get, not AZ.

[Scott]

A post with false or misleading information has been removed.  

 

[jayboy]

15 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

I have to admit, the girl has caught on, i.e. the young are not dying like the old and frail, and if herd immunity is ever reached all and good, but she will get vaccinated when she is comfortable having all of the data in, no rush, so you might look at other alternatives as well.

 

Your daughter has missed the point.It's not that the fit young are much less at risk.The issue is that the young may contract Covid 19 and be asymptomatic, but may still pass it on to those who are very vulnerable indeed.

 

Australia is in a vulnerable position in my view having achieved tremendous success in blocking the virus through closed borders, but effectively still largely unvaccinated.

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, jayboy said:

Australia is in a vulnerable position in my view having achieved tremendous success in blocking the virus through closed borders, but effectively still largely unvaccinated.

 

Australians are unique individuals and will stand up for that they feel is right.

 

Why are they still largely unvaccinated, not because they don't have enough jabs to go around, but because the blame the Prime Minister put his foot in it early when he boasted that he secured 50 million doses of AZ and at the same time said that he would make it mandatory for everyone to get vaccinated, only to be on the back foot the following day when everyone was up in arms, that said, it's now the vaccine passport that is stirring up trouble, with the government saying if you want to travel you must be vaccinated !

 

His comments in my view and many Australians views are nothing short of vaccine blackmail, vaccine passports restricts the freedoms, movements and liberties of Australians.

 

There are a number of laws that exist that make it a criminal offence for a government to coerce or make mandatory any form of medical treatment against the will of the individual. These laws were brought in after the 2nd world war revolting against the Nazi's and other totalitarian regimes that were conducting 'scientific experiments'.

 

In any given society the government's role is to persuade, not to coerce or to mandate.

 

By all means, the government must keep its citizens safe from the corona virus by all ethical means possible. This requires persuading the public that the various vaccine options are safe (where available) and that they serve the common good.

The government can even claim that they are essential for the borders to be fully opened up to incoming tourists/people as has been commonplace around the world for decades in any number of health scenarios.

 

You are correct in saying that she can be asymptomatic and infect others, the same can be said for the Flu and Pneumonia.

 

We all have choices, we are not anti-vaxers, but will eventually, more than likely get the vaccination, might just be a matter of choice, once more data is in.