Dystopian blues anyone?

[CharlieH]

Bickering exchange removed.

[The Hammer2021]

On 7/5/2021 at 2:13 PM, Fat is a type of crazy said:

There's a lot of posts here that seem to see authority as some evil dark force that have an agenda to cower us into submission. Australia has done really well with covid - the one problem has been people arriving from overseas and because they are stuck in hotels it spreads. 

I would love a holiday in Thailand but clearly it's difficult for the reason you give and the state of Thailand.

A bit of common sense goes a long way in seeing that when there's no covid we have been able to do what we want except travel. Qantas is putting pressure on the Govt to relax rules and they will over time. Not ideal and I may not agree with all the decisions but I don't think there's a secret government agenda behind the decisions. Like I say people think too much. Too much time on their hands. 

Australia has done disastrously with covid! It's a nightmare of government incompetence, corruption  , anti vax propaganda, no vax roll out, chaotic off and on lockdowns, insane zero covid policy..People can't return...people can't get out! Police have suppressed dissent....

Edited July 20, 2021 by The Hammer2021

[Fat is a type of crazy]

49 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Australia has done disastrously with covid! It's a nightmare of government incompetence, corruption  , anti vax propaganda, no vax roll out, chaotic off and on lockdowns, insane zero covid policy..People can't return...people can't get out! Police have suppressed dissent....

They have done a bad job of getting the needles out, and for hotel quarantine in the past, but few deaths and cases.

Sydney waited a bit recently before lockdown, as you might prefer, and cases went from 10 to 100 a day and that would have become 1000 and up and up so what to do..

Melbourne took fast action and kept it at 10 a day ...

If you can get cases low it seems good to keep them low. You might prefer a US and UK approach, before the needles, but I don't. 

 I have a work from home job - people with some small businesses e.g. catering, cafes etc  are taking the brunt - it is tough. Many businesses do OK with support.

No corruption  that I am aware of - the odd sportsmen getting special treatment and  businesses accessing support funds they shouldn't.  

Not sure that anti needle stuff is significant in Australia - much smaller in size than say US or UK. 

People could come in more easily if we had a decent quarantine facility but hotel quarantine keeps getting breached. As I said people can leave if they can show they'll stay out for a bit.

Police just stop people who break the lockdown rules  ..same Thailand ..make of that what you will..

I sense most Australians are somewhat OK with it, see the sense in it, but they need to get the needles out there fast

 

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Fat is a type of crazy

[Sparktrader]

5 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

They have done a bad job of getting the needles out, and for hotel quarantine in the past, but few deaths and cases.

Sydney waited a bit recently before lockdown, as you might prefer, and cases went from 10 to 100 a day and that would have become 1000 and up and up so what to do..

Melbourne took fast action and kept it at 10 a day ...

If you can get cases low it seems good to keep them low. You might prefer a US and UK approach, before the needles, but I don't. 

 I have a work from home job - people with some small businesses e.g. catering, cafes etc  are taking the brunt - it is tough. Many businesses do OK with support.

No corruption  that I am aware of - the odd sportsmen getting special treatment and  businesses accessing support funds they shouldn't.  

Not sure that anti needle stuff is significant in Australia - much smaller in size than say US or UK. 

People could come in more easily if we had a decent quarantine facility but hotel quarantine keeps getting breached. As I said people can leave if they can show they'll stay out for a bit.

Police just stop people who break the lockdown rules  ..same Thailand ..make of that what you will..

I sense most Australians are somewhat OK with it, see the sense in it, but they need to get the needles out there fast

 

 

Nonsense. Most are angry with lockdowns. The delta strain is milder. Plus 99% of cases overall mild according to who. People are being ruined for nothing while pollies get pay rises.

[The Hammer2021]

3 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

They have done a bad job of getting the needles out, and for hotel quarantine in the past, but few deaths and cases.

Sydney waited a bit recently before lockdown, as you might prefer, and cases went from 10 to 100 a day and that would have become 1000 and up and up so what to do..

Melbourne took fast action and kept it at 10 a day ...

If you can get cases low it seems good to keep them low. You might prefer a US and UK approach, before the needles, but I don't. 

 I have a work from home job - people with some small businesses e.g. catering, cafes etc  are taking the brunt - it is tough. Many businesses do OK with support.

No corruption  that I am aware of - the odd sportsmen getting special treatment and  businesses accessing support funds they shouldn't.  

Not sure that anti needle stuff is significant in Australia - much smaller in size than say US or UK. 

People could come in more easily if we had a decent quarantine facility but hotel quarantine keeps getting breached. As I said people can leave if they can show they'll stay out for a bit.

Police just stop people who break the lockdown rules  ..same Thailand ..make of that what you will..

I sense most Australians are somewhat OK with it, see the sense in it, but they need to get the needles out there fast

 

 

For an ostensibly, western modern country Australia has coped attrociosly with the Covid-19 crisis. It is not a model that any country in the world is emulating. It's politicians have been exposed as being corrupt and amateurish.

[Sparktrader]

According to abc the delta strain death rate is 0.3%. Thats similar to flus. 

[Sparktrader]

2 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

For an ostensibly, western modern country Australia has coped attrociosly with the Covid-19 crisis. It is not a model that any country in the world is emulating. It's politicians have been exposed as being corrupt and amateurish.

True. Not enough vaccine choices. Plus chemists should all have them. Plus lockdowns over a 0.3% death rate? Swine flu death rate was higher. 1/10 for pollies.

[Fat is a type of crazy]

Just now, Sparktrader said:

Nonsense. Most are angry with lockdowns. The delta strain is milder. Plus 99% of cases overall mild according to who. People are being ruined for nothing while pollies get pay rises.

..and public servants so I am OK. The Delta seems to be more transmissable and I am hearing mixed things about it's strength. Tonight I saw that it is worse. Channel 9 news so must be true. A lot of people are not happy and I can understand that but the majority support the lockdowns. The lockdowns are bad but the option of just keeping going just leads to a Thailand situation. The needles are coming. 

[Sparktrader]

1 minute ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

..and public servants so I am OK. The Delta seems to be more transmissable and I am hearing mixed things about it's strength. Tonight I saw that it is worse. Channel 9 news so must be true. A lot of people are not happy and I can understand that but the majority support the lockdowns. The lockdowns are bad but the option of just keeping going just leads to a Thailand situation. The needles are coming. 

Not surprised.

[Sparktrader]

Channel 9 news? Oh dear.

 

The official data on delta is its milder. 0.3%.

 

 

[Sparktrader]

Professor Turville said so far, mortality rates data looked promising.

"Looking at the 28-day follow up after infection, the death rate for the original variants was 1.9 per cent mortality," he said.

"So far the Delta variant is showing 0.3 per cent mortality.

[gargamon]

12 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

The delta strain is milder

Where do you get this nonsense? Since you haven't posted a link I can only assume it's a non-reputable source that would not be allowed here.

[Sparktrader]

1 minute ago, gargamon said:

Where do you get this nonsense? Since you haven't posted a link I can only assume it's a non-reputable source that would not be allowed here.

I posted the profs name. It's true it you researched it.

[gargamon]

7 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

Channel 9 news? Oh dear.

 

The official data on delta is its milder. 0.3%.

 

 

What official data? We don't want your interpretation, we want a reputable link.

[Sparktrader]

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-07-02/delta-coronavirus-variant-symptoms-vaccines-spread/100255804

[Sparktrader]

Just now, gargamon said:

What official data? We don't want your interpretation, we want a reputable link.

Try google. Do some research.

[Sparktrader]

The most recent evidence from the UK shows the Delta fatality rate is about 0.3 per cent, compared to about 2 per cent for the earlier Alpha variant, said Professor Gregory Dore, an infectious diseases physician and epidemiologist at the Kirby Institute.

[Fat is a type of crazy]

12 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

Channel 9 news? Oh dear.

 

The official data on delta is its milder. 0.3%.

 

 

I think that 0.3 figure was from ABC news three weeks ago and Channel 9 news told me it is higher now. Didn't note the source. But the figure in the US IS 623 deaths and around 14500 cases two weeks before so a low rate, in this case a rough estimate of 0.4 sounds low, but it can result in a lot of deaths given the high infection rate. That's in a country where the majority have had needles.

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Fat is a type of crazy

[Sparktrader]

Just now, Fat is a type of crazy said:

I think that 0.3 figure was from ABC news three weeks ago and Channel 9 news told me it is higher now. Didn't note the source. But the figure in the US IS 623 deaths and around 14500 cases two weeks before so a low rate, in this case a rough estimate of 0.4 sounds low, but it can result in a lot of deaths given the high infection rate.

 

Channel 9 told u so? Show the proof.

[Sparktrader]

5 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

I think that 0.3 figure was from ABC news three weeks ago and Channel 9 news told me it is higher now. Didn't note the source. But the figure in the US IS 623 deaths and around 14500 cases two weeks before so a low rate, in this case a rough estimate of 0.4 sounds low, but it can result in a lot of deaths given the high infection rate.

 

0.02% under 50yos. Why are they locked down?

[Fat is a type of crazy]

4 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

0.02% under 50yos. Why are they locked down?

Not sure. Because people get sick too and not only die. Because they pass it on to others. Because with a low rate, but with lots of cases, still a lot of deaths. Couldn't find the source on higher rate - just that it is too soon to tell- so disregard that. I did note that before. 

[Sparktrader]

1 minute ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

Not sure. Because people get sick too and not only die. Because they pass it on to others. Because with a low rate, but with lots of cases, still a lot of deaths. Couldn't find the source on higher rate - just that it is too soon to tell- so disregard that. I did note that before. 

Which makes no sense. Not much different to annual flu.

[Sparktrader]

4 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

Not sure. Because people get sick too and not only die. Because they pass it on to others. Because with a low rate, but with lots of cases, still a lot of deaths. Couldn't find the source on higher rate - just that it is too soon to tell- so disregard that. I did note that before. 

Covid deaths 915 in 20 months. Road deaths 1142 in 12 months.

 

Explain the lockdown theory?

 

It defies any logic. They dont ban cars.

[StreetCowboy]

9 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

Covid deaths 915 in 20 months. Road deaths 1142 in 12 months.

 

Explain the lockdown theory?

 

It defies any logic. They dont ban cars.

Good on you, mate.  You have my support on that one.  We should treat automobile carnage the same way we treat gun crime or COVID.  Or the same way we treat COVID, if you are American.

[Fat is a type of crazy]

10 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

Covid deaths 915 in 20 months. Road deaths 1142 in 12 months.

 

Explain the lockdown theory?

 

It defies any logic. They dont ban cars.

Lockdowns have bad outcomes. Correct.

How about no lockdowns. 10's of 1000's of cases a day and lot's of deaths. 

Australian and New Zealand outcome up to 31 December 2020 or US outcome. I'll take Australia. After that US has done better and us not so much.

Your example of death comparisons would make sense if there is low deaths and no lockdowns - in a sense the low death figures are making a case for lockdown. 

[StreetCowboy]

2 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

Lockdowns have bad outcomes. Correct.

How about no lockdowns. 10's of 1000's of cases a day and lot's of deaths. 

Australian and New Zealand outcome up to 31 December 2020 or US outcome. I'll take Australia. After that US has done better and us not so much.

Your example of death comparisons would make sense if there is low deaths and no lockdowns - in a sense the low death figures are making a case for lockdown. 

I'm with Sparktrader.

We should ban cars.  I can't see why anyone would think differently

[Sparktrader]

Just now, Fat is a type of crazy said:

Lockdowns have bad outcomes. Correct.

How about no lockdowns. 10's of 1000's of cases a day and lot's of deaths. 

Australian and New Zealand outcome up to 31 December 2020 or US outcome. I'll take Australia. After that US has done better and us not so much.

Your example of death comparisons would make sense if there is low deaths and no lockdowns - in a sense the low death figures are making a case for lockdown. 

0.3% is few deaths. People who were most likely going to die soon anyway. Its 0.02% inder 50yos. Pre existing conditions.

 

The low death rates are percentage based ie lockdowns didnt cause it.

 

Logic says lockdowns are illogical.

 

[Sparktrader]

Just now, StreetCowboy said:

I'm with Sparktrader.

We should ban cars.  I can't see why anyone would think differently

Yes and ban smokes and fries and coke and beer. They kill millions. Lockdowns is modern day  fascism.

[StreetCowboy]

1 minute ago, Sparktrader said:

Yes and ban smokes and fries and coke and beer. They kill millions. Lockdowns is modern day  fascism.

Just cars.  They are the enemy of society, and of cities.  Cigarettes, beer, coke - fine in my view. Cars have destroyed our society, our towns, our countryside and our planet. 

[Sparktrader]

Just now, StreetCowboy said:

Just cars.  They are the enemy of society, and of cities.  Cigarettes, beer, coke - fine in my view. Cars have destroyed our society, our towns, our countryside and our planet. 

Factories pollute a lot. Ban them. Heck ban everything except water.